Why people have a right to criticize CD PROJEKT RED?

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The Witcher 3 Super-Resolution 2020.11.16 - 06.40.10.38.jpg

First of all, hat off to all the developers who worked their butts off to make this game that I enjoyed. But I decided to post this because of my recent encounters with other people in social media about Cyberpunk 2077. Cyberpunk is getting criticized by many people for issues & some of them are really unfair. It's normal when something got immensely popular, it's gonna get some unearned hate. However I also realized that whenever I post some criticism about the game in a Facebook group or a forum, I get attacked by passionate fans. They have this attitude of the game being absolutely perfect despite it's clear issues. I think that valid criticism is needed for any company to improve.
Personally, I consider Witcher 3 as the best game I've played. I bought all Witcher games including DLCs. Preordered Cyberpunk day one. I forced all of my friends to buy Witcher 3 & they really enjoyed it. So, I'm not a guy who post clickbait posts just for attention.
Even though I love CDPR for what they did earlier, I can't refrain from criticizing CDPR right now. Vocalizing these concerns will lead to a better future.

These are the reasons why we should criticize both CDPR & Cyberpunk.

1) Why we should criticize CDPR?

*Since 2018, they overhyped the game. I remember them saying that Cyberpunk has the most engaging & detailed open world in any video game. (48 minute demo) In the actual game, open world is nothing like that. It looks good & even impressive in scale. However NPC interactions, physics, police, water effects, AI & random incidents are so bad to the point of a mid 2000s game. At some point of the development they should have known what they are making. Even though I'm a medical student with no idea of game making, I'm pretty sure that you can't implement those in final stages of polishing.
*In the trailers, they showed engaging in side activities with Jackie as it's just another feature but in the game it turned out to be a cutscene.
*How many times CDPR said that the game gonna be absolutely polished at release?
*They didn't show any footage of base consoles & no review codes of consoles.
*Minimum & Recommended System Requirements are not enough to run the game with promised settings.
*Recently people uncovered files that confirm Judy was also supposed to be a male romance option. CDPR's reply to that was a bad lie even more than the "Surprise mechanics" lady. It actually disrespects gamers' intelligence level because those kinda responses make gamers look like idiots that believe anything big corporations say.
* They reduced the game length because most people didn't finish Witcher 3? What kinda test audiences they use? Which Witcher 3 fan screamed to make Cyberpunk a shorter experience?
This feels like an excuse to justify the cut content which would have made the game longer.
* CDPR also getting into mobile gaming business which was never a good thing.
* They also getting into microtransactions business in PC & consoles with Cyberpunk multiplayer.

2) Why we should criticize Cyberpunk 2077?

* Bugs & Glitches. Game never should have released like this. Bringing Fallout New Vegas arguments doesn't change the fact that this game was broken for many people. Also the industry came a long way since New Vegas.
*Significantly shorter than Witcher 3 even though at the time of my preorder they said "Don't expect anything less than Witcher 3's main quests and side quests".
*Gigs, NCPD activities & Rides feel like filler even though they said "No fetch quests". Also the quality of side stuff is significantly less than main quest & secondary quests. Witcher 3's main quests, secondary quests & witcher contracts had similar quality.
* Subpar physics, AI & console performance as mentioned earlier.
*Cut content that is obvious in every corner.
* Game brushes off themes of Cyberpunk only superficially.
*Most of the side stories are in data shards. I read everything in all games that I play. Good reading materials should be supplementary to the story, specially in a 2020 AAA game.
* If you like romance in video games and a heterosexual male, amount of romance options are significantly less than Witcher 3. This is less comparing to other AAA RPGs like Dragon Age, even though those games also respect people who are not heterosexual males. After all, this game is advertised as a game with so many choices.

These are reasons that I think people have a right to criticize CDPR without getting attacked by passionate fans. All of us bought the game with our hard earned money. If you don't agree with me, you are absolutely free to criticize me.
 
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They also said everything subject to change, and boy did everything change.

The horse is dead and beaten at this point. Either they fix it or not, doesn't matter since they've sold millions of copies and made hundreds of millions in profit. A grand success!

All this will be forgotten when the next Witcher or Cyberpunk is announced and people fall over themselves to pre-order. Same as with Bethesda. The internet had an annurism over a ES6 teaser, even after the mediocre Fallout 4 and abysmal Fallout 76.
 
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Fair evaluation should be encouraged on any game. I think you will find people are quick to jump in and defend the game due to the absolute hate that some are spewing. Its quite appalling how some gamers have came across in their dislike for the game.
 
They also said everything subject to change, and boy did everything change.

The horse is dead and beaten at this point. Either they fix it or not, doesn't matter since they've sold missions of copies and made hundreds of millions in profit. A grand success!

All this will be forgotten when the next Witcher or Cyberpunk is announced and people fall over themselves to pre-order. Same as with Bethesda. The internet had an annurism over a ES6 teaser, even after the mediocre Fallout 4 and abysmal Fallout 76.
Agree. If everything subject to change, that shouldn't be a part of the promotional material of the actual game.
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Fair evaluation should be encouraged on any game. I think you will find people are quick to jump in and defend the game due to the absolute hate that some are spewing. Its quite appalling how some gamers have came across in their dislike for the game.
As I said, if something becomes so popular, it's gonna get unfair hate.
Regarding Cyberpunk, those hate became enhanced because the game turn out to be bad in some aspects.
 

Moxy3

Forum regular
I agree. Criticism is not necessarily a bad thing, as long as it is constructive and not just out of pure hatred.

What i would like to add to your list is that characters were just abandoned (killed) after 2/3 missions, giving us no time to get used to them. I mean i guess you could say its cut content, but i just wanted to clarify it a bit.
 

Icinix

Forum veteran
I'm all for criticisms.

How those criticisms are brought up is where I have issue.

Often on the threads there is some passionate but hearty debate that is blurred when extreme angles feel the need to jump in and tell others they're outright wrong. This happens on both love / hate sides of course.

Too many voices smashing into each other missing context that might go back pages of threads and firing everyone up more.
 
I agree. Criticism is not necessarily a bad thing, as long as it is constructive and not just out of pure hatred.

What i would like to add to your list is that characters were just abandoned (killed) after 2/3 missions, giving us no time to get used to them. I mean i guess you could say its cut content, but i just wanted to clarify it a bit.
Yeah, it’s so baffling because Witcher did an amazing job with characters. Specially Bloody Baron questline.
Don't know why CDPR did something like this with Cyberpunk. They even had a bigger budget & a crew than Witcher 3 days.
 

Moxy3

Forum regular
Yeah, it’s so baffling because Witcher did an amazing job with characters. Specially Bloody Baron questline.
Don't know why CDPR did something like this with Cyberpunk. They even had a bigger budget & a crew than Witcher 3 days.
Probably Management who just wanted to push out the game. (so because of money) But we can only guess, since we will never know without official statement.
 
Just don't buy pre-order, and don't be impatient. Everything is subject to change, we all are adult enough to understand how real world operates.
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Especially when they think that they're entitled for everything.
Entitlement thing is something that confuse me. In my country (Sri Lanka), we believe that we have a right to criticize what we buy. I don't know about other countries.
Also CDPR said to wait for reviews, if people don't wanna preorder. Problem was that CDPR only gave review copies for PC. Reviewers gave high scores thinking that,
*Console versions are also ready.
*Most technical issues will go away with day one patch.
 
The way i see it. I 've been a huge fan of CDPR and the Witcher series since around 2009.

I thought the first Witcher with all its shortcomings was a very good, very original game. Heads and shoulders above Oblivion which was released the same year pretty much, and CDPR at the time, had a tine fraction of the budget compared to Bethesda.

Then came The WItcher 2 which i thought was AMAZING. I was already a huge fan of Demon Souls and the new Dark Souls, and TW2 was a hardcore game that took heavy inspiration from Demon Souls in terms of combat. Sure it was not nearly as precise or responsive but it was a good effort for a western ARPG at the time (notably the combat in these kind of games suck. Think Skyrim). In addition to the decent combat, the choice and consequence system was the best i had seen in a game (far surpassing Mass Effect for me), the characters were amazing, the writing top notch and the graphics pushed the boundaries for the RPG genre. Short game, but a true gem.

On top of that there was that hidden message that CDPR thanked all the PC gamers, and declared how they are proud PC developers, taking a stance as flag bears of ethical game developing and prioritising PC gaming which thought to be dead.

And then started the downfall - in my eyes at least. Promises that seemed impossible to fulfill. Remember the whole downgrade fiasco. Still to this day that VGX trailer looks better than even Cyberpunk. And some of the top guys over there seemed to have a priority to become the next Rockstar and make tons of money rather than focusing on making top quality, I remember one of the CEOs, saying that the game is equally good on all platforms and he personally would play it on the Xbox. To me that seemed like a betrayal, having in mind the secret message in TW2. Then they talked about production costs. They said something as 20 million for development, 40 million marketing.....Rockstar way. Not good.

And then came the game... And it was great BUT..... The path to commercialization was obvious. The hardcore roots of the game were completely gone. I expected combat polished and responsive like the Souls titles. Geralt was very unresponsive and the combat was far closed to Batman. A clear move to appeal to a broader audience. Also, i did not like parts of the main quest, having also read the books, i thought the wild hunt was wildly misrepresented. Anyway. The game overall, even though failed to fulfill all the promises was VERY VERY VERY good.

But one of the top guys had something to say like this (paraphrasing): Some people might think is the best thing ever but it didn't break any records..... Ok, you have created one of the most critically acclaimed games of all time, AND one of the best selling games of all time, and you seem displeased because it didn't sell as much as GTA V and you have not become the next George Soros. The greed and the vanity there seemed fot eh charts. That's how this comment sounded to me and my skepticism grew further. In addition to this we had all the controversies with the mandatory crunch to workers which is still an issue.

And then came Cyberpunk.... At this point they probably spent 10 times the development costs to PR and marketing, making it the most hyped game of all time -save for Half Life 3. And what happened? The game UNDERDELIVERED on EVERY SINGLE ASPECT. Even if you complete ignore bugs and technical issues, the game simply is not that good.

The main quest is very small. Side quests are not nearly as good as in The Witcher games. The writing is good but still not nearly as good as their previous works. The gameplay is mediocre at best, or even bad in certain aspects (notably melee, which is crap on FPP). Side quests are not that mane. Gigs are boring and repetitive, nothing like witcher contracts where you had to deal with unique monsters. The world is DEAD. It feels like a huge counter strike map occupied with vegan zombies. There is NOTHING to do when you finish the scripted content, which is not much by any means for an open world game.

And with all these i do not even mention the unfulfilled promises and the flat out lying during promotions. My trust in CDPR is shaken. For me this game cannot be saved even with bug fixes. They have to try REALLY hard in their next release, and REALLY focus on the quality of the product, rather than marketing, hyping and commersialism to regain my trust.

That's just an opinion of a former HARDCORE CDPR fan.
 
Entitlement thing is something that confuse me. In my country (Sri Lanka), we believe that we have a right to criticize what we buy. I don't know about other countries.
Also CDPR said to wait for reviews, if people don't wanna preorder. Problem was that CDPR only gave review copies for PC. Reviewers gave high scores thinking that,
*Console versions are also ready.
*Most technical issues will go away with day one.

I wonder how much local consumer law affects people with how they engage with company, and the product they've bought.

We have solid laws here that you can pretty much take anything back and be like "This didn't do what it said it was" and you can get a refund pretty easy. Even Steam has some different laws here to make refunds easier. So if something is borked, you get your refund, the product usually gets recalled or taken off the market anyway.

If I was in a place where that wasn't an option and something didn't do what was said - I'd be pretty damn pissed.
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I don't think we are getting a "Yellow statement" regarding mmanagement issues.


Execs don't make mistakes. Just ask them.

To many of them get bonsues and they're protected no matter how much they stuff up and they just move around between companies, it's all pretty damn atrocious and parasitical.
 
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First of all, hat off to all the developers who worked their butts off to make this game that I enjoyed. But I decided to post this because of my recent encounters with other people in social media about Cyberpunk 2077. Cyberpunk is getting criticized by many people for issues & some of them are really unfair. It's normal when something got immensely popular, it's gonna get some unearned hate. However I also realized that whenever I post some criticism about the game in a Facebook group or a forum, I get attacked by passionate fans. They have this attitude of the game being absolutely perfect despite it's clear issues. I think that valid criticism is needed for any company to improve.
Personally, I consider Witcher 3 as the best game I've played. I bought all Witcher games including DLCs. Preordered Cyberpunk day one. I forced all of my friends to buy Witcher 3 & they really enjoyed it. So, I'm not a guy who post clickbait posts just for attention.
Even though I love CDPR for what they did earlier, I can't refrain from criticizing CDPR right now. Vocalizing these concerns will lead to a better future.

These are the reasons why we should criticize both CDPR & Cyberpunk.

1) Why we should criticize CDPR?

*Since 2018, they overhyped the game. I remember them saying that Cyberpunk has the most engaging & detailed open world in any video game. (48 minute demo) In the actual game, open world is nothing like that. It looks good & even impressive in scale. However NPC interactions, physics, police, water effects, AI & random incidents are so bad to the point of a mid 2000s game. At some point of the development they should have known what they are making. Even though I'm a medical student with no idea of game making, I'm pretty sure that you can't implement those in final stages of polishing.
*In the trailers, they showed engaging in side activities with Jackie as it's just another feature but in the game it turned out to be a cutscene.
*How many times CDPR said that the game gonna be absolutely polished at release?
*They didn't show any footage of base consoles & no review codes of consoles.
*Minimum & Recommended System Requirements are not enough to run the game with promised settings.
*Recently people uncovered files that confirm Judy was also supposed to be a male romance option. CDPR's reply to that was a bad lie even more than the "Surprise mechanics" lady. It actually disrespects gamers' intelligence level because those kinda responses make gamers look like idiots that believe anything big corporations say.
* They reduced the game length because most people didn't finish Witcher 3? What kinda test audiences they use? Which Witcher 3 fan screamed to make Cyberpunk a shorter experience?
This feels like an excuse to justify the cut content which would have made the game longer.
* CDPR also getting into mobile gaming business which was never a good thing.
* They also getting into microtransactions business in PC & consoles with Cyberpunk multiplayer.

2) Why we should criticize Cyberpunk 2077?

* Bugs & Glitches. Game never should have released like this. Bringing Fallout New Vegas arguments doesn't change the fact that this game was broken for many people. Also the industry came a long way since New Vegas.
*Significantly shorter than Witcher 3 even though at the time of my preorder they said "Don't expect anything less than Witcher 3's main quests and side quests".
*Gigs, NCPD activities & Rides feel like filler even though they said "No fetch quests". Also the quality of side stuff is significantly less than main quest & secondary quests. Witcher 3's main quests, secondary quests & witcher contracts had similar quality.
* Subpar physics, AI & console performance as mentioned earlier.
*Cut content that is obvious in every corner.
* Game brushes off themes of Cyberpunk only superficially.
*Most of the side stories are in data shards. I read everything in all games that I play. Good reading materials should be supplementary to the story, specially in a 2020 AAA game.
* If you like romance in video games and a heterosexual male, amount of romance options are significantly less than Witcher 3. This is less comparing to other AAA RPGs like Dragon Age, even though those games also respect people who are not heterosexual males. After all, this game is advertised as a game with so many choices.

These are reasons that I think people have a right to criticize CDPR without getting attacked by passionate fans. All of us bought the game with our hard earned money. If you don't agree with me, you are absolutely free to criticize me.

I gave them money for a product they misled me about.
And now they are ghosting me and refuse to refund me my money.

The game is an utter disaster on every level other than may be writing but thats more of a subjective point.
Witcher 3 innovated the rpg genre. CP2077 does nothing new and does less really compared to their competition.
This game is not the deep rpg they promised, its barely an rpg. Even the writing cannot be fully enjoyed because many story threads and characters just... end.

You also have a 6 month montage instead of actual gameplay and the life paths literally don't matter because they serve to nothing more than a 10 minute intro quest. All in all.
An epic failure on every level.
 
I remember buying The Witcher at launch having heard little about it prior to its release. I remember thinking that it was a diamond in the rough but that there was absolutely a great game in there somewhere and indications of a great game developer. I went to bat for the game and also tried to encourage as many people as I could to give this then small developer a chance, that they almost certainly would not regret it. I remember Assassins of Kings coming out and noting the masive improvements to polish and cohesion while noting the downgrading of Witcher combat and the cleaning up of themes that made it less gritty and less mature. [...]

[...] I guess all things are subject to change. No man can step into the same river twice. But a fool might drown themselves in one.
 
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Entitlement thing is something that confuse me. In my country (Sri Lanka), we believe that we have a right to criticize what we buy. I don't know about other countries.
Seller also entitled to change their products, everyone is entitled. Not just consumers, that's why they have TOS. To protect themselves from consumers. That's how the world is.

Also CDPR said to wait for reviews, if people don't wanna preorder. Problem was that CDPR only gave review copies for PC. Reviewers gave high scores thinking that,
That is on the player itself to fall for that, you guys get hyped for everything even after what happened to Bethesda, EA, Bioware etc.


I installed this game after patch 1.04, because I expect it would be a rough launches based on the Witcher 3 history. But it's way more rough that I've expected...
 
I don't think to "criticize" itself is bad if you look at my posts I have criticized the game and the company both in a time what I don't like a individual not as someone "defending anything" is the way that some member of the community have "overexaggerated" and some have literally said " the whole community is mad"

I don't personally agree with any of the

"entitlement posts"
"not what was promised"
" false advertising"
"multiple features "
"scam thread"

In every single one of the " rants " above I personally believe ( regardless of how relevant someone thinks the "false advertising laws apply in their country) if you fall for hype / pre order or literally buy anytime before the first 3 or 4 days after release before any of the "reactions" come out you only have yourself to blame

If those topic were so important to someone and they would have seen all those things after the launch for example say December 15th and disagreed with what they saw they would have simply not bought the game .

In which case there is nothing above to rant about .

Last gen Console players were able to get blanket refund if they wanted them. If someone didn't like the game or it didn't work for them they could get a refund and move on .

Again you have your refund so no reason to fill the forum with the above types of "criticism"

To prevent this form a happening again I suggest this . This would protect people and company from "themselves" as example above and again none ofthe issue I stated above would have happened.

Personally If I was them I would NEVER share as much about upcoming titles like they have with cp EVER again.

based on a segment of some members of the communities reaction that is being displayed. I personally think is overreactive.

It was a mistake as you can see by the way people have reacted to missing content. Its fine saying working on this title and that title we will share more with you once we have set a firm release date .

And then don't say ANYTHING about the game until you are sure of the release date and content. ( ideally just before it goes gold)

really if they had done that all the "missing" thread would not exist because people who never know what is "missing"

and there would not be anything "misleading" as everything advertised would be in the game if they didn't start advertising till close to gold.

Also these reposts

1.
Honestly I think a lot of the "rage" is an overaction.

Game overall

I also think people complain about companies having "greed" in general is overused to almost a meme compared to the way the community has acted in general. As you see below in no way do I think this game did not have its flaws but also don't think it deserves the amount of rage it is getting from some people.

8 million presales + player meticritic rating (pc)

User Score
7.1 Mixed or average reviews based on 21233 Ratings

Shows the game was not the "disastrous embarrassment hat will kill CDPR reputation" that some on the forum make it out to be. Personally I would give it a

6.5 myself just average major flaws and disappointments but overall satisfied and feel got my moneys worth . It nothing that will enter the hall of fame but really its not worth all rage It is what it is and honestly just need to move open and wait for the "next big thing" W3 was a remarkable game ( rating of 9 in my books) but I don't think its reasonable to expect that level of success every time when there dev teams are not consistent with the team that made W3 I also think focusing on old technology is one of the reasons that caused this down fall.

Also from my personal observations Although it does happen in north America to a certain extent It seems that in the Non-North America side of the world some people like to champion the "Karen" aspect of "consumer rights" to a absurd extreme and expect everything to turn out to be a 10/10 game. (W3 has a 9.4 user score) when in reality not everything comes out perfect or as planned.

2.

Again with the "hype" and "missing features" rant so what?

If the dev's had not said a thing there would still be a subset of people who would be complaining.
So the game has a 83 /72 metcritic rating instead of 93/94 like W3 that's not a HUGE gap.

Also in my view to quote myself i

"Also from my personal observations Although it does happen in north America to a certain extent It seems that in the Non-North America side of the world some people like to champion the "Karen" aspect of "consumer rights" to a absurd extreme and expect everything to turn out to be a 10/10 game. (W3 has a 9.4 user score) when in reality not everything comes out perfect or as planned."

This nothing to do with "defending" anything.

Its a $60 videogame not the end of the world so its not a 10 I personally gave it 6.5 so it didn't come out as planned I and others that have posted still fun it enjoyable and worth the $60

The people saying "the community got scammed" is not correct in this case as that is a subjective statement

I personally did not get scammed.

as for last gen console rage . You had ample time to get a refund and move on . If you got a refund there should be no console rage .
 
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