TW3 General Feedback [SPOILERS]

[derpinsky]

@HolyDemon,

did you read what you just wrote?

" In other games I would often do every combat I encountered even if I wanted to go to a question location, simply because otherwise it would feel like a waste. Now I don't have to deal with that anymore"

Exactly, if its more work to fight in a game about fighting and you just avoid it, that's a bad game design.

and yes, if it costs more based on the income of the game, it objectively punishing you and everyone else who chooses to fight random mobs... that's how logic works.

but you are right, its more realistic because in reality you would want to avoid fight... in a game you want to enjoy them and seek them (bad game design)

 

[kaltorakh]

I was one of the people who got lucky and got the game early. I finished it, put more hours into it already than I dare admit and I will stand by this design choice.

I can see what you are trying to say, I do not think i'm missing the point. Rather it looks to me like your point is valid but only as long as it's raised against most other open world games, but not Wild Hunt.

There is much to say on this topic, but i'm not sure it will make any sense to someone early in the game and i'm not about to spoil anything either. So for now I suppose we will have to agree to disagree.

I'm on the side that thinks that every fight should give more reward than costs. But kudos to your polite and well explained posts. Your posts are like every forum should be.

 

[derpinsky]

@gogmeister777

yes you can make small amounts of money that way, but you make a lot more money by just avoiding the fighting all together and just picking up loot. Its literally counter productive to fight enemies.

 

[kaltorakh]

I hate that you get your ass handed to you if you go off the path of the story, I easily ran into 2 groups of deserters that were 10 levels higher than me, took one arrow and lost 90% of my health.

I prefer a system like Skyrim's where the environment 'levels up' with you. So it doesn't come down to levels but instead to skill. And sure, I can dance around a mob for 10 minutes without getting hit but there's no fun in that.

No, no, no and again no.

Dynamic leveling = no leveling at all. This was the worst mistake of Oblivion, which for me was only playable after a mod that fixed the levels. In skyrim they fixed it a bit, there are ranges of levels.

But when everything levels with you, you are removing the leveling factor from the game.

I would like random encounters to give more reward than they cost you... buu I prefer it the way it is than dynamic leveling. Anything but that

 

[HolyDemon]

I disagree, I think it's good design, I don't want to do every fight in a game because that gets dull. I play the game for the quests and story and lore, not for combat all the time. This game is about more than fighting.

I guess maybe you do want to seek every fight in a game, but I don't. I don't see the point in unnecessary filler fights, I rather do a quest instead.

I don't think it is bad game design at all, but if all you care about is fighting enemies all the time then yes I can see why it's not working for you.

 

[kaltorakh]

I disagree, I think it's good design, I don't want to do every fight in a game because that gets dull. I play the game for the quests and story and lore, not for combat all the time. This game is about more than fighting.

I guess maybe you do want to seek every fight in a game, but I don't. I don't see the point in unnecessary filler fights, I rather do a quest instead.

I don't think it is bad game design at all, but if all you care about is fighting enemies all the time then yes I can see why it's not working for you.

Thing is, fighting+reward is pretty tied with exploring. If you jsut do quests, you are not exploring, you are following the dots on the map. And that's fine, I like that too. But then, sometimes I just want to explore, but... 1. Exploring an area without enemies is boring 2. Killing enemies where your costs are higher than your gains makes you think, why am I exploring?

So it's not just "you guys like fighting too much". Fighting beeing worthwhile gives life to the world and makes exploring fun

 

[moonknightgog]

Thing is, fighting+reward is pretty tied with exploring. If you jsut do quests, you are not exploring, you are following the dots on the map. And that's fine, I like that too. But then, sometimes I just want to explore, but... 1. Exploring an area without enemies is boring 2. Killing enemies where your costs are higher than your gains makes you think, why am I exploring?

So it's not just "you guys like fighting too much". Fighting beeing worthwhile gives life to the world and makes exploring fun

Absolutely no. It's not a JRPG, it is an RPG. XP reward is for quests only. Because an RPG is not about the random trash enemy encounter, it's about the quest design.

You are exploring for loot, for new quests, for places of power. Not for XP.

 

[Fronko32]

I was wondering if I'm doing something wrong. I have explored a big chunk of the map already, checked the board twice, and I'm still on level 2. Now to officially do the main quest I'm supposed to be level 3, but I'm not sure what else I can do to level up. The experience points being given aren't that much.

 

[Yellowcardus]

@Yellowcardus

again you haven't addressed the point...

Objectively does it cost more to fight things than to avoid them? yes or no?

Ah, in that case I have indeed missed your meaning.

As is the case with any game where monsters don't scale with you. Killing lower level creatures will eventually become a waste of time, unless you need the loot for crafting. However the Witcher 3 extends this to all monsters outside of quests. They will drop useful (sometimes invaluable) loot and often guard areas that provide:

• Quest starting items (diaries etc.)
• Unique items (upgradable armor sets)
• Ability points (Places of power)

But attempting to grind on higher level monsters is made a lot harder than in most other games.
There is a way however, and here is how:

• There is an ability in your general abilities menu that allows you to regenerate wounds when outside of combat and in the sun. Making food almost entirely unnecessary early in the game. (This naturally cuts your expenses)

• Many trophies that you acquire from monsters are not required as proof by the quest giver. Trophies, like in the past game confer a bonus. And believe it or not a bonus that increases XP gained from monsters is surprisingly common. The first such trophy just so happens to come from the first "boss" monster in the game, the Griffin. And yes Peter Saar Gwynleve, - the Nilgaardian captain - doesn't rob you of the trophy. (This increases your XP gains of course).

• Repairing your gear is rarely necessary, it will never be destroyed completely. When you find the penalty drops the damage or defense beyond another piece of gear in your inventory you can simply change it. Before you notice, you will have a new piece of gear that is better. (No need to pay for repair).

• All monsters I can think of have more than one weakness. You don't need to craft a bomb, oil or potion to win, they make your life easier but signs work just as well.

With this you can grind a ton of money and even some XP if that's really what you desire.

 

[kaltorakh]

Absolutely no. It's not a JRPG, it is an RPG. XP reward is for quests only. Because an RPG is not about the random trash enemy encounter, it's about the quest design.

You are exploring for loot, for new quests, for places of power. Not for XP.

I didn't say it has to be more XP, although it would also be better. But at least more loot reward than the cost of repair+food, which in most random encounters isnt.

And the rest you say is not exploring for me. Following a quest or a place of power is not exploring. Exploring is saying, Ill just leave the path in this direction into the forest, lets see what I encounter. And those "encounters" have to cost me less than what they give me, otherwise leaving the "path" to the quest is just better.

---------- Updated at 01:09 PM ----------

Thanks for the tips Yellowcardus.

In my case it's not grinding what I want, but the feel that after a random combat I'm stronger/richer not poorer

 

[derpinsky]

@Yellowcardus

Closer to the point, but not quite there yet...

going to the markers on your map is not exploring and most of them are apart of missions... so are all quest items

in skyrim when you explore (off the beaten path no mission no marker no objectives) you gain money and levels, its beneficial. In the witcher going off the beaten path gets you nothing but a infinitesimally small amount of experience which it would take a dozen hours of grinding to level once (even with the bonuses). It is a better decision to strictly follow the quest line and never explore anything outside of it, that's the problem... in a really big beautiful world the game punishes you for exploring it.

 

[Yellowcardus]

It looks to me like we just have different taste, you say that design of XP gain is objectively bad, but I find it very, very good. I don't know if that makes you wrong, but I certainly don't feel wrong myself.

To me personally, the carrot on a stick approach is often so over used that the mere sight of the "carrot" makes me sick. Why is it that exploration cannot be a reward unto itself? Why do I need an incentive? I never killed a single enemy in any game other than "loot games" (like Diablo) for XP. That crumbling castle in the distance? That's what makes me go there, the opponents on the way are not bundles of loot or XP. The game has terrific draw distance I see interesting stuff wherever I look. I don't need the perpetual loop of improvement cycle to entice me to see more of it.

 

[Visegrip117]

(Today found some monsters in the wood, nothing special there, killed them. Then activated Witcher senses ... still nothing there. Then wanted to walk away, but tree-stump caught my opinion. Again senses on - still nothing. But I did go to the stump anyway and had to laugh, some nice gauntlets where hidden there ... so, sometimes you just need to explore carefully )

I also, saw a hollowed out stump, and figured what the heck let's have a look. Sure enough there was loot inside.

Also many of the loot bags, treasure chest, often blend in with the scenery. And not everything gets highlighted with the witcher sense. Some things require a little more exploration and a keen eye.

And to the OP.
Admittedly, I'm not very far along in the game. Maybe some of the more seasoned members could chime in. But it may be possible that further along as you upgrade armor/ weapons that they have more durability? Also there's the use of the signs. Which to my knowledge, doesn't require being repaired. So maybe use more fire and less sword on the enemy would reduce your cost of combat?

I've upgraded my fire once (don't remeber spelling of the actual name. Newbie, I know) and with a couple casts and and a few dodges, I have no problem taking out weaker foes.

Again, I'm still very early into the game, so take all this with a grain of salt please.

 

[zeuseason]

I play for the fights mostly, story and lore quite down the list of enjoyable things to do in a game for me. I'll go out of my way to fight mobs instead of following a linear quest line.

 

[algroshaw]

just wait for mods- we shall see double xp, more gold, etc

 

[val.mitev]

Thing is, fighting+reward is pretty tied with exploring. If you jsut do quests, you are not exploring, you are following the dots on the map. And that's fine, I like that too. But then, sometimes I just want to explore, but... 1. Exploring an area without enemies is boring 2. Killing enemies where your costs are higher than your gains makes you think, why am I exploring?

So it's not just "you guys like fighting too much". Fighting beeing worthwhile gives life to the world and makes exploring fun

From my experience so far, the cost of fighting is never higher than the reward.
I can go about, killing monsters and bandits for a while and during that time I gather quite a lot of stuff that is worth way more than the cost of the repairs.

I'm not sure how the gear degradation is handled. If your strikes are often blocked, this could degrade the weapon faster. This way just bashing the shield of an enemy would be bad for your sword. It could also depend on the armor of the enemy, heavy armored opponents could degrade the weapons faster as well.
Does anyone know if there's a proper explanation of this system?

---------- Updated at 01:56 PM ----------

just wait for mods- we shall see double xp, more gold, etc

Basically making the game too easy.

 

[derpinsky]

@Yellowcardus

no, has nothing to do with opinion, if you like smashing you head against a brick wall that is your opinion. If the game gives you less for more work, thats an objective punishment for an action.

it is objectively true that by playing the game you will get more money and more experience by never exploring, and only ever doing the quests.

This is objective ive tested it, you can to, you spend less money and get more experience by never doing anything but the quests.

if a reasonable amount of experience was gained from killing random mobs, there would be a reason to explore the world. As in previous witcher games it is more effective to run past everything and complete the mission there is no incentive for exploration.

spending 5 min perfectly dodging and countering an enemy twice you level that kills you in one hit hoping for a really awesome XP boost only to realize you get jack makes the combat utterly disappointing and empty to fight and kill creatures that are not mission related..

 

[GeraltOrBust]

+1 please add this option

 

[Sethanor]

+1
/10char

 

[LambertoKevlar]

+1 please