Way of the Witcher revealed!

[InkognitoXI]

Among the three, Vypper seems very bad to me as it has a lot of potential downsides. It shouldn't be killed, it shouldn't be locked and you need to build around Vypper so that it returns in R3.. it is pretty useless if not drawn in R1 and can be shut down by factions which needs their GY support. Ideally Vyyper should have been 8 points since it has so many disadvantages.
[...]

Vypper is something you want to play immediately before leaving a round, so there is not a lot of time to answer it.
Also from among the 3 it is the only one that gives carryover, next to Gabor and Ciri:Nova the best carryover currently possible.
You could argue that Hjalmar and Ozzrel would be better counters if it had higher base strength.
It forces the opponent to make a suboptimal play in a later round, even if does not return that is still carryover.

I would say Vypper is the most fragile, but also the potentially strongest of the faction beasts currently revealed.

[...]
Saber is a good card. It can get 9 or 11 and can act as an uninteractable 7 points.
[...]

It is, which is why I am saying that all 3 have about equal potential, otherwise I would say Saber-Tooth would be the worst.

[...]
Bear on the other hand completely shuts down MO. MO knows nothing other than boosting. So, unless you kill the Bear in one shot (Rockslide or Heatwave), this can shut down MO. You don't have to play Bear as your first card. Wait till MO plays 3 or 4 thrive units on a row and then play it on the row, to make that row a dead row. I don't like MO, infact I hate them, but I can see how this can hurt MO. Doing partial damage to this will not work as "Restore" (which has not been used till now), Heals the unit first before boosting. Use it on Bear to heal it back up.
[...]

You do realize that the Bear only shuts down one row and a lot of the currently used MO consume stuff is on deploy, so they can just switch to the other row, right ?
As for the thrive engines you are right, however if 4 thrive engines are on a row the MO player is either silly (not spreading the engines into multiple rows) or already has 2-3 engines on the other rows, at which point they have already gotten sizable value.
It is not like MO is forced to play into the same row and with every turn passed before it gets dropped thrive cards already get value. Just take Bruxa as an example, 2 turns and the card is effectively worth 7 points, a Bear afterwards does not change that fact, it only blocks it from getting more.

Ozzrel might not be used as as large a finisher if Bear is played directly before it, however in that case it only interacts with Ozzrel and Ozzrel can still just go into the Melee row and consume something from the opponent's graveyard, easily consuming a 5-7 (as the minimum in 90%+ of games), trading down little, if it even does.

[...]
As an ST main, I am not much worried about this card as, as an ST, I can always move it to the Melee row. Just saying how absolutely essential for MO to remove this card.

As someone who considers MO one of his favourite factions I can tell you that you overhype the impact and that this card is indeed good, however in no way whatsoever even remotely as imperative to remove as you claim.

[...]
The deck I see most hurt is Vyso + Dandelion on Ranged.

To be fair this card countering all these strategies, which try to huddle behind a defender to play solitaire on a single uninteractable row, deserve to have a counter and should be willing to live with either a) also commit to another row, b) force out this card or c) run removal (not even SW, which actually does this, should have an issue spending an Anseis, Seltkirk or Viraxas to answer this thing).

 

[Messyr]

Among the three, Vypper seems very bad to me as it has a lot of potential downsides. It shouldn't be killed, it shouldn't be locked and you need to build around Vypper so that it returns in R3.. it is pretty useless if not drawn in R1 and can be shut down by factions which needs their GY support. Ideally Vyyper should have been 8 points since it has so many disadvantages.

Probably a question that might have been answered previously, but I'm still not sure about that end of round effect. Is that only from the board, or from your GY too? In case Vypper moves to the opponent's GY no matter what (unless locked ofc), this part is less of a downside.

Would not say that MO is mostly hit. Ok, thrive will get more complicated for them as the bear can basically block a row, but MO strategies focusing on thrive have ever been vulnerable to thrive to a certain extent.

Pretty much. I don't see it a major issue rowlocking an otherwise uninteractive, solitaire-style gameplan. I have two solid reasons to think this is ok:
- this does not take away buffs that happened previously, and usually gives ample time for the opponent to move his new units to the other row. Sure, he will lose out on a huge thrive potential on the initial row if the majority of his thrive units were placed there - but there is the tactical element I mentioned earlier. If you place the bear too early, the opponent will have time to adjust, losing on relatively low thrive potential. If you place it too late, you only block a few extra thrives on those units.
- I cannot repeat this enough times: the fact that these greedy decks run without any sort of control (including a Wrath, movement, a lock, anything) is just pure flawed mindset. Sure, if you CAN do that without serious risks, you will do so. If however the meta evolves, these decks will have to adapt as well. Which is an absolutely healthy thing in my mind at least. The bear will only shut down totally greedy setups, which in this case is well deserved.

 

[rrc]

...

Very nice objective take of the cards!

 

[InkognitoXI]

Very nice objective take of the cards!

Is that empty quote including the entire set of statements I made or only the empty subset included in all sets (which would be hilarious) ?

 

[quintivarium]

Despite the power creep, at least without seeing cards in action, I am really liking this expansion. Dire Bear is nicely strategic and offers a different approach to shutting down some of the most oppressive cards out there (Cahir, Dagur). I think it does unfairly hit MO as a faction that has relatively little removal (either damage or locks), important rowlocked units (e.g. Ozrel), and strategies like thrive that might take several turns of set up before the units generate value.

I also believe units like Vypper and Bear provide sufficiently universal and defensive strategies that they ought to be available to all factions (i.e. neutral).

 

[Barracuda88]

Bear is kind of an interesting card. Seems like a nice fit for a warrior deck, but no warrior tag and what would they drop to fit this in, really? Or you could say, a beast deck, but a beast deck is kind of boosty... We'll see how it's used, I guess. I can see it being real annoying for my elves.

 

[Messyr]

Bear is kind of an interesting card. Seems like a nice fit for a warrior deck, but no warrior tag and what would they drop to fit this in, really? Or you could say, a beast deck, but a beast deck is kind of boosty... We'll see how it's used, I guess. I can see it being real annoying for my elves.

Annoying for a good number of boost based decks and that is already a good thing to have.
As for what to remove, the question is really - is it generally worth more than a single unit removal in a deck that is already sporting multiple options for that purpose? I'd say yes.

 

[Barracuda88]

Annoying for a good number of boost based decks and that is already a good thing to have.
As for what to remove, the question is really - is it generally worth more than a single unit removal in a deck that is already sporting multiple options for that purpose? I'd say yes.

A good number of boost based decks will be able to play around it with movement, and the elves aren't so much "boost based" as "wide-boost-finish based," so moving is not going to do much. But, admittedly, that's a very specific and minor complaint.
As for whether or not it's worth a single unit removal, there's also a consideration of sacrificed consistency and synergy, so... I don't play that deck, so I'm not sure. The answer might still be a yes.

 

[rrc]

Cat Witcher Adept
Revealed by Jess

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1334498452017975296

 

[Barracuda88]

Cat Witcher Adept
Revealed by Jess

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1334498452017975296

Well, it's a 4p card that will probably never see 7, but... I still kinda like it.

 

[Draconifors]

Explains what the Cat Mentor is looking at in his art.

 

[ya1]

View attachment 11070524

Skellige, sure... In every other faction this would be like 5 for 10.

 

[InkognitoXI]

Skellige, sure... In every other faction this would be like 5 for 10.

What is the basis for this claim ?

 

[rrc]

What is the basis for this claim ?

No basis and all.. just pure frustration of how strong SK is how most of their cards give more value for the provision comparing to other factions (with little to no setup required with unbelievable synergies).. I assume.

 

[InkognitoXI]

No basis and all.. just pure frustration of how strong SK is how most of their cards give more value for the provision comparing to other factions (with little to no setup required with unbelievable synergies).. I assume.

The issue with that is that due to a couple of cards (of one archetype, not even all cards of that archetype) an image of the entire faction is drawn.
Imagine saying "Of course this card is overpowered, SW is a thing, so clearly every card in NR is overpowered".

 

[DRK3]

At first, i also thought that SK bear was kinda OP, and also thought of Yrden/Cahir comparisons.

The fact that it also keeps the user from boosts its not a big downside - SK always was and is the least boosty faction.
But since the effect only affects one row of the opponent, it can be very easily played around, thus removing the need to counter this card.

For example, huge cards like Aglais or Gord or Glustyworp arent rowlocked. I can only see it useful in these situations:
- vs Cahir, Ozzrel, (EDIT) i forgot Dagur, yes, thanks for the other user who mentioned it
- vs boosty scenarios like SY and MO, since the units spawned appear on the same row, i believe
- vs NR boosty decks that rely on boosting adjacent units, but you need to play dire bear after the setup is made or they will just play it on the other row

 

[Barracuda88]

At first, i also thought that SK bear was kinda OP, and also thought of Yrden/Cahir comparisons.

The fact that it also keeps the user from boosts its not a big downside - SK always was and is the least boosty faction.
But since the effect only affects one row of the opponent, it can be very easily played around, thus removing the need to counter this card.

For example, huge cards like Aglais or Gord or Glustyworp arent rowlocked. I can only see it useful in these situations:
- vs Cahir, Ozzrel
- vs boosty scenarios like SY and MO, since the units spawned appear on the same row, i believe
- vs NR boosty decks that rely on boosting adjacent units, but you need to play dire bear after the setup is made or they will just play it on the other row

Row-locked stuff like Visigota, Cahir, Ozzy aside, it effectively halves the output of full board-boosting cards and strategies, such as Deus Irae, the sacred flame (?) Artifact, the talisman, Yenn, Isengrim, etc.

 

[Gyg]

The cat adept can provide a good value but require some setup and enough turn length. Theoretically it can work with half-elf hunter and Ambush leader ability as soon as turn 2 with vitality 6. But I suspect he won't be very popular. Vitality can be purified and he ends as 4 for 4p.

 

[InkognitoXI]

https://www.reddit.com/r/gwent/comments/k5ze4y

 

[DRK3]

Row-locked stuff like Visigota, Cahir, Ozzy aside, it effectively halves the output of full board-boosting cards and strategies, such as Deus Irae, the sacred flame (?) Artifact, the talisman, Yenn, Isengrim, etc.

Vysogotta is row locked but his ability isnt - he can still boost units on the melee row i believe.
I hadnt thought about dire bear vs swarm decks, which usually rely on boosts. In those cases, it works very similar to a Yrden - the upside is it has a bigger body and cheaper than Yrden, the downside is it can be countered by a lock or removal, unlike Yrden.

Also, this direbear doesnt have any particular synergies with old or new SK cards, its definitely a tech card, so i dont know if it will see much use.