Triss Merigold (all spoilers)

[Riddlin]

Yeah we didn't get any of those in this game did we? Was it exclusivley a W2 thing?

Ummm, what I was talking about was the thing that happens after you make a BIG story decision and 'realize' the consequences of your action...like when the Bloody Baron quest ends...or you go back to the 'haunted house' and see that Sarah and Corrine are living together...

Seems like the BREAKUP would have been a natural place for one of those...

 

[Pav94an]

Ummm, what I was talking about was the thing that happens after you make a BIG story decision and 'realize' the consequences of your action...like when the Bloody Baron quest ends...or you go back to the 'haunted house' and see that Sarah and Corrine are living together...

Seems like the BREAKUP would have been a natural place for one of those...

oohhhhhhhhh Yeah i remeber now - I was thinking of the comic like animation that played during the flashbacks in W2


I get what you mean now.
And yes that is a good idea - although I don't think it would change that much - I mean thats not much different than the epilogue slides.

 

[justname]

1)Another Triss x Geralt scene before the final battle/Give Triss the rose back ((I admit this seems unlikely now))
2)Characters recognise and comment on our romance choice
3) Dialogue in SKellige during Act3
4) Triss vs Yen convo
5) Triss and Ciri convo

You forget about "Good Luck"

 

[Pav94an]

You forget about "Good Luck"

Point number 1 was supposed to replace the good luck -- but now i doubt they will add another intimate cutscene

 

[Riddlin]

Difference is we asked for something possible whereas you are expecting the IMpossible.
Even if it will never completely be the way you want it - it is still a vast improvement.

You know, I have gotten into full blown, piss in your corn flakes, type forum fights over this kind of thing...what is possible and what we should ask for!

I have been SCREAMED down by two or three gang-bullies all over me saying 'we should keep our expectations in line with what CAN be done'

There is one side that thinks "DEMAND BIG!" and I am of the other side, this is CDPR's game/story/playhouse..."Yes please may I have some water and a cracker maybe?" THEN when they lay out a plate of fruit we are BOTH happy! I got more than I was expecting and they gave as much as they could!

The other way of thinking tends to make NO ONE happy...the demander isn't happy cause they didn't get the full steak dinner WITH the Texas toast! and the supplier KNOWS no one will be happy so, if they bust their ass to NOT make you happy...they can do nothing and NOT make you happy too!

I prefer the ask what you think can be done...don't hold back, ask for reasonable things but keep reason in the mix and EVERYONE is more likely to be happy in the end...

 

[Brian6666]

You forget about "Good Luck"

I really hope they will fix that, such an anticlimactic moment before one of the most important battles of their lives, it deserves at least a kiss or a hug if nothing more.

 

[Riddlin]

oohhhhhhhhh Yeah i remeber now - I was thinking of the comic like animation that played during the flashbacks in W2


I get what you mean now.
And yes that is a good idea - although I don't think it would change that much - I mean thats not much different than the epilogue slides.

Thats right but it tells you, here is the consequence of your action...I would think there would be one if you sent Triss off too...I can't even think about writing that one

 

[zbum]

We are all aware that small dialogue changes here and there is not going to fix the inconsistencies, that part is obvious. Especially if there are not content or scenes to make the player choices meaniful or show the character and depth of their relationship. If anything small dialogue tweaks here and there with no meaniful content will feel like an insincere attempt just to shut us up.

I don't agree. But you guys should really focus on what aspects are real issues, problems in the game story mechanics and what aspects are just writing assumed decisions that you don't agree with.
The main issue with the Triss romance is that it makes no difference if you romanced her or not, the difference depends more of the choice to romance Yen or not.
@GingerEffect was pretty clear :

As it has been stated in the opening thread, the consequences of choosing Triss are not adequately represented.

aka lack of acknowledgement by the NPC and so on.

So I think we can expect as solved issues : the kiss when Ciri's returned, be able to tell others NPC's that you are with Triss and not Yen, maybe some reactions from Ciri, Yen, Phillipa, some additionnal lines for Triss at key moments like the "goodbye" issue. Because all of this are little tweaks that made the structure of the Geralt/Triss story logical and you will experienced the consequences of your choice.

But if you expect Triss being at Kaer Morhen for the Uma quest, Triss replacing Yen for some scenes, new quest, Kovir DLC, a home to retired at the end game, I think you'll end up disappointed. And it woulb be a shame, because what happen here (devs immediately at work to fix issue with the story, not the gameplay bug or else) is very very very rare in the industry. So, after that, if RED's only receive complaints because their response is not a Kovir DLC, they will not do that sort of thing again. And that I'm not ok with that.

 

[Pav94an]

You know, I have gotten into full blown, piss in your corn flakes, type forum fights over this kind of thing...what is possible and what we should ask for!

I have been SCREAMED down by two or three gang-bullies all over me saying 'we should keep our expectations in line with what CAN be done'

There is one side that thinks "DEMAND BIG!" and I am of the other side, this is CDPR's game/story/playhouse..."Yes please may I have some water and a cracker maybe?" THEN when they lay out a plate of fruit we are BOTH happy! I got more than I was expecting and they gave as much as they could!

The other way of thinking tends to make NO ONE happy...the demander isn't happy cause they didn't get the full steak dinner WITH the Texas toast! and the supplier KNOWS no one will be happy so, if they bust their ass to NOT make you happy...they can do nothing and NOT make you happy too!

I prefer the ask what you think can be done...don't hold back, ask for reasonable things but keep reason in the mix and EVERYONE is more likely to be happy in the end...

I think we achieved that didn't we??? We didn't ask for rewrites like some are but nor did we ask just one more scene and thats it.

 

[hector0193]

This should put it in perspective just how little writing she has and what problems are caused by that. Reading all the posts I don't think people are quite aware of just how unbalanced the writing is in favour of Yen.

Yennefer is more important than Triss in TW3 storyline. We can't expect that to change, it would mean rewriting almost everything and it probably would not make sense. I don't think that Triss necessarily needs more quests (though I would love that). The game just needs to acknowledge and react accordingly to choosing Triss over Yen. It doesn't make sense that you can't talk to your lover before a really important battle where you both could die, or after losing someone important. That's what needs to be fixed, I don't see it as new content, but as small fixes/additions.

 

[Pav94an]

I don't agree. But you guys should really focus on what aspects are real issues, problems in the game story mechanics and what aspects are just writing assumed decisions that you don't agree with.
The main issue with the Triss romance is that it makes no difference if you romanced her or not, the difference depends more of the choice to romance Yen or not.
@GingerEffect was pretty clear :

aka lack of acknowledgement by the NPC and so on.

So I think we can expect as solved issues : the kiss when Ciri's returned, be able to tell others NPC's that you are with Triss and not Yen, maybe some reactions from Ciri, Yen, Phillipa, some additionnal lines for Triss at key moments like the "goodbye" issue. Because all of this are little tweaks that made the structure of the Geralt/Triss story logical and you will experienced the consequences of your choice.

But if you expect Triss being at Kaer Morhen for the Uma quest, Triss replacing Yen for some scenes, new quest, Kovir DLC, a home to retired at the end game, I think you'll end up disappointed. And it woulb be a shame, because what happen here (devs immediately at work to fix issue with the story, not the gameplay bug or else) is very very very rare in the industry. So, after that, if RED's only receive complaints because their response is not a Kovir DLC, they will not do that sort of thing again. And that I'm not ok with that.

Exactly my point - we asked for realistic things and because of this RED took note and are making some changes and small additions - small meaning new dialogue options and possibly "fingers crossed" a scene right and the end before the final fight instead of "Good luck"

 

[justname]

Point number 1 was supposed to replace the good luck -- but now i doubt they will add another intimate cutscene

Point number 1 is about "Well". Triss said "Good Luck" before the KM battle.

 

[Pav94an]

Point number 1 is about "Well". Triss said "Good Luck" before the KM battle.

Nooo I thought Triss said good luck before the final battle against Eredin in the nilfgaardian camp when her Avallach and Yen were discussing strategy???



Point number 3 was about "Well?"

 

[Riddlin]

I think we achieved that didn't we??? We didn't ask for rewrites like some are but nor did we ask just one more scene and thats it.

No no...I agree...

I was mentioning that cause we occasionally get folks on here...can't remember his name now(.wouldn't call him out if i did) went ON and ON about how this wouldn't fix the game how HE wanted it...went on for PAGES with folks trying to calm him but on he went. I say give us this fix and then lets evaluate where we are?

I bet, from the statements we've seen the last couple of days, if they do this and it STILL is lacking...the will do what it takes to make it right. I have more faith in that now, with THIS company, than i EVER have with any other dev team!

 

[zbum]

Exactly my point - we asked for realistic things and because of this RED took note and are making some changes and small additions - small meaning new dialogue options and possibly "fingers crossed" a scene right and the end before the final fight instead of "Good luck"

Absolutely.

 

[Pav94an]

No no...I agree...

I was mentioning that cause we occasionally get folks on here...can't remember his name now(.wouldn't call him out if i did) went ON and ON about how this wouldn't fix the game how HE wanted it...went on for PAGES with folks trying to calm him but on he went. I say give us this fix and then lets evaluate where we are?

I bet, from the statements we've seen the last couple of days, if they do this and it STILL is lacking...the will do what it takes to make it right. I have more faith in that now, with THIS company, than i EVER have with any other dev team!

I feel exactly the same way "Long Live CDPR" although I could say the opposite for the "Respect my authoritah!!!" people if you read my PM lol

 

[justname]

Nooo I thought Triss said good luck before the final battle against Eredin in the nilfgaardian camp when her Avallach and Yen were discussing strategy

Wait. Maybe you are right and she said it before the battle against Eredin. I can't quite remember. If it's true then Triss didn't say a word in KM? Now i'm confused.

 

[Brian6666]

Yennefer is more important than Triss in TW3 storyline. We can't expect that to change, it would mean rewriting almost everything and it probably would not make sense. I don't think that Triss necessarily needs more quests (though I would love that). The game just needs to acknowledge and react accordingly to choosing Triss over Yen. It doesn't make sense that you can't talk to your lover before a really important battle where you both could die, or after losing someone important. That's what needs to be fixed, I don't see it as new content, but as small fixes/additions.

I strongly agree with this, as much as we love Triss, Yen is simply more important for the main story in TW3. What is realistic to expect and what would satisfy me personally is if the game did a better job at recognizing the fact that I choose Triss, being able to talk to her in crucial moments( Vesemir's funeral, before the battle), not having other NPC reminding me that Yen is the one, and having more dialog on a boat. Seeing how amazing facial expressions are in this game, even a meaningful look or a smile in the right moments could do wonders.

 

[Pug.]

Dijkstra essentially has involvement in five quests - Finding Dandelion, Finding his money, finding Phillipa and the two assassination plot quests. Triss gets three. Dijkstra's dialogue consists of the following.

Initial meeting:

- Bath house entry dialogue and fight scene.
- Bath house introductions and explanations.
- Clues to Dandelion's location.
- 'Mission briefing' for his first of three personal quests - finding his money.
- All associated background dialogue/questions

The writing does a better job at introducing his character than it does Triss. Given that she's a potential romance option, that makes no sense. Triss has almost no background dialogue so if you're new to the franchise, she's just some random character with no more emotional attachment than one of the girls in the whorehouses. The writing actually makes it sound like you had nothing but a fling with her. This is contrary to the writing in TW2 where she's (potentially) very important to Geralt's life.

Count Reuven's Treasure:

- Meeting in the house.
- Meeting at the docks.

He's also heavily involved in Now or Never:

- Banter in the Cellar.
- Banter at the docks.
- Banter at the light house.
- Introduction/Mission Briefing for the first assassination plot.

Finally you can go back to Dijkstra for help in finding Junior if you find out that he's working for Redania. He introduces the Roache to TW3.

That's all in Act. 1. In Act 2, we then have Brothers in Arms: Novigrad

Act 3:

- Phillipa Eilheart quest.
-- Insistance Triss stay.
-- Arguments over Phillipa.
-- Introduction of Assassination plot 2.
- Assassination plot 2 briefing.
- Assassination plot 2 treachery.

Realistically the game has two sub-plots. First is Dijkstra's assassination plot, the other is your romance. The first under pins the setting of current world events, the other under pins Geralt as a character. After all, the game allows for Geralt to be presented as a more mature Geralt, one that is less interested in whoremongering and more interested in a long term relationship with his love interest and his daughter. Whilst Dijkstra and Yen work, Triss does not, being largely forgotten for most of the game and limited to three missions. The rest of the time she's a background character, no more important to the plot than Eilheart, Margarita or Emhyr. From a writing perspective that makes no sense and she needs to be put on the same level as Yennefer for the romance sub-plot to work if she's your love interest of choice.

This isn't about fanboy shit, it's not about Triss vs. Yen, those people need to grow up and stay out of the thread. It's about the writing making sense and treating the player's decision with respect, rather than invalidating our choice in favour of the writer's. Playing Triss feels like the writing cheats you and that's not what good writing should do in these circumstances. A few additional lines aren't going to fix that. Triss needs substantially more content to bring parity between the two characters and thus make the sub-plot work.

Addendum: Just to add, since I'm trying to achieve parity, compare the above with Yen. She's involved in every Skellige mission to do with the main plot. That's five quests right there. Then she's heavily involved in Act 2, including a second love scene if you romance her. That's another five quests. Come Act 3 she has another three quests she's directly involved in, and acts as a quest giver for a fourth. All in all she's more involved than the above two put together despite Triss having substantial history with Ciri of her own and (potentially) being in a relationship with Geralt. This is why a few lines aren't going to cut it. The entire romance needs re-writing.

Fair enough. You make some good points and I will concede the argument to you. At any rate, you're preaching to the choir.

I have a feeling that, at the end of the day, you are going to be greatly disappointed, though. You're asking for them to "re-write the entire romance," to add at least two more Triss quests to the main storyline. That ain't gonna happen. We're talking about, at most, probably some additional cutscenes and dialogue to give the Triss/Geralt romance more reactivity and consistency. Marcin has said as much. I wasn't as disappointed as you were, so I'm fine with that.

 

[SoleilMeurtri]

I am back, yesterday i dreamed about Triss, i guess i became crazy