Why do they do it?

[GrimReaper801]

The general answer is the money runs out.

You start developing a game with a certain budget to pay your programmers and artists. When that money is gone, you only have a few options:

You can go to your publisher/investors and ask for more money, which might happen if you can show you're close to release and have a solid product and have reason to believe sales will cover the additional cost.

You can abandon the game (or sell the work you've done to another company). This happens fairly regularly.

You can release the game, and take the money from sales to pay for development to fix/refine/add to the game (or just take the money and call it a day).

That's my take on it too.

Maybe they still had money to keep going for another 6 months or even another year. The simple truth is that the closer you get to having no funds left, the riskier it gets. Say, after an extra year the product still isn't technically as ready as you want it to, you're now left with no money and won't be able to adjust if the sales you get by then aren't sufficient.

It's a gamble either way and there no "right" decision in such situations. You make a decision and hope for the best.

 

[msxyz]

They clearly stated money was no worries. There are plenty of interviews and plenty of people who spoke out and said money was literally no issue here. Especially since the Gov also funded them.

Poland didn't give CDPR a blank check. Also, investors expect to be paid back within a certain time frame. Game was already being delayed two times. Considering CDPR is a public company, a delay could have a ripple effect not only on the immediate stock value but also on investors confidence.

 

[Restlessdingo32]

Poland didn't give CDPR a blank check. Also, investors expect to be paid back within a certain time frame. Game was already being delayed two times. Considering CDPR is a public company, a delay could have a ripple effect not only on the immediate stock value but also on investors confidence.

It seems like a small price to pay given the current state of events.

 

[Andes_Attack]

Some care about quality but denial is a widespread phenomenon. We are all susceptible to it (of course it helps when the acting party manipulates that potential). There are those that are happy with how the game is now - they know nothing about quality. Then there are those that are apologetic because they live for the concept of the game and hope for some kind of miracle in the future, not seeing that the dice was cast when CDPR decided to fake a demo and present it as gameplay.

Excuse me, but I am happy with how the game is now, are you saying I know nothing about quality? Interesting, perhaps you could define quality? Perhaps you could define elitism whilst you're at it.

 

[Metalomaniac16]

If not PS4/Xbox one shit storm release, everything would look completely different. I had a blast during about 100 h gameplay on medicore PC. Yes, I would love many game mechanics developed in completely different way but it was design decision to make it looter/shooter type of game. The story was great and emotional in my opinion. Last gen consoles version put CDPR in the situation they are now.

I don't think that would've been the case. First of all, the backlash and complains that came from the consoles were indeed because of bugs and glitches, but the vast majority of gamers complained more about the lack of polish and the way the game was advertised compared to what we received at launch. People are trying to make it look like the only problem CP2077 have is the bugs and that's the less important thing about the game. If the console versions would've launched in a playable condition, the complains, backlash and subsecuent hate would've still be there because this game need so much more than just get rid of bugs.

EDIT: This goes way beyond your or my likings. Everyone has the right to enjoy whatever they want, no matter if it's good or bad. We're not discussing subjectivities.

 

[Myajha]

To the OP,

The reason the do it is profitability. EA is a master of this. Figure out the best amount of money to spend on a game, and not a single cent more. Take into account the gullibility of your average gamer to buy into hype or names on game boxes. Release said game to maximize profit.

There's a reason EA has been the most hated game company so many years in a row, and yet they keep trucking in the money. Because a) gamers will cry and whine and then go out and buy their sub-standard products again with the hope that this time it'll be different, and this time for some reason it'll change. b) because they've figure out, even masters, how much they should sell a game for, compared to how many gamers will buy it, compared to how much it cost them to make.

Because of this, it's sometimes, even most of the times, better to release a substandard game, then a polished one. If you release said game for 60 dollars per unit, and it cost you 40 dollars per unit to release substandard, and you know you can sell it to 13 million people, the profit is better then if you sell it for 60 dollars and it cost you 59 dollars per unit to release fully polished.

There are other things involved, like company reputation and future profits. EA is hated, but it knows people will buy the game. It's reputation can go no lower, so it doesn't care. CDPR had a great reputation, that has been lowered. Future profits may be effected if people don't buy the DLCs or their future games. It's a gamble on CDPR. My guess they decided to trade on their reputation in order for profits guessing, (and from this board rightly) that quite a few people will praise them no matter the trash they release, and the majority of the rest will give them a second chance.

 

[ElsonsoJannus]

I don't think that would've been the case. First of all, the backlash and complains that came from the consoles were indeed because of bugs and glitches, but the vast majority of gamers complained more about the lack of polish and the way the game was advertised compared to what we received at launch. People are trying to make it look like the only problem CP2077 have is the bugs and that's the less important thing about the game. If the console versions would've launched in a playable condition, the complains, backlash and subsecuent hate would've still be there because this game need so much more than just get rid of bugs.

Maybe... maybe not. Never under-estimate the social media dogpile effect. Because of the poor performance on old-gen consoles, people were willing to dogpile on every issue they could find. Once that starts, people start to associate everything bad in the world with the game, because... dogpiles are fun. They generate views, likes, interactions, retweets, and all that stuff that makes people feel more important than they really are.

I am sure that there would be people complaining about bugs. I am sure that there would have been people complaining about "what they got". Both of these are eclipsed by the WTF console performance, which was enhanced by dramatic actions by Sony, and I think that was the driving force that allowed people to join the dogpile.

 

[Ayinde_Palmer]

Massive pressure from the shareholders is the main reason. That and the overwhelming desire to recoup development funds and to acquire the most profit possible as early as possible. The opposite is generally in play though as the damage incurred by releasing the game in a state like CP2077 is much greater. Damage to a companies reputation takes a long time to recover, however the norm seems to be AAA game companies to release crap, apologize for doing it, then take forever to attempt to fix the game.

I've said it many times on this and other forums, but the government needs to get involved (like the FCC in the US) to outlaw the practice of "pre-ordering". All it does is give game developers and manufacturers a license to do whatever they want and deliver products like CP2077, Anthem, Fallout 76, etc. This needs to stop. Let the content creators on YT, Twitch, FB, etc., play the games, early editions, and see for ourselves whether they meet standards of what was promised or not. I realize some of the content creators are paid by the games devs, but not all of them are. A little bit of caution and research prior to throwing down our money should take the place of pre-ordering from now on.

government doesn't need to ban preordering...

developers can already do whatever they want. People preorder games because they are hyped and want to play them. these people would just buy it the day it comes out. Preordering came to exist because people wanted the games asap. Thats still why it exists.

People who were going to calmly wait for reviews, don't preorder. Reviews are also fake anyhow. All these "game journalists" complaining are full of it. You know what version you are testing, you know if you see bugs, you know what the content is. Its nonsense that cdpr controlled their reviews, just by not letting them show footage or not sending them ps4 versions. There is no requirement to show any footage at all to give an honest review. Also no one should be presenting a ps4 review if they never played it.

 

[Metalomaniac16]

Maybe... maybe not. Never under-estimate the social media dogpile effect. Because of the poor performance on old-gen consoles, people were willing to dogpile on every issue they could find. Once that starts, people start to associate everything bad in the world with the game, because... dogpiles are fun. They generate views, likes, interactions, retweets, and all that stuff that makes people feel more important than they really are.

I am sure that there would be people complaining about bugs. I am sure that there would have been people complaining about "what they got". Both of these are eclipsed by the WTF console performance, which was enhanced by dramatic actions by Sony, and I think that was the driving force that allowed people to join the dogpile.

I agree with that.

 

[GethroShepard]

Excuse me, but I am happy with how the game is now, are you saying I know nothing about quality? Interesting, perhaps you could define quality? Perhaps you could define elitism whilst you're at it.

Well, quality in video game.

It is :

1 : A working and enjoyable gameplay.

2 : A working and challenging AI

3 : A working and clear UI.

4 : A working and efficient inventory management.

5 : A working and understandable game mechanics.

6 : A lack of glitchs, bugs and game blocking events.

7 : A lot of possibilities, letting the player do as he like with what the game give him.

8 : A good use of music and sound effects to give an atmosfere.

I'm talking in general, not for CP specifically. I play in majority 4X games and all this points are necessary. As you can see, I don't put the pretty graphics in the list because a lot of indie has proven that ultra 4K with several million of polygons for each face meeted in the game is not the alpha and omega of a good game.

What does give CP2077 to me?

1 : Hacking freeze me in place one of ten tries. Slow motion is bugged and being in stealth mode during discussion is tiring.

2 : No need to talk about the AI.

3 : Infamous mini map, UI who dispaear periodically and Relic glitch lasting hours of game. Horrible.

4 : Crafting and sorting items is a chore.

5 : Perks are bugged or non functional. Evasion and critical are all over the place.

6 : Each time I tak control of the security cameras, I am glued to the place. Great... And the list is long in my gameplay.

7 : Too linear and too promising. No customisation in a LOT of places.

8 : Why can't I listen to music outside a car? I have a phone in my head after all... But the musics are fine, yes.

Playing a lot of obscure games and some protos made with RPGmaker, I'm not into elitism. For the video game world, it is probably something like "this series is better than this one!" but it looks more like clans, no?

About the OP, we must probably follow the money. Not only the external and internal pressures but the launch period absolutely ideal : Lot of people blocked in their houses, no big games at the moment, Christmas, the new consoles launch... A good CP2077 would be a system buyer for the new PS and Xbox so perhaps a bit of pressure from them?

Well, they get their money back now. What we don't know is if they will do something like that again. After all, they are wealthier now.

 

[Ayinde_Palmer]

Well, quality in video game.

It is :

1 : A working and enjoyable gameplay.

2 : A working and challenging AI

3 : A working and clear UI.

4 : A working and efficient inventory management.

5 : A working and understandable game mechanics.

6 : A lack of glitchs, bugs and game blocking events.

7 : A lot of possibilities, letting the player do as he like with what the game give him.

8 : A good use of music and sound effects to give an atmosfere.

I'm talking in general, not for CP specifically. I play in majority 4X games and all this points are necessary. As you can see, I don't put the pretty graphics in the list because a lot of indie has proven that ultra 4K with several million of polygons for each face meeted in the game is not the alpha and omega of a good game.

What does give CP2077 to me?

1 : Hacking freeze me in place one of ten tries. Slow motion is bugged and being in stealth mode during discussion is tiring.

2 : No need to talk about the AI.

3 : Infamous mini map, UI who dispaear periodically and Relic glitch lasting hours of game. Horrible.

4 : Crafting and sorting items is a chore.

5 : Perks are bugged or non functional. Evasion and critical are all over the place.

6 : Each time I tak control of the security cameras, I am glued to the place. Great... And the list is long in my gameplay.

7 : Too linear and too promising. No customisation in a LOT of places.

8 : Why can't I listen to music outside a car? I have a phone in my head after all... But the musics are fine, yes.

Playing a lot of obscure games and some protos made with RPGmaker, I'm not into elitism. For the video game world, it is probably something like "this series is better than this one!" but it looks more like clans, no?

About the OP, we must probably follow the money. Not only the external and internal pressures but the launch period absolutely ideal : Lot of people blocked in their houses, no big games at the moment, Christmas, the new consoles launch... A good CP2077 would be a system buyer for the new PS and Xbox so perhaps a bit of pressure from them?

Well, they get their money back now. What we don't know is if they will do something like that again. After all, they are wealthier now.

Quality is subjective.

for me
art direction
fun factor
depth
does it reach you (create some feeling)

basically, do I enjoy this game, do I want to keep playing this game, do I feel playing it was worthwhile.

all the other stuff is whatever. Some games story may be so great it eclipses everything else, some games combat carries them

If I want to critique a game, I may point out where I think it can improve, but ultimately a quality game is one that entertains and engages, to me.

 

[GrimReaper801]

ultimately a quality game is one that entertains and engages, to me.

And that's the gist of any "quality" argument. It's so subjective that it's impossible to properly quantify and even harder to apply as a "standard" across the industry.

If you enjoy the game, good for you. If you don't, hopefully future patches fix that.

 

[Andes_Attack]

Well, quality in video game.

It is :

1 : A working and enjoyable gameplay.

2 : A working and challenging AI

3 : A working and clear UI.

4 : A working and efficient inventory management.

5 : A working and understandable game mechanics.

6 : A lack of glitchs, bugs and game blocking events.

7 : A lot of possibilities, letting the player do as he like with what the game give him.

8 : A good use of music and sound effects to give an atmosfere.

I'm talking in general, not for CP specifically. I play in majority 4X games and all this points are necessary. As you can see, I don't put the pretty graphics in the list because a lot of indie has proven that ultra 4K with several million of polygons for each face meeted in the game is not the alpha and omega of a good game.

As Ayinde Palmer says accurately above, this is a subjective list.

 

[AddForm]

Excuse me, but I am happy with how the game is now, are you saying I know nothing about quality? Interesting, perhaps you could define quality? Perhaps you could define elitism whilst you're at it.

I don't know you so that would be foolish of me. I wasn't speaking of anybody in particular, so I guess you will have to do some introspection and answer that yourself. But it could be said that my expectation of a common ground in regards to quality in other people is the opposite of elitism. If all is subjective then one's own view becomes totalitarian. I at least base my assumption on some standards of quality that is recognized by the industry, so they are not purely subjective.

 

[ottakanawa]

They clearly stated money was no worries. There are plenty of interviews and plenty of people who spoke out and said money was literally no issue here. Especially since the Gov also funded them.

But keep in mind they also stated the game would be good

 

[Mentos3]

The game has worked for me far better than any bethesda release has ever worked for me and I'm mostly talking about fully patched versions of their games. For example, I've only ever had one quest bug out in my 100+ hours experience with Cyberpunk 2077, you usually end up with a handful of bugged quests in your journal in Bethesda games by the time you've racked up that many hours. The game has also crashed on me exactly 3 times, I had to abandon my survival playthrough of the goty version of Fallout 4 on my xbox one, because crashing had become so frequent it was just not fun anymore. As for performance, while Cyberpunk 2077 doesn't run well on last gen consoles, many games don't. Aformentioned Fallout 4 is a lagfest in the downtowm area, RDR noticeably drops frames in Saint Denis and the list can go on and on here.

That said, there are a lot of small time, insignificant bugs in Cyberpunk 2077, that's true, and they might bother some people and that's a perfectly reasonable attitude, I, however, couldn't care less about bugs that don't break anything. I'm all for having a polished experience here, but that'll not happen overnight.

So, to answer your question, I think they made the decision to release this game because they thought that most of the people playing the game would hold an opinion similar to mine.

Why is Bethesda the new standard? They weren't listed at the stock-market, they had private investors, who pushed the games out and didn't care about customers, just their own pockets. Ok, CDPR got them, too. Holding shares big time. But there are working in the company or are related to them (Brother?)... they made their profit with the release. Maybe they didn't care either.

I don't know if B. can recover. (Btw.: I can't remember that Skyrim was such a bugparty). But this is not the point. Compare yourself to the worse, feeling fine because you didn't messed up that much (not sure about that), and you will never come anywhere.
CDPR themselves wanted to release a game polished as RDR2, not Fallout76. We know how that went.

 

[Rudo_]

The game has worked for me far better than any bethesda release has ever worked for me and I'm mostly talking about fully patched versions of their games. For example, I've only ever had one quest bug out in my 100+ hours experience with Cyberpunk 2077, you usually end up with a handful of bugged quests in your journal in Bethesda games by the time you've racked up that many hours. The game has also crashed on me exactly 3 times, I had to abandon my survival playthrough of the goty version of Fallout 4 on my xbox one, because crashing had become so frequent it was just not fun anymore. As for performance, while Cyberpunk 2077 doesn't run well on last gen consoles, many games don't. Aformentioned Fallout 4 is a lagfest in the downtowm area, RDR noticeably drops frames in Saint Denis and the list can go on and on here.

That said, there are a lot of small time, insignificant bugs in Cyberpunk 2077, that's true, and they might bother some people and that's a perfectly reasonable attitude, I, however, couldn't care less about bugs that don't break anything. I'm all for having a polished experience here, but that'll not happen overnight.

So, to answer your question, I think they made the decision to release this game because they thought that most of the people playing the game would hold an opinion similar to mine.

You are right. Difference is that behind bugs, bethesda released an RPG (a poor one compared to previous fallouts, but an RPG after all), as promised, whereas CDPR released a linear adventure game in a poor open world with retarded AI. I think that comparing CP77 and RDR2 bugwise is frankly insulting.
Red dead redemption 2 (even in ps4 base) is a masterpiece. CP is not and it will never be, unfortunately. And not because bugs or the lack thereof, but because of a bad design, bad mechanics, and bad everything except for the story, the characters and the acting.
So, to respond OP: CP goes nowhere. Its going to be a polished unbuggy version of a mediocre game.
If they released because they thought people would share your (very respectable) opinion, they were wrong, as its now obvious.

 

[NorseGraphics]

It is. Because those people don't see the exploitation. Buying a game that in this day and age requires only a roster patch. Not $60 purchase. And losing all the stuff they buy each game. To rebuy it again. If everyone was smart. EA would collapse from people not buying Madden etc.

Well, that's why EA is shutting down Anthem, from what I've heard. They went too far, and now getting their asses handed back to them.

 

[RGstar]

About the OP, we must probably follow the money. Not only the external and internal pressures but the launch period absolutely ideal : Lot of people blocked in their houses, no big games at the moment, Christmas, the new consoles launch... A good CP2077 would be a system buyer for the new PS and Xbox so perhaps a bit of pressure from them?

I think this had a lot to do with it. Never before has their been a new generation of consoles launched with so few games. Halo Infinite was delayed, all Microsoft had was Valhalla. CDPR should have stood their ground, but hindsight is 2020.

 

[msxyz]

It seems like a small price to pay given the current state of events.

Hindisght will only get you so far...

I'm not judging the morals of it, but sometimes you've to take a bet. Having grown with a father who used to be a manager in a large company, I've heard many "horror stories" of hazardous bets (and complete disregards for clients/consumers) taken to pay the bills at the end of the day.