Was stealth takedown updated in hotfix?

[batouyukinawa]

I was doing a gig end up grabbing this Militech dude.
I go to subdue him and V straight up knocks him out
by hitting him in the head! Is there more than one
subdue animation?

 

[SOLIDKREATE]

Yes.

 

[batouyukinawa]

Weird, first time I've ever seen it.
180+ hours in the game.

 

[SOLIDKREATE]

I've seen it a few times, just not much. 315hrs here myself. I'm just about to end my second play through.

 

[Ayinde_Palmer]

I was doing a gig end up grabbing this Militech dude.
I go to subdue him and V straight up knocks him out
by hitting him in the head! Is there more than one
subdue animation?

if you do it while not in full stealth you'll usually knock them out. like if they are kind of alerted, but not fully.

 

[mumia76]

Never seen anything like that in 120 hours. If they are alterted it is no longer possible to grab them at all.

 

[cannabination]

Wild, I have over 200 hours in and have never seen this animation. I've grabbed enemies as their detection eye turns to an exclamation point, grabbed them from atop cover, and grabbed them around corners... there must be a very specific set of circumstances that needs to line up for that.

 

[Raptorousrex]

I think V punches if something breaks stealth while grabbing!

 

[Guest 4531988]

I was doing a gig end up grabbing this Militech dude.
I go to subdue him and V straight up knocks him out
by hitting him in the head! Is there more than one
subdue animation?

If you go uptop and hit the guards during the Heist missions (or at least for me) it always does a the hit animation.

When you look at the guards (scan) it says they have Break Hold. (ability)

Break Hold is a again something that shows the game was released in a broken state. They were suppose to counter you trying to take them out silently with a grapple.

Instead now it just plays a different animation making the ability pointless.

Post automatically merged: Feb 10, 2021

I think V punches if something breaks stealth while grabbing!

It does not I've taken the two sumo looking guards up-top on the heist, which both do this and it does not break stealth on it own.

Post automatically merged: Feb 10, 2021

Never seen anything like that in 120 hours. If they are alterted it is no longer possible to grab them at all.

There is a Talent that allows you to grab them after melee-ing with a weapon in the stealth tree. The window is small however.

 

[CS554]

Break Hold is a again something that shows the game was released in a broken state. They were suppose to counter you trying to take them out silently with a grapple.

High level Animal gangers sure as heck did that to me when my body stat was too low to grapple them. Body stat also determines how long you can keep them grabbled (to drag away for example) before they break hold.

I do recall punch happening but I don't recall if I had pistol or something equipped when it did or if it did happen for some other reason.

 

[Guest 4531988]

High level Animal gangers sure as heck did that to me when my body stat was too low to grapple them. Body stat also determines how long you can keep them grabbled (to drag away for example) before they break hold.

I do recall punch happening but I don't recall if I had pistol or something equipped when it did or if it did happen for some other reason.

That has more to do with how higher level enemies are. Any of them on the same or lower level do not do this. Higher level they spot you faster, they break holds faster, etc etc etc.

 

[CS554]

That has more to do with how higher level enemies are. Any of them on the same or lower level do not do this. Higher level they spot you faster, they break holds faster, etc etc etc.

I do believe higher level enemies has also higher stats, other than hp/armour and dps. So it's about relative difference anyway and in game description is correct. I just don't see what any sort of cut feature has anything to do anything here. Stuff works in a way it makes sense.

 

[Casualclick]

Break Hold is a lot stronger than one would think. For yuks and giggles, I hacked a character playthough to Level 20 Body and maxed out the melee, yet the Jonin at Clouds when he goes to take a leak easily, easily broke my grab despite a 100 percent successful Stealth creep. I short-circuited him after two punches.

 

[Guest 4531988]

I do believe higher level enemies has also higher stats, other than hp/armour and dps. So it's about relative difference anyway and in game description is correct. I just don't see what any sort of cut feature has anything to do anything here. Stuff works in a way it makes sense.

It was noted in previous advertising show-offs that you couldn't even just Stealth drop people like this. That you had to worry about abilities that your enemies will have that will basically put you in combat and at a severe disadvantage. That didn't make the game so it was cut content, or hype-machine advertising content that was never even in the game. Take your pick. Similar to how you can scan the Weight benches, but you can't do any hacks to them is how I look at it. Partially implemented then never finished.

 

[CS554]

It was noted in previous advertising show-offs that you couldn't even just Stealth drop people like this. That you had to worry about abilities that your enemies will have that will basically put you in combat and at a severe disadvantage. That didn't make the game so it was cut content, or hype-machine advertising content that was never even in the game. Take your pick.

Or cumbersome mechanic cut for a good reason. Despite 20 body I played a lot of stealth, even ghosted some missions that contributed a lot that I had 160 hours in game when I finished it for the first time. Mechanic like what you describe would also limit players to invest more to body even if they want to focus more on other aspects.

For me this looks like monowire debate again.

 

[Guest 4531988]

Or cumbersome mechanic cut for a good reason. Despite 20 body I played a lot of stealth, even ghosted some missions that contributed a lot that I had 160 hours in game when I finished it for the first time. Mechanic like what you describe would also limit players to invest more to body even if they want to focus more on other aspects.

For me this looks like monowire debate again.

It isn't Cumbersome, it forces you to not focus into a be-all end-all. (Stealth has been op and hasn't really evolved since Elder Scrolls model) It's a dumbing down of mechanics.

No it would not limit players to invest body. The original mechanic you could not Grapple these enemies, you had to avoid them or shoot them/melee attack them. It forces diversity or avoidance.

Look at the investment required for the Ricochet build, if they were pruning to make builds so forced into specs then you wouldn't have talents in separate trees like Ricochet. This was one of their Advertised big feature builds with Smart guns, yet no-one really uses Ricochet builds because they don't work.

Hell if you want to not limit how players play, then make perks that are used for something besides Crafting, Combat (Either direct or avoidance via stealth). They ham-fisted almost everything into combat focus.

Either way it wasn't fully cut and remains are still there.


This is no Different than just a weaker version of system of where if you attacked at night the AI started wearing Nightvision, or if you used Guns, they wore heavier and heavier armor, If you pulled headshots they wore head armor, If you used long range they turned to using rifles with scopes, if you were up close dropping people they switched to SMG/Shotguns. etc. It's just an obstacle, and at least one other game has implemented this system and it wasn't a broken mess or a cumbersome mechanic. It just forced diversity or change in gameplay style.

 

[CS554]

It isn't Cumbersome, it forces you to not focus into a be-all end-all. (Stealth has been op and hasn't really evolved since Elder Scrolls model) It's a dumbing down of mechanics.

No it would not limit players to invest body. The original mechanic you could not Grapple these enemies, you had to avoid them or shoot them/melee attack them. It forces diversity or avoidance.

Look at the investment required for the Ricochet build, if they were pruning to make builds so forced into specs then you wouldn't have talents in separate trees like Ricochet. This was one of their Advertised big feature builds with Smart guns, yet no-one really uses Ricochet builds because they don't work.

Hell if you want to not limit how players play, then make perks that are used for something besides Crafting, Combat (Either direct or avoidance via stealth). They ham-fisted almost everything into combat focus.

Either way it wasn't fully cut and remains are still there.

What we have in game works for me and I don't feel any need for it to be any more complicated. I'm not doing this oh, but look whole mess of a maze of But What About That Build? or Made This Up How I Think It Should Work to Cut Content.

I agree to disagree and that the end of this for my part.

 

[Guest 4531988]

What we have in game works for me and I don't feel any need for it to be any more complicated. I'm not doing this oh, but look whole mess of a maze of But What About That Build? or Made This Up How I Think It Should Work to Cut Content.

I agree to disagree and that the end of this for my part.

However you are implying that it cannot work whatsoever. That is the issue.

What we have the game doesn't work, Large portions of the games don't work due to Bugs or whatever you call it.
Hell the Car chases are being added it seems after mods were able to do it. It was released early and they didn't cut car chases because they were cumbersome and couldn't work. This idea of everything that was removed is too cumbersome to be doable isn't true.

It might be harder to play and you might of not enjoyed it, but it isn't "Cumbersome" from a coding aspect or gameplay aspect. If you want to be in the swallow pool, that can even be implemented where lower difficulty the ability would respond differently, and several games have worked that way over the years. There is no difficulty increase in pure-takedown gameplay since everything is one-shot and difficult doesn't increase any of the risks of stealth with the exception of boss or specific set piece scenes.

 

[batouyukinawa]

It was noted in previous advertising show-offs that you couldn't even just Stealth drop people like this. That you had to worry about abilities that your enemies will have that will basically put you in combat and at a severe disadvantage. That didn't make the game so it was cut content, or hype-machine advertising content that was never even in the game. Take your pick. Similar to how you can scan the Weight benches, but you can't do any hacks to them is how I look at it. Partially implemented then never finished.

Not true, you can hack the weight bench. I killed a guy in the recreation area at V's apartment.
A little immersion breaking though as no no one cared. The death animation is exactly the same as
what you saw in the 2019 deep dive.