Was last gen a mistake?

[ya1]

So, no evidence then. And, they don't have evidence that the demo was fake either.

They must have evidence of statements from CDPR employees. Otherwise, they could be sued for libel. Of course, those employees might have been a disgruntled minority eager to get back at their bosses through slander. But then again, the state of the game is all the evidence one needs to deem their words true.

My question is: was any gameplay/demo, that was presented before 2020 (shortly before release), ps4/xbox's version?

No.

 

[mbrto]

i think cp2077 is just incredible on pc
its a shame others didnt get the chance to experience the game the way i did

yes, i think the last gen release was a mistake

 

[GerhardA]

Hindsight is 20/20, like everyone else said. But in my opinion: Yes, releasing for last-gen was a mistake. A rather huge mistake, when you take all the fallout into consideration.

If you compare the hardware specs of last-gen vs next-gen & (modern) PCs, it's clear to anyone (even to the laymen) that there is a rather large gulf in performance between the two groups. Considering how ambitious CDPR was with Cyberpunk, I honestly don't get why they even considered releasing on last-gen.

It is hard enough to develop such an ambitious project on 3 platforms. But adding 2 more platforms, that are going to be obsolete tech- and performance-wise by the time the game would be in any shape for release, is just entirely ilogical to me.

The problems that I see being:

1. Considering the ambition of Cyberpunk, trying to force something like that to run well on obsolete HW would be a mammoth undertaking. The HW of last-gen was already not that impressive compared to (good) PC's of the era when they first released. Trying to make the game work would require a bunch of smart algorithms & tricks that would take quite a bit of time to develop-implement-test. Time that they clearly didn't have. Time they could've used to polish the next-gen and PC versions.
2. It would also compromise what they could've implemented in the game, had they just focused on the latest HW at the game's release date. They could've been more ambitious. Implemented more functionality/features, etc. A bunch of concepts/ideas probably got thrown in the bin because they would be too heavy for last-gen HW and that sucks. They could've been more free to implement their ideas had they not decided to release on last-gen.

I'm not gonna even argue about why they decided to release on last-gen. That is something that is super subjective for every person asked. Some would say greed, some would say they wanted to give last-gen players a chance. Whatever it is, I don't care. Releasing on last-gen is still a huge mistake.

 

[batouyukinawa]

If I had to take an educated guess, it would be somewhere along the lines of being contractually obligated by MS.

 

[Krul2k]

I played somewhere over 600hours on last gen, Xbox One X to be specific.

Did i have bugs? Yip ahd still do

Did it crash? Yip an still does but not to the extent it did

Disappointed? To a degree, in a few things that had zero to do with bugs or crashes or even how it performed on the One X but more about features, or lack of, in the game, story, CC etc etc basically things i tbh get disappointed at in all games to varying degrees because i have a opinion an think like everyone else about how X would've been awesome or Y would've been great but i got Z instead.

Every game, as i said, i have these thoughts/disappointments on while playing and ultimately it comes down to is the fun im having outweight the disappointment i feel at how a feature is, how a character/story is etc etc and well over 600 hours and about 20 characters speaks for itself in saying any disappointments i had were far overshadowed by the sheer fun and experience i had playing the game.

So for myself atleast, no releasing CP2077 on last gen was not a mistake, far from it, i loved my time in NC bugs, crashes and disappointments, all were buried as i hopped about either knocking ppl out with my fists, a bat or a dildo, shoot ppl up slow mo style with my pistols, AR or SMG or went toe to toe with my shotties not to mention my hackers, snipers, bladesmen, ninjas etc etc i had fun and i cant wait for the next gen patch, DLC and expansions to do it all again on Series X

 

[snakey_77]

catch 22 really firstly take in account the lack of next gen consoles due to scalpers add in to the mix that both xbox and playstation now have a ( im going to say silly ) everything has to be backwards compatible with the previous gen and this is what you get..
before i get ripped for my silly comment there was a time where you brought the latest console for the latest games that did not need to be backwards compatible so not to play ps2 games on the ps1 and ps3 games on the ps2 for example..
what this did was ensure that developers had the world at there feet to develop there games to the best of there ability and to push the limits to the specs of said machine ...
now i understand not everyone can afford a next gen console and should not be penalised for there financial standing or situation ..
BUT put simply you dont push out a next gen game like cyberpunk and expect it to run like clockwork on a 10 year old machine especially with how quickly tech is evolving theses days!!
somebody always loses either the person with the last gen machine or the person with the latest and greatest machine running well below its full potential!!
flip side though think of the player uproar had they said sorry if you dont have a pc or next gen console then you cant play it..
catch 22 how do you win damned if you do damned if you dont!!

 

[Krul2k]

catch 22 really firstly take in account the lack of next gen consoles due to scalpers add in to the mix that both xbox and playstation now have a ( im going to say silly ) everything has to be backwards compatible with the previous gen and this is what you get..
before i get ripped for my silly comment there was a time where you brought the latest console for the latest games that did not need to be backwards compatible so not to play ps2 games on the ps1 and ps3 games on the ps2 for example..
what this did was ensure that developers had the world at there feet to develop there games to the best of there ability and to push the limits to the specs of said machine ...
now i understand not everyone can afford a next gen console and should not be penalised for there financial standing or situation ..
BUT put simply you dont push out a next gen game like cyberpunk and expect it to run like clockwork on a 10 year old machine especially with how quickly tech is evolving theses days!!
somebody always loses either the person with the last gen machine or the person with the latest and greatest machine running well below its full potential!!
flip side though think of the player uproar had they said sorry if you dont have a pc or next gen console then you cant play it..
catch 22 how do you win damned if you do damned if you dont!!

Everything doesnt need to be BC with previous gen, it just so happens MS made previous titles able to play on newer systems with zero work required from the game developers.

Yeah there was a time when if i bought a game on say the 360 i would need to buy it again on xbox one to continue playing it, which was total an utter bullshit and everyone knew it, ppl could easily spend thousands throughout a consoles life to then have to dump it all and start from scratch an publishers took advantage of it by re releasing there game with minimum effort to buy at full price again, how would a PC player like it if everytime they got a new PC they had to re buy all there games even though your using the same accounts? Not like it im guessing and rightly so.

BC has zero to do with CP problems considering the next gen version hasn't even been released an i play CP on the series X better than on One X the system it was made for

 

[EmpireMan]

The best thing is that they rushed the release of the game to sell It on last-gen, but it gets deleted from the PSN store. So they got almost nothing from it. Just hate.

 

[snakey_77]

Everything doesnt need to be BC with previous gen, it just so happens MS made previous titles able to play on newer systems with zero work required from the game developers.

Yeah there was a time when if i bought a game on say the 360 i would need to buy it again on xbox one to continue playing it, which was total an utter bullshit and everyone knew it, ppl could easily spend thousands throughout a consoles life to then have to dump it all and start from scratch an publishers took advantage of it by re releasing there game with minimum effort to buy at full price again, how would a PC player like it if everytime they got a new PC they had to re buy all there games even though your using the same accounts? Not like it im guessing and rightly so.

BC has zero to do with CP problems considering the next gen version hasn't even been released an i play CP on the series X better than on One X the system it was made for

pc is completely different and even then there is a recommend specs so min requirements is not yeah play cyberpunk with a 20 year old computer .

not to mention when was the last time youve seen a console game allow you to change resolution from 1080 to 1440 to 4k or fine tune your graphics from low to ultra ?? this is where you get your older pcs able to run newer games on lower specs even at reduced fps

its has everyhting to do with backwards compatibility of course your preious gen game is going to work like a charm on your next gen console .. but doubt your next gen game is going to work so well on previous gen and devs have to deal with nerfing there games to work on last gen consoles..

while im not 100% on whos to blame is it sony and microsoft saying you want to put your game on our system you must make it for last gen as well or if the companys are trying to maximize there profits by selling there new stuff to older consoles ..

if cd reds goal was to maximize there profits its surely bit them in the arse!!

 

[Bassdeff]

From a business point of view, no. Last gen consoles are a large chunk of market. From a game development point of view, yes. Catering to last gen means compromises need to be made.

 

[Force58]

I wonder how much getting CP to run suitably on last gen hardware is not only a futile effort, but doubly causing real harm to the potential of CP truly becoming that masterpiece we all hope it will be. This patch will be telling.

You can't be serious. 99.9999999 percent of the gamers worldwide don't have a next gen console yet unless they were out of their mind and bought a scalped one at double or higher the MSRP. I was reminded via another post that when the game was announced way back when, the PS4 wasn't even a thing yet. There was no PS5 or Series X even in the wind. It would have been a major boner to have decided 6-7 years ago to not include, at that time, next gen.

Post automatically merged: Mar 16, 2021

the harm was brought onto them by themselves

they said they focused more on the PC version, and assumed that it would work, with some tweaking, on consoles:
it also doesn't help that they released the game 2 years too early (knowing all the issues, they still released it)

Patch 1.2 won't do much at all, other than perhaps make the game not a crash-fiesta on consoles (and fix some bugs here and there)

Nicely said. What CDPR did was criminal knowing now all the details leading up to the launch. They're no different than any of the other money-grubbing companies that have put out trash in the last 5 years.

 

[reaper1]

pc is completely different and even then there is a recommend specs so min requirements is not yeah play cyberpunk with a 20 year old computer .

Thing is, the console players like myself understand that and since the game was advertised and released as compatible with our hardware, I fail to see how anyone is to blame apart from CDPR.

 

[animalfather]

I wonder how much getting CP to run suitably on last gen hardware is not only a futile effort, but doubly causing real harm to the potential of CP truly becoming that masterpiece we all hope it will be. This patch will be telling.

back in 2012 when it was first announced we were debating here when it would come out. the consensus was 2017 at the latest...

 

[MaxPrimal]

Dumbing games down to run on last gen machines is one of the things that keeps games in an unevolved state. I'r rather a company make a choice on whether to cater to that mentality or relase a truely exceptional contemporary product .

 

[reaper1]

Dumbing games down to run on last gen machines is one of the things that keeps games in an unevolved state. I'r rather a company make a choice on whether to cater to that mentality or relase a truely exceptional contemporary product .

Expecting companies to cater for the minority that place cutting edge technology above all else while being happy that the technology is never used to its full potential before being declared obsolete is not the sort of mentality I would want to see encouraged. Certainly not just to satisfy those who believe that their choice to spend their cash on PC hardware makes them the superior gamer who should be pandered to. In the case of this game, the narrative seems to be both that it runs in a shocking state on consoles due to the game's complexity, yet when it is mentioned that all the complexity was stripped out, the excuse is that it had to be to make the game run on consoles. As lovely as ray tracing is, I would rather have a decent, playable game.

 

[casadechrisso]

While I guess last gen support was a mistake, I wonder if it's the reason I can even play Cyberpunk today on my slightly older hardware, particulary my RX580, and still enjoy it without vomiting on my screen. Maybe with Next-Gen only we'd all have to get ourselves unavailable 2080s/3070s now if they didn't have to make compromises for older hardware.
Although I think the real culprit with the last-gen performance is more the streaming, i.e. fast SSDs, but what do I know.
Of course CDPR wants to sell as many games as possible and only catering to the PC masterrace with big wallets would be utterly stupid, yet if the game (on PC) had been like it is now without last gen support I guess they could've avoided most of the bad press. The question is just if it would be the same if they hadn't had any reason to do compromises.

 

[R001c]

This is all about the consoles impact on the evolution of gaming. Consoles are good because they helped create a much larger market for games and made AAA games possible. Consoles are bad because they dictate the pace at which gaming hardware can progress. What was once an organic process has become regimented. A mass market has also led to market forces. From a financial point of view its preferable to make conservative(small c)games that do not push boundaries, make any kind of statement and that can be consumed by the entire market. Small studios were consumed by publishers and the publishers are now being consumed by corporate. The result has been that, just as gaming was ascending to an art form, it has been and is being rationalised down to some lowest common denominator pop trash.

The pitches and forks brigade seem to be getting their way though and most of the studios capable of bucking this trend have been bought up by corporations such as Walt Disney or are on the floor somewhere. That's going to be great for gaming. And its going to be an oh so popular career choice for our brightest creative minds in the future.

Somewhere out there are solutions, a correct level of involvement for the bean counters, better People management by people who are not too innocent of corporate methodology. An end to E3! DOWN WITH PAX. You don't need them to PARTY!! They will lie to you. Not because they are evil but because they are human.
Microsoft and Sony get off your butts. Getting these kinds of games to work on your old potatoes is as much your responsibility as it is the developers. I'm not talking about Ray tracing or any of the nice things you can do on a PC. I'm talking about game complexity. Complexity, in a game, makes demands of all of the computers resources.

TL;DR
Yes. In the current climate it was asking the impossible but it should be possible and this 'Mistake' has a lot of owners.

 

[Krul2k]

pc is completely different and even then there is a recommend specs so min requirements is not yeah play cyberpunk with a 20 year old computer .

not to mention when was the last time youve seen a console game allow you to change resolution from 1080 to 1440 to 4k or fine tune your graphics from low to ultra ?? this is where you get your older pcs able to run newer games on lower specs even at reduced fps

its has everyhting to do with backwards compatibility of course your preious gen game is going to work like a charm on your next gen console .. but doubt your next gen game is going to work so well on previous gen and devs have to deal with nerfing there games to work on last gen consoles..

while im not 100% on whos to blame is it sony and microsoft saying you want to put your game on our system you must make it for last gen as well or if the companys are trying to maximize there profits by selling there new stuff to older consoles ..

if cd reds goal was to maximize there profits its surely bit them in the arse!!

I can sit here now and switch my console between a few different modes including performance 60 to 120 fps, resolution 720, 1080, 1440 an 4k it just upto the game if it supports it, do i have the ingame options a pc player has? No an i doubt i ever will

Im failing still to understand how BC is to blame here, CP was not made for Series X, it was made for Xbox one and P4, yes Series X plays it better just like a good PC may play it better with higher settings but how is BC at fault with how bad it runs on the systems it was announced for? If anything it should be working and playing great and i should be sweating eagerness out every pore waiting on the actual next gen version.

Its like CDPR announcing the recommended specs for CP on PC an it turns out they recommended specs aint even minimum specs then blaming the person who has the recommended specs for the game running shite

MS and Sony force no 3rd party devs to release anything its upto the 3rd party publishers where they publish noone else and as you seen with Sony ripping CP of there store its no guaranteed to stay there either

 

[peteed1985]

The problem is that when they started making the game there wouldn't have been a devkit for the PS5 and the new Xbox so they made it for the one they could at the time. It's more that they should have made it purely a PC game and then made the console versions after the newer console devkits came out. That or make the game of the quality and complexity that the older consoles could handle.

 

[ya1]

I totally disagree with some of the stuff here. No, CP77 could and should run on PS4 no problem. Games better than it run on PS4 no problem. The problem is that the game supposedly misses about 2 years of development. So it runs how it runs. And the fact that next gen launched and CDPR didn't have those two years is no excuse. They should have started working on it when they announced it (2012), not 4 years later (2016), and then not waste so much time on making fancy demos and trailers and promo material (up until 2018) but do the actual work from the very beginning.

Some of these discussions are like analyzing and criticizing a painting which hasn't been put half the paint on yet. CP77 is an unfinished product that should have never been released like this NO MATTER WHAT. That's all there is to it.