SOLVED Weaken cannot pass Quen

[Terobero]

Weaken cannot pass Quen

Oppenent plays DBP with quen, i peter it, it loses shield and gets to 2 str. Bug or intended?

 

[4RM3D]

Quen only protects against damage effects. Peter weakens a unit, which isn't counted as a damage effect. So, it's working as intended.

 

[Draconifors]

Quen doesn't protect against resetting, but does block Weaken. Peter resets before Weakening, so that's why the DBP lost its shield but kept its 2 base strength.

Working as intended.

Edit: Ninja'd because I took so long writing this post.

 

[KDean11]

Peter Saar Gwynleve bug.

I actually don't know if it's intended by the developers or a bug. When I reset a card with Peter Saar Gwynleve with a Quen Sign it's not damaging the card. I feel like if you reset a card the Quen sign should not block the damage.

 

[4RM3D]

KDean11

thread merged

 

[Ataxiate]

Similarly, when Venendal Elite targets a card with quen in the hand, it copies the power but does not set the strength of the quen unit to 1. The quen absorbs this. If this is intended for quen, it should be written on the card.

 

[Ataxiate]

Here's hoping there will be a Geralt: Quen gold card. Quen was my go-to sign in witcher 2 + 3.

 

[leprochauninja]

I find it weird that reset also removes quen from the unit. Reset doesn't reset armor, timers, lock, spying or resilience and I'm not sure why quen is some weird exception to this.

 

[NlelithZ44]

Maybe order of Peter effects just triggers in reverse order? First, he tries to Weaken, which is blocked by Quen, breaking it. Then the reset comes in. This explains 2 STR DBP.

 

[frytom]

Similarly, when Venendal Elite targets a card with quen in the hand, it copies the power but does not set the strength of the quen unit to 1. The quen absorbs this. If this is intended for quen, it should be written on the card.

Quen protected units should not being affected by this Venandal Elites. Cause the Quen description says, protection from first attack, so how can Venendal Elites suck / copy the value? This is a fatal error of Venendal elites' skill, that should be corrected. Attacking any quen'ed unit should only only result in removing the shield, not copying any values of the formerly quen'ed unit at the same time. You should need two actions not one like it is currently.

So the current behaviour of the Venendal Elite is not compliant with the formerly quen idea. In fact, the current quen design is weakened to buff crappy NG revealing play style.

 

[4RM3D]

So the current behaviour of the Venendal Elite is not compliant with the formerly quen idea.

That's up for debate. I, personally, have to disagree with you because the order of events is clearly stated in the card's description:

Deploy: Choose a Revealed card. If it's a Unit, copy its Power, then set that Unit's Power to 1. If it's a Special card, Boost self by 9.

First the Elite copies the unit's power (like Dudu) and then sets that unit's power to 1. The first part still works, only the second is countered by Quen.

In the same way, BTM doesn't work with Quen because the order of events is reversed:

Damage the Highest Unit by an amount equal to its Power, but no more than 10 (ignoring Armor) and Boost the Lowest other Unit by the same amount.

Here, the highest unit is damaged first (which is prevented by Quen) and, because of that, no strength is transferred.

 

[frytom]

I think, you don't see the point. A Quen shield should prevent any attack concerning the unit's value, if the attacking unit hasn't lock function. Point. Only the shield should be lost when the unit was attacked. Venendal Elite currently has two actions done in a one hitting. First removing the shield, second copying the value. And that sucks. And it's a demoting of the quen shield idea.

 

[TheTexen]

I'm guessing this is related to all of the above - but when i use spores on a DBP with a quen shield, it resets the unit back to 2 str. Should it not also weaken the unit by 3 and banish it?

 

[4RM3D]

I'm guessing this is related to all of the above - but when i use spores on a DBP with a quen shield, it resets the unit back to 2 str. Should it not also weaken the unit by 3 and banish it?

The weaken effect is nullified because of Quen. However, Quen doesn't protect against reset effects, so that goes through the shield.