Will intelligence affect dialogue?

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That is a pretty large dose of assumption. When has CDPR ever released a game where dialogue options did not have a clear and decisive impact on the story? If if the skill-based choices are more rare than one may like, that hardly makes the game unplayable. You either have the skill or you don't. Either way, the story moves forward.

It's not about that, it's about dialogues locked behinds stats (cause we know there are some).

I want to know which V is considered intimidating by the dev' point of view: 10 Body 1 Cool V or 1 Body 10 Cool V.
It's about putting the stats at the right place to match your vision of V.

Putting stats randomly would be as annoying a putting your stats in Body and reflexes while you mainly want your V to be a great hacker.

The problem is we don't know the dev' point of view about everything and there can be many interpretations of which stat is important for what action.

I just want my stats to be as accurate as possible on my vision of V.
 
It's not about that, it's about dialogues locked behinds stats (cause we know there are some).

I want to know which V is considered intimidating by the dev' point of view: 10 Body 1 Cool V or 1 Body 10 Cool V.
It's about putting the stats at the right place to match your vision of V.

Putting stats randomly would be as annoying a putting your stats in Body and reflexes while you mainly want your V to be a great hacker.

The problem is we don't know the dev' point of view about everything and there can be many interpretations of which stat is important for what action.

I just want my stats to be as accurate as possible on my vision of V.

I'm still not following. That would require advance knowledge of how the game and story goes. How is it possible to let the player know in advance what skills will be required for which dialogue options? Obviously, if a character has a high level in a skill, then it will be more likely to succeed in any situation (dialogue included) that requires the use of that skill.

So, if I have a vision for how I want my V, then I build my V that way. And now, role-playing! I need to play to the strengths and weaknesses of my character. I can't prepare ahead-of-time for things that will happen in the future -- not on my first playthrough, obviously. That's what makes subsequent playthroughs fun. Now, I do have an idea of how the mechanics work at a nuanced level, and I can try for a certain type of build.

As for how the skills are applied, the whole point is to surprise the player at times. (Not all the time, but sometimes.) Are you expecting the game to tell you upfront: "Welcome to the character creation screen. If you want to ensure Jackie stays alive until the end of the game, be sure to focus on EMP-based weapons..."? (<--- as a totally fictional and arbitrary example.)

The whole point of an RPG is to build characters according to our vision, then the world will provide avenues based upon those choices. If something doesn't work out the way I wanted, well...that's part of the experience. So, best bet is to build a character according to the types of things you want to do. Then play that character.

If you want to know how everything works ahead of time...I guess you'll have to wait for spoilers.

(I'm not waiting. :p )
 
I'm still not following. That would require advance knowledge of how the game and story goes. How is it possible to let the player know in advance what skills will be required for which dialogue options? Obviously, if a character has a high level in a skill, then it will be more likely to succeed in any situation (dialogue included) that requires the use of that skill.

So, if I have a vision for how I want my V, then I build my V that way. And now, role-playing! I need to play to the strengths and weaknesses of my character. I can't prepare ahead-of-time for things that will happen in the future -- not on my first playthrough, obviously. That's what makes subsequent playthroughs fun. Now, I do have an idea of how the mechanics work at a nuanced level, and I can try for a certain type of build.

As for how the skills are applied, the whole point is to surprise the player at times. (Not all the time, but sometimes.) Are you expecting the game to tell you upfront: "Welcome to the character creation screen. If you want to ensure Jackie stays alive until the end of the game, be sure to focus on EMP-based weapons..."? (<--- as a totally fictional and arbitrary example.)

The whole point of an RPG is to build characters according to our vision, then the world will provide avenues based upon those choices. If something doesn't work out the way I wanted, well...that's part of the experience. So, best bet is to build a character according to the types of things you want to do. Then play that character.

If you want to know how everything works ahead of time...I guess you'll have to wait for spoilers.

(I'm not waiting. :p )

I think you are misinterpreting. He WANTS to role play, but he doesn't know which stats fit which type of roleplayed character. He isn't asking to know in advance exactly where each stat/skill is going to be applied, he just wants a general idea because it's crystal clear that CDPR is not following traditional RPG conventions here.

All it would take is a simple message in Character creation for each stat:

"Body: The higher this stat, the easier it is for you to take a punch (or bullet) and keep on swingin'. It also governs your strength, and how intimidating you are to other people in Night City."

"Cool: The higher this stat, the easier it is for you to keep calm under pressure. It also governs your ability to "improve relationships (???)" (WTF does that even mean, I have no idea)

Is Body the de-facto "intimidation" stat? If that quote from a page or two back is accurate, probably? But what about Cool? is Cool for intimidation as well? Or is it for persuasion? Or seduction? Is there even a seduction check for anything in the game? What does "improving relationships" mean, and should someone pick a different stat if they want to play a persuasive character?

Contrary to what the devs seem to have thought, it actually makes the game MORE confusing for some people when you remove dialogue-specific skills from the game because now you're at a point where the player doesn't know what kind of character they're playing until later. Seems unfun and unrealistic to me. Maybe some people like the surprise, but I don't consider that a "feature."

In D&D, I decide from the start that I want to play a persuasive bard. There will be exceptions, but I could reasonably expect my character to be good at that if I put a bunch of points into Charisma, write an appropriate back story, and pick a class that gives bonuses toward that playstyle.
 
Minus we don't know it there will specifically be explanation about those uses of stats.
That why I made a topic a while ago so they add social effects of each stats on stat description.

I based my assumption on Witcher 3 tutorial, which was rather extensive. Why do you think CDPR will make a worse job with the CP2077? "We don't know" but you are already convinced it won't be explained?
 
I based my assumption on Witcher 3 tutorial, which was rather extensive. Why do you think CDPR will make a worse job with the CP2077? "We don't know" but you are already convinced it won't be explained?
Kakita tends to assume the worst until proven otherwise, and then when proven otherwise, assumes the worst version of that proof.
 
I think you are misinterpreting. He WANTS to role play, but he doesn't know which stats fit which type of roleplayed character. He isn't asking to know in advance exactly where each stat/skill is going to be applied, he just wants a general idea because it's crystal clear that CDPR is not following traditional RPG conventions here.

All it would take is a simple message in Character creation for each stat:

"Body: The higher this stat, the easier it is for you to take a punch (or bullet) and keep on swingin'. It also governs your strength, and how intimidating you are to other people in Night City."

"Cool: The higher this stat, the easier it is for you to keep calm under pressure. It also governs your ability to "improve relationships (???)" (WTF does that even mean, I have no idea)

Is Body the de-facto "intimidation" stat? If that quote from a page or two back is accurate, probably? But what about Cool? is Cool for intimidation as well? Or is it for persuasion? Or seduction? Is there even a seduction check for anything in the game? What does "improving relationships" mean, and should someone pick a different stat if they want to play a persuasive character?

Contrary to what the devs seem to have thought, it actually makes the game MORE confusing for some people when you remove dialogue-specific skills from the game because now you're at a point where the player doesn't know what kind of character they're playing until later. Seems unfun and unrealistic to me. Maybe some people like the surprise, but I don't consider that a "feature."

In D&D, I decide from the start that I want to play a persuasive bard. There will be exceptions, but I could reasonably expect my character to be good at that if I put a bunch of points into Charisma, write an appropriate back story, and pick a class that gives bonuses toward that playstyle.

Exactly what I wanted to say.
Currently I know what kind of character I want to play, but I have no indication of what stat does what outside of how to kill things.

Kakita tends to assume the worst until proven otherwise, and then when proven otherwise, assumes the worst version of that proof.

Well it wasn't always like that, but I've been burned quite a lot in the past year so now I'm afraid of fire.
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Exactly.
Those branches open options that wouldn't otherwise exist. They don't box you into a corner where you must have X stat or Y skill to progress the game/story.

I don't fear being unable to advance the story, I understand it will be some kind of "Call of Cthulhu" where every build leads you to the end anyway, what I want to avoid is making a character, playing the character, discover the character doesn't do what I wanted to do because I did not interpreted the stats the same way the dev' did, then having to start the whole game again to be able to play the character I wanted.
 
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Well it wasn't always like that, but I've been burned quite a lot in the past year so now I'm afraid of fire.
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Haha. I know. I was just teasing you. You have lots of valid reasons for your opinions. I don't agree with 100% of them, but I certainly understand 100% of them.
 
Contrary to what the devs seem to have thought, it actually makes the game MORE confusing for some people when you remove dialogue-specific skills from the game because now you're at a point where the player doesn't know what kind of character they're playing until later. Seems unfun and unrealistic to me. Maybe some people like the surprise, but I don't consider that a "feature."

I wont argue that it can get confusing, and that is something that should absolutely be addressed, but it doesn't seem especially unrealistic to me. What I find unrealistic is passing or failing all social challenges solely on the basis of a number, completely ignoring anything else I might have said or done. Speech 100 is a meme precisely because it is an example of this kind of absurdity.

As to fun, I think that this kind of setup has potential, but I agree we need to know up front what the stats do in this context. No one wants to try to guess what stats they have to pick to be able to be intimidating or persuasive or whatever, that can only end in unnecessary frustration. Even if it turns out that social skills are mostly skill independent, that should be made clear so that we know we don't need to worry about it.
 
I wont argue that it can get confusing, and that is something that should absolutely be addressed, but it doesn't seem especially unrealistic to me.
This tends to be a significant issue in video games.

Either you get lots of skills, many of which have only a tiny number of instances during the game where they're useful. Or they streamline things so severely, and with so little explanation you wind up guessing what does what ... OR ... for the most part only a couple of them are actually needed.
 
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Cyberpunk's main stat is Cool, if anything it should affect on stuff. Even smart nerds are cool in Cyberpunk world. At least that's how I remember Cyberpunk 2020 RPG.
 
What I find unrealistic is passing or failing all social challenges solely on the basis of a number, completely ignoring anything else I might have said or done. Speech 100 is a meme precisely because it is an example of this kind of absurdity.

I'll keep it short as it isn't about C2077, but in many RPG Speech check are affected by "what you have done" and in a scale where skills goes from 1 to 100 can go way over 100 if you do is wrong or if your demand is absurd. About "what you have said" it's a bit more complicated as speech skills as if should affect that part too.

But even in an action/perk game it is possible to simulate a social Butterfly by giving the player kinda the same abilities those have, like for example knowing in advance the reaction to what you will decide to say. That's actually the reason cyber psychosis did affect your social abilities in C2020: because your lose your ability to understand other peoples.
 
"Cool: The higher this stat, the easier it is for you to keep calm under pressure. It also governs your ability to "improve relationships (???)" (WTF does that even mean, I have no idea)
I mean, basically it sounds like willpower and charisma. Just like body is strength and constitution. However, based on the quotes we have on it cool's charismatic effect is more about "throwing off a vibe that commands respect" ... so more likely it's a hard dialogue gate than a some sort of push X and see if it works thingy. That also fits with how we'v seen the dialogue work in other situations. I wouldn't be surprised if it also made you gain street cred faster.
 
I mean, basically it sounds like willpower and charisma. Just like body is strength and constitution. However, based on the quotes we have on it cool's charismatic effect is more about "throwing off a vibe that commands respect" ...

That's exactly why I hesitate between Body or Cool as the Intimidating character stat, cause being big by itself doesn't forcibly makes you looking dangerous, think of Hodor: I would more define him as a big teddy bear than a threatening foe.
 
That's exactly why I hesitate between Body or Cool as the Intimidating character stat, cause being big by itself doesn't forcibly makes you looking dangerous, think of Hodor: I would more define him as a big teddy bear than a threatening foe.
It is likely contextually action dependent (i.e. intimidate by bending steel bar gated by Body, intimidating through a line insinuating blackmail gated by Cool). There can be more than one way to intimidate a person. There could be some sort of "Body stat 7 or more, low level enemies wont fight hand to hand and run instead" ... but I haven't seen any evidence of that.
 
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There could be some sort of "Body stat 7 or more, low level enemies wont fight hand to hand and run instead" ... but I haven't seen any evidence of that.
I doubt there will be any game-wide effects for having a low/high stat or skill. More there will be instances where a particular stat or skill will provide an option that otherwise wouldn't exist.
 
It would be cool if these stats affected combat and other non-dialogue gameplay situations. I kinda like the idea of some enemies just turning tail and running for the hills based on your reputation or the general vibe you give off.

Fallout 4, for all its problems, had a somewhat cool system where you could essentially order enemies to drop their weapons and surrender. Didn't always work and was heavily dependent on Charisma (A general "do what I say" skill, not the classic suave persuasion), plus the implementation was rather lackluster, but it was a cool idea.
 
I doubt there will be any game-wide effects for having a low/high stat or skill. More there will be instances where a particular stat or skill will provide an option that otherwise wouldn't exist.

No need for a game wide effect, just not not want to have a greyed options for an action my character is supposed to be a specialist good in because I didn't take the good stat for my wished specialisation.
 
No need for a game wide effect, just not not want to have a greyed options for an action my character is supposed to be a specialist good in because I didn't take the good stat for my wished specialisation.
The easy solution is to just not display options that aren't available to the character. But we know that won't be the case because people would whine that "hidden" options are unfair/gamebreaking becuse they should know everything about everything (in order to min-max).
 
I doubt there will be any game-wide effects for having a low/high stat or skill. More there will be instances where a particular stat or skill will provide an option that otherwise wouldn't exist.
I agree entirely. Just musing on other possibilities. Like I said, there's no evidence of it, while there is evidence of stat/skill gates for individual actions.
 
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