Triss Merigold of Maribor (All Spoilers) Resurgence

[saladin1701]

I've come to terms with fact that Kaer Morhen section will remain terrible. For the limitations of a patch 1.10 does a nice job of adding reactivity to the experience later.

I'm still working through Act 1so haven't heard a lot of the dialogue yet but I'm disappointed that you still can't tell Triss you split up with Yen if you do Skellige before Novigrad, still can't tell Cerys you're with Triss, not Yennefer, and, from what you're saying, she still doesn't show up where and when she's meant to. Throw in a mishandled Shani romance (coming after you've romanced either Triss or Yen and, like many other parts of the game, being inconsistent with the other romances) and I'm beginning to think CDPR either don't care or are simply incompetent at writing the romances in this game.

---------- Updated at 09:42 PM ----------

In fact, without going in to specifics about the dialogue, can anyone tell me where the new dialogue actually occurs? At what point/s in the game is it inserted and within what context?

 

[sv3672]

Throw in a mishandled Shani romance (coming after you've romanced either Triss or Yen and, like many other parts of the game, being inconsistent with the other romances) and I'm beginning to think CDPR either don't care or are simply incompetent at writing the romances in this game.

It seems implementing consequences in the game (rather than just some final cutscene or picture) is problematic in general, as the situation with TW2 save imports shows as well. But the patch could at least have made scenes that look as if the player romanced Yennefer (like the forced kiss before the battle, or Geralt running toward Yennefer to embrace one another after the battle for Kaer Morhen) conditional, this would not have required recording new dialogue.

In fact, without going in to specifics about the dialogue, can anyone tell me where the new dialogue actually occurs? At what point/s in the game is it inserted and within what context?

All new dialogues in patch 1.10 and where they are added can be found in this post.

 

[Sarcen]

but I'm disappointed that you still can't tell Triss you split up with Yen if you do Skellige before Novigrad

Yeah, so you can finally give the "right" answer to the question which has no right answers ("How's Yen doing?"). But it would completely change the whole dynamic of all following missions so I kind of understand why it doesn't exist.

 

[saladin1701]

It seems implementing consequences in the game (rather than just some final cutscene or picture) is problematic in general, as the situation with TW2 save imports shows as well. But the patch could at least have made scenes that look as if the player romanced Yennefer (like the forced kiss before the battle, or Geralt running toward Yennefer to embrace one another after the battle for Kaer Morhen) conditional, this would not have required recording new dialogue.



All new dialogues in patch 1.10 and where they are added can be found in this post.

Thanks but I don't want to know what the dialogue is, I want to know where in the game it occurs.

---------- Updated at 10:50 AM ----------

Yeah, so you can finally give the "right" answer to the question which has no right answers ("How's Yen doing?"). But it would completely change the whole dynamic of all following missions so I kind of understand why it doesn't exist.

Yeah, that one still bloody confuses me so I suppose it's at least in keeping with female logic

As for changing, not necessarily. Triss has (mysteriously) broken up with Geralt because she feels like she used him. Just because he's no longer with Yen doesn't mean she's going to jump right back in a relationship with him. It's the guilt that defines the other moments with her, not Yen.

 

[sv3672]

Thanks but I don't want to know what the dialogue is, I want to know where in the game it occurs.

The new lines are all in spoiler tags, but not where they occur. So, you can find the locations in that post without spoiling the actual content of the dialogues.

 

[wright1978]

Yeah, so you can finally give the "right" answer to the question which has no right answers ("How's Yen doing?"). But it would completely change the whole dynamic of all following missions so I kind of understand why it doesn't exist.

Yeah you couldn't really do it without mucking up the integrity of the later content as it's very much a case of her feelings of inevitability in terms of Geralt's choice that is the impediment to the relationship not guilt imo. Hence why she reads same interpretation into whatever Geralt answers & why she needs a declaration of love to get her to commit. The only way it could work would be for Triss to disbelieve Geralt or believe the breakup will only be temporary, which isn't something a route i'd be particularly like to see precious time spent on in a patch. Don't see the drawbacks of doing that talk before Skellige personally.

---------- Updated at 02:23 PM ----------

Yeah, so you can finally give the "right" answer to the question which has no right answers ("How's Yen doing?"). But it would completely change the whole dynamic of all following missions so I kind of understand why it doesn't exist.

Yeah you couldn't really do it without mucking up the integrity of the later content as it's very much a case of her feelings of inevitability in terms of Geralt's choice that is the impediment to the relationship not guilt imo. Hence why she reads same interpretation into whatever Geralt answers & why she needs a declaration of love to get her to commit. The only way it could work would be for Triss to disbelieve Geralt or believe the breakup will only be temporary, which isn't something a route i'd be particularly like to see precious time spent on in a patch. Don't see the drawbacks of doing that talk before Skellige personally.

 

[saladin1701]

Yeah you couldn't really do it without mucking up the integrity of the later content as it's very much a case of her feelings of inevitability in terms of Geralt's choice that is the impediment to the relationship not guilt imo. Hence why she reads same interpretation into whatever Geralt answers & why she needs a declaration of love to get her to commit. The only way it could work would be for Triss to disbelieve Geralt or believe the breakup will only be temporary, which isn't something a route i'd be particularly like to see precious time spent on in a patch. Don't see the drawbacks of doing that talk before Skellige personally.

As I said, the reasons for the breakup is rooted within the guilt she has that Geralt did not chose her over Yen with all his faculties in place, and that Yen is (probably) her best friend. That's plain to see in her voice and her actions, the way she dancers around the subject.

Regardless of Geralt confessing his undying love or not, it could be seen as the only reason why she actually goes back in to the relationship with him. She knows that at least this time any relationship with him succeeds or fails on its own merits and not because of any guilt that she's sleeping with her best mate's boyfriend. Just because you're able to split up with Yen before meeting Triss and then tell her so does not mean she's going to jump back in bed with him immediately. Triss, like Shani in that romance (only she's more explicit about it) needs to work it all out in her head first.

 

[wright1978]

As I said, the reasons for the breakup is rooted within the guilt she has that Geralt did not chose her over Yen with all his faculties in place, and that Yen is (probably) her best friend. That's plain to see in her voice and her actions, the way she dancers around the subject.

Regardless of Geralt confessing his undying love or not, it could be seen as the only reason why she actually goes back in to the relationship with him. She knows that at least this time any relationship with him succeeds or fails on its own merits and not because of any guilt that she's sleeping with her best mate's boyfriend. Just because you're able to split up with Yen before meeting Triss and then tell her so does not mean she's going to jump back in bed with him immediately. Triss, like Shani in that romance (only she's more explicit about it) needs to work it all out in her head first.

A guilt based model isn't something i see at all as being present to any particular degree. For me its plain to see that it is an already defeated mentality that's behind her behaviour. So don't agree that a Geralt who broke up with Yen wouldn't throw her outlook and cause arc issues. Though it's interesting to see how others interpretations differ wildly based on viewing exactly the same material.

 

[saladin1701]

A guilt based model isn't something i see at all as being present to any particular degree. For me its plain to see that it is an already defeated mentality that's behind her behaviour. So don't agree that a Geralt who broke up with Yen wouldn't throw her outlook and cause arc issues. Though it's interesting to see how others interpretations differ wildly based on viewing exactly the same material.

I'm not sure how you can come to that conclusion? She repeatedly references her 'taking advantage' of Geralt. That is the guilt she harbours. That's the reason for the break up. It's the reason she wants to leave the area and start afresh. If she feels she's taken advantage of him, his telling her he loves her isn't going to change the circumstances. The only thing that will is if she feels she can have a relationship with him without feeling like she's taking advantage of either him, or Yen. Either way, simply saying he's split up with Yen isn't going to make her turn around and say "let's get back together again then!". Guilt or not, she has a lot of stuff to work through in her head so having the option wouldn't affect anything after that.

 

[Pav94an]

Well guys its been a while but im back and I am finally starting my playthrough with the Triss romance fixes (have not seen or even read the extra lines yet) and HoS. SO excited lol

 

[xxRENEGADExx]

Well guys its been a while but im back and I am finally starting my playthrough with the Triss romance fixes (have not seen or even read the extra lines yet) and HoS. SO excited lol

I bet you'll enjoy!

 

[LadyStoneheart]

Actually doing Skellige first would have made a heck of a lot more sense. Firstly, it makes doing the various side quests for Triss feel more like Geralt wooing her back; she knows you've reunited with Yennefer, so if Geralt then makes an effort to help her in Novigrad it mens more. Plus he seems to express himself better through his actions than his words anyway! If I were to add anything, it would be on the docks when he asks Triss to stay and she says "not this again", you could have the option to say it's different this time. Secondly, Yennefer's fans couldn't complain that it's unfair that players don't get to know her before being faced with a romantic choice.

From the PoV of someone choosing neither romance, the new dialogues changed nothing in terms of my reason for going the single route, which is to say overall the romances are done badly. I've expressed my feelings often enough, in that I can at least not interact with Triss if I don't want to have her around, but I can't even tell Yennefer I'm not interested and have her back off. The Skellige wake is excruciating enough when I know I don't want to be with her - it'd be even worse had I already chosen Triss by that point. Triss should be at Kaer Morhen for Ugly Baby if you pick her, and there should be an option for a second sex scene with her - there are two functional bedrooms after all.

If the romances were even in any way, and your choice actually did have a proper impact, I would pick Triss. I didn't in TW2 but she isn't the same person in TW3. Although to be fair, even if she was, I'd still pick her if it made any difference to interacting with Yennefer. As it is.. I will continue to wish for that "romantic neutral" dialogue and a real freedom of choice.

 

[xxRENEGADExx]

Yep, and why doesn't she have terrible burn scars on her décolleté?

Seems even in books she has no "terrible burn scars" already

From "Blood of Elves"

'They used the highest magics on us,' she continued in a muted voice, 'spells, elixirs, amuletsand artefacts. Nothing was left wanting for the wounded heroes of the Hill. We were cured,patched up, our former appearances returned to us, our hair and sight restored. You can hardly see the marks. But I will never wear a plunging neckline again, Geralt. Never.'

 

[sv3672]

Secondly, Yennefer's fans couldn't complain that it's unfair that players don't get to know her before being faced with a romantic choice.

If the Skellige quest line was done before Pyres of Novigrad, then it would be unfair that the player can only interact with Yennefer before The Last Wish (I mean, more unfair than the current order of quests, where she is met in the tutorial, prologue, and Vizima, and is also in that Priscilla song). A better solution would be to move Now or Never only to a higher level, for example between the Uma quest and The Isle of Mists, and add a new quest in its place. In any case, according to one of the developers, no further changes are planned.

From the PoV of someone choosing neither romance, the new dialogues changed nothing in terms of my reason for going the single route, which is to say overall the romances are done badly. I've expressed my feelings often enough, in that I can at least not interact with Triss if I don't want to have her around, but I can't even tell Yennefer I'm not interested and have her back off. The Skellige wake is excruciating enough when I know I don't want to be with her - it'd be even worse had I already chosen Triss by that point. Triss should be at Kaer Morhen for Ugly Baby if you pick her, and there should be an option for a second sex scene with her - there are two functional bedrooms after all.

Some of the forced Yennefer scenes, particularly those after The Last Wish, could perhaps be fixed with mods. Not sure if Sarcen's tools make it possible, but adding "if sq202_yen_girlfriend and not q309_triss_lover" type of conditional checks might fix some annoying scenes. But it may be more difficult than that.

 

[Sarcen]

Not sure if Sarcen's tools make it possible, but adding "if sq202_yen_girlfriend and not q309_triss_lover" type of conditional checks might fix some annoying scenes.

It's very do able. But a bit tedious. Can't do such things in the flow diagram yet.

 

[EzekielThePaladin]

I'm so happy this thread exists. I haven't read through all of it but the start with all that we'd like to see for Triss is full of things that I would most definitely hope for and love to see. I was thrilled to see the dev responses and consequences in the patch, though I think the changes are lackluster (probably just a beginning) if only in comparison with what there'd need to be for me to be really happy with the Triss content in this game. It's amazing that we have Devs who listen to us and will, as they put it, change something for what the fans want.

I was rather disappointed by the lack of Triss in TW3, which was an insta-buy with the season pass for me due to how much I loved the first two games and subsequent reading of all of the books, and I really felt she took a back-seat in comparison to Yennefer, due to her debut in the games. Yennefer does seem rather forced upon us and seems to have more about her in every way, I would even argue Yennefer looks more beautiful due to the very creased forehead Triss seems to have grown. I'm beyond elated that this imbalance is actually being changed, as it was one of my favourite parts of TW2, the romance for one felt magical, unique and, well, romantic. The Hearts of Stone DLC with Shani embodied that very well for me, I felt Shani got the amount of content she deserved and it was all very special for her - that's the kind of stuff I'd love to see for Triss. I really can't wait for Blood and Wine now, and though I felt after the game rather lonely and melancholy in the open world and thus didn't play it too much, the DLC brought me back to adventuring both in it and now NG+. If we got maybe a return of Triss for that DLC (idk how likely that is) or just more in the game about her, I really think this game would be perfect for me, it was one of the greatest disappointments for me, on par with when I finished the game and realised I had nothing left to play. Hearts of Stone heartened me (excuse the pun) and reminded me that CDProjektRED still has it, more so when I found this thread and saw the patch notes about extra dialogue. That DLC's the kind of romance and content we need for Triss, she deserves better than the backseat, with so many inconsistencies.

Thanks very much for caring and implementing this stuff Devs, so many wouldn't, you're awesome. Laying on the flattery a bit thick perhaps, but this has been on my mind since my completion of the game, and I've not until now found the place to give such feedback, it kinda rushes out.

 

[sv3672]

I'm so happy this thread exists. I haven't read through all of it but the start with all that we'd like to see for Triss is full of things that I would most definitely hope for and love to see. I was thrilled to see the dev responses and consequences in the patch, though I think the changes are lackluster (probably just a beginning) if only in comparison with what there'd need to be for me to be really happy with the Triss content in this game.

The developers did not promise more changes, but one can always hope for more improvements, even if the chance is low. As noted above, some scene tweaks may be possible later with mods.

Yennefer does seem rather forced upon us and seems to have more about her in every way, I would even argue Yennefer looks more beautiful due to the very creased forehead Triss seems to have grown.

That could perhaps be tweaked with mods in the future, although I am not sure if the current tools make such editing of the models possible. Other simple appearance improvements can be made with mods as well, like more natural hair color, and better LOD (cutscene model in gameplay).

 

[saladin1701]

The developers did not promise more changes, but one can always hope for more improvements, even if the chance is low. As noted above, some scene tweaks may be possible later with mods.

I hope so because I've just reached the third act for the first time since the changes went live and I'm deeply disappointed with them. Feels like being paid lip service rather than any genuine desire to bring parity between the romances and fix the broken time line and disjointed story.

---------- Updated at 11:22 PM ----------

I was rather disappointed by the lack of Triss in TW3, which was an insta-buy with the season pass for me due to how much I loved the first two games and subsequent reading of all of the books, and I really felt she took a back-seat in comparison to Yennefer, due to her debut in the games. Yennefer does seem rather forced upon us and seems to have more about her in every way, I would even argue Yennefer looks more beautiful due to the very creased forehead Triss seems to have grown. I'm beyond elated that this imbalance is actually being changed, as it was one of my favourite parts of TW2, the romance for one felt magical, unique and, well, romantic. The Hearts of Stone DLC with Shani embodied that very well for me, I felt Shani got the amount of content she deserved and it was all very special for her - that's the kind of stuff I'd love to see for Triss. I really can't wait for Blood and Wine now, and though I felt after the game rather lonely and melancholy in the open world and thus didn't play it too much, the DLC brought me back to adventuring both in it and now NG+. If we got maybe a return of Triss for that DLC (idk how likely that is) or just more in the game about her, I really think this game would be perfect for me, it was one of the greatest disappointments for me, on par with when I finished the game and realised I had nothing left to play. Hearts of Stone heartened me (excuse the pun) and reminded me that CDProjektRED still has it, more so when I found this thread and saw the patch notes about extra dialogue. That DLC's the kind of romance and content we need for Triss, she deserves better than the backseat, with so many inconsistencies.

A couple of good points here. It does annoy me no end that the game still pushes you towards Yen rather than treating Triss as an equally valid romance.

As for Shani, whilst there is a minor inconsistency with the inability for Geralt to tell her he's willing to settle down, she does feel far more of a genuine romance than Triss, or to be fair, Yen does, largely because of the highly enjoyable date you get to go on with her. It was a welcome diversion in an otherwise rather dark and serious story of the main quest. I really hope they include something like that for the two main love interests in the next expansion.

 

[Pug.]

It seems unlikely to me that CDPR is going to make any additional changes to Triss' character arc for several reasons:

i. The number of people who are actually requesting fixes is relatively small. I know it may not appear that way when you frequent the forums or visit threads like these, but it's important to take into account that forum members comprise a teeny tiny percentage of CDPR's customers. We're talking something like less than 1%. And of that 1%, the fraction of people who actually romanced Triss and have expressed dissatisfaction with her portrayal in-game is even more minuscule.

ii. It would probably be cost prohibitive to do a complete rewrite and isn't very realistic. Every time that CDPR makes substantial alterations they have to call in the writers, voice actors, programmers, Q & A teams, bug testers. It's a whole production.

iii. Given what Wild Hunt set out to accomplish, I think it's entirely reasonable that Yennefer has a larger role within the game. The main quest is about Geralt's search for his adoptive daughter and the familial bond which he, Yennefer, and Ciri share. It's also the first and probably only time that Yennefer is going to make an appearance within the franchise, so it should come as no surprise that the developers had to accord her more screen time for exposition and things of that nature.

Frankly, I'm amazed and grateful that CDPR even went to the trouble of including Triss as a romance option in this third and final game. Geralt recovering his memories provided them with a convenient means to end Triss and Geralt's relationship, and they could have just as easily focused entirely on Yennefer. God knows there's enough source material to drawn upon.

The additions which they implemented with patch 1.10 were also more than I was expecting. When CDPR said "small tweaks," I was expecting a few extra lines of dialogue inserted here and there, not whole new cut scenes.

I do hope that there are a few more opportunities to interact with Yennefer, Triss, and Ciri in the upcoming expansion Blood & Wine. I like some of the ideas that have been bandied about on these forums, e.g. including player housing for Geralt and his respective love interest, but I would caution people to keep their expectations in check and to remember that CDPR is, at the end of the day, a business with limited resources and man power.

 

[saladin1701]

Probably because the majority of people have given up all hope that CDPR actually give a shit. That doesn't mean we should given up being a vocal minority. All I want 'fixed' is Triss, Keira and Letho to be at Kaer Morhen at the beginning of Act 2, for the ability to correct certain NPCs about my romance choice and Acts 2 and 3 to have additional content added to them. Adding those characters to the beginning of Act 2 provides a platform for more content and, in the case of Triss, presents an opportunity to scrap the romance lock in. Things like Eredin, Dijkstra and boss fights or the save import from TW2 are not things I would expect them to ever fix, it's simply too much work. I've never viewed asking Triss romance to be treated as seriously as Yen's romance to be an unreasonable thing to ask.