What Dragon's Dogma features could enhance The Witcher?

[Tuco]

What Dragon's Dogma features could enhance The Witcher?

A quick premise:
I don't want to start another shitfest over TW3 and I won't go into any hyperbole claiming "This is garbage and should totally copy the game X".

BUT

as the title says I'm finally playing Dragon's Dogma now that it got a PC release, and I have to say there's a lot that the Witcher devs could take as inspiration for future games, about how to handle big fights with big monsters.

I previously thought the Monster Hunter franchise was another good source of ideas, but in that case the whole thing has a quite different feeling overall, while on the other hand the more I play DD the more I can see how (with the proper adjustments here and there) a lot of his systems about big fights could very properly fit a new Witcher title.
At least when it comes to playing some specific classes.

I'd like to hear some opinions, ideally from people who ACTUALLY played both.

 

[dimonicus92]

I don't think that climbing monsters should be a main mechanic in a Witcher game,I mean he climbed a dragon at Witcher 2,but that's all.

Dragons Dogma combat is actually really good for Dragon's Dogma. Witcher combat is good for the Witcher

 

[moonknightgog]

Why not Bayonetta?

 

[Tuco]

Why not Bayonetta?

Because it doesn't fit the theme and style at all and it doesn't bring in any useful mechanic.
Was this supposed to be sarcasm?

 

[Boromir2015]

"Dragon's Dogma"... Very beautiful game... I love it!!! The bossfights are awesome!!!

 

[tenthousandface]

When climbing BOSS there's not much of interaction.Most ACTs and witcher 2 add QTE into it,but QTE is not welcome now.

 

[dragonbird]

Can you all decide if you want to talk about TW3 or Dragon's Dogma? There's an existing thread on Dragon's Dogma here:
http://forums.cdprojektred.com/threads/57613-Dragon-s-Dogma-coming-to-PC
As this thread was placed in the main Witcher forums, my assumption is that @Tuco wished to discuss TW3.

 

[Tuco]

Can you all decide if you want to talk about TW3 or Dragon's Dogma? There's an existing thread on Dragon's Dogma here:
http://forums.cdprojektred.com/threads/57613-Dragon-s-Dogma-coming-to-PC
As this thread was placed in the main Witcher forums, my assumption is that @Tuco wished to discuss TW3.

It's actually about what of Dragon's Dogma could be "borrowed" to enhance future Witcher iterations, so of course we are (eventually, if anyone will care enough) going to discuss both games.
Eventually even having developers chiming in to give their 2 cents (yeah, I wish...).

It wasn't really a mistake to open it on The Witcher forum; it was a deliberate choice and the very point of it.

 

[BoboTheMighty]

Honestly, I was disappointed with big boss climbing...looks cool at first, but feels silly and clumsy plus all the button mashing...I guess you could say it's a bit "too gamey".
I think it works far better against smaller creatures, like cutting of a tail of a Saurian that cannot stand up afterwards...adding more dynamic to combat ( even if I would like it to require bit more effort).
In Witcher, I'm not sure it would work well since it does not rely on manual targetting...but didn't they intend to do something similar, but scrapped it, for being too expensive?
One thing that Dogma does right and all Witcher games do poorly is CHARACTER PROGRESSION.
There is a very distinctive difference between each class and how they play, every level up feels meaningfull...if CDPR had designed it, warrior would have more +x % stamina regeneration, +y % health, etc, next to rogue or some other class...while it's play style would be (almost) exactly the same.

 

[tenthousandface]

Attributes and passive effects does't help much,and it has enough difference already.Add more active abilities to each school will be more effective.

 

[annata]

I think it's controller scheme would lend itself well to Witcher 3. Nothing would change for sword fighting. LT would still be block and parry, X,Y, still Fa and Sa. But instead of having a radial menu for signs and one button to cast, you would just have to hold LB and A,B,Y,X,RB would switch to signs. Pressing the left stick would now bring up the radial menu which is now free for more bombs and RB to throw bombs when LB is not held. The RT is now free for crossbows or whatever non combat item you have assigned to it.

 

[Trireme]

The main monster combat thing I would like to see in future Witcher games is weak points. The ability to cripple a monster with carefully placed hits would fit perfectly with the professional monster slayer concept. With flying creatures you could damage their wings to ground them, against insectoids you could chop off limbs or stingers, against creatures with spiky tails you could chop off the tails, and if they ever bring back the zeugl there would be chopping of tentacles! The Kayran fight in Witcher 2 had a few of these elements, but that was one single scripted fight. There was also the Draug fight where you could break the shield to make it vulnerable from the front. This principle could even be applied to some human opponents- there could be special moves to knock away shields or break large weapons like halberds.

 

[sv3672]

The main monster combat thing I would like to see in future Witcher games is weak points. The ability to cripple a monster with carefully placed hits would fit perfectly with the professional monster slayer concept.

It was planned during the development of the game that monsters would have vital spots (see also this page for specific examples), but unfortunately due to the difficulties implementing it, the idea was dropped.

 

[Beas7ie]

I'd be happy with just some special finishing animations for monsters.

Humanoid monsters like drowners can just have the standard people finishing animations as they basically have the same body type, larger ones like wyverns, fiends, and what not could have Geralt jump on them and stab them in the head. With a cyclops, Geralt could stab it in they eye.

Hopefully a future update or DLC can get this going.


In a similar note, Dragons Dogma had some awesome monster combat and has been out for a few years. I'm really surprised that NO ONE has tried to copy parts of their combat system.

COME ON Game companies! COPY DRAGONS DOGMA!

 

[Garrison72]

-Controls, controls, controls.

-Night time actually impacts gameplay

-Epic boss battles.

-Dynamic character builds with active abilities, not +10% to this or that - whole new combat abilities.


The devs are avid Dark Souls fans,.I'm not sure it's helping them at this point. Time to leave Dark Souls behind. DD is a game more in the spirit of Witcher, with faster combat and more group fights. Seriously, forget Dark Souls. Look at this game. Look at the builds, look at the animation style, look at how you can traverse the environment with ease, look at some of the best spell effects in gaming. @Marcin Momot: has anyone at CDPR played Dragons Dogma?

 

[Marcin Momot]

-Controls, controls, controls.

-Night time actually impacts gameplay

-Epic boss battles.

-Dynamic character builds with active abilities, not +10% to this or that - whole new combat abilities.


The devs are avid Dark Souls fans,.I'm not sure it's helping them at this point. Time to leave Dark Souls behind. DD is a game more in the spirit of Witcher, with faster combat and more group fights. Seriously, forget Dark Souls. Look at this game. Look at the builds, look at the animation style, look at how you can traverse the environment with ease, look at some of the best spell effects in gaming. @Marcin Momot: has anyone at CDPR played Dragons Dogma?

Can't remember talking to anyone about this game but I'm sure some people have. I intend to play it sometime this year as well.

 

[Tuco]

Honestly, I was disappointed with big boss climbing...looks cool at first, but feels silly and clumsy plus all the button mashing...I guess you could say it's a bit "too gamey".

I think you may be underselling the system a bit too much here.
Sure, the early bosses are somewhat basic and don't require much beside whacking them (climbing on their back or not) and avoiding their blows.
But as soon as stronger bosses come into play you'll start having a lot more variety.
Some of them are heavily armored and you'll need to aim for specific spots, some need to be damaged/slowed enough or any attempt to climb them will turn in with you being thrown around. Some will take forever to die unless you'll apply a very specific strategy (and in that case they can die really fast, which makes all this extremely satisfying) and so on.
And that's without even starting to bring in all the annoying special abilities they can have that need to be defused for your own good.

There's a lot more than just "climbing on them and button mashing".

 

[Riven-Twain]

A friendly reminder to all: This thread is here so people can make concrete suggestions about features that The Witcher III might borrow from Dragon's Dogma. If, however, people would prefer to merely discuss that game at length, this should be done not in Suggestions but rather in the existing thread for Dragon's Dogma. Please bear this in mind. Thank you. Carry on.

 

[BoboTheMighty]

I think you may be underselling the system a bit too much here.
Sure, the early bosses are somewhat basic and don't require much beside whacking them (climbing on their back or not) and avoiding their blows.

Hmm, I'm about three quarters in the game and so far mixed impressions on combat, but that's straying from topic.
But I like how combat abilities and in general, are more dynamic and interactive, than just activate abilitiy--> static damage or effect.
CDPR had to stick to the lore, but they could have done something similar here...these "windows of opportunity" when you create one opening and exploit it with another, make combat feel a lot more engaging and rewarding...cast Igni of Yrden at the right moment creates circle of fire... that sort of thing.
It feels, in general, that Japanese devs are simply more imaginative with game play design, even if it leads to bizarre results at times. Just look at what you can find in MGS V, but at the same time so many options that no 'western" developer could come up with.
No more dumping passives and calling it "character progression", CDPR...create skill trees where each path leads to a certain role in game play, with active abilities, while allowing player more flexibility to create his own play style.

As for related to Dogma they could have done something similar:
Witcher Core skills: Where you have basic attack combos and general improvements in combat
After this player has to choose, like in Dogma, a certain specialization: Cat, Bear, Wolf, Viper and Griffin...respectively: duelist, tank, swordsman, assassin, barbarian...each with abilities that contribute to that specific play style.
Each with their own class specific augments that the player keeps, like in Dogma, for more versatility and class builds.

---------- Post merged on 25-01-2016 at 04:13 AM ----------

DD is a game more in the spirit of Witcher, with faster combat and more group fights.

I don't think, in general, that DD style of combat would work in Witcher. Abilities are fantastic, but transition between them is too "janky" for a fluid sword game play Plus many of them have very long animations ( some up to 20 seconds) and are only possible because a lot of enemies have sub-par AI and erratic, disorganized combat movement.
For Witcher, I think CDPR should look up to is DmC...high mobility, group combat, very easy to use combos that can be mixed in a huge variety of ways. And you can do all of it with just a few buttons.