What is your biggest fear regarding CP2077

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Wait. Are we talking about what qualifies as an RPG again?


Just two guys patting eachother in the back. There’s no thunder yet to run away from. ;)
 
A bit worried about hardware requirements and the amount of time that game will take to enjoy. Some RPGs like to make you grind for hours upon hours before you can advance past certain stages. That and having a PC that can't run this game will be biggest fears.
 
A bit worried about hardware requirements and the amount of time that game will take to enjoy. Some RPGs like to make you grind for hours upon hours before you can advance past certain stages. That and having a PC that can't run this game will be biggest fears.

I think it's been stated "any old PS4 will run the game", and, in that respect, one can compare that to PC and work out what potential minimum requirements to run the game are.

As far as game length goes, I'm on the opposite side of the fence you're on. I want the game to last 1000 hours, and have meaningful content all the way. I don't believe there's any such thing as a game that's "too long".
If anything, on top of an impossible 1000 hours play time for just the main quest, I'm all for robust modding support so that any brilliant stories that don't get told in additional quests, DLCs, and features, can get added by the modding community ... and used, or not used depending on anyone's preference.

Granted, the game will not have 1000 hours of play time in the main quest. We'll probably only ever start to see something like that happening with games when real world AI develops to such sophistication and economy of use, likely in the next 20 -25 years, to have "dev teams" of AI systems churning out content with human QA teams ensuring quality for next to nothing for a budget.
 
That comes largely from stats and their effects getting cut and/or streamlined to hell.

Most people take an "RPG" to mean a game that has a high-drama story, inventory that consists of more than just your weapons, some dialog choices and where you can make a couple of narrative decisions.

Talk about stats in a manner that actually makes a difference and most of the time you get ignored or boo'd out of the room.
I get where you're going with everything else, but that particular bit is such a vague, broad description as to include almost every story-driven game in existence.
 
I think it's been stated "any old PS4 will run the game", and, in that respect, one can compare that to PC and work out what potential minimum requirements to run the game are.

As far as game length goes, I'm on the opposite side of the fence you're on. I want the game to last 1000 hours, and have meaningful content all the way. I don't believe there's any such thing as a game that's "too long".
If anything, on top of an impossible 1000 hours play time for just the main quest, I'm all for robust modding support so that any brilliant stories that don't get told in additional quests, DLCs, and features, can get added by the modding community ... and used, or not used depending on anyone's preference.

Granted, the game will not have 1000 hours of play time in the main quest. We'll probably only ever start to see something like that happening with games when real world AI develops to such sophistication and economy of use, likely in the next 20 -25 years, to have "dev teams" of AI systems churning out content with human QA teams ensuring quality for next to nothing for a budget.
What I mean by too long, is too grindy. They put a bunch of meaningless side quests in for you to do that have zero impact on the main story, and then make you do them to progress the main story line. Or they make you do it for exp. I don't mind if a story is long, love it actually.
 
What I mean by too long, is too grindy. They put a bunch of meaningless side quests in for you to do that have zero impact on the main story, and then make you do them to progress the main story line. Or they make you do it for exp. I don't mind if a story is long, love it actually.

I like side quests. I like side quests that have nothing to do with the main story. I like a living, breathing world in an RPG where not everything has to do with the main character, or the main story line.
What's your definition of "meaningless"?
If there's a side quest, or 562 dozen side quests, and they all have interesting stories and content, but none of that content has anything to do with the main quest, I'm all for it.
Screw the main quest. I never touch the main quest line in an open world game until I've run out of all the other interesting things to do. Every action taken to advance the main story quest line is an action that brings the end of the game closer, and if I like a game, I don't want to see the end. I'm hoping there's a ton of things that can be done that have absolutely nothing to do with the main quest. The more things to do, places to go, adventures to have that all give zero cares about the main quest line, the better.

I want my character to be able to go down to a retro themed arcade, and toss quarters into machines to beat the Galaga rip-off, and and come back later to find that someone else has beat my high score, and now I have to beat theirs.
I want my character to be able to play pool on a pool table with NPCs, and even make bets on the game.
I want there to be a street racer scene where you can tune up your car and go do street racing against NPCs for cash, prizes, or just the fun of racing all over Night City.
I want to be able to follow random NPCs throughout their day/night cycle schedules to see if they repeat, or if there's any NPCs the devs have given a secret life that means nothing to the game, means nothing to any quest, gives you no experience, and is only interesting to the kinds of people like me that might find it really interesting that NPC #295 has a complete collection of beanie baby plush animals hidden in the closet of their apartment.
I want all that stupid meaningless activity that I can spend tons of time on enjoying all the weird freckles and moles of the game that don't give any experience, don't give items or quests, and have nothing to do with really anything in the game, but, still add meaningful subjective experiences.
Now, I can certainly understand a disdain for fetch quests that don't really do anything to bring a quality experience, but, so long as a quest tells a good story, regardless how meaningless the quest is, so long as it tells a good story, I'm all for it.

That, however, is me. More = better.
 
but that particular bit is such a vague, broad description as to include almost every story-driven game in existence.

Yeah, it is. That’s part of the point. The definition has been broadened too much.

I don’t know why exactly. Perhaps because it has seemed that it is somehow ”cool” (for the lack of a better word) to call a game an RPG or like RPG’s because it might have a token similiarity somewhere to why people used to like them. Or not. I dunno.
 
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Yeah, it is. That’s part of the point. The definition has been broadened too much.

I don’t know why exactly. Perhaps because it has seemed that it is somehow ”cool” (for the lack of a better word) to call a game an RPG or like RPG’s because it might have a token similiarity somewhere to why people used to like them. Or not. I dunno.
Marketing.

RPG is a buzzword just like multi-player, open world, and realistic graphics.

Their real meaning is irrelevant, it's what the marketing department thinks customers will buy that matters.
 
Marketing.

RPG is a buzzword just like multi-player, open world, and realistic graphics.

Their real meaning is irrelevant, it's what the marketing department thinks customers will buy that matters.

Isn't that a bit pessimistic?
Certainly the term "RPG" can be painted with a broad brush, as well as can most genres. I doubt, however, anything like the Street Fighter, or Mortal Combat games could ever fit into that picture, regardless how wildly delusional a marketing team might try to sell such a notion.

Yes, there can be narrow and broad definitions applied to what makes a Role Playing Game, but, it's far from being just a buzzword.

The gaming community, if one is paying attention, is getting tired of marketing ploys in attempting to tell the community what it's suppose to be thinking. The community is getting tired of the money grabs, game as service, and other scams. There's some kickback against developers employing such tactics. Look at Bethesda going through the wringer with Fallout 76.
Sure, there's a demographic that will eat up any old crap, and call it icecream if they're told to call it icecream, but, it's not a significant enough percentile to hold against all the current backlash in the review, and gaming news set that's calling things for what they are, pointing fingers, and making noise about it.

It seems CDPR has had their ears to the ground, and read the signs correctly considering their current approach with CP 2077 with no micro transactions, rumored No DRM, lack of online features or elements on launch, no exclusivity deals, and all the many things so many are rather upset about and tired of game developers trying to push.

In that sense, when CDPR says the game is an "RPG", despite a very shooter-looking game demo, I'm compelled to believe, at the very least, that they believe they're making an RPG. What everyone's subjective definition of what an RPG is, however, is a matter for discussion.
Character Customization? - check
Character inventory - check
... what other little check boxes can we all agree swim around in the RPG pool?
Which check boxes are mandatory? Optional, but nice to have?
What's the stripped down absolute bare necessities for something to be defined as an RPG?
 
My biggest fear is that the mod support for the game will be equivalent to the Witcher's which was not good at all. Skyrim still lives on thanks the incredible mod community it has. Adding in entire new companions or guns or clothing would make this game last so much longer and give me something to look forward to other than DLC.
 
My biggest fear is that the mod support for the game will be equivalent to the Witcher's which was not good at all. Skyrim still lives on thanks the incredible mod community it has. Adding in entire new companions or guns or clothing would make this game last so much longer and give me something to look forward to other than DLC.

I'm of similar mind.
If the mod support is equivalent to Skyrim/Fallout, or, we can only hope, better, there's far more than just simple add-ins that could be had.
We could write, and build out entire quest lines and stories.
I'm not sure how prevalent "deep fake" software is, but, if there's open-source for it, and it's applicable to and can be impoted to work with the CP 2077 character models, then modders could have fully voiced NPCs without the need of voice actors.

Much, of course, depends on what tools CDPR is using to develop this game, issues with licensing, and/or whether there's open-source equivalents, and how those can be applied.
We can certainly have hope.
It's one of the biggest ticket items on my wish list for this game. :)

There's also the question regarding inclusiveness. Traditionally Modding has mainly been the province of PC, but, there's attempts been had for consoles, so, as inclusive as CDPR is about getting the base game out for all platforms, it's likely they'd want to do similar for modding so no one feels left out. It's just good business, but, it adds a layer of complexity for the development of such tools for a feature that would be free, and that likely comes with a cost/risk/benefit calculation.
As said, We can hope.
 
Must ... resist ... repeating ... self ... about ... what makes ... a R ... PG ...

Drat.

It's really not that broad. A role playing game is where you take on the role of a persistent character or characters and make choices within the role(s) that effect the narrative of a story. Said more shortly, it's playing a role. Acting and making choices as the character. RPG is where character agency and player agency meet. Thus the player character is not just an avatar of the player themselves, but the player puts themselves in the shoes of the character, and makes choices as them.

There are some games that claim to be RPGs that do not meet this definition. It's not necessarily stats, or character creation, or any of those other bells and whistles that make an RPG (though those things are certainly common in RPGs). It is role playing. That's what it is ... by definition.
 
My only fear currently is that the character creation and all of the creative aspects of the game will fall short. Fashion/Fashionware, character creation, even vehicles, i hope there are plenty of options so you are truly able to do your own thing. And hopefully aren't eventually limited because there are higher level things that you almost have no choice but to use. Some sort of colour system would be cool.
Blood and Wine had color system for armor so i think CP2077 has to have something similar
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Far Cry has become an "RPG" with new dawn. :ROFLMAO: That's so stupid, you shoot at someone's head from 1 meter with a shotgun but if he's level 4 and you have low level shotgun you barely hurt him. Or you unlock the blowtorch with skill points. :ROFLMAO:

Goddamn if CP will do the same...
You do realize that in this world it actually makes sense with implants?
 
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Isn't that a bit pessimistic?
I call it realistic.
It's what Marketing does, and why they do it. To appeal to the broadest possible market thus increase sales.


In that sense, when CDPR says the game is an "RPG", despite a very shooter-looking game demo, I'm compelled to believe, at the very least, that they believe they're making an RPG. What everyone's subjective definition of what an RPG is, however, is a matter for discussion.
Character Customization? - check
Character inventory - check
... what other little check boxes can we all agree swim around in the RPG pool?
Which check boxes are mandatory? Optional, but nice to have?
What's the stripped down absolute bare necessities for something to be defined as an RPG?
And 90% of the time the folks labeling games as RPGs miss (or intentionally ignore) the primary thing that make an RPG an RPG, character stats and skills, character driven combat and skill usage. Customization, inventories, "perks" (i.e. abilities vice improvable skills), stats that are easily/frequently upgraded, a story-line, the occasional game altering decision, and most of the rest are game mechanics not RPG mechanics. They're not integral to the core features that make an RPG an RPG.

Your assumption various game mechanics are core RPG features makes my point. Marketing has so muddied the waters most gamers don't even know what an RPG is, they assume it's what Marketing tells them it is.

And this is why we hardcore RPG types are disappointed by what we saw in the 48 minute demo. Virtually everything in it shouts FPS with minor RPG elements.
 
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If the main plot line falls in line with The Witcher 3, i'll be dissappointed. I want more of an emotional punch from the main story. Everything else in the Witcher 3, minus maybe the combat was perfect though
Witcher 3 had an emotional punch for a lot of people me included first time i ever hear someone say it didn't have that.
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What I mean by too long, is too grindy. They put a bunch of meaningless side quests in for you to do that have zero impact on the main story, and then make you do them to progress the main story line. Or they make you do it for exp. I don't mind if a story is long, love it actually.
Have you played W3? if CP2077 has any of that meaningless grindy sidequest i will be seriously shocked. That one thing i wouldn't worry about.
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rumored No DRM
No DRM needs no confirmation and its confirmed by default. CDPR owns GOG and they only sell games without DRM.
 
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My biggest fear is that the mod support for the game will be equivalent to the Witcher's which was not good at all. Skyrim still lives on thanks the incredible mod community it has. Adding in entire new companions or guns or clothing would make this game last so much longer and give me something to look forward to other than DLC.

Mods aren't going to happen.
 
It's not necessarily stats, or character creation, or any of those other bells and whistles that make an RPG

Not alone (necessarily). But neither does a branching storyline.

It’s more about the mix of those two, but if it’s a roleplaying ”game”, instead of simply ”roleplaying” (which can ne done anywhere, any time, with or without a game), the use and presentation of stats absolutely matter. A lot. Because they are the ones that make the difference between characters models like Andre the Giant and Stephen Hawking, where the lack of them would simply leave those two character types mechanically and physically identical.

There is more to a role and player agency than simply unfolding a story.

Witcher is a great example of a somewhat disjointed approach of this. He is supposed to ve a master swordsman, but if the player is bad with the controls, Geralt will flail around like a child and is flain by peasants with pitchforks. Here, playeragency would be better served - rpG-wise - by leaving the physical action to Geralt (it’s his forte) and letting the player make the more tactical decisions.

(And before Sard jumps in with the ”but players have different levels tactical eye and intelligence, not fair” ;) the optimal situation would of course be to have automated combat sequences ala Wasteland and Bard’s Tale with a combat tactics skill... but, the point is that while the player has to have something to actually play, the important stuff that befits the character as per who he is and how he is built, should remain on him and his level of skill. The players’ lot is to build the character to fair in different situations where he guides him.)
 
And 90% of the time the folks labeling games as RPGs miss (or intentionally ignore) the primary thing that make an RPG an RPG, character stats and skills, character driven combat and skill usage. Customization, inventories, "perks" (i.e. abilities vice improvable skills), stats that are easily/frequently upgraded, a story-line, the occasional game altering decision, and most of the rest are game mechanics not RPG mechanics. They're not integral to the core features that make an RPG an RPG.

This is a very convoluted, very specific definition in which you describe not what an RPG is but what a few games that belong to the RPG genre are. It’s also one of the reasons why I’ve come to believe that trying to describe a video game using a single acronym has become pointless as it isn’t in any way an exhaustive method of describing it’s features.

How would games like Skyrim or KD: Deliverance fit into that definition? Or are you saying they're not part of the loving RPG family?

Your assumption various game mechanics are core RPG features makes my point. Marketing has so muddied the waters most gamers don't even know what an RPG is, they assume it's what Marketing tells them it is.

I doubt there’s anyone out there trying to pull one over RPG or “hardcore” RPG types.

This argument might work.. except it has one major flaw.. RPG’s as you describe them were never among the top selling games for PC, even less so on consoles, they were always a nishe genre. The few exceptions would be the Bioware games like Baldur’s gate or NwN, but even those pale in comparison to other games in different genres. Marketing a game as something that doesn’t really sell would be bad marketing.
 
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