Unfair judgement sorrounding this game.

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I honestly think Cyberpunk is not bad, not average, it's actualy good. Not great, not revolutionary, it's good.

My first impression was comparison to Fallout 4 - becouse gameplay is quite similar in my opinion. Cyberpunk ( even in the current state ) , is to me much better title than Fallout 4, which was nominated for game of the year award. It's just my personal preference so nobody cares, but it's puzzling to me how harsh Cyberpunk is judged in comparison to similar titles. It's almost like this game supost to be game of games. THE GAME, to play forever and ever till the end of times - and if it's not that ? - it's complete garbage!

Now let's talk about year of the release, and why it doesn't matter at all. I am still playing legendary RPG's like New Vegas, VtMB, Planescape Torment or Mass Effect 1 , and havent found anything similar to replace those games yet ( maybe I'll never will ). So it doesn't matter if it's 2020, becouse we all know games doesn't get better in a linear way. Graphics change, sure, and that's about it. We could even argue that essential gameplay elements are getting worse with every new year. Making visuals for the game takes so much time nowdays ... polishing, optimization, cool gameplay features ? " ain't nobody got time for that ". The most important rule of Triple A releases ? Has to look good.

It's trendy thing nowdays to give CDPR hard time for this release, and that's fair. They deserve criticism. But if we talking about game alone, Cyberpunk is not even nearly that bad like some people trying to make it look. What i see all over the internet is a lot of nitpicking, clickbait articles \ videos, and ton of bad will.

I recommend more playing, less browsing.
 
The judgement of the game is fair. It's also more of a judgement of character for CDPR.

They talk a big game: Consumer friendly, non-greed, trust and so on. They broke all the principles they built up.

They lied, the game did not run remotely well on last gen. It was awful.

They broke peoples trust, they released a game in an unacceptably broken state.

They were consumer unfriendly, as they hid the base last gen console games from everyone. They didn't give out review copies of them and had reviewers not use footage of the games, presumably to hide the bugs.

They were greedy, they released the game in a state that would make EA blush. Then say ehh whatever release it anyways.

Lets be honest the game is only on last gen because most userbase of consoles is on that (Assumption on my part that its due to greed, but whatever the reason its not a good reason). Could it be delayed on just them? Sure probably. But that would cost money. They decided its best to release an unacceptably broken game that is so unacceptable sony took it down and both they and xbox are offering refunds.


Once again the issue was that they spoke a big game, but didn't walk the walk. Actions speak louder than words and their actions show they didn't care. This is also a management issue as it came out to so obviously be. Witcher 3 had issues during development with insane, for some folk 3 year long, crunch. They promised it wouldnt happen again.

2018, devs complain about working conditions on CP2077.

2020, game is an unacceptable mess. Developers are rather unhappy going by the meeting with some choice quotes.
"One employee asked the board why it had said in January that the game was “complete and playable” when that wasn’t true, to which the board answered that it would take responsibility. Another developer asked whether CD Projekt’s directors felt it was hypocritical to make a game about corporate exploitation while expecting that their employees work overtime. The response was vague and noncommital."

The judgement surrounding this game is unfair in that some people are being more awful than they should with death threats and blaming the devs, or attacking certain people specifically. Make no mistake: These people don't deserve to be heard and are the worst kind of people. Nobody should be attacked for this.

But the issues can also not be ignored: The game wasn't finished because to put it lightly management (and by extension the board of directors that some senior managers are on) once again underestimated the time it would take to make the game. They also lied about the state of the game. And released a broken mess. All while speaking of releasing the game when its done, and leaving the greed to others.

The outrage is deserved, and I hope they look internally at how they plan things out because this should have never happened in the first place. The development team (management excluded) did the best damn job in the world with what they had. They should be praised not yelled at or sent death threats. Criticism should be constructive.

But the judgement is fair. They fucked up.
 

iCake

Forum veteran
The game is good and has a very tangible potential to become great, given proper refinement and treatment. But what @bureizu said there. All the more reason why It is especially painful to realize that the game was released unfinished. And all that coming from who? CDPR no less! It's a "them of all people" kind of situation to many and that's why people got fired up so much and so quickly.
 
I'd also like to add that don't get me wrong: I like the game. I think it's fun. It could have been a masterpiece.

Do I think its a good game? No. Is it a masterpiece? Not even close. Don't confuse a fun game with a good game because those things are very different.

It's a fun game in spite of its issues, due to the excellent work that the great folk over in CDPR put into the game with what time they had. Its a testament to their skill, determination and passion that even in this worst state possible the game is still fun.

A lesser game wouldn't be. The potential for this game was an absolute masterpiece. If they just had the time to finish all the promised features they clearly wanted to make.

I'm more angry about CDPRs response to allegations on their management. Last time it was also noncomittal and they just brushed it off. Which I found disgusting. 2018? Same thing. 2020? "vague and noncommital" this attitude to me is as unacceptable as death threats sent to developers. I hope this mess and ordeal will make them open their eyes and decide its time for real change. I am holding out hope that management will decide yes. We messed up. This is our plan on how to improve because we are clearly not doing a good job and we can change.

I believe they can change, people deserve chances even if its like the fourth now? Maybe I'm being a clown for having some hope for a better future. Though I've made my stance clear on how I see their response to issues there. I don't see why they cant learn from this, accept their mistakes, publicly apologize and actually commit to doing better.

They [management] aren't bad people and don't deserve to be fired as some have stated before. But perhaps the wild success of Witcher 3 has blinded them as it tends to do with just about anyone in their position. It's time to wake up managers, we got a reputation to rebuild.

Note: Played a lot of the game, I think its fun. But not a good game by any means. It can be good with time and eventually a masterpiece.
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Only tangentially related but has anyone found a translator implant yet? I remember them talking about this in a promotional video but have yet to come across one myself. What’s more, at least with subtitles turned out V apparently understands Russian, Japanese, Chinese and Spanish without an issue given that I can tell what enemies are saying to each other.
 
Only tangentially related but has anyone found a translator implant yet?
It doesn't exist. Probably because it wasn't deemed fun? Or intuitive? Or just cut.

Don't expect to find many things from the promotional videos. Many were changed or cut out due to time constraints. You can see this in the police system. Great plans: But clearly cut for time and replaced with a band aid solution.
 
I honestly think Cyberpunk is not bad, not average, it's actualy good. Not great, not revolutionary, it's good.
You're right, it is good. Problem is, it's not the game that was advertised.

Borderlands series games are considered a good or even great games. Still, I don't play them, because I don't like this type of games. I'm just not the shooter guy.

Cyberpunk was advertised as highly immersive, first-person RPG experience in a detailed, interactive open world. I wanted to play that game, because this is the type of games that I like. But it isn't what it was supposed to be. It's a shooter with RPG elements, in an open world that offers very little in terms of interaction. It can be a bloody good shooter, but I'm not a shooter guy.

In conclusion, the judgment is fair, because what we are judging is not the game by itself, but the game that it is, in the context of the game it was supposed to be.
 
Only tangentially related but has anyone found a translator implant yet? I remember them talking about this in a promotional video but have yet to come across one myself. What’s more, at least with subtitles turned out V apparently understands Russian, Japanese, Chinese and Spanish without an issue given that I can tell what enemies are saying to each other.

what the hell are you talking about ? i can see in real time how subtitles above enemy head translates each word.
 
what the hell are you talking about ? i can see in real time how subtitles above enemy head translates each word.
Aye, I think they're referring to the highlighted blue words. Which is a bit odd in that everything translates but certain very specific things. If I remember right this was suppose to be part of what gets auto translated when you had the chip, but was probably changed/removed.

Now it's just a bit confusing that some sentences are translated, other times words or short phrases aren't. Inconsistent basically.
 
what the hell are you talking about ? i can see in real time how subtitles above enemy head translates each word.

He's right in a way. You see if you turn off subtitles you would not see that real time translation presented as, surprise, subtitles! What a bummer! I hope it's just another bug that'd be fixed eventually. This kind of subtitles should be its own thing, and should not be affected by genereal subtitles settings.
 
I honestly think Cyberpunk is not bad, not average, it's actualy good. Not great, not revolutionary, it's good.

My first impression was comparison to Fallout 4 - becouse gameplay is quite similar in my opinion. Cyberpunk ( even in the current state ) , is to me much better title than Fallout 4, which was nominated for game of the year award. It's just my personal preference so nobody cares, but it's puzzling to me how harsh Cyberpunk is judged in comparison to similar titles. It's almost like this game supost to be game of games. THE GAME, to play forever and ever till the end of times - and if it's not that ? - it's complete garbage!

Now let's talk about year of the release, and why it doesn't matter at all. I am still playing legendary RPG's like New Vegas, VtMB, Planescape Torment or Mass Effect 1 , and havent found anything similar to replace those games yet ( maybe I'll never will ). So it doesn't matter if it's 2020, becouse we all know games doesn't get better in a linear way. Graphics change, sure, and that's about it. We could even argue that essential gameplay elements are getting worse with every new year. Making visuals for the game takes so much time nowdays ... polishing, optimization, cool gameplay features ? " ain't nobody got time for that ". The most important rule of Triple A releases ? Has to look good.

It's trendy thing nowdays to give CDPR hard time for this release, and that's fair. They deserve criticism. But if we talking about game alone, Cyberpunk is not even nearly that bad like some people trying to make it look. What i see all over the internet is a lot of nitpicking, clickbait articles \ videos, and ton of bad will.

I recommend more playing, less browsing.

I agree with you: having in mind those games you quote (less F:NV I've never played as the third installation in the series was a "meh" for me), I think that Cyberpunk can be listed in their same category of "really good memories" and I sometimes replay them for what they gave to me in terms of feelings, characters and stories to tell.
I am 34 and I have not many free time to spare in gaming (like when I attended university), so I probably will finish CP2077 with many GIGs and Side Quests incomplete (not the main ones, like Judy or Panam, but RIver yes for example). For me this is a plus, as the next run will have a lot of content I've not already played. Content with good background, not Skyrim-like fetch quests.
I can understand the view of completionist or of people that want to play for 200+ hours with new missions and contents (even if randomized or not exactly original), but for my style of play it is very good.
And I like the story (I appreciate the sad endings, there's no problem for that kind of epilogue) and voice acting (even Keanu Reeves, I don't know why people dislike him as Silverhand).
 
I take into consideration many things when I speak my mind, the important thing is to do it with a relaxed tone. Those that derivate into external matters, being political or whatever, and change the tone of the conversation are to blame, but I don't think CD Projekt is free of blame.

Many need to understand that the last straw of development for this game happened during a pandemic, post launch development is still happening during a pandemic, and I understand it very well. I haven't really made a single post blaming them for launching this game in the state that it is regarding bugs/performance, I haven't. I know that they will deliver on those terms.

Now, my issue, and many others' issue, is the fact they are toning down a lot of aspects of this game. Almost all of it is here if you want to read it.

I was just checking the 2020 source book included in our extra goodies and it just deeply saddens me how so many aspects about character customization, and body cult is non-existant in the game. The game is based that table-RPG, but apart from violence and taking place in Night City, I don't really see much of it.

People is addicted to body modifications, they go around almost naked, there's no sexual inhibition or shame. But we can't shower naked, we can't change our body, we can't do anything, we can't watch braindances, we can't really do ANYTHING fun. We are just a mercenary that is in this city to kill and carry on black ops, lol. Look at these strippers, please...
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As I said, my issue isn't that the game needs a lot of performance and bug fixing, is that content is being/has been censored behind doors...
 
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Agreed in part: The game is ok to good...

...although, this comes with many many many caveats, from CDPR's whole handling of the development and marketing, to the state the game is in on consoles, the missing and unfinished content and systems, etc.

So, yea, not sure the "bashing" is entirely unwarranted... look at it this way: People don't care for EA or Bethesda enough anymore to even bash their broken messes. Not sure we would want that for CDPR.
 
They dig the grave themselves. It's fair. If they didn't make big promises, release the game as it is, then they won't get this much backlash. Even if the game in the same stage, it would be at most "let down but good game with bugs".

The biggest problem is previous-gen. PC gamers, we knew a head of time what we would get and we were prepared. But console? That's THE WORST even with EA's standard. You don't lie or try to hide the fact that it can barely run on previous gen like that, and pray that people would just accept the most anticipate game of this year in that state.

TL;DR bad PR and upper management ruins GoTY.
 
People don't care for EA or Bethesda enough anymore to even bash their broken messes. Not sure we would want that for CDPR.
Best way to explain this:
You expect more out of someone who you trust and like, not less. Especially when they tend to speak and follow through on their principles. Small mess ups? Happen. Completely shattering every pillar of their principles? You will be sorely disappointed. Angry if they go entirely against their principles as CDPR did.

Compare this to an unlikable dead beat drunkard. People don't expect much from him. It's just Monday for them. Or well, literally any day of the week. That being EA in this example.

I believe CDPR thought people would give them somewhat of a free pass for the issues with CP2077 due to their reputation. Time they can use to fix, improve and get the game to a better state. Some did, but they broke so many pillars of what make up their reputation that a ton of folk are infuriated and for good reason.
 
I do not mind the people that say its buggy or not advertise. It is the people that think the game core features are awful. They are good, not solid or great. The photomode I wish was live action with V but it is what it is. 6/10 for me but I think the game can get better than that with some love from the devs. I do not feel sorry for the people expecting and wanting a different game. Refunds are being issued out easier than what would have been if the game was retail only sales. I mean open boxes was impossible to refund unless you made a scene.
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Quite honestly I do not see how people thought they could pull off the game play that was hyped up in the first place. I seen the hype and thought I would believe it when I see it. I am not a fan of the Witcher series one bit.
 
While the game definitely has it's issues I have enjoyed the experience so far.

As for all the judgement surrounding the game the most astonishing thing is watching people resort to insulting people for having the audacity to enjoy things they don't. If this game does not meet your expectations you should not try to force your disappointment and misery to people who are having a good time.
 
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