V is a bad person with a good heart.

[Neuronin]

I think it's referenced somewhere that Vik thinks that V has a good heart. However, V is a product of his/her environment. Night City is brutal, and if you're not vigilant and strong you'll either end up slaving for a corporation, or dead in a ditch somewhere. I bet most people playing this game aren't shy about killing almost anything in their path, but it's obvious from how V and Jackie is portrayed that they aren't mindless killers, even though most people will probably have V kill over 300 humans during a single playthrough.

Two questions:

1. How do you justify V's kill count in Night City?

2. Do you think it's possible to have a good heart when killing has become second nature to you?

 

[Draconifors]

1. I only kill those who attack me on sight or I know would attack me if I didn't attack first. In other words, gangers.

2. Depends.

 

[Taril]

1. How do you justify V's kill count in Night City?

V only kills those who's lives revolve around harming others. Gangbangers, Corpos and Hansen's military.

It's a sort of vigilatism similar to say The Punisher or Dexter.

The hard to justify kills would be those against law enforcement. Cops and Max Tac. But, I personally avoid that anyway (In all my playtime, I've only killed a handful of cops due to them getting aggressive when I'm dealing with gigs or NCPD scanner callouts due to borked AI - Realistically, in the setting the cops wouldn't have aggro'd onto my V for shutting down crimes on their behalf)

2. Do you think it's possible to have a good heart when killing has become second nature to you?

Aye.

Do you think that every soldier immediately has a bad heart when they're capable of doing their job? (In this case, it's even more notable as the enemy isn't necessarily evil, they might simply be forced into action by evil people. Like, look up the WW1 Christmas phenomena.)

The act of killing, even when it becomes second nature, does not impact the morality.

The morality is derived by the motive. There are many motives for killing that aren't inherently bad. (Such as protecting one's land/people, or taking down people who are demonstrably evil).

In many cases, someone can be capable of killing as second nature, but they will still feel guilt for it after the fact. They just were able to overcome it in the moment.

In V's case, they're not trying to be malicious. They're ending the lives of scumbags (If you check in the scanner the details of gang members, all of them have horrible rap sheets) in the process of shutting down major crimes (Many gigs revolve around this).

It can get a little dubious at times, such as during The Heist where V is the criminal stealing the Relic. But even then, these aren't completely innocent people. Corpos, especially the agents they use for hunting down threats, have dubious morality at best (As is part of the theme of the Cyberpunk world)

 

[LeKill3rFou]

1. How do you justify V's kill count in Night City?

To quote Shepard (ME): Yes I kill people, but at last resort, only when all other solutions failed.
And to quote Leon : No women, no kids.

2. Do you think it's possible to have a good heart when killing has become second nature to you?

Yes, I suppose.
If V is not a cold blood murderer, if he doesn't search to kill people and if V follow the rules above, V may be led to kill people but still have what we call a good heart.

 

[Bartinga2077]

How do you justify V's kill count in Night City?

Self preservation.

Do you think it's possible to have a good heart when killing has become second nature to you?

No. Killing is never right. Those that kill are evil. Just because YOU are unable to solve an issue does not give you the right to kill. It just makes you a murderer.

 

[TheGheist]

1. How do you justify V's kill count in Night City?

2. Do you think it's possible to have a good heart when killing has become second nature to you?

Good questions!

The way I see it, Night City is simply a terrible and bizarre place to be in. The many injustices committed with impunity is insane.

1. First and foremost, each life path I play has a different personality in my mind.

For example, my street kid female V is more inclined to pull a gun in your face to get her answers and this comes from years of abuse she experienced when growing up in the streets of Heywood. (somewhat head canon)
My male V nomad, is less impulsive, so he tries the least violent route possible.
My corpo female V, is probably the most brutal of the two in some regards, but then also very reserved in others. A lot less predictable than the other two.

All my Vs, have dirt under their nails. That much is surely established in my runs.
So while they're not blood thirsty monsters, they're also not angels in disguise.
However, each have drawn a line of their own they don't intend to cross during their journey, but it can be controversial at times.
The line gets blurred in some situations.

That's when my brain begins to go on overdrive.
"Why did I save a person's life yesterday, but today, I blew a Maelstrom's head clean off ....after he was already dead??"

2. I think it's possible to have a deeply embedded good heart hindered by terrible experiences.
You abide by "The law of the jungle" and Night City being the most dense of jungles out there, sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do.
The challenge is having to emanate that beautiful ray of light from the heart, right through the thickly weaved brush of darkness that surrounds it.

There are rules I abide by when I play my game.
I don't go senselessly shooting police officers, for example. But if in some situations they don't let up and aggravate my V (depending on which one I'm playing, so let's say female Street Kid V), she might overreact and cross that drawn line I spoke of earlier, followed closely by a sense of regret.
Did that officer have a family? Have I just orphaned a child?

I'm going to be honest with you, there were times where I felt disgusted in myself irl when playing this game. lmao.
I'd get that immersed in it sometimes.

My V (all three archetypes) defend themselves when threatened (violently if necessary) and they do aid civilians who are clearly being harassed or have their lives threatened.
But it's not because my Vs wants to be heroes per se, but because my Vs all retain just enough humanity inside to react to such injustices.
Sometimes the killing happens from frustration and wanting to rid a small sliver of grime, despite knowing it would only grow back like mold.

In game (especially during my first run back in March 2024) I remember asking myself, while immersed in my character, what is this city doing to me? Or better yet... is this who I really was all along before the locks came off within my darkest cauldron?
My goodness.
Well, I could go on and on but I'll stop right here. haha



I ****ing love this game.

 

[Snowline001]

Chaos kindness

 

[northwold]

I mean to my mind you can play V as good as it's possible to be in that particular world. And there is an ending which, to my mind, is what a noble V would actually choose to avoid, well, total massacre of anyone in their way. It's not a very popular ending(!) but I do think it's an emotionally consistent and arguable choice in V's specific circumstances. The easy choice is to just play V as a self-absorbed psychopath. But it's not the only choice. Phantom Liberty also does a good job of allowing you to draw clear lines between V's morality and someone like Reed's.

 

[tru3story]

2. Do you think it's possible to have a good heart when killing has become second nature to you?

Absolutely. I think it's called greater good, or something like that.

 

[wilczajagoda]

I don't think a good person would take the sort of jobs/quests V does, where there is a high risk of civilian casualties. It takes a ruthless mindset to do so, accepting that if things go sideways uninvolved people will likely die. It's like doing high speed car chases on a busy road for the adrenaline or money (like the car racing quest). And V seems to be written this way, though whether they are like this from the start, or this is the result of Johnny's personality slowly taking over, is open to interpretation. For example, when you call Judy after the parade, they can talk about Arasaka having killed civilians in pursuit of V and Takemura, and V sounds unbothered about this, almost bored in that conversation.

This is also reflected by the gameplay. I have done a (mostly) non-lethal playthrough using takedowns and it was quite disappointing how little impact it had on the story. Except for a few quests like cyberpsychos, the game really doesn't acknowledge that sort of playstyle, and a knocked out enemy is treated like a killed one.

On a side note, quickhacks combined with high cool almost reached Skyrim levels of stealth, so at least it was quite entertaining. Hopefully they will keep the possiblity of stealth and non-lethal gameplay in the sequel.

 

[Spockprime]

Two questions:

1. How do you justify V's kill count in Night City?

2. Do you think it's possible to have a good heart when killing has become second nature to you?

1:
I don't try. It's a videogame set in an alternate universe with its own rules of behavior. My character runs mostly non-lethal just for the fun of emphasizing to the "bad guys" that they're completely in my control and there's nothing they can do about it.

2:
In a videogame or a movie, sure. To some extent, it's a means of vicariously dealing with the frustration of what we perceive as injustice in life. Sometimes I'll save the game, storm into a building full of murdering goons, and go full John Wick on them; and then reload from the save point and not do that.

But in real life, where the lives and/or deaths of real people are at stake, I don't know. I'm inclined to say no, to the extent that second nature implies a callous disregard for the lives of those being killed, no matter how despicable they might be. And yet, I'd also be lying if I didn't say that there are times when I nod my head and say yep, he had that coming to him.

 

[MartineDee]

Explanation:
Both points relate to the nature of NC. It's a killhouse, killing is more common than saying hello. The more things you need to get done, and the more visibility you get, the more killing is going to be necessary to stay alive.

If it is a necessity, it is not the question of whether it's someone's nature or not.

1. Technically low kill count is a way to go, due to non lethals. But getting downed in NC is pretty much the same as dead for all practical reasons. Back to the answer: technically no high kill count (not even Oda) is necessary. Else, see the explanation.

2. See the explanation.

 

[Spockprime]

Explanation:
Both points relate to the nature of NC. It's a killhouse, killing is more common than saying hello. The more things you need to get done, and the more visibility you get, the more killing is going to be necessary to stay alive.

If it is a necessity, it is not the question of whether it's someone's nature or not.

1. Technically low kill count is a way to go, due to non lethals. But getting downed in NC is pretty much the same as dead for all practical reasons. Back to the answer: technically no high kill count (not even Oda) is necessary. Else, see the explanation.

2. See the explanation.

Agreed. Everything is disposable, including people. In that sense, it's an alternative world that exists as an overexaggerated satire of this aspect of modern culture.

 

[Neuronin]

Self preservation.

No. Killing is never right. Those that kill are evil. Just because YOU are unable to solve an issue does not give you the right to kill. It just makes you a murderer.

Thank you for the feedback!

The implication of your statement is that V is evil, even if the motive is self-preservation. Is that correct?

The easy choice is to just play V as a self-absorbed psychopath. But it's not the only choice. Phantom Liberty also does a good job of allowing you to draw clear lines between V's morality and someone like Reed's.

Thank you for the feedback!

To me it seems difficult to play V as a self-absorbed psychopath. This is due to the many scripted interactions with other character throughout the game that indicates that he/she is more empathetic and emotional than your average mercenary in NC.

Absolutely. I think it's called greater good, or something like that.

Thank you for the feedback!

V is basically concerned with saving himself/herself. What greater good is served in this case?

1:
I don't try. It's a videogame set in an alternate universe with its own rules of behavior. My character runs mostly non-lethal just for the fun of emphasizing to the "bad guys" that they're completely in my control and there's nothing they can do about it.

2:
In a videogame or a movie, sure. To some extent, it's a means of vicariously dealing with the frustration of what we perceive as injustice in life. Sometimes I'll save the game, storm into a building full of murdering goons, and go full John Wick on them; and then reload from the save point and not do that.

But in real life, where the lives and/or deaths of real people are at stake, I don't know. I'm inclined to say no, to the extent that second nature implies a callous disregard for the lives of those being killed, no matter how despicable they might be. And yet, I'd also be lying if I didn't say that there are times when I nod my head and say yep, he had that coming to him.

Thank you for the feedback!

Based on your respons I'd take it that you're not into hardcore role-playing? I was just curious how people square the way V is represented by developers through scripted interactions, versus how they play the game. The discrepancy doesn't really matter to people who play the game just for fun, but for people who immerse themselves fully in the world it becomes an important consideration.