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This game just isn't hard enough.

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C

chmielu125

Rookie
#161
Jul 1, 2015
Death132 said:
The people with complaints tend to be the most vocal. Witcher 3 sold 4 million copies in it's first 2 weeks and is guaranteed to have sold even more since then.

The people on forums make up a small minority when you look at the numbers and compare it to the sales. It's like when some claim that Witcher 3 is broken because of all the threads pointing out bugs. Forum threads and posts are a small minority compared to the overall number of people who own the game.
Click to expand...
Yes, but difficulty is kind of a different story, CDPR said themselves that the game will be hard, so we expected a game that will make us struggle on higher difficulty levels, which it doesn't. See they should not hold themselves back with the difficulty level, highest should be hard as hell, and if you find it too hard, go for one below it. It's not like we demand the easy mode to become new DM. We just want hard to be hard, and it's not currently.
 
A

AlphaGamer

Rookie
#162
Jul 1, 2015
Taurusbull said:
True, however the money cut is too harsh (can i fix it with that other mod?) and QUEN got nerfed wayyyy to much. I do indeed like some of Ucrosses aproaches , like the one you mentioned about enemies doing more dmg but having less health, also poison and fire doing a lot less dmg. But i like Enhanced aproach to signs a bit more, the delay in QUEN stamina but lasting longer is better, imo.
Click to expand...
There are several economy balance mods out there, I just don't know if they're compatible with ucross.One can always add money via console commands.
 
K

Khronikos

Rookie
#163
Jul 1, 2015
http://www.nexusmods.com/witcher3/mods/139/?tab=1&navtag=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.nexusmods.com%2Fwitcher3%2Fajax%2Fmoddescription%2F%3Fid%3D139%26preview%3D&pUp=1

The mod has made a ton of progress since its release due to fan feedback. Now currently at 2.10. Just posting this as more feedback is always welcome on the site for anyone wanting to test things out. I am waiting to see what this 1.07 patch does before I start a playthrough so will not be testing anymore.

Things like Gwent and Decoctions are now pretty balanced in the mod and it is advisable to not play Deathmarch unless you actually want a challenge unlike Vanilla. Peace.​


The mod itself is actually pretty mature at this point but still changing a decent amount. I would hold off any new playthroughs until we see what 1.07 does though. Leave your feedback and upvote the mod if you like it the guy works on it quite a bit and is always open to suggestions.
 
Last edited: Jul 1, 2015
T

TouPoutsou

Senior user
#164
Jul 1, 2015
As i said before, despite being a huge dark souls fan, i am sort of OK with the difficulty of death march(my default difficulty, never played much on anything else), since the combat is nowhere near as precise polished and responsive to support Dark Souls levels of difficulty. However CDPR heavily contraicted themselves with the final product.

http://www.vg247.com/2015/02/05/dark-difficulty-and-permadeath-how-hard-is-the-witcher-3/

Some bits from the interview.

The developer expects most people to choose normal difficulty – it’s the default. But “Normal should be a challenge,” quest designer Philipp Weber told me.
“Usually normal is easy, and easy is – well, you can be on your phone while playing.”

“It’s the same with the difficulty – there’s a nice curve. It gets more difficult the more you progress in the game

(Nope, normal is insanely easy, bot a challenge whatsover. After white Orchard, if you pick on enemies at your level it's as easy as skyrim, propably easier. And of course the game does not become more difficult as you progress through game at all. I am OK with this though. I like reverse Difficulty on RPGs. That's also the case with Dark Souls)


Dark difficulty is something that many people in the company are very passionate about,” Weber said when I expressed incredulity at this feature.
“Because they want a real challenge. If you die five minutes before the ending, it’s over. There are actually people who have already done it,” he added.
(Here is a feature that did not make it into game. Sort of shows how chaotic TW3 developement was, since only 3 months before release they still did not know how they would ultimately handle several things. This is just an example) Continuing:


At the end of my time with The Witcher 3 and CD Projekt RED earlier this month, I decided to nail down precisely how hard the RPG is. Pulling out my notebook and a pen, I drew a simple chart and labelled the Y axis with “Skyrim” at the bottom and “Dark Souls” at the top.
“I don’t know what the X axis is,” I apologised, “But let’s say the Y axis is a difficulty scale. Down at the bottom here is the toughest challenge in Skyrim. Up the top here is the hardest thing in Dark Souls – something really life destroying, you know?”
Weber caught on immediately. “First of all, Dark difficulty would be somewhere over here,” he said, indicating a space on the other side of the table from us. We both laughed.


So dark difficulty or death march was said to be much harder than Dark Souls. Not even close, but as i said before it;s OK. The witcher 3 does not have the mechanics to support such high difficulty, with the game still being "fair".


 
Last edited: Jul 1, 2015
D

Death132

Rookie
#165
Jul 1, 2015
TouPoutsou said:
As i said before, despite being a huge dark souls fan, i am sort of OK with the difficulty of death march(my default difficulty, never played much on anything else), since the combat is nowhere near as precise polished and responsive to support Dark Souls levels of difficulty.
Click to expand...
I can argue that Witcher 3 combat uses just as much precision and ability as the Souls games. In terms of polish and responsiveness it's just as good. This is coming from a massive Souls fan.

In the Souls games you have Invincibility Frames. If an attack comes at you, press dodge at the right time and you won't get hit no matter what.

In Witcher 3 there are no I Frames. The only way to dodge is to ensure that your body isn't physically touched by the enemy. Just pressing dodge at the right moment won't prevent you from getting hit. Distance matters. That alone adds more depth and challenge.
 
R

riotamus

Rookie
#166
Jul 1, 2015
Death132 said:
In the Souls games you have Invincibility Frames. If an attack comes at you, press dodge at the right time and you won't get hit no matter what.

In Witcher 3 there are no I Frames. The only way to dodge is to ensure that your body isn't physically touched by the enemy. Just pressing dodge at the right moment won't prevent you from getting hit. Distance matters. That alone adds more depth and challenge.
Click to expand...
For real honest-to-God collision-based damage try Exanima:)
 
J

ju5t_me

Rookie
#167
Jul 1, 2015
Death132 said:
In Witcher 3 there are no I Frames. The only way to dodge is to ensure that your body isn't physically touched by the enemy. Just pressing dodge at the right moment won't prevent you from getting hit. Distance matters. That alone adds more depth and challenge.
Click to expand...
This is not true tho, there are i-frames on both dodge and roll, just turn on your combat log, it will tell you that "Geralt took 0 damage" and no hit effects will be applied, or pit yourself against the wall and just backstep the attacks of a drowner, attacks will pass right through you. But a wide array of moves simply ignores i-frames (almost anything from Griffin type enemies) and it's not really obvious which moves can be i-framed and which can't.

If this wasn't quirky enough already... there is also "Fleet Footed" which does work as advertised, but again... not quite like the average gamer might expect. It does reduce dmg to 0 (5/5 points spent), if you get hit during any evasive move after the normal i-frames expired, but does not negate the hit effect (easiest to verify with a forward "dodge" as this one has no i-frames). You will still get staggered, pushed back, Quen will break etc.

There's still more... you can dodge right after an attack, or after you took dmg, but those dodges have no i-frames what so ever (even though they look exactly the same) and "Fleet Footed" does not work either, so basically no dodging possible, when you need it the most...

Overall it's a system that seems to work against player expectation as much as possible :p and that's before we talked about the Hit-Boxes...
 
M

Martindnewton

Rookie
#168
Jul 1, 2015
Going to try the ucross mod without a new game, does it break the balance not having 10% and the extra skill point? Not too fussed about the gold. Curious about the gwent changes. What difficulty? Blood and broken?
 
C

chmielu125

Rookie
#169
Jul 1, 2015
TouPoutsou said:
The witcher 3 does not have the mechanics to support such high difficulty, with the game still being "fair".
“Usually normal is easy, and easy is – well, you can be on your phone while playing.”
Click to expand...
DM is not supposed to be fair, that's why have Easy, Normal and even Hard for the game to be fair.
But DM should makes us howl at the moon in despair and consider lowering the difficulty level. However it doesn't even come remotely close to that
Reactions to difficulties should be like this :
Just the story = Nah all too easy
Story and Sword = Not bad but you need to do better than that
Blood and Bones = Ok this is not easy, not easy at all
Death March = How the FUCK am I supposed to win that !

DM is so easy currently that I'm pretty sure I could win some fights while being on the phone
 
Last edited: Jul 1, 2015
G

Goodmongo

Forum veteran
#170
Jul 1, 2015
Black_Iris said:
Whoever told you that it's a level 10 char? Bah.

Anyway, it's not difficult to find the video in youtube. If you cannot understand the keywords to use for yourself, well... let's just say that I find IT HARD TO LOVE YOU SO MUCH. YET I DO.
Click to expand...
Searched youtube for witcher 3, fists only, high level monsters, no armor, death march etc. Couldn't find the video on the first 2-3 pages of each time I tried.

As for Jenny my point was that people say the game is so easy that they can defeat monsters without swords etc. So I'm directly challenging that by saying I do not believe that anyone can defeat the Jenny contract at or below the suggested level (level 10) without using swords, alchemy etc. Just using yerden and fists will never do it.

And there are other monsters (wraiths etc.) in other quests where fists will never do enough damage to overcome their regen health points.
 
C

Cordon_Bleu

Rookie
#171
Jul 1, 2015
1-8 on Deathmarch was quite hard but after that it was a breeze and very easy. And since like Level20 or so I don't even need Quen anymore, Mobs barely do any Damage to me now :eek:
 
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G

Gerald01

Rookie
#172
Jul 1, 2015
Cordon_Bleu said:
1-8 on Deathmarch was quite hard but after that it was a breeze and very easy. And since like Level20 or so I don't even need Quen anymore, Mobs barely do any Damage to me now :eek:
Click to expand...
What's your build+equip?
 
G

Goodmongo

Forum veteran
#173
Jul 1, 2015
Cordon_Bleu said:
Mobs barely do any Damage to me now :eek:
Click to expand...
Interesting to see what build you have. While I can defeat all the mobs if I just stand there I will take some massive damage.

I'm not saying what you wrote is untrue. I am saying that I'm not aware of any build from level 20 where mobs won't damage you for decent amounts.
 
G

Graelock

Rookie
#174
Jul 1, 2015
CostinRaz said:
As someone who finished Insane and Dark Mode multiple times in TW2 difficulty in itself is meaningless, it's the satisfaction of combat, the good design of it that makes a game enjoyable not some random dweb one shotting you because the only way to make the game challenging and thus satysfying is nonsensical difficulty modes, not that W3 isn't already guilty of this.
Click to expand...
Yeah, finally a game comes out that makes you feel like the badass your character is supposed to be, but people still complain. Most games have insane hard mode difficulties that keep you reloading checkpoints incessantly. Obviously, that is not the intended design of this game, with all there is to explore and so many different endings to experience. If you want to turn a 200+ hour game into 400+, on account of a harder setting, so be it, but you should really be playing Dark Souls. That's as hardcore as an RPG gets.
 
A

Amioran

Senior user
#175
Jul 1, 2015
Graelock said:
Yeah, finally a game comes out that makes you feel like the badass your character is supposed to be, but people still complain. Most games have insane hard mode difficulties that keep you reloading checkpoints incessantly. Obviously, that is not the intended design of this game, with all there is to explore and so many different endings to experience. If you want to turn a 200+ hour game into 400+, on account of a harder setting, so be it, but you should really be playing Dark Souls. That's as hardcore as an RPG gets.
Click to expand...
I don't understand what's so difficult for people to comprehend about "various difficulty levels". They are there for a motive, you know? If you want to be a badass then Just the story! and Story and Sword! will be perfect for you. What's the need to even want an hardcore mode as should be Death March easy is beyond me, seriously.

Now we also have people that complain about options and the people asking about having them. It's hilarious.
 
Last edited: Jul 1, 2015
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T

Taurusbull

Rookie
#176
Jul 1, 2015
Graelock said:
Yeah, finally a game comes out that makes you feel like the badass your character is supposed to be, but people still complain. Most games have insane hard mode difficulties that keep you reloading checkpoints incessantly. Obviously, that is not the intended design of this game, with all there is to explore and so many different endings to experience. If you want to turn a 200+ hour game into 400+, on account of a harder setting, so be it, but you should really be playing Dark Souls. That's as hardcore as an RPG gets.
Click to expand...

I disagree with you. If you want to feel the badass your character is supposed to be you have 3 dificulties for that. When people chose the hardest they do know that reloading and checkpoints are a thing that will happen. And that does not detract from the RPG part of the game at ALL. Look at CLASSIC Tatical View RPGs like Baldurs Gate, Dragon Age Origins and the recent Pillars of Eternity. All of them have crazy insane hard modes, and rpg lovers as well as strategy lovers like them. (im both).
 
A

Amioran

Senior user
#177
Jul 1, 2015
Goodmongo said:
Interesting to see what build you have. While I can defeat all the mobs if I just stand there I will take some massive damage.
Click to expand...
Explain "massive damage" because I increased damage by 150% in Death March and still that's not enough to have you killed in three normal hits standing still (and in Better Combat there are no levelup bonuses to vitality, plus various reduced bonuses to vitality as all the ones coming from the alchemy tree, as Refreshment that's one of the most insane skills I have ever seen in a game as far as bonuses go; it is on par with Fade Shield for an Eldritch Knight in DA:I). Moreover where the hell did you take this "stand still" from? It's obvious that when you play you don't stand still but you try to dodge and roll, hence what you are saying is completely moot.

The fact is that with the insane damage bonuses the vanilla game gives by middle game you will be so powerful that you will easily beat everything before they can even do some good harm to you.
 
Last edited: Jul 1, 2015
G

Gerald01

Rookie
#178
Jul 1, 2015
Taurusbull said:
I disagree with you. If you want to feel the badass your character is supposed to be you have 3 dificulties for that. When people chose the hardest they do know that reloading and checkpoints are a thing that will happen.
Click to expand...
Well an argument can be made about lowering the difficulty not allowing you to feel like a "badass" because it's not actually your character being powerful but simply the game being made easier. As in it's not supposed to be like that. Unlike the regular/max difficulty showing you are one.

One is game difficulty as in a setting, the other indicates (sort of) what objectively is the situation in universe.

Like the Ciri segment in Skellige during the final mission.. she's OP no matter the diff, because she's supposed to be/look like that.
Versus someone one shotting the same enemies with G. due to exploits/difficulty being on easy.
 
A

Amioran

Senior user
#179
Jul 1, 2015
Gerald01 said:
Well an argument can be made about lowering the difficulty not allowing you to feel like a "badass" because it's not actually your character being powerful but simply the game being made easier. As in it's not supposed to be like that. Unlike the regular/max difficulty showing you are one.

One is game difficulty as in a setting, the other indicates (sort of) what objectively is the situation in universe.

Like the Ciri segment in Skellige during the final mission.. she's OP no matter the diff, because she's supposed to be/look like that.
Versus someone one shotting the same enemies with G. due to exploits/difficulty being on easy.
Click to expand...
This is nonsense. First of all usually higher difficulties are not the norm (i.e. they are made appositely to be more difficult and the normal difficulty is the norm) and then if you don't feel "badass" only because you cannot play the higher difficulty without killing everything easy then that's a problem of your ego. You cannot force all the other users that want a challenge to not have it just because you cannot stand to not feel insanely powerful in a context where you are supposedly not meant to be.

If we go with this criterion then there's no point on having difficulties options altogether. Various difficulties are given so that people can tailor their experience depending on what they want from the game. If you make them behave all in the same manner then what's the point of giving an option to begin with? If a difficulty doesn't change the context of the game to tailor the experience around that difficulty then there's no point for a different difficulty at all.
 
G

Goodmongo

Forum veteran
#180
Jul 1, 2015
Amioran said:
Explain "massive damage" because I increased damage by 150% in Death March and still that's not enough to have you killed in three normal hits standing still (and in Better Combat there are no levelup bonuses to vitality, plus various reduced bonuses to vitality as all the ones coming from the alchemy tree, as Refreshment that's one of the most insane skills I have ever seen in a game as far as bonuses go; it is on par with Fade Shield for an Eldritch Knight in DA:I). Moreover where the hell did you take this "stand still" from? It's obvious that when you play you don't stand still but you try to dodge and roll, hence what you are saying is completely moot.

The fact is that with the insane damage bonuses the vanilla game gives by middle game you will be so powerful that you will easily beat everything before they can even do some good harm to you.
Click to expand...
You really need to read my response in context to what I'm responding to. Here is the original statement:

"And since like Level20 or so I don't even need Quen anymore, Mobs barely do any Damage to me now"

So this guy says he barely receives any damage from mobs. So my response is that if I let the mobs hit me I take massive damage. Massive to me means 15-20% of my health. And crits can be around 35-40%.

So I naturally asked him to tell us the build + equip that he uses where mobs do barely any damage at all.

You went way off tangent and talked about your damage. The original comment and my response had zero to do with our damage output. So maybe now you know the full context of the post.
 
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