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Things I wanted to say for a week or two

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Archpriest

User
#1
Recently, I see a strong pushback to criticism everywhere. One recent, very dismissive post here made me write this. I personally enjoy HC and had heated debates with people here. However, the majority doesn't just bitch and moan for the sake of it. It's because they love the game. And many are still playing it. They spent their time and money for two years and, at the end, got quite a different game. It's not their fault that one former CDPR member was dismissing any criticism. It's not their fault that CDPR released that disastrous Mid-Winter patch. It's not their fault that factions and cards in beta devolved from being unique to being generic. We may disagree with their current take but we surely can understand their feelings and respect their opinions. Unfortunately, here and on reddit, debates are more about being right (and I was guilty of that myself a few times) and not about working together to make Gwent better.

So, what I'm trying to say here? Gwent isn't going back, as was stated many times by CDPR. And HC is still a work in progress. Shouldn't we stop trying to be "right" and finally start working together? Because, and we all know it, there's still a lot of work to do.

My apologies for this rant.
 

4RM3D

Moderator
#2
True, I tend to debate the arguments rather than the opinion of people, which appears as if I just want to be right. We should just all get along because we love CDPR (or, at least, at some point in time we did).
 

kAiSeR007

User
#4
Well, forums are for expressing opinions, you can agree or disagree with them. And the opinions come from the current state of the game and from the devs answers to the current problems.

And the problem is that when you undergo such a change, such a game overhaul, considering the game was in beta for two years, and paused for 6 months in promise of this new changes; players, despite they agree or not in how different the game looks like, how different some mechanics are, they expected a somehow balanced and finished game. And sadly, this is not the case.

Gameplay and playerbase wise, the game seems to go backwards. Yes, we yet have to get expansions, yes, we yet have to get updates, but also yes, we waited for a VERY long time, and the space for more patience and more waiting is not the same than a year ago. It just cannot be, we can't just endlessly wait for a better future, for the promise of better updates.

I said multiple times, that in general is not about how different the game is now, but about how this new changes are implemented. And for me, it still lacks a lot of work.

Finally, it may sound not important, but check the Skirmish. The Skirmish has been completely ABANDONED. Even though it's a minor event, it is an event promoted by CDPR, and they not only not give it the cover it deserved, but they just stopped covering it before finishing. I still don't know who won, what are the matches results. It just scapes my understanding how an event promoted by the same game developers has been abandoned in such a way, the ones that should care de most about it is CDPR and they didn't even give us any update in the forums. Really, I don't get it.
 

Archpriest

User
#6
I don't quite understand what you're trying to say tbh. Yes, I was talking in general but espcecially about people who, despite their grievances, still play Gwent. Many of them are very vocal about those grievances. They shouldn't be dismissed just because they're frustrated. The ones who moved on, well... they did move on and are not going to play Gwent anymore. What else is there to do? As was stated many times, HC is Gwent CDPR is moving forward with, there's no going back. The question is: how? And these pepople's opinions should be taken into account. Because as I see it, to them Gwent isn't just another card game. They genuinely love it. In my book, it accounts for something,
 

Archpriest

User
#8
the main problem is how CDP threw to the trash bin those 2 years of beta
We may or may not disagree on that and that's fine. The fact is that old Gwent isn't coming back. One of the mottos of one great king was "It is what it is". So, the real problem is how we proceed forward? And there, I don't want these people to be ignored. Or to see their opinions just being dismissed.
 
#10
Unfortunately, here and on reddit, debates are more about being right (and I was guilty of that myself a few times) and not about working together to make Gwent better.
To make progression you need the same footing. And that is why we argueing about/for our points. If we agree on a same point, we can start from there. If we dont, we cant do it together but have to try it for us alone.
Gwent isn't going back, as was stated many times by CDPR
And thats the point. I dont want to formulate ideas, if reroll is a no-go. Many mechanics deserve another chance, but we cant even try partially to go back? Ist like changes engine and wheels of adriving car but saying to the mechanics "Dont put them back again, try something different"
As was stated many times, HC is Gwent CDPR is moving forward with, there's no going back
i would go wit CDRed is moving it. Forward is a interpretation. And that is another point you have to understand: If you want to work with people who dislike the (current) game, stop making such interpretations and be neutral in phrasing. Otherwise you will offend the people you want to work with.
 

Pruny

User
#11
We may or may not disagree on that and that's fine. The fact is that old Gwent isn't coming back. One of the mottos of one great king was "It is what it is". So, the real problem is how we proceed forward? And there, I don't want these people to be ignored. Or to see their opinions just being dismissed.
Cdpr doesnt care about our sugestions d'hoine , i need more vodka...
 

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Esmer

User
#12
So, what I'm trying to say here? Gwent isn't going back, as was stated many times by CDPR. And HC is still a work in progress. Shouldn't we stop trying to be "right" and finally start working together? Because, and we all know it, there's still a lot of work to do.
Weren't we all working together for 2 years? How many times was the community actively discussing various changes? Gold immunity, locks, weather, create, mill, handbuff, silver spy wars, etc.

We are doing the same thing now, but this time there's much more people who really dislike the direction the game is taking. But even so, there's a lot of constructive criticism regarding every aspect of Homecoming. What more can we do, really? Especially given a lack of communication from CDPR and some really, really strange decisions like promoting ST faction while Eithne control's already in every single match?
 

Shabman

User
#14
I am all for working together and unlike some of my companions who have lost all hope, I still believe it's possible. That is what I wish, that we work together as a community to communicate clearly what kind of game we want and support the devs in making it.

But it makes me question your sincerity when you say some things are off the table. What are these, nuclear disarmament negotiations? When you say Gwent will not go back, I assume you mean certain elements which made old Gwent what it was will not come back. But if we love them, why wouldn't they?

Allow me to make this perfectly clear. I was willing before to step on my heart and try to get with the program at least for some time, but not anymore. My position is very simple:

- if it doesn't have three rows, it's not Gwent to me, and I will not play it; it literally makes me feel claustrophobic.

Everything else is negotiable - here are some examples of things from old Gwent I wish would make their way back into the current game:

- bigger point variance: I don't want to play for 5 point swings, it's just not interesting. I want scores like 79 to 46 not 12 to 9.
- more control over your deck - whether this is achieved by more tutors or mulligans or whatever, I don't mind; it doesn't have to be oppressive like some decks in beta, but it needs to be better than what we have now
- more card combos - this is again a strong argument for tutors, as far as I am concerned; I want to play 3-4-5-6 card combos, it makes the game so much more interesting. It doesn't have to be OP combos that kill everything or put insane points on the board. Just having more stuff to play with.
- having the option to play on a board or on some sort of tavern table or in a tavern setting; to get some of that homey feeling from original Gwent.
- FASTER TEMPO
- get rid of this ridiculous dark overlay on all the backgrounds and art. Find more creative ways of giving the game a darker vibe without throwing gray tones over everything. Let the colours be vibrant just like they're supposed to be.

There's probably more stuff, but this is what I could think of for now.
 

Archpriest

User
#15
No idea what do you mean. Can you explain?
I dont want to formulate ideas, if reroll is a no-go.
There's no re-roll. If it's a no-go for you well... that's a shame but "it is what it is". Besides, somehow you're bringing points that suit more "Gwent is uninstalled" thread.
What more can we do, really?
I thought I stated that clearly: people need to stop being so polarised. Neither side seems to listen to the other. It's either "the game is garbage" or "the game is great". There's no middle ground. And we're to expect here that CDPR would listen to any feedback?
Especially given a lack of communication from CDPR and some really, really strange decisions like promoting ST faction while Eithne control's already in every single match?
That's a very specific point we could argue about in another thread.
After all those "working together", and now look what we have: GWENT - HOMECOMING.
Working together? Was a visiting different forums lately?
I mean, we can't expect to be taken seriously if the only thing that is going on now is either toxic negativity or equally toxic praise.
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But it makes me question your sincerity when you say some things are off the table.
CDPR's decisions and statements make you question my sincerity? What kind of a logic is that? I am not affiliated with that company in any capacity, just to make things clear.
Allow me to make this perfectly clear. I was willing before to step on my heart and try to get with the program at least for some time, but not anymore. My position is very simple:
- if it doesn't have three rows, it's not Gwent to me, and I will not play it; it literally makes me feel claustrophobic.
Sorry it makes you claustrophobic. But CDPR said they are not going back to three rows. Ok, I have to ask you: are you being serious with this post? It's either you're joking or somehow disregard their statements.
Everything else is negotiable
Apparently, given your previous statement, "everything else" doesn't matter.

And again, this wasn't the post to share ideas in this thread. Sorry if it mislead some people.
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Cdpr doesnt care about our sugestions d'hoine , i need more vodka...
Go get it then... I would never presume to stop anyone from having fun.
 
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Pruny

User
#16
They left us 6months in the dark without even consulting playerbase, and those months were pure misery against hordes of braindead alchemy and emyr handbuff, excuse me for being full with negativity but all i asked were small nerfs, like -1 to viper, cdpr did nothing
 
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Esmer

User
#17
I thought I stated that clearly: people need to stop being so polarised. Neither side seems to listen to the other. It's either "the game is garbage" or "the game is great". There's no middle ground. And we're to expect here that CDPR would listen to any feedback?

That's a very specific point we could argue about in another thread.
I am not polarised, and I provided a lot of feedback on these forums with explanations why I think a certain change is good or bad. So my question stands: what more can be done?

As for the specific point of no communications from CDPR, I see nothing specific here. The only things we got are Burza's replies to one specific thread. Pawel had 41 posts since Homecoming release, and his last message was on November, 27. Then he went on vacation. Great timing, I have to say!
 

Shabman

User
#20
Sorry it makes you claustrophobic. But CDPR said they are not going back to three rows. Ok, I have to ask you: are you being serious with this post? It's either you're joking or somehow disregard their statements.
Lol I'm joking?

You must be misunderstanding me. I put ZERO stock in CDPR's statements, simply because they are not reliable indicators of what's going to happen. Just like all game devs these days, they say one thing now and they do another thing later because they find it more convenient. They said Thronebreaker would only be available on GOG - super duper exclusively, definitely not gonna be on Steam. What happened then? No one was buying it (except me I guess and some other fans), so they put it up on Steam because they needed more sales. You can bet your cowboy hat that if CDPR realizes that they're bleeding players and that bringing back 3 rows will bring in old disgruntled fans, they WILL do it. It's just business.

Anyways, the point is: if your idea of "working together" is us renouncing what we love about the game and helping you make the game YOU like evolve, you can keep your peace offering. No thanks.
 
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