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Don't cross lines, everyone. No personal attacks, including attacks on people OUTSIDE the forums, and keep politics out of it.
You can comment on her opinions as much as you want, but that's as far as it goes.
You can comment on her opinions as much as you want, but that's as far as it goes.
Geez...
If one looks at it objectively, Anita actually makes a valid point, although I will concede it gets lost in the hyperbole of the soundbite.
But God Forbid anyone makes a mature retort to the comment...
If one looks at it objectively, Anita actually makes a valid point, although I will concede it gets lost in the hyperbole of the soundbite.
But God Forbid anyone makes a mature retort to the comment...
What sexist tropes are there?
1. The one where one of the main characters is a perfectly capable young woman able to take care of herself, showing character and determination?
2. The one where one of the female characters is a powerful mage?
3. The one where another chracter is a powerful mage, not to mention her relationship with Geralt strongly suggests she is the one in control?
4. The one when one of the endings involving said young woman has her
?
She couldn't have picked a worse example. The world of the Witcher is full of powerful female chracters. Geez, the mage council in this world has only women!
1. The one where one of the main characters is a perfectly capable young woman able to take care of herself, showing character and determination?
2. The one where one of the female characters is a powerful mage?
3. The one where another chracter is a powerful mage, not to mention her relationship with Geralt strongly suggests she is the one in control?
4. The one when one of the endings involving said young woman has her
becoming an Empress for the most powerful nation in the world
That's the point - she misses the mark. You know what is full of sexist tropes? Lord of the Rings. Every single female character there is a 'damsel in distress' archetype.
She couldn't have picked a worse example. The world of the Witcher is full of powerful female chracters. Geez, the mage council in this world has only women!
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This so much. That's exactly what I'm thinking about it.
I mean, women still aren't treated equal in some places (like different wages and such problems), that's right. And to those problems we need to attend first, for they occur to a woman's real life. I do have some understanding for feminists, but actually they should try to find solutions for real problems. Bashing on sexism in video games is just pointless up to an extent where people are turning away for they do not want to listen any longer to such hystery. People could mistake this for feminism and don't care about realistic feminists making valid points ('cause they're existing) anymore, making it even harder to achieve gender equality in real life. And with 'gender equality', I mean it. It might be naive, but I'm dreaming of real equality both of men and women. Just because sometimes you get the impression all this gender equality discussion is discriminating men.
I know they might argue it's about culture. That tropes vs. women and sexism in general is deeply rooted in our culture and thus expressed throughout films and video games and literature etc. So what? I want to see how you're changing whole cultures. It's ambitious, but simply impossible.
Feminists claim to speak for all those females not daring to speak aloud. This certain feminist doesn't speak for me at all. It's a pity others might think I could support her because I'm female.
Professional victim Sarkeesian, she is just trying to stir some trouble so later she can claim "muh harrassment".
...but but, Ciri wears a blouse with a low neckline... oh, and there are hookers = horrible, sexist game that hurts women everywhere in the world!
I know you are joking, but I also love the 'neckline' argument. People forget full plate armor is 30-40kg heavy. You cannot move in this shit at all. Hell, in Middle-Ages knights had people helping them to get on the horse, since it's impossible to do it alone while wearing plate armor....but but, Ciri wears a blouse with a low neckline... oh, and there are hookers = horrible, sexist game that hurts women everywhere in the world!
First of all, even the Ursine armor doesn't look full plate, not to mention Geralt is a mutated superhuman. Second, Ciri is clearly a trickster/rogue archetype, her clothes allow her freedom of movement.
Still, even LianaK (who is generally a moderate feminist) made the argument that she think Ciri's outfit is stupid and unrealistic... thing is, she is a nimble fencer, not a warrior, for her to wear anything more cumbersome would make no sense... not to mention the fact that she has other means to defend herself then mundane armor.
lol. I can´t believe some people were throwing a hissy fit over Ciri´s design because an open button on her shirt exposes approximately .5 millimeters of bra. I literally didn´t even notice it until someone insisted to me that it was somehow sexist.
This whole thing is just a series of cherry picked arguments where people ignore context and crop out the bits and pieces that support their theory. I´ll even concede that the sex cards in Witcher 1 were a bit daft, and I think CDPR themselves said they considered it a mis-step or something (don´t quote me on that) but looking for some kind of sexist agenda in W3 is reaching, especially when it features probably the most convincing and realistic love-triangle subplot I´ve seen in a video game.
This whole thing is just a series of cherry picked arguments where people ignore context and crop out the bits and pieces that support their theory. I´ll even concede that the sex cards in Witcher 1 were a bit daft, and I think CDPR themselves said they considered it a mis-step or something (don´t quote me on that) but looking for some kind of sexist agenda in W3 is reaching, especially when it features probably the most convincing and realistic love-triangle subplot I´ve seen in a video game.
5. The one where a woman is of the most influential, intelligent and powerful people in the world, who also leads a female only group shaping the course of international politics and history?
6. The one where a highly respected and capable military commander is a young woman, who is followed by both men and women not because of her beauty, but because of how inspiring and charismatic she is?
7. The one where in the end women working together manage to save the world?
I could go on and on. Andrzej Sapkowski managed to write one of the finest portrayal of women in fiction, and CD Projekt did the same when it comes to video games. All of the respect, guys.
And for Anita: I would rather have my future daughter be as strong as Ciri, as brave as Triss, as loyal as Yennefer, as smart as Philippa, as determined as Saskia than be like her. There I said it.
going to shove my defensive rant from facebook here because it's just URGH ANITA NO:
> the author is a matriarch
> the main three characters include two women
> the male character worships both of them
> one of those women is a lesbian sword wielding goddess of space and time
> the other is an all power sorceress who is the dom in every relationship she has
> i can point to essays (NERD) where its being argued that all women are worshipped to some degree (see first point)
> the Lodge of Sorceresses exists on the basis that males are too emotionally incompetent in stressful political situations to rule the North
> they were seriously considering putting in total male nudity, dick physics and everything, but someone pointed out 'the world isn't ready for Geralt's D' ;~;
> all violence that involves women is depicted that it is 1) a terrible thing 2) that it exists in the real world
> all sexism is a result of the era that the people live, but no female actually abides by any specific set of rules - they have their own agency
> if she's going to compare any violence against women as 'kick the dog' trope, i can name similar scenes with male characters being terribly treated
> 'the women are sexualised' no, you're sexulising them yourself, they can wear what they like within the realms of practicality. also have you SEEN geralt's butt.
> literally all i have to critique is the female witcher wearing high heels (and the devs have heard the complaints on this one, i bet the next DLC will fix that)
> the author is a matriarch
> the main three characters include two women
> the male character worships both of them
> one of those women is a lesbian sword wielding goddess of space and time
> the other is an all power sorceress who is the dom in every relationship she has
> i can point to essays (NERD) where its being argued that all women are worshipped to some degree (see first point)
> the Lodge of Sorceresses exists on the basis that males are too emotionally incompetent in stressful political situations to rule the North
> they were seriously considering putting in total male nudity, dick physics and everything, but someone pointed out 'the world isn't ready for Geralt's D' ;~;
> all violence that involves women is depicted that it is 1) a terrible thing 2) that it exists in the real world
> all sexism is a result of the era that the people live, but no female actually abides by any specific set of rules - they have their own agency
> if she's going to compare any violence against women as 'kick the dog' trope, i can name similar scenes with male characters being terribly treated
> 'the women are sexualised' no, you're sexulising them yourself, they can wear what they like within the realms of practicality. also have you SEEN geralt's butt.
> literally all i have to critique is the female witcher wearing high heels (and the devs have heard the complaints on this one, i bet the next DLC will fix that)
People who are looking for things to get offended about are offended. Oh well.
pointing out neofeminist selective bias oppresses women and supports rape culture, you misogynistic bigot swine
The witcher is sexist at times and even has two scenes that can be construed as homophobic, that's a fact. BUT there are certain major qualifications:
1. The world of gaming is incredibly male-oriented in general. Sometimes I feel like some of the devs still live in the early 90s. Female NPCs are either sex objects or damsels inn distress, and even if they end up doing something truly heroic, at the end of the day they always realize it's better to let the man do the heavy-lifting and just be supportive. The last great female character I can think of is Mona Sax from Max Payne 1. The Witcher 2 is hardly the main culprit.
2. Women of the Witcher are shown fighting for the right thing, not just blindly accepting patriarchy like in most games. There are some side quests that clearly flesh out this struggle. Again, bit could be much better but it could be way worse.
3. Ciri reminds me of the season 1 Daenerys from GOT. Sure, there are some scenes that clearly aim to get the nerd crowd excited, but at the end of the day Ciri forges her own path and stays true to her ideals without the protection of a man. When you compare this to how helpless women in games usually are, it's actually not that bad. Especially when you compare it with GOT women that have lost most of their independence and strength in the course of the series (apart from Arya)
4. Sure, pretty much everyone wants to have sex with Geralt. However, have you seen how men usually treat women in this medievalesque world? Geralt has actually learned that women are a force to be reckoned with. Don't you think a rare guy like that would be super-desirable in a world where most other men treat women like glorified sex toys?
5. Lastly, It's a world inspired by the medieval times. You can't expect the society not to be patriarchal in a setting like that.
in the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king, nuff said
1. The world of gaming is incredibly male-oriented in general. Sometimes I feel like some of the devs still live in the early 90s. Female NPCs are either sex objects or damsels inn distress, and even if they end up doing something truly heroic, at the end of the day they always realize it's better to let the man do the heavy-lifting and just be supportive. The last great female character I can think of is Mona Sax from Max Payne 1. The Witcher 2 is hardly the main culprit.
2. Women of the Witcher are shown fighting for the right thing, not just blindly accepting patriarchy like in most games. There are some side quests that clearly flesh out this struggle. Again, bit could be much better but it could be way worse.
3. Ciri reminds me of the season 1 Daenerys from GOT. Sure, there are some scenes that clearly aim to get the nerd crowd excited, but at the end of the day Ciri forges her own path and stays true to her ideals without the protection of a man. When you compare this to how helpless women in games usually are, it's actually not that bad. Especially when you compare it with GOT women that have lost most of their independence and strength in the course of the series (apart from Arya)
4. Sure, pretty much everyone wants to have sex with Geralt. However, have you seen how men usually treat women in this medievalesque world? Geralt has actually learned that women are a force to be reckoned with. Don't you think a rare guy like that would be super-desirable in a world where most other men treat women like glorified sex toys?
5. Lastly, It's a world inspired by the medieval times. You can't expect the society not to be patriarchal in a setting like that.
in the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king, nuff said
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I don't think she was picking an example or comparing which is more sexist. It's just that W3 is happening now.
She has a valid point in that there are sexist elements in the game: all the female protagonists (Yen, Ciri, Triss) are beautiful, wearing high heels, tight outfits, showing skin; you got your brunette, your red head, and your ashen haired (which seems to be really big amongst the fantasy|high fantasy crowd); you have all of the females that fall for the pretty boy (Dandelion); inordinate amount of prostitutes and all of them are young, good looking, fresh looking, and act in a certain way... so that is the valid point. There are indeed sexist tropes in the game.
On the other hand, we have our "mature gamers" make the following comments:
"Can you now please, PLEASE stop pandering to the perpetually offended special snowflakes?"
"On behalf of Canada, we'd like to apologize for that... thing ever being born. Were very sorry, honestly. There is a clear difference between a feminist, and an extremist. That bitch"
"OH, OH YES! MOAR! CRY FOR ME MOAR! Mmmm~ your tears are delicious, and salty. Mmm~ oh yes, yes! YES! MOAR! Use them as lubr- "
"TW3 makes feminists going nuts? GOOD!!! I like it even more now!! Their tears and moans are going to be delicious! "
.. and those within the first 10 posts.
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