Upgraded roadmap speculation

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Pawel Sasko said in last stream interesting thing about 3rd person programmer jobs - in general that players solution is not always the best but their feedback shines light on a problem or feature to work on. Could be my wishfull thinking but my interpretation of that was that there wont be TPP in CP2077 but because people want to see V more often , they might be working on ways to show it more often - like have V in reflections and thats why you need proper animations and model.
 
I think this is the reason tbh. Would be the easiest way too make clothes and looks matter ingame. The shadows are pretty nice now with hair and all but not reflecting anything is really odd. vampire V.

Not to be a jerk, but you can look down to see your clothes. The running animations still look awkward though. It's like they focused on the camera being right, but the shadow just looks weird.
 
It took Rockstar a long time to implement Online play. I just can't see CDPR not trying for multiplayer at some point. Outside of modding, multiplayer is the best for sure way to guarantee longevity. Joining a faction and battling others for dominance would be great. Throw in character customization and it's a winning recipe, imo. Be modded like Maelstrom, tatt'd like the Tyger Claws, roided like the Animals, etc etc.

That doesnt make any sense, Ubisoft and Bethesda both grew insanely big without anykind of online. Game industry seems to think online is somekind of mandatory, but it isnt. Your brand gotta be pretty strong before you move to online.
 
That doesnt make any sense, Ubisoft and Bethesda both grew insanely big without anykind of online.
Strangely enough, CDPR was nearly worth more than both Ubisoft and Bethesda combined in 2020 at 8.1b, according to various sources. Do you want to talk about a specific year, because we both know about Fallout 76, Farcry, The Division, etc etc... Frankly, I don't think it matters what other game companies have done, and it's not as if 2077 multiplayer is a thing right now at this moment. Witcher 3 and 2077 are easily the biggest competition for Elder Scrolls and Fallout (and arguably the only real competition for those types of games), and many people would no doubt argue that Witcher 3, by itself, is a much better game than both Fallout 4 and Skyrim (without mods, of course). Everyone is free to have their own opinion, I like Bethesda games just as much, and I don't think it matters at what state you're in before you start multiplayer. If it works for the game, it's worth trying. I don't think multiplayer makes sense for Witcher 3, but I do think it makes sense for 2077. Considering how popular GTA Online and Red Dead Online continue to be (in case of the latter, at least enough to support itself), I don't see why 2077 couldn't do the same.
 
Not to be a jerk, but you can look down to see your clothes. The running animations still look awkward though. It's like they focused on the camera being right, but the shadow just looks weird.
Imho that's an absolute must for any first person perspective game and far too many don't do that. Apparently it is more "immersive" to be a floating camera than a person with an actual body :LOL:

That being said, reflections of V would be awesome!

That doesnt make any sense, Ubisoft and Bethesda both grew insanely big without anykind of online. Game industry seems to think online is somekind of mandatory, but it isnt. Your brand gotta be pretty strong before you move to online.
Strangely enough, CDPR was nearly worth more than both Ubisoft and Bethesda combined in 2020 at 8.1b, according to various sources. Do you want to talk about a specific year, because we both know about Fallout 76, Farcry, The Division, etc etc... Frankly, I don't think it matters what other game companies have done, and it's not as if 2077 multiplayer is a thing right now at this moment. Witcher 3 and 2077 are easily the biggest competition for Elder Scrolls and Fallout (and arguably the only real competition for those types of games), and many people would no doubt argue that Witcher 3, by itself, is a much better game than both Fallout 4 and Skyrim (without mods, of course). Everyone is free to have their own opinion, I like Bethesda games just as much, and I don't think it matters at what state you're in before you start multiplayer. If it works for the game, it's worth trying. I don't think multiplayer makes sense for Witcher 3, but I do think it makes sense for 2077. Considering how popular GTA Online and Red Dead Online continue to be (in case of the latter, at least enough to support itself), I don't see why 2077 couldn't do the same.
In a way it creates player retention which is very important and it is without a doubt that multiplayer games are more successful than singleplayer games. However , there are also gamers who do not like multiplayer (like myself) or vice versa (I call them weird people...). Thus, depending on the game it might be impossible to satisfy both, or you might position yourself in the middle without having any kind of player base.

Given that the production cost of singleplayer games also increase companies like to get as much revenue out of them as possible and this is where service games like the ones produced by Ubisoft come in, which is a simple way to create revenue for singleplayer games. While it is frowned upon by gamers the number of sales do not reflect this.

Also, be careful when comparing Ubisoft/Bethesda with CDPR. First, Bethesda is part of Microsoft and this changes the structure and Ubisoft is still larger than CDPR, which had a parabolic rise of its valuation. Furthermore it should be noted that while Ubisoft, Activision and EA are "large" they pale in comparison to a Behemoth like Microsoft or other FAANG companies.

Sadly, this comparison is still important because all of these companies fight for skilled employees and the larger the company the higher the salary of their employees can be which helps them immensely in talent acquisition. As a result, it has become important for CDPR to increase its player base, which is where a multiplayer would have come in. (@Madae mentioned success stories like GTA Online and Read Dead Online.)

Personally, I hope that along the way the singleplayer experience does not get sacrificed, because some stories do not go well with a service game character or suffer from the additional resources provided for the multiplayer. I also consider CDPR one of the few remaining bastions of quality singleplayer experience, which is why I'm emotionally invested in the wellbeing of the company.
 
Also, be careful when comparing Ubisoft/Bethesda with CDPR. First, Bethesda is part of Microsoft and this changes the structure and Ubisoft is still larger than CDPR, which had a parabolic rise of its valuation. Furthermore it should be noted that while Ubisoft, Activision and EA are "large" they pale in comparison to a Behemoth like Microsoft or other FAANG companies.
The company has a value regardless of who owns it. The products Bethesda and Ubisoft release are what determines that, and no one would say Bethesda is worth 2 trillion just because Microsoft is. If Microsoft were to sell the company, which is basically the collection of IP's that are owned by Bethesda itself, the amount might be inflated, but it wouldn't be the value of the whole. It's just an investment that can succeed or fail on its own. Lots of developers have been purchased and eventually shuttered (or absorbed) over the years despite being owned by a more valuable company.
 
The company has a value regardless of who owns it. The products Bethesda and Ubisoft release are what determines that, and no one would say Bethesda is worth 2 trillion just because Microsoft is. If Microsoft were to sell the company, which is basically the collection of IP's that are owned by Bethesda itself, the amount might be inflated, but it wouldn't be the value of the whole. It's just an investment that can succeed or fail on its own. Lots of developers have been purchased and eventually shuttered (or absorbed) over the years despite being owned by a more valuable company.
I would not go so far as to say that a parent company and one of its subsidiaries all share the same value. That is definitely not how these acquisitions are made. Any company that is absorbed will basically be expected to work off its purchase. Not instantly, but there will definitely be a deadline after which the parent company expects to see profits. And if I have my own company, I am definitely not going to risk all of it simply to buy another company. I will set a budget for that acquisition, and they'll have to provide results within that budget.

Generally, I think very few people that are working for either Microsoft or Bethesda (as part of that team) have any idea what the Bethesda corporation is actually worth right now. (It's not $2 trillion, though.)
 
The company has a value regardless of who owns it. The products Bethesda and Ubisoft release are what determines that, and no one would say Bethesda is worth 2 trillion just because Microsoft is. If Microsoft were to sell the company, which is basically the collection of IP's that are owned by Bethesda itself, the amount might be inflated, but it wouldn't be the value of the whole. It's just an investment that can succeed or fail on its own. Lots of developers have been purchased and eventually shuttered (or absorbed) over the years despite being owned by a more valuable company.
I was not insinuating that Bethesda's net worth and Microsofts' are added together, but rather that being part of a larger company like MS results in different responsibilities and different freedom on the other hand. Just as @SigilFey has said, there might be expectations those studios need to uphold and if those expectations are not met they get a few advisors that help them reach the goals.

However, at the moment I think there are not many goals Microsoft has for Bethesda directly. The only main narrative MS follows is to expand their XBox Game Pass no matter the cost and for this they need a diverse game portfolio.
 
The jobs could very well be referencing Cyberpunk 2077 as a franchise, not as a stand alone game. Not saying that is what is happening - but that could be the explanation if third person doesn't come to the game. If it doesn't, it appears it will be in Cyberpunk 2.

There is no Cyberpunk 2077 "franchise", there is just the base game. It would be wayyyyyy too early to start focusing on sequels when they've clearly indicated that there's going to be at least 2 expansions and that in past they've always waited to finish the game before moving into another title. It would just slow down the development for the CP 2077 which has still multiplayer as a promised feature as an thing to be slowly added as an addon to the base game. Sure in far future there's a demand for a sequel and they must have some ideas (I certainly would) what locations to go to and what kind of stories to tell, but there's so many unanswered questions... and like Pawel has said, if things are left unanswered, that's by intention (meaning they will visit those unanswered questions in expansions pretty much).

It is true however that multiplayer is it's independent production (that despite the media rumor mill hasn't shown to be cancelled in any way) and having a 3rd person to see your allies and enemies characters in game would be quite a natural thing to have, the job description is just strange if that was the goal. Wouldn't the job description be focused more on character animation rather than talks about 3rd person?

Like someone LeKill3rFou speculated that 3rd person could simply mean shadows and reflections... but I think this would once again fall into the animation category rather than 3rd person aspect.

I truly do think there's some work being done with being able to shift with first and 3rd person and the way head model loads in and out. It was in the promotion materials, and there was also a lot of disappointment when it was changed. And it's not like they need 100 programmers to implement this back in.

Whether it's going to be in lets say patch 1.6 coming out lets say July or 1.7 coming out lets say October, or that it's going to be reserved to the time of expansion release (still likely implemented in base game) with some additional work done on these dialogues with V's own head movements from 3rd perspective and where the eyes would be looking...

I guess it could of course be referencing to the multiplayer broadcaster PoV where you could zoom out of players own perspective and take a look around the bigger battlefield.
 
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There is no Cyberpunk 2077 "franchise", there is just the base game. It would be wayyyyyy too early to start focusing on sequels when they've clearly indicated that there's going to be at least 2 expansions and that in past they've always waited to finish the game before moving into another title. It would just slow down the development for the CP 2077 which has still multiplayer as a promised feature as an thing to be slowly added as an addon to the base game. Sure in far future there's a demand for a sequel and they must have some ideas (I certainly would) what locations to go to and what kind of stories to tell, but there's so many unanswered questions... and like Pawel has said, if things are left unanswered, that's by intention (meaning they will visit those unanswered questions in expansions pretty much).

It is true however that multiplayer is it's independent production (that despite the media rumor mill hasn't shown to be cancelled in any way) and having a 3rd person to see your character in game would be quite a natural thing to have, the job description is just strange if that was the goal.

Wouldn't the job description be focused more on character animation rather than talks about 3rd person?

Like someone LeKill3rFou speculated that 3rd person could simply mean shadows and reflections... but I think this would once again fall into the animation category rather than 3rd person aspect.

I truly do think there's some work being done with being able to shift with first and 3rd person and the way head model loads in and out.

Whether it's going to be in lets say patch 1.6 coming out lets say July or 1.7 coming out lets say October, or that it's going to be reserved to the time of expansion release (still likely implemented in base game) with some additional work done on these dialogues with V's own head movements from 3rd perspective and where the eyes would be looking...

I guess it could of course be referencing to the multiplayer broadcaster PoV where you could zoom out of players own perspective and take a look around the bigger battlefield.

Or maybe some scenes they felt they needed 3rd person (like the endings). However, this job has basically been up there for a long time. So, who knows really what's that about.
 
There is no Cyberpunk 2077 "franchise", there is just the base game. It would be wayyyyyy too early to start focusing on sequels when they've clearly indicated that there's going to be at least 2 expansions and that in past they've always waited to finish the game before moving into another title. It would just slow down the development for the CP 2077 which has still multiplayer as a promised feature as an thing to be slowly added as an addon to the base game. Sure in far future there's a demand for a sequel and they must have some ideas (I certainly would) what locations to go to and what kind of stories to tell, but there's so many unanswered questions... and like Pawel has said, if things are left unanswered, that's by intention (meaning they will visit those unanswered questions in expansions pretty much).

It is true however that multiplayer is it's independent production (that despite the media rumor mill hasn't shown to be cancelled in any way) and having a 3rd person to see your allies and enemies characters in game would be quite a natural thing to have, the job description is just strange if that was the goal. Wouldn't the job description be focused more on character animation rather than talks about 3rd person?

Like someone LeKill3rFou speculated that 3rd person could simply mean shadows and reflections... but I think this would once again fall into the animation category rather than 3rd person aspect.

I truly do think there's some work being done with being able to shift with first and 3rd person and the way head model loads in and out. It was in the promotion materials, and there was also a lot of disappointment when it was changed. And it's not like they need 100 programmers to implement this back in.

Whether it's going to be in lets say patch 1.6 coming out lets say July or 1.7 coming out lets say October, or that it's going to be reserved to the time of expansion release (still likely implemented in base game) with some additional work done on these dialogues with V's own head movements from 3rd perspective and where the eyes would be looking...

I guess it could of course be referencing to the multiplayer broadcaster PoV where you could zoom out of players own perspective and take a look around the bigger battlefield.
There was also reflective mirrors and alot of other stuff in the promotional materials that never came too the game. TPP was never shown at all exept for cinematics (its still there ingame, for the ending).

Multiplayer would probably be a whole new game seperate from cp2077 since there switching engine, there would be no benefit developing a multiplayer framework since RED does not have it and UE5 does. Even think its stated somewhere in the investors call gonna see if i can find it. Since its a write off in the budget for MP too i think its scrapped in favor for the expansions and DLC that still not released.
 
...but rather that being part of a larger company like MS results in different responsibilities and different freedom on the other hand.
Based on what happened with Fallout 76, I think Zenimax wasn't taking Bethesda too seriously, anymore. Either that, or maybe Zeni was having some extreme management issues, but I'd imagine the former. And, to be fair, Zenimax did have to bail Bethesda out more than once. Like bankruptcy bailouts. Maybe they just got tired of it.

Seeing how Microsoft is seemingly handling the studios they own, though, I think it was a good move. I'm the first one to grit my teeth at some of their business "policies", but the games they've been dropping are pretty nicely done. That part of Microsoft seems to be on a good track. They appear to be listening to the devs then actually providing support instead of trying to pressure releases and micromanage features that "analysts" say are "so hot right now".
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Being worth trillions must mean that they can finally relax a bit on raising their income bracket. We finally got there.
 
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