What exactly happened at the end of The Lady of The Lake? (Major Spoilers Obviously)

[hajalie24]

What exactly happened at the end of The Lady of The Lake? (Major Spoilers Obviously)

I just finished reading the fan translation of The Lady Of The Lake. I'm a bit confused on what happens.

So Geralt gets stabbed and is dying. Yennefer desperately tries to save Geralt but she dies in the process (Or did she just faint?) Then Ciri's unicorn comes and by some sort of magic revives Geralt. Afterwards the boat comes.

What's confusing me, is what exactly did Ciri do? Why did they start seeing the dead around them? Dandelion seeing the whole gang from the third and fourth novels, the dwarves seeing their old friends, and Triss seeing the dead too.

Are Geralt and Yennefer still alive? Are they in the same world, but just in a remote land. Or are they in some other universe, or the afterlife? What was Ciri talking about when she mentioned the wedding with the living and the dead? And why did Ciri go to the other world?

Were these things ever explained by the author?

 

[sfinx]

I think we can't say exactly what happened - Ciri is so powerful, I think Ihuarraquax help her with the power and she healed them both.

As I think - they were both very close to death or nearly there and she healed (someone thinks ressurected) them. Than she moved them to "their" island.
Yennefer and Geralt are alive for me. When someone dies, I think - he will not doubt about that and he will not be confused, where he is and what happened. Geralt had bandaged wounds - again - why someone bandage injuries on dead body? And why he felt pain? Ending is opened and I like that - you can imagine whatever you want

What I know - Sapkowski didn't say something to make that clear - and I doubt he will do that, that was maybe his intention to make it like that.

"And that," Galahad asked, "is the end of the story?"
"Certainly not," said Ciri, rubbing one foot against the other, trying to get rid of 
the sand sticking to her feet. "You want it to end? I do not!"

She make fun from him after this sentence, but why to consider this sentence as wrong? I like it.

 

[r3dd3v1l]

Geralt hesitates to kill a peasant, who then stabs him with a pitchfork in the abdomen. Geralt bleeds to death. Yennefer arrives and tries to save him using her magic power- she uses too much killing herself in the process. Ciri was with Yennefer and sees everything. I'm not sure about it, but I think Ciri (which you already know has the power of the Elder Blood) and the unicorn revive Geralt and Yennefer and put them in a boat. While doing so they see - I am not entirely sure what- "reflections" or "ghosts" helping them- though I think Triss saw the witcher Koen who was alive at the time, so perhaps they just saw their friends/loved ones. Geralt and Yennefer are then taken to the Isle of Avallach (the name of the island is shown in the seccond game via a flashback). Ciri leaves the world because she will always be pursued bu different factions- i.e. The Lodge of Sorcerers- for her royal blood(she is the rrightful ruler of Cintra) and for powers over time and space- oretty much everybody save for her friends want to use her.
These thoughts are just my way of interpreting what I saw/read I do not know how Sapkowski explained it, if at all.
I will also post a link below with the flashback from Withcer 2 which fill the gap between the lsat book and the first game.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=imh-aZmWoAQ

 

[sfinx]

Ciri leaves the world because she will always be pursued bu different factions- i.e. The Lodge of Sorcerers- for her royal blood(she is the rrightful ruler of Cintra) and for powers over time and space- oretty much everybody save for her friends want to use her.

I don't want to fight with you, but this was maybe little bit different. She left that world, because Yennefer and Geralt moved, so she didn't want to stay.

'Apologise to the ladies at Montecalvo, Triss,' she said. 'But it can be no other way.
I cannot stay if Geralt and Yennefer leave. I simple cannot. They must understand.'

I don't think she was afraid of the Lodge, I think she really consider to join them.

 

[hajalie24]

Thanks for the responses guys. Although I'm pretty sure Coen was dead when Triss saw him. He died in the battle of Brugge, remember when they bring a witcher to the halfling in the middle of the battle. And right before Geralt is about to die, he remembers how Ciri predicts the death of Geralt and Coen.

The video was also useful, I played through TW2 twice before reading the books but I needed to refresh my memory. However apparently The Witcher games aren't in any way canon. So it doesn't help much. It's weird though that the Isle is named after the Knowing One Avallac'h though, and IIRC isn't the King of the Wild Hunt the elf that was also in the same world with him?

I'm a little disappointed on how the saga ended. I thought we were going to see the adventures of Geralt and Letho, but pretty soon into the last book you realize that's not going to happen. Not to mention it kind of sucks to end it in such an ambiguous way, but oh well I still enjoyed the books. The only thing that were hard for me to enjoy were the chapters about politics where Ciri and Geralt weren't involved.

 

[Kallelinski]

As I think - they were both very close to death or nearly there and she healed (someone thinks ressurected) them. Than she moved them to "their" island.
Yennefer and Geralt are alive for me. When someone dies, I think - he will not doubt about that and he will not be confused, where he is and what happened. Geralt had bandaged wounds - again - why someone bandage injuries on dead body? And why he felt pain? Ending is opened and I like that - you can imagine whatever you want

Pretty much this. It's kinda certain that Geralt died (or was dead for some seconds) for me, even in the game Geralt remembers dying and he got told that he died by several persons. Yennefer tried to heal him, but healing the dead isn't possible, however Ciri could do it with the help of Ihuarraquax. In the progress Yennefer faints, but i don't think she died. It's impossible to kill yourself without any "tools". You can't suffocate yourself by holding your breath, your body will not allow it. If you burn out yourself, you will get tired and in the end faint, unless you stress your body with enough caffeine or energy drinks.

Ciri, knowing that both will never acquire happiness in this world with her around, she brings her to a place nobody knows (or at least knew), leaving them there.

Geralt wakes up, is bandaged, feels pain. As sfinxCZ said, the dead don't feel pain, he isn't a zombie. So in the end it's kinda a happy end, but not in the traditional way.

Even though i liked the wedding end more

 

[arkblazer]

Pretty much this. It's kinda certain that Geralt died (or was dead for some seconds) for me, even in the game Geralt remembers dying and he got told that he died by several persons. Yennefer tried to heal him, but healing the dead isn't possible, however Ciri could do it with the help of Ihuarraquax. In the progress Yennefer faints, but i don't think she died. It's impossible to kill yourself without any "tools". You can't suffocate yourself by holding your breath, your body will not allow it. If you burn out yourself, you will get tired and in the end faint, unless you stress your body with enough caffeine or energy drinks.

Ciri, knowing that both will never acquire happiness in this world with her around, she brings her to a place nobody knows (or at least knew), leaving them there.

Geralt wakes up, is bandaged, feels pain. As sfinxCZ said, the dead don't feel pain, he isn't a zombie. So in the end it's kinda a happy end, but not in the traditional way.

Even though i liked the wedding end more />

Actually im pretty sure that magicians can die if the try to use magic when they run out of energy. that, if im not mistaken, is what happened to yeneffer. anyway then ciri along with the unicorn revived those 2 but for some reason needs to bring them somewhere else. as for the dead following ciri, i dunno. my interpretation is that ciri power works as an interdimensional beacon and when she revived geralt and yenneffer she ended up opening a gate to the netherworld to retrieve their souls. this allowed other souls that were connected to her to go with her, dunno really.

as for the wedding, it was ciri that she just dint want to accept such sad ending for geralt and yen and i think a sort of reference to something ends, something begins.

 

[sfinx]

It's impossible to kill yourself without any "tools". You can't suffocate yourself by holding your breath, your body will not allow it.

You need realistic explanation again - I like it, but there could be one good explanation for you ... I think - what Triss said in game (even when that is not saga anymore) - you can die for using magic too much - is true (game is different just in ammount of magic, which cause you faint, sorceresses are weaker, but still I think it could be truth). And death from exhaustion is possible, I think.

Even though i liked the wedding end more

Best story in the books

 

[Shavod]

I don't think she was afraid of the Lodge, I think she really consider to join them.

She was considering joining them only to protect Yennefer. After both Yennefer and Geralt were gone, she simply had no reason to join them.

 

[Kallelinski]

Actually im pretty sure that magicians can die if the try to use magic when they run out of energy. that, if im not mistaken, is what happened to yeneffer.

Did anyone else die due that?

as for the wedding, it was ciri that she just dint want to accept such sad ending for geralt and yen and i think a sort of reference to something ends, something begins.

lalala, i can't hear you.... I know it's not canon

You need realistic explanation again - I like it, but there could be one good explanation for you ... I think - what Triss said in game (even when that is not saga anymore) - you can die for using magic too much - is true (game is different just in ammount of magic, which cause you faint, sorceresses are weaker, but still I think it could be truth). And death from exhaustion is possible, I think.

Of course it's possible, but in most cases people overwork themselves with the help of medications, e.g. workers with caffeine, athletes with dubious meds, gamers with countless energy drinks and so on.

Usually your body will fight against you, you get tired, you can't really open your eyes anymore, even too weak to move anymore. It's struggling/fighting against you. If your will is strong enough, sure, you can overwhelm it. But i don't really like this "sacrifice for another human"-cliché in any entertainment medium and in the end it doesn't really matter, if she died as well, both were brought to that island and lived happily until that stupid Witch Hunt came around

 

[sfinx]

She was considering joining them only to protect Yennefer. After both Yennefer and Geralt were gone, she simply had no reason to join them.

I am not sure about that.
First - when she was on Montecalvo, she said she will try to convince Geralt about that, because she saw differency in their goals.

‘I have to think about it,’ Ciri said. ‘Meditate. Put my thoughts in order. Calmly. And when I’m done I will come back here, to Montecalvo, and come before this Lodge and discuss what has been decided.’
...
'I have to try and convince Geralt that what you ladies want to do with me, differs substantially from what Vilgefortz wanted to do with his glass tube. I’ll try and explain to him the differences between castle Montecalvo and castle Stygga.'
...
'It is important that he understand it, that he accepts it. It is very important. Also for you ladies.’

And also her message for Lodge, which I quoted before seems to me like kind words for them - not for some enemy, she could leave without word for them, but she cared if they will understand what she will do and sent them apology.

Kalelinski: During my next reading of saga I will pay attention for this issue, but I also think, there wasn't mentioned something about this.
But you are also right - in the end it doesn't change anything. Both were close or few momments behind that line or one of them was - it doesn't matter. Even with Geralt we can't be sure how far he was.

 

[arkblazer]

@kalle

Not that i remember, but i think yeneffer herself warned ciri that would happen if someone just kept going the way that yeneffer did in rivia. Besides its said that she died from overusing it. and yes i know itsa cop out, but so was killing off geralt at the end.

as for ciri and the lodge, i dont think she cares all that much for them. back when they met they were fairly commanding and intimidaating with ciri and were very degrading to yen. I think most of the softer tone that she took was more because she was talking to triss who was like a big sister to her.

Even then i dont think ciri will align with the lodge in the next game. We saw how the lodge treats their queens, just look at saskia. they just want to control her the same way that everyone else wants to.

 

[Kallelinski]

Not that i remember, but i think yeneffer herself warned ciri that would happen if someone just kept going the way that yeneffer did in rivia. Besides its said that she died from overusing it. and yes i know itsa cop out, but so was killing off geralt at the end.

Ah okay. I guess both dying had more impact, both are willing to die for the other person. They already showed that affection in the books, so it makes sense.

 

[MarcAuron]

It's somewhat funny that it can be seen based on ones own beliefs.
The origin of these reflections is in one iteration based on a more metaphysical thinking, basically otherworld isn't the same as underworld or death depending on the individual reading it.
It's often a realm of supernatural beings and pretty much a temporary transition, death in one world as in not being present there anymore, doesn't mean that someone is physically dead.

The other abducted individuals where missing from this world, believed that they are dead also probably by their close ones, adding to it that by the time they returned everyone was already dead so ther would be no one anyway to remember that they even lived.
Ciri's ability to manipulate time probably solves this in Geral't case, or a grander plan to be seen if Sapkowski ever writes on the topic.

Sapkowski somewhat managed to frustrate me somewhere in the second half of the book, he wrote with a lot of space left to continue one day if he wishes so.
Another element is being very adamant about, there is no doctor, there was no doctor yet Geralt awakens in professional corset of bandages. If he's completely dead ,Ciri wouldn't have a reason to bandage him, and probably wouldn't .
Geralt reflects on this as being dead or close to it.

Ciri's sadness could be just be due to her awareness that She shouldn't be around them, or better said in any world that is any way affected by the Prophecy, and crying because She will never see them again.

 

[lurklen]

It's impossible to kill yourself without any "tools". You can't suffocate yourself by holding your breath, your body will not allow it. If you burn out yourself, you will get tired and in the end faint, unless you stress your body with enough caffeine or energy drinks.

Actually it is very possible to die of exaustion. If somehow your body doesn't have the resources to sustain life anymore than the stress put on your body can cause your heart to give out. Now for most people this happens due to a combination of lack of sleep, lack of food and water, and strenuous activity or very high temperatures.

So considering we don't know exactly how the resources of the body are used when useing magic but we do know that they are( because of the fatigue that is complained about when mages do anything huge)and we know that raising the dead the way Yenn was trying to is impossible for the average mage/sorceress and that she continued to try anyway. We can only guess that doing so depleted her body's resources so much that she dropped dead.

 

[Kallelinski]

Sure,

Of course it's possible, but in most cases people overwork themselves with the help of medications, e.g. workers with caffeine, athletes with dubious meds, gamers with countless energy drinks and so on.

but that takes >30 hours to have an effect. She would have died within a minute.

As i said later, it makes sense that she died for him because of their relationship (her life for his and vice versa, as we have already seen it in the books and later in the game), but we have not really any proof beside what the game says, so take it for whatever you want, i stick with the wedding until TW3 comes out....with a wedding at the end

 

[darcler]

Technically, even if you sever someone's head, the person (or the head, at least ) is still alive. It dies only when the brain dies a few minutes later due to lack of oxygen.

For me the whole scene was rather clear, and I didn't for a second think that Geralt died at the end. He bled out, lost consciousness, Yen also lost her consciousness when she used up too much power. Then Ciri healed Geralt with the help of Pony, and transported them to a solitary place where they could rest, away from the worries of the world. Then she took off to another world because, one: there was nothing holding her back, and her world brought her pain and hardships, and two: she thought of herself as death, that she ultimately brought doom on those around her, as she stated it repeatedly since 'The Tower of the Swallow', IIRC.

At least that's how I see the ending. And yes, Sapkowski have not shed light on whether Geralt died or lived, stating that that was his, author's, intention.

 

[jjavier]

The end of the saga is very open to interpretation.
This is mine interpretation:

The 5th entry in the saga is divided in 2 volumes:
'The Tower of the Swallow' and "The Lady of the Lake".

If you read both books as one, you can see Sapkowski uses a literary technique called "frame story".

You may have learned "frame story" in middle school. In a "frame story", the main story surrounded by a secondary story.
The secondary story it self use to be called "frame story".
This technique is typically used to give verisimilitude to the story or to place in doubt part of the narration.

When I think in what Ciri says in the secondary/frame story, I interpret Sapkowski suggests Ciri made up the rescue of Geralt and Yennefer by the unicorn and herself.
I think Ciri made up this 'cos the true story is too sad and she doesn't want to talk about it any more.
Galand has the head full of chivalry tales, so he buys the happy ending.

Think about it. Spakowski regularly mocks about mainstream storytelling in the novels.
What is more mainstream storytelling than all the text from the unicorn apparition in Rivia to the point Ciri finish to tell the story to Galland.

In summary, I think Geralt and Yennefer are dead and CDProjekt goes out from the cannon to do the game.

 

[GuyNwah]

That was very well thought out; I had wanted to draw similar inferences myself, though you have done so much better.

I am not sure, though, that the use of a frame story to make it possible to impeach Ciri's narration was something Sapkowski would do. Tolkien condemned strongly the use of frame stories to enable suspension of disbelief in fantasy, "...since the fairy-story deals with 'marvels,' it cannot tolerate any frame or machinery suggesting that the whole framework in which they occur is a figment or illusion." [On Fairy-Stories], and I don't think Sapkowski would use it for such a weak purpose, either.

I prefer to give the story its full effect, more or less along the following line:

Geralt really did die of the wounds he suffered at the business end of Rob's pitchfork.
Yennefer really did die of exertion while casting spells in an attempt to save him.
But the "marvel" that must not be lessened or dismissed as Ciri's wishful thinking or imagining is that she really did take them to a place of peace and revive them.

Where the frame does break down in the way you describe is when Galahad presses Ciri for what happened after. At this point, the fairytale wedding she confabulates is clearly something she knows not to be true, and the impossibility of returning to a life in which this could happen brings her to tears.

 

[goopit]

that's some Life of Pi shit right there.