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Okay. Please don't go after other people for their opinions. -You- think "there are no excuses" but that doesn't make it truth.
This is a discussion forum, and there are many opinions. As long as everyone sticks to the rules, everyone gets to post.
Don't tell people they should stop posting their opinions or perspectives or arguments here, thanks.
They released the teaser for Cyberpunk 2077 to test the waters but no actual work was done. After Witcher 3 the pre-production supposedly started, but I could be wrong.
True, CDPR always tries to be ambitious which is something I hold in very high regards. Other studios only make incremental changes to avoid problems that might arise.
Yup, I definitely was getting the patches mixed up, I completely forgot about the hotfix.
Probably speaks volumes as to what was updated with it (nothing significant from where I stand and possibly why I have forgotten about it
).Cheers!
1.31 brought back the wet roadsYup, I definitely was getting the patches mixed up, I completely forgot about the hotfix.
Probably speaks volumes as to what was updated with it (nothing significant from where I stand and possibly why I have forgotten about it
Cheers!
1.31 brought back the wet roads
I have to admit I've not noticed the removal before but I have definitely noticed the improvements to them in 1.31.
I think the problem was that I stopped playing altogether after 1.31 since I'm waiting for something more substantial after my time already spent with the game.
But hey, I was wrong again, two for two
.
No...I'm saying it's not conclusive evidence. It's not even really evidence. Of much of anything. At all.
The only things we know for certain are:
1.) Release of the Next-Gen Update postponed until 2022.
2.) Little yellow chart confirms this. Otherwise: mostly blank.
Not being informed of details does not mean that there are no details. Not having information is not evidence of there being no information. Thinking a thing because I think so based on nothing but what I think and whole lot of stuff I don't know does not validate something.
How about waiting for more information from the studio before leaping to wildly speculative conclusions?
It is. It is also a non-issue if you're not keen on going on GTA-like rampages.
The way some people talk about it is as if it makes the game literally unplayable. Which begs the question: what kind of game do you want to play if underdeveloped police system is game-breaking to you? That's where ''this isn't GTA, move on'' comes from.
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Absolutely agree. No work on the actual gameplay, the story details, etc., but just looking at the incredible level of visualization that needed to be done to capture the tone and style of that piece shows that a hell of a lot of work had already been done at the conceptual/design stage. Plus, it's 100% proof that they were already in business with Pondsmith and R. Talsorian Games. They were directly using the IP.
None of that happened over the course of a few days. That teaser was the result of a significant amount of ongoing work.
But I, too, believe it was absolutely to test the waters. Tricky gamble, too. The whole cyberpunk genre has never achieved much more than a cult following around the world. Arguably, ongoing developments in anime especially have drawn in more of a widespread audience, but it's still not a genre that can be considered a main-stream hit.
Right behind this, as well. The downside is that when you try to push the envelope constantly like that, eventually something is not going to work out as spectacularly as hoped. But I'd never want to discourage that sort of creativity and just "play it safe."
1.31 brought back the wet roads
And none of it ever appeared on the chart!I have to admit I've not noticed the removal before but I have definitely noticed the improvements to them in 1.31.
I think the problem was that I stopped playing altogether after 1.31 since I'm waiting for something more substantial after my time already spent with the game.
But hey, I was wrong again, two for two
Exactly as stated above -- all opinions are welcome and will be respected. My position as a moderator has absolutely nothing to do whatsoever with my freedom to express my thoughts in any discussion. All moderators are still community members, too. I'm bound by exactly the same rules as everyone else.
To that end, nothing that I am saying is a personal criticism or judgement. What I'm identifying are fallacies of reasoning and argumentation (objectively stated) that are leading people to extremely negative conclusions for invalid reasons. Let me hit it this way:
Could there be absolutely nothing else released, patches or DLC, until next year? Absolutely. That's a possibility:
- It could be because huge portions of the engine need to be rebuilt before any further work can continue.
- It could be that whole swaths of the development team are being moved over to the Next-Gen work, and there's not enough available for other parts of the game.
- Perhaps there's an issue with licensing between CDPR and one of its partners that's put a freeze on any further content until it's sorted.
- Maybe the studio suffered a major failure with some of their critical technology.
- Maybe there's a huge delay because the designers are still trying to figure out exactly where they want to take the game next.
Where am I getting any of that? I could argue that there's clearly a staffing and/or technological issue, since the Next-Gen Update was delayed. "Obviously", this "must" be true, since if they had more people and no issues, it would be done faster -- isn't that right?
Nope.
That's completely invalid reasoning. Just like all of the bullet points I list above are totally groundless speculation based on absolutely nothing. I just pulled them out of thin air.
There's no argumentation issue with someone saying:
"I have a bad feeling about the future of the game. These delays don't really inspire a lot of confidence, and the near radio-silence coming from the studio isn't helping anything. We're paying customers, and we've had a rather rough ride since the launch. Can we not get some direct explanation from CDPR about what's going on and why?"
^ Nothing wrong with that! That's a personal opinion on the situation, completely validated by the existing communications from the studio, and expressing dissatisfaction, constructively and respectfully.
There is a significant problem with someone saying:
"And now, we clearly don't have any more updates or anything until the end of the year! You've gotta be kidding me. And how do we learn this -- we get a sneaky update to the roadmap that they intentionally didn't advertise."
^ Numerous issues here. This is presumptive and accusatory reasoning assuming a foregone conclusion based on nothing but a lack of information and pure speculation. It is pointing fingers (which is not allowed on the forums). The tone is derogatory and abrasive, and is implying that people are being dishonest with absolutely no evidence beyond a single, vague chart being edited and the writer's subjective impression. This is not only non-constructive...
...it's invalid argumentation. (<--- This is the part I'm choosing to focus on.)
As for the rest: yeah. I get it. People are annoyed because it's taking longer than everyone wanted, and a lot of players are just not happy with the overall game. Can't really say it worked out brilliantly, and I won't ever stop people from expressing their complaints. Such is life. But:
Everyone is free to express their opinions. Everyone is required to remain constructive and respectful. Someone expressing a different point of view or saying things you happen to disagree with is not an attack.
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I'm fine with that and I already have said it earlier. I only think that editing many months old annoucement with updated info (graphic and also text part) without saying a word is wrong way how to handle informations flow on forum (I guess am not alone with such view). All other things you are saying are not relevant to what I wanted point at. For me is important only what I wrote in bold/yellow text above, I do not want evaluate given informations relevance or debating about actualised annoucement content, there is already enough written about it by others. I accept that you do have different view on it, so we can agree on disagree.
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Absolutely not. My point (half joke, I put the
) was just saying that regarding cp77 development time, the most common narratives were my point 1 and my point 2 (implying "poor Devs they didn't have enough time"). No more no less. Please don't try to read between the lines, I write what I think, if it's not there, I don't mean it.He had quotes with names of CDPR former employees and a track record that makes him quite reliable. Anyway, feel free to think he's making things up as other people (me included) are free to think he's right at least to a good extent. The power of freedom of speech and thoughts
As I said, don't try to read between the lines. I don't think it's your forte. Or do it, freedom of speech, but keep in mind I've never said anything like that. On the other hand... Other studios are better at estimating their skills. Maybe. Who knows, some games way more ambitious than cyberpunk exist but potentially they wanted to make them even bigger and failed so they just gave up and decided to polish the game with the fetsure it had. We can speculate as much as we want to prove we're right.
Oh, and btw, "if you think it's easy do it yourself" is the worst argument ever. I'm proving my skills in my job, I don't need to do other people's ones. Feel free to say drugs don't save lives if you want to criticize mine, you won't be the first, but also off topic I fear, we're here to discuss about cyberpunk if it's allowed.
I think the reaction was because gamers usually expect features of an upcoming game of this scale to be just as good and polished as in older games or better, certainly not worse. It's not natural to go backwards. This doesn't mean that every big new release has to have call of duty like shooting, forza like driving, have npc routines and interaction like rdr2 etc. Developers should make sure that the systems present in their game are at least usable, which police in my opinion is not. At least not in a way that wouldn't damage the worldbuilding. When I tried to mess with it, It broke my immersion quicker than you could snap a finger.
People don't care whether the developers had any prior experience with such a system or not. The fact that cyberpunk never tried to be like GTA also doesn't matter. All that matters to the public eye is that the game includes a feature that has been done way better a long time ago. CDPR said that the system or AI in general was bugged but they didn't really do much to "fix" it so far. Which leads me to the conclusion that the system is indeed that underdeveloped.
Sadly this overshadowed a lot of things in which cyberpunk is leagues above the competion.
Personally, I found out there was something wrong with the police after 20 hours during my first playthrough, from the internet. That's how important was police for me.
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Knowing that the previous Patch/Hotfix/DLCs have not been announced before their release, so even if something is "ready to release" right now, it would be weird to do it in November at random date rather than, I don't know... for example, around the December 10th (and also make an announcement about them before)
IMHO that's an extremely smart move actually. As long as the increment is significant.
Knowing that the previous Patch/Hotfix/DLCs have not been announced before their release, so even if something is "ready to release" right now, it would be weird to do it in November at random date rather than, I don't know... for example, around the December 10th (and also make an announcement about them before)
I feel like that's wishful thinking...
Its sort of a shame that the CDPR management did not take this sort of wisdom to heart, especially since the devs knew the game needed way more time in the oven
Well, the question is what would make the police more usable. My preferred solution would be spawning level 100 MaxTac squad to one-shot players who'd go into the GTA-mode. It wouldn't harm the worldbuilding, but it wouldn't be very popular with GTA fans. It's not really about realism, but what they consider as "fun". System that effectively prohibits carnage isn't very fun (for them).
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That would be better than what we have now, I agree at least to some extent, but the optimal situation is a fully working police system that opens up to emergent gameplay. I also don't think it'll ever be achieved in cp77.
This is exactly what I was thinking about earlier, some sort of drastic punishment. No need to run away, or make car chases, you're dead anyway
Not really, I don't say (and I don't know) if something is ready or if something will be released in December, just that it would be very weird to release it now while the anniversary date is in only one month
And I'm habit to wait in any case, no problem on my side. More than a year to see Subnautica Below Zero on Xbox, more than a year to see Terraria Journey's End on Xbox,... the list could be (very) long. Whatever I think, write or ask won't make it release any faster... So, few months, it's really nothing (And I have other games to play if I want).
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Just because it's a non-issue for you doesn't mean it should be a non-issue for everyone even those with no interest in GTA-like rampages.
Just saying it doesn't make it so.
I've seen very few people call it "game breaking". Especially on it's own. A game is the sum of it's parts and the police problem is only compounded by the other issues.
I want an immersive game, which this is obviously meant to be. Yet, it definitely breaks my immersion when I see a police officer spawn out of thin air because....
For me, it is about realism. You probably don't believe me (why would you? this is the internet) but it truly is.
I would take one-shot kill MaxTac squads at maximum wanted level any day over what we have currently. A realist and immersive police system implies appropriate level of response relatively to the game and it's lore/setting and your actions. MaxTac coming in to simply end you makes perfect sense at maximum wanted level because you killed a bunch of police officers or whole lot of civilians by that point and you need to die.
You're painting with a broad brush here. Not every GTA fan is the rampage loving kind you seem to think they are. One can play and enjoy the hell out of GTA without spending every minute blowing shit up.
This last bit I aim generally.
We all agree the police system is mediocre at best. Just because you don't care for it getting better doesn't mean you should dismiss other people's opinions/feedback on improving the system or try to shut down conversations about it. At worst the feedback will be ignored and at best we'll all get something better and you'll still be free to stay completely out of trouble and ignore the system completely.
EDIT: Of course the same is true of any criticism/feedback regarding any of the game's systems. Not just the police system.
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