Why do many fans believe this game (in comparable aspects) will be inferior to GTA?

[fridgeband]

It is not the case in a single-player mode (GTA V). Because it is a linear adventure story game with some action and optional simulation. They might refer to multiplayer, which I am not a big fan of. I am a single player games fan.

Even the multiplayer of GTA is still very sandbox, driving around wherever the player wants. I like many elements of the GTA series, but the overall experience I do not like for many reasons. it has nothing to do with single or multiplayer, I say this just in case. (even though I do prefer single player games) all I'm saying is that GTA does CONTAIN sandbox elements INSIDE of it.

Post automatically merged: Aug 25, 2020

I vote for coining a new classification of genre, specifically for cyberpunk and all games like it.
We are too hung up on the labels of games. I'd be happy if it could just be called RPG.


Any suggestions?

Cyberpunk has all kinds of different elements in it. I'm also tired of the constant labeling and trying to put things inside of limiting boxes. I like it how Cyberpunk2077 is just doing a lot of different things, seemingly the best parts of many different things just mixed together, like very good ingredients coming together to make a very good recipe for really good food. Without these different ingredients, like FPS, and RPG, and Adventure and sandbox, racing cars, science-non-fiction (rather than science fiction) really would the food still taste the same? It's all these different spices that make the game have FLAVOR

If the game was forced into any one box, it wouldn't be fun anymore. really really old video games could maybe do one thing only, some of the time. (honestly I had things I loved and things I did not like at all about old games) We're in the year 2020 and video games (and hopefully movies too) are evolving out of what are essentially "The dark ages"/"Medieval times" of movies and games into an age of "lets just make some crazy **** because it's FUN and it works, **** the labels"

and I'm happy about that.

Post automatically merged: Aug 25, 2020

It clearly says "non-linear gameplay" It is a contradiction because GTA is linear in single-player mode. It does not "give the player a great degree of creativity to complete tasks towards a goal within the game"

In every GTA game I have ever played, even when playing single player mode, I always got in a car and drove around all over the place and just did whatever I wanted, often ignoring the main story missions for even a couple years IRL because the main story missions were always so difficult and frustrating. So linear.... I wouldn't say I agree with that.
"DAMNIT CJ ALL YOU HAD TO DO WAS FOLLOW THE DAMN TRAIN" LOL I was like "nah I'll just put in cheat codes and fly my car like an airplane"

Post automatically merged: Aug 25, 2020

Ok, this is kinda off-topic but I'll elaborate.

I brought up flexibility in mission completion because you did. You can often achieve the objective in different ways. Gold medals are irrelevant to the discussion if you don't mind my saying so.

Maybe you feel that there's little to do in GTA when not on a mission but people always tell me how much fun they have just messing about. In previous entries I did too. It might not be your cup of tea but they love having the freedom allowed, hence the term sandbox.

Do you think R* themselves would agree with you that, 'Outside of story missions, there's little to do'? I think they'd disagree strongly.

For example, my son played hours and hours of GTA SA, and hardly touched the story missions.

People will play these games and just drive about sight-seeing or finding stunts, blow things up, hold off against the police, run through a park in their underpants beating people with baseball bats, try to ride a bike along the edge of a bridge, see if they can skydive through a Ferris wheel, pilot a speedboat up a ramp into a food market...it goes on and on. Because it's a sandbox that players love messing about in. That's why it's regarded as such.

Just to add an on-topic point, this is why comparisons with CP are difficult in some ways. I don't think CP is trying to create the expriences mentoned above - CP doesn't desire to be a sandbox, from what I can tell.

I agree with almost everything but I disagree in the sense that I feel like Cyberpunk2077 might have some really fun sandbox stuff in it. It's just my opinion, but based on what I've observed from all the gameplay CDPR released so far, it looks like there's gonna be some sand-boxy type stuff going on, for example the car racing events around the city that was mentioned by someone a while back, and the npc variety and how npc's can pee and all these different things TO ME at least, point towards a non-corporate-buzzword "living breathing world" that's ACTUALLY seriously a convincing game world that can be messed around with like a sand box. I feel like Cyberpunk2077 is completely going to beat any GTA game ever in how "alive" the world is and how much fun things you can do and how much you can mess around. I'm just saying, this is just my opinion and I just have a feeling, this is gonna be gooooooooooooood

Post automatically merged: Aug 25, 2020

Minecraft is not a story-driven game, in which it is the story that dictates progression etc.

After Microsoft purchased it from Notch, it totally did become.

Post automatically merged: Aug 25, 2020

Minecraft has no limitations.

Well.... It's really difficult to make a circle in minecraft.

Post automatically merged: Aug 25, 2020

If people wanna compare other "cyberpunk-like" games with "GTA," then "Watch_Dogs" should be the prime comparisons for that.

Oh no please don't remind me how disappoint I was with watch doges

 

[fantesmeee]

In every GTA game I have ever played, even when playing single player mode, I always got in a car and drove around all over the place and just did whatever I wanted

What did you do? Drive around? Driving is like riding a horse in RDR or the Witcher. Open exploration won't give you a full "sandbox experience". GTA does not offer a lot of sandbox features in single player. The world is immersive and beautiful, but except missions that are story and gameplay linear and repetitive, I had not much to do in it. A few side activities that I enjoyed had to be unlocked through the linear story. This is not how a sandbox game looks like. Even though GTA does have sandbox elements included in it. I don't deny it.

RDR2 is also a story-driven game. That's the focus of Rockstar Games. It has a few side activities - hunting, a few mini-games. That's it. But is this the most important in their game? No. They do add some activities for the sake of the multiplayer. In single-player the plot, the story is the most important thing. I can go wherever I want, but only have a few options to interact with...

 

[fridgeband]

What did you do? Drive around? Driving in like riding a horse in RDR or the Witcher. Open exploration won't give you a full "sandbox experience". GTA does not offer a lot of sandbox features in single player. The world is immersive and beautiful, but except missions that are story and gameplay linear and repetitive, I had not much to do in it. A few side activities that I enjoyed had to be unlocked through the linear story. This is not how a sandbox game looks like. Even though GTA does have sandbox elements included in it. I don't deny it.

I would just explore and try to crash my cars in spectacular ways and mess around, and try to try if certain things would work. Eventually all GTA games became very boring for me. For how big the world is, it's very dull and depressing after a while, even with little activities (which I would argue weren't that great) But I still consider GTA games sandboxes, just not very good ones. So Yea to be fair, they're sandboxes but just not good games overall in my opinion. This is why I think Cyberpunk is going to completely be better than GTA in every way, since the game world is just going to be so high quality that it will be more difficult to get bored, in comparison to GTA. I'm only comparing it to GTA because this thread exists, and because both games let you drive a car around a city. Beyond that, there's no reason for me to compare it, other than to point out how obviously vastly better Cyberpunk2077 is/will be, in my opinion.

 

[fantesmeee]

I would just explore and try to crash my cars in spectacular ways and mess around, and try to try if certain things would work. Eventually all GTA games became very boring for me. For how big the world is, it's very dull and depressing after a while, even with little activities (which I would argue weren't that great) But I still consider GTA games sandboxes, just not very good ones. So Yea to be fair, they're sandboxes but just not good games overall in my opinion. This is why I think Cyberpunk is going to completely be better than GTA in every way, since the game world is just going to be so high quality that it will be more difficult to get bored, in comparison to GTA. I'm only comparing it to GTA because this thread exists, and because both games let you drive a car around a city. Beyond that, there's no reason for me to compare it, other than to point out how obviously vastly better Cyberpunk2077 is/will be, in my opinion.

They are and they aren't sandboxes. In the missions, they are not because they don't meet the definition criteria. Ignore missions, and yes... what you get is a poor sandbox because it lacks many sandbox features.

But those games can be very beautiful. I do enjoy that Kingdom Come Deliverance realism in RDR. Just riding a horse through the world and its exploration can be very enjoyable because it is really immersive and realistic.

And one thing. Rockstar Games did not write and record 500,000 lines (8 years of work) for a sandbox experience. No. Their focus is a story-driven action-adventure game that reminds a movie.

I basically love Rockstar Games since I played GTAV. It is a lot of fun, even though I am generally an RPG, strategy, or survival gameplay fan.

 

[fridgeband]

They are and they aren't sandboxes. In the missions, they are not because they don't meet the definition criteria. Ignore missions, and yes... what you get is a poor sandbox because it lacks many sandbox features.

But those games can be very beautiful. I do enjoy that Kingdom Come Deliverance realism in RDR. Just riding a horse through the world and its exploration can be very enjoyable because it is really immersive and realistic.

And one thing. Rockstar Games did not write and record 500,000 lines for a sandbox experience. No. Their focus is a story-driven action-adventure game that reminds a movie.

I basically love Rockstar Games since I played GTAV. It is a lot of fun, even though I am generally an RPG, strategy, or survival gameplay fan.

I think it's an important thing to consider that the sandbox elements of GTA, however lacking they were, were still more fun than the story missions that the games provided. I could not possibly be less interested in the story missions in GTA games, and most people that I have ever spoken to about GTA only purchased GTA games for the sole purpose of ignoring the story missions and just driving around, because even using the games sandbox elements only, which were very boring, were still more fun and worth it than the actual story missions in the first place. I couldn't say the same thing about kingdom come deliverance, which had some interesting story (but really not that interesting at all in my opinion), a really boring main character that seems like a good friend in real life, but just not an interesting main character for a video game, but absolutely awful horrendous atrociously bad clunky game play, both inside the main quest, and outside of it just messing around in the game world. The only part of kingdom come deliverance that stood out to me was the story, and only certain parts of the story caught my interest. It was almost something I could handle and go along with, if not for the horrible game play that was essentially a giant slow grindy collection of fetch quests. The game was an absolute chore to play, and watching the game contradict itself constantly while attempting to adhere to a very inconsistent idea of very unrealistic "realism" made for a really bad experience.

The reason why I think these details are important in comparison to Cyberpunk2077 is that Cyberpunk2077 seems like it's going to have:
1. an interesting main character that can be customized and shaped to the players enjoyment
2. very interesting story
3. very interesting game world that seems full of cool things and people and feels alive (even outside of the main missions) and not in the corporate buzzword sense. (because I always hear game devs and publishers say "LIVING BREATHING WORLD" but it's always a lie, but Cyberpunk actually feels like it's going to be this special and unique game that does well with that.
4. game play that appears fun, and not tedious or grindy or a chore.

I feel like based on what everyone has seen of Cyberpunk so far, that Cyberpunk seems to get right what countless games before it get so so very wrong.

Just by being as good as it is, I feel like Cyberpunk is going to be a better GTA than GTA, and it's gonna be a better Kingdom than Kingdome come deliverance. All these games, it's gonna beat them and out-do them and say to them "Yea, THIS IS HOW YOU DO IT!" I really believe that this is going to be a game changer.

 

[fantesmeee]

I think it's an important thing to consider that the sandbox elements of GTA, however lacking they were, were still more fun than the story missions that the games provided. I could not possibly be less interested in the story missions in GTA games, and most people that I have ever spoken to about GTA only purchased GTA games for the sole purpose of ignoring the story missions and just driving around, because even using the games sandbox elements only, which were very boring, were still more fun and worth it than the actual story missions in the first place. I couldn't say the same thing about kingdom come deliverance, which had some interesting story (but really not that interesting at all in my opinion), a really boring main character that seems like a good friend in real life, but just not an interesting main character for a video game, but absolutely awful horrendous atrociously bad clunky game play, both inside the main quest, and outside of it just messing around in the game world. The only part of kingdom come deliverance that stood out to me was the story, and only certain parts of the story caught my interest. It was almost something I could handle and go along with, if not for the horrible game play that was essentially a giant slow grindy collection of fetch quests. The game was an absolute chore to play, and watching the game contradict itself constantly while attempting to adhere to a very inconsistent idea of very unrealistic "realism" made for a really bad experience.

The reason why I think these details are important in comparison to Cyberpunk2077 is that Cyberpunk2077 seems like it's going to have:
1. an interesting main character that can be customized and shaped to the players enjoyment
2. very interesting story
3. very interesting game world that seems full of cool things and people and feels alive (even outside of the main missions) and not in the corporate buzzword sense. (because I always hear game devs and publishers say "LIVING BREATHING WORLD" but it's always a lie, but Cyberpunk actually feels like it's going to be this special and unique game that does well with that.
4. game play that appears fun, and not tedious or grindy or a chore.

I feel like based on what everyone has seen of Cyberpunk so far, that Cyberpunk seems to get right what countless games before it get so so very wrong.

Just by being as good as it is, I feel like Cyberpunk is going to be a better GTA than GTA, and it's gonna be a better Kingdom than Kingdome come deliverance. All these games, it's gonna beat them and out-do them and say to them "Yea, THIS IS HOW YOU DO IT!" I really believe that this is going to be a game changer.

You see. I don't want to talk about our tastes, but you forgot about the beautiful graphics and incredible medieval atmosphere. Towns, castles, sounds, music. The fact of being in that world and exploring it. KCD is one of my favorite games, in fact. Just look at the alchemy system in the game. Is there a game that provided a similar system? Yes, it can be tidious but they gave auto after you have mastered it. Great solution. And awesome "clunky" hardcore combat system that you need to master. I did play it on hardcore mode. When I went into the forest, I got lost and never came back. I died of hunger or they killed me. I was too weak to go there. "My mistake". I should have stuck to roads etc. Every sing is important like in the real world. I love such gameplay. I also installed mods, and it was very difficult to survive. That's why I turned RDR2 and The Elder Scrolls games into a survival simulator. It is a niche game. You love it or hate it. Maybe I am a masochist gamer who enjoyed games such as Gothic 1 and 2. Who knows?

Grind is not bad if it is implemented well. It needs to blend with story and gameplay. Some people also ignore world exploration, loot, and things like "secret and unique items". Maps and rare treasures. There are a lot more details etc.

Sadly enough, Rockstar Games does not support mods to fully turn it into an RPG or survival game. However, I managed to do it with Witcher 3

Except for those above features that CP won't give me, I would like it to be brutal, which will force you to make difficult moral choices that have consequences. Good character development, feeling of RPG character progression. Good story, multiple endings. Unique and interesting, not generic side quests. Good music (guaranteed) already. Good graphics. I would like an advanced dynamic weather system (it's very important to me, no Ubisoft game ever had that even FC or Assasins). Well, most of these things, as well as others, are almost sure already. Sci-fi vibe and atmosphere that will blow Deus Ex away forever.

Other things, I would like to see real metro, car customization. What else? Combat and driving need to be improved and adjusted. But that is only my personal but quite common opinion.

 

[fridgeband]

You see. I don't want to talk about our tastes, but you forgot about the beautiful graphics and incredible medieval atmosphere. Towns, castles, sounds, music. The fact of being in that world and exploring it. KCD is one of my favorite games, in fact. Just look at the alchemy system in the game. Is there a game that provided a similar system? Yes, it can be tidious but they gave auto after you have mastered it. Great solution. And awesome "clunky" hardcore combat system that you need to master. I did play it on hardcore mode. When I went into the forest, I got lost and never came back. I died of hunger or they killed me. I was too weak to go there. "My mistake". I should have stuck to roads etc. Every sing is important like in the real world. I love such gameplay. I also installed mods, and it was very difficult to survive. That's why I turned RDR2 and The Elder Scrolls games into a survival simulator. It is a niche game. You love it or hate it. Maybe I am a masochist gamer who enjoyed games such as Gothic 1 and 2. Who knows?

Grind is not bad if it is implemented well. It needs to blend with story and gameplay. Some people also ignore world exploration, loot, and things like "secret and unique items". Maps and rare treasures. There are a lot more details etc.

Sadly enough, Rockstar Games does not support mods to fully turn it into an RPG or survival game. However, I managed to do it with Witcher 3

Except for those above features that CP won't give me, I would like it to be brutal, which will force you to make difficult moral choices that have consequences. Good character development, feeling of RPG character progression. Good story, multiple endings. Unique and interesting, not generic side quests. Good music (guaranteed) already. Good graphics. I would like an advanced dynamic weather system (it's very important to me, no Ubisoft game ever had that even FC or Assasins). Well, most of these things, as well as others, are almost sure already. Sci-fi vibe and atmosphere that will blow Deus Ex away forever.

Other things, I would like to see real metro, car customization. What else? Combat and driving need to be improved and adjusted. But that is only my personal but quite common opinion.

I agree the landscapes in kingdom come deliverance were sort of nice, but I guess they weren't my cup of tea. Eventually it kept repeating and it all looked the same to me and I even lost interest in the landscape as well, especially considering how I kept getting stuck and trapped on every single little difference or feature in the terrain constantly throughout my entire gameplay experience. Yes I also agree with modding being important. I LOVE video game mods. Sometimes mods save an otherwise unplayable game, (sometimes they can't) and sometimes mods make an already great game even more magical.
I am very excited to see the variety of different landscapes and cityscapes in Cyberpunk2077 and I also hope that there is excellent modding support for Cyberpunk2077.

 

[fantesmeee]

I agree the landscapes in kingdom come deliverance were sort of nice, but I guess they weren't my cup of tea. Eventually it kept repeating and it all looked the same to me and I even lost interest in the landscape as well, especially considering how I kept getting stuck and trapped on every single little difference or feature in the terrain constantly throughout my entire gameplay experience. Yes I also agree with modding being important. I LOVE video game mods. Sometimes mods save an otherwise unplayable game, (sometimes they can't) and sometimes mods make an already great game even more magical.
I am very excited to see the variety of different landscapes and cityscapes in Cyberpunk2077 and I also hope that there is excellent modding support for Cyberpunk2077.

Maybe you played some early (buggy) version? Well, not every game is for everyone. Not your cup of tea simply. And that's all right. Let's agree to differ. How about RDR2 with its "tidious" mechanics?

Mods are very powerful. It gives a lot of choice and freedom. Bethesda Game Studios rules here. Paradox Games and many other niches or indie companies that allow for it. EA or UBI sucks really much in that regard. Their games could be so great, but they lack the modding possibilities.

Mods make games live forever!

Witcher 3 had some modding support. Not as big as Bethesda Games, but you can already see the results. Many huge and great mods available on Nexus.

So yeah, another thing. I hope CP has more modding support than GTA or Witcher 3 etc.

 

[fridgeband]

So yeah, another thing. I hope CP has more modding support than GTA or Witcher 3 etc.

I feel like bethesda and paradox used to be better, but I don't really feel that they're the same anymore. They've changed so much, and I am shocked.
Even EA and Ubisoft used to be really good a very long time ago, but I can't say the same now.

If CDPR can release modding tools/ mod kit but like REALLLLLLLLLLY GOOD modding tools kit for Cyberpunk2077, the popularity of the game combined with how good the modding toolkit is would boost the popularity of the game even further and create a modding community even bigger than minecraft and skyrim combined. The only way for this to work is if the modding toolkit is EXCELLENT, like the best modding toolkit that has ever been seen in video game history, hopefully with support for overlapping mods.

Thats the biggest thing that messes up most mods, is lack of mod toolkits, and lack of mod compatibility meaning that the player can only use some mods at a time, but not others because they conflict. But of course, no modding toolkit = less mods made in the first place, or some mods are even very difficult to make in the first place. This of course is extremely bad because less mods = less mods, and less mods is very bad. I would argue that the Witcher 3 suffered from not having many mods,

(I consider it not much because most of the mods were just attempts at making certain things work and most of the mods were broken or outdated, and the extent to which the mods did things was very limited since modders couldn't change very much, and when they tried to do more interesting things, the mods would break or have issues)
So I really feel that lack of very good quality in depth modding toolkit sort of ruined mods for the Witcher 3, I feel like it could have been much better, but wasn't because of these reasons.

I'm really hoping that Cyberpunk2077 will make it extremely easy for modders so that people don't just make a couple of mods and then abandon them. It's always the worst feeling when 99% of all the pages of mods a game has are all broken and outdated, or when 99% of all the mods are all very light, superficial, minimal changes because modders couldn't do more because they were limited by lack of mod tools.

 

[fantesmeee]

I feel like bethesda and paradox used to be better, but I don't really feel that they're the same anymore. They've changed so much, and I am shocked.
Even EA and Ubisoft used to be really good a very long time ago, but I can't say the same now.

If CDPR can release modding tools/ mod kit but like REALLLLLLLLLLY GOOD modding tools kit for Cyberpunk2077, the popularity of the game combined with how good the modding toolkit is would boost the popularity of the game even further and create a modding community even bigger than minecraft and skyrim combined. The only way for this to work is if the modding toolkit is EXCELLENT, like the best modding toolkit that has ever been seen in video game history, hopefully with support for overlapping mods.

Thats the biggest thing that messes up most mods, is lack of mod toolkits, and lack of mod compatibility meaning that the player can only use some mods at a time, but not others because they conflict. But of course, no modding toolkit = less mods made in the first place, or some mods are even very difficult to make in the first place. This of course is extremely bad because less mods = less mods, and less mods is very bad. I would argue that the Witcher 3 suffered from not having many mods,

(I consider it not much because most of the mods were just attempts at making certain things work and most of the mods were broken or outdated, and the extent to which the mods did things was very limited since modders couldn't change very much, and when they tried to do more interesting things, the mods would break or have issues)
So I really feel that lack of very good quality in depth modding toolkit sort of ruined mods for the Witcher 3, I feel like it could have been much better, but wasn't because of these reasons.

I'm really hoping that Cyberpunk2077 will make it extremely easy for modders so that people don't just make a couple of mods and then abandon them. It's always the worst feeling when 99% of all the pages of mods a game has are all broken and outdated, or when 99% of all the mods are all very light, superficial, minimal changes because modders couldn't do more because they were limited by lack of mod tools.

Maybe let's drop that company comparisons because this topic is totally off-top, and we could discuss it somewhere else, not here.

However, I wanted to add a few words to your post:

Point one: I would really love if CDPR made modding tools so big they would allow as easy modding as Bethesda Games Studios. From some quest and world editor to scripting, and graphics. etc. They should do it for sure. No doubt about it. Nowadays it is a must if they want the game to live long years. Just look at the old Morrowind. Over 1,000 new mods in 2019. Such an old yet beautiful and unique game. Probably a record in 20 years, but we should wait for 2020, etc.

Point two: Witcher 3 got a lot of extremely good mods that should make you re-play the game more than one time. It's amazing. However, Skyrim has over 60,000 mods just on Nexus. There are more mods outside Nexus. And those numbers change. I do not follow it. So it's not a current number. It's devastating. A mod needs another mod that needs a patch that needs a number of other patches or mods. It's crazy. Hard to follow. There is a guy on Youtube that installed over 1326 mods on Skyrim and it works. Total conversion of a pretty old game.

And this is amazing. Why CDPR shouldn't allow for it? Please do it if you can!

Thanks to Skyrim mods, many Youtubers made some decent careers, too.

 

[gogmeister777]

I agree with almost everything but I disagree in the sense that I feel like Cyberpunk2077 might have some really fun sandbox stuff in it.

You might well be right and that'd be fine by me I mean, if it does, it'll be a bonus - something we can dip in and out of depending on one's mood.

 

[fridgeband]

Maybe let's drop that company comparisons because this topic is totally off-top, and we could discuss it somewhere else, not here.

Hey you brought it up, but I'm glad to talk about things as long as I feel that they're related, and I totally felt that was relevant, so I don't see any problem, but I'm sure that all of our posts have been on topic considering that there were very strong good reasons to mention the different games and their different features and levels of modding support and compare them to each other and Cyberpunk2077, considering that the title of the thread says "Why do many fans believe this game (in comparable aspects) will be inferior to GTA?"
I just copy-pasted it to make it impossible for me to make a mistake.
(considering that quality of modding support and the existence or lack of modding support is something that is definitely factored into this whole entire better/worse comparison)
So it's actually very important and useful that we are comparing the game(s) and their aspect(s) to each other, to deconstruct the logic behind why some believe that one or another game will be better or worse for a variety of different fact and/or also opinion based reasons for the different comparisons. One of the discussions that comes out of all of this, as well as every other thread as some point or another is all of our hopes and dreams for the game, because in this example comparing games based on opinions of better and worse etc. are related to what we want and what we don't want, therefor this is directly correlated with our hopes and dreams for Cyberpunk2077, resulting in the inevitable usual short and sweet discussion about modding that usually pops up for a post or two (interwoven with various on topic discussion of course since it's all related and connected to everything else 100%) where forum users further illustrate their hopes and dreams even further. Really, if anyone really thinks anything I said was off topic, I would probably just throw my computer into the trash can from the overwhelming and utter demoralization I would experience. I am not aiming this comment at anyone, I'm just saying, This is really serious discussion to me, and the connections are everywhere. I bring it up first and foremost because I care very very much about all of it, and in a very deep way it does directly connect, as I have pointed out so clearly. So everything is fine, and the conversation flows naturally and continues, we said what we needed to say and we're past that point, but I'm glad it happened because it was a healthy part of the conversation required to go from point A to point B, resulting in a pretty good level of understanding, and we got a bunch of weight off of our shoulders by expressing our hopes and dreams, while remaining on topic the entire time.

However, I wanted to add a few words to your post:

Point one: I would really love if CDPR made modding tools so big they would allow as easy modding as Bethesda Games Studios. From some quest and world editor to scripting, and graphics. etc. They should do it for sure. No doubt about it. Nowadays it is a must if they want the game to live long years. Just look at the old Morrowind. Over 1,000 new mods in 2019. Such an old yet beautiful and unique game. Probably a record in 20 years, but we should wait for 2020, etc.

Point two: Witcher 3 got a lot of extremely good mods that should make you re-play the game more than one time. It's amazing. However, Skyrim has over 60,000 mods just on Nexus. There are more mods outside Nexus. And those numbers change. I do not follow it. So it's not a current number. It's devastating. A mod needs another mod that needs a patch that needs a number of other patches or mods. It's crazy. Hard to follow. There is a guy on Youtube that installed over 1326 mods on Skyrim and it works. Total conversion of a pretty old game.

And this is amazing. Why CDPR shouldn't allow for it? Please do it if you can!

Thanks to Skyrim mods, many Youtubers made some decent careers, too.

Yea I can agree I also find it very annoying when modding a game is anything more difficult or complicated than (on the mod-users end) (not mod-makers end) than
1. download mod
2. put mod into "Mods" folder
3. Play
(Wow I came back to edit this, and I'm now noticing how I'm getting sucked back into this whirlpool of off-topic DOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM, considering I thought that part of the conversation was over..... This is a very uncomfortable feeling for me. It's like I'm on a boat, and my boat is trying to go one way with it's engines, but the whirlpool is pulling me the other way. My boat feels like a boat of a total loss of control, and I feel like a hypocrite right now. No person has ever gone their whole life without falling victim to this at least a few times, especially when it's totally outside their own control. I'm getting some serious weird vibes about this, and the existential implications it has.)
So seriously, I'm gonna stop right here with the modding talk, because I can not believe how stuck in a spider web I already am. wow. I will now reply to other posts as well, to make this post more full of on-topic goodness. please bear with me. rawr.

Post automatically merged: Aug 26, 2020

You might well be right and that'd be fine by me I mean, if it does, it'll be a bonus - something we can dip in and out of depending on one's mood.

Yea I know right? It just has this feel, like Cyberpunk2077 compared to GTA5, GTA5 just seemed like it had some stuff... but it was like... meh....

Cyberpunk2077 seems like it's actually going to be a full on paradigm shift in the video game world. I really feel this weird thing coming like it's going to hugely change the way games are made after. The calender will read B.C. (Before Cyberpunk) and A.C. (After Cyberpunk)

What do you think? heh

 

[CyberpunkRoslyn]

In my honest opinion; this game is going to be everything we don't get with the typical GTA franchise. For the GTA fans that wanted story DLC; I'd consider hopping on the Cyberpunk 2077 boat. CDPR has already stated that game expansion will be the size of Witcher 3. So it will be almost like receiving a new game; which is enough to keep us occupied. One thing I do give GTA credit on, were the side missions. The game was filled with enough stuff to keep you occupied, while taking a break from the main campaign. Cyberpunk will also be able to deliver this. Definitely more detail with a vertical design for the city. My guess is that the there will be so much to do, per height. When I say that; I mean that each level has it's own world. You have the problems on the street and all the things to do inside buildings. If they detailed it to the level that they said they did; you'll probably have to go back and explore things more than once. Some things may only be uncovered with certain tech gadgets. We just have to use our imagination for now.

 

[Nicademusx]

Grind is not bad if it is implemented well. It needs to blend with story and gameplay. Some people also ignore world exploration, loot, and things like "secret and unique items". Maps and rare treasures. There are a lot more details etc.

Play the game, Earn the loot, Love the grind. - RNGsus

 

[fantesmeee]

Play the game, Earn the loot, Love the grind. - RNGsus

Sounds like the Witcher 3 without the story. Kill a monster, gain experience, and level up. I don't know what you expect?

 

[Nicademusx]

Sounds like the Witcher 3 without the story. Kill a monster, gain experience, and level up. I don't know what you expect?

I expect to grind it out. Just like every game ever made.
I LOVE the grind, dont you?

Speaking of, do we yet know how RNGsus will play into 2077?

 

[fridgeband]

Play the game, Earn the loot, Love the grind. - RNGsus

Sounds like the Witcher 3 without the story. Kill a monster, gain experience, and level up. I don't know what you expect?

I expect to grind it out. Just like every game ever made.
I LOVE the grind, dont you?
Speaking of, do we yet know how RNGsus will play into 2077?

I really hope this is sarcasm lol, but if it isn't, then hey to each their own lol.
The definition of grind, to me is this:
- I feel forced to do something, rather than wanting to do it.
- everything feels like a chore
- I have to keep doing it over and over again even though I don't like it
- I'm not having fun
- It takes a very long time to do it
- it's not satisfying and I only feel relief when I'm done because I'm happy I'm just not doing that anymore

Kinda like homework, or school for that matter.
It's very important that video games be different than this of course. My reasoning is that school in my opinion should be a place where you learn things, but I always found myself learning nothing at all, and forgetting the rest.
In a video game, I could totally see myself learning, but only because I'm having fun. (No, video games with school-related learning mechanics are never ever fun...) The main thing I'm trying to get at here is that I shouldn't really have to feel like I need to question whether or not I'm having fun. If I'm doubting it, chances are I'm not having fun. If I'm not having fun, then why am I even playing the game at all? Video games, like movies, are stories, which are technically art and entertainment, and also potential learning experiences because they sharpen the mind and make you think, but only as a side effect, by accident, on purpose.

Also I dunno about you, but for some reason RNGsus always means 100% of the time, I automatically lose or have a bad experience somehow. Random shouldn't mean "100% consistent rate of failure" LOL but it always does somehow. I hope RNG just... maybe... isn't a thing, or gets a serious looking at.

 

[fantesmeee]

I expect to grind it out. Just like every game ever made.
I LOVE the grind, dont you?

Speaking of, do we yet know how RNGsus will play into 2077?

Video games, like movies, are stories, which are technically art and entertainment...

In fact, video games are more about gameplay, not stories. They are not animated movies with the story. There is a boundary, however.

 

[Nicademusx]

Since life is a grind, isnt it fair our games simulate that as well. Like life, the odds of you getting what you want are pretty slim.

 

[fridgeband]

In fact, video games are more about gameplay, not stories. They are not animated movies with the story. There is a boundary, however.

Every piece of art tells a story, and a picture is worth a thousand words...
Remove the story elements of Cyberpunk2077 and you basically have a slightly futuristic GTA (because the story of GTA is really not... that... interesting... eh...) lol

Post automatically merged: Aug 28, 2020

Since life is a grind, isnt it fair our games simulate that as well. Like life, the odds of you getting what you want are pretty slim.

There are parts of video games that work really well when they are made with realism in mind, and there are other parts that work really bad, or don't work at all when done realistically. Some things are better in video games being done unrealistically, and some things are done better realistically. However, any game that tries to be like the game of life and be 100% realistic always fail because it can't achieve that level of realism and this always translates directly into tedium, because no matter how real the game is, now you're playing real life through the bottleneck of a controller or a keyboard, which is like trying to cook a five course meal while wearing two layers of oven mittens while holding barbecue tongs.

Any game that tries to be 100% unrealistic also always fails because the human idea of un-realism is only based in comparison and in opposite to our idea of realism. Things are basically absurd because they go against what we think are not absurd. This sort of means that our idea of un-realism, is still technically realistic to what we would believe is unrealistic, which means it's still within our own realm of realism. So the idea of unrealism is technically sort of fake, because we can't know what fake is, if we can't know what real is.

The other issue with this whole entire thing, is that I would even go as far as to argue that even real life isn't realistic, because humanity doesn't actually 100% know for sure what "real" even is in the first place. Everyone is completely sure that what is- is, until something unexplainable happens (which is quite often if you really think about it) and then everybody isn't sure anymore, but then that's inconvenient and thinking hurts so they just forget about it lol.

We might even be in a simulation, which means that what we think is real, might not even be the real real. but this is just a theory.

I don't mind if the game tells a story about life, because the game is inside of life, but I would argue that because of the fact that life is a grind, that the game should attempt to stand out and not be, in order for there to be a difference in which the player can be immersed into. The problem is that life is like a very grindy video game that I would probably walk away from and press the quit button (don't get any funny ideas) if I had the ability to. So considering I'm already stuck in a grind (life) then I would ask, why in the world would I sit down and do more grind in a grindy video game? I'm already bored. Why would I want to torture myself, and suffer more? Be even more bored? I play video games to get away from the boredom and grind. It needs to be refreshing, and enjoyable, and fun, in contrast to life, or there is no reason for me to play it. (nevermind the theme or the setting of the game, which is a different, although very related discussion)

I guess my point for the game is that it's okay if it has a mix of realistic and unrealistic, as long as it's done right. I think CDPR deeply understand this, or they wouldn't even be able to make a game like this. CDPR is smart.

A proper blend will set Cyberpunk2077 FAR FAR FAR apart from GTA.