Ploutonas said:
On the other hand, the countless many who did watch the conference without an agenda and got exposed to The Witcher franchise for the first time far outnumber those who might have learned about it through Youtube videos or marginal gaming websites. The scales are vastly different.
Hysteria. That's the word that aptly describes the reaction you've depicted. I'm sorry, there's no sugarcoating it. Don't like XBone DRM policy? I despise it. Don't buy it then, go as far as persuading others not to. But penalizing Developers based off on hearsay, just for showing up, is sheer madness.
ConfidenceMan said:
I've been looking into this quite a bit so what I've got so far is:
1. Still applies. They said if your internet can't or hasn't checked in you get 24hrs to play but this doesn't state how or what they mean by it. Is it: If I turn on my xbox and my internet sucks that day does the count down to my 24hrs starts OR is it: it's after midnight and technically the next day and scene my system is always on and it didn't check it does my 24hours start now so by the time I wake up at say 9AM and play by 10AM I've got less time now to play due to the none check in? A side note it is said that after 24hours if no internet connection is remade you can't play your games HOWEVER you can still watch TV and play your DVDs so it won't be a useless brick for somethings.
2. Yes this still stands 1 hour of playtime if you import your cloud info to a friends xbox1
3. Yes publishers can say if they will or won't let you resell this game. Xbox is pointing fingers saying its all in the publishers hands completely forgetting they designed the system for this to occur. Also the fee if your particular publisher allows you to resell this game used will be paid by the store so you know the store will pass this fee to you so you essentially do pay the fee either way.
4. They're walking this one back it's an up in the air now. You might be able to give your friends your game for 1 hour or a day or you may have to pay a fee due to them having the game you wrote to your console. It's complicated and I'm not sure how much of these walked back details you'd like me to recap but what MS did say is this loaning friends feature isn't going to be available to you when the console is out its a future thing they're " looking into".
This system has many problems that have many consequences that people may or may not care about.
Always on even when its off they say you can turn off your kenetic however it really isn't ever off it will still listen for xbox on which means its still listening even though you've manually turned it off. I love how xbox said in a recent video that they wanted to know and hear everything about you and your gaming time.
There maybe a fee if you exceed too many guest for your system. It seems xbox has ok'd 10 people only can be in the room during any game, movie, or TV watching if you have an 11th or 12th person in the room you will be prompted to pay a fee in order to keep enjoying the content because you've exceeded your approved amount of people in room. Thanks kinect!
They do say you can have up to 10 friends and or family members play under your xbox in YOUR house so that means if you wanted to loan that game to your friend and they want more then an hour with it they must live at your home while they "barrow" your game. Sound inconvenient for everybody involved save xbox.
Face recognition software seems to be apart of the kinect it will learn your face, your habits, and make the system do this for instance Susan plays zombie hunter in the morning first it will learn Susan's face and put zombie hunter up first in her que similar to how when you put in a game to play it pops up on the gaming menu in a highlighted square in the upper left corner of your screen.
For racing games at least there is also a feature that the xbox will learn how you drive then when players do multiplayer your ghost avatar will race in the game so if your screen name is jabba88 then someone in Japan gets on the MP they'll see your car with the name jabba88 over it and it will drive like you do in your SP game. When you get into MP if your car has won prizes you will auto get them with no work because your ghost was doing the work will you where not playing the game at all.
You must download all games to the hard drive in order to play and it will write it to your system to prevent piracy. Articles that have yet to be given a no from MS but this goes to used games and the fee again it was stated that if you want to sell agame or gift a game you'd have to erase it from your hard drive so the other party doesn't incur the second use fee for playing that game meaning there goes your progress too.
There is no backwards compatibility with your downloaded games or your xbox 360 games HOWEVER your xboxgold will now transfer over to your xbox1.
Some preceved consequences of the above:
The used market will tank forcing game companies and mom and pop stores to loose valuable extra income remember when you buy used the store you bought it from got 100% of the profits. Publishers don't like used and game makers don't like used they loose their profits once a game goes to the used shelf so who is going to let their games be resold when they can keep making profits 100% long after the sale if all it takes to do so is they say you can't resell this game?
Stores are being asked to take the hit in more ways too they now have the added burden of playing all their customers reuse fees so if a publisher says yes you can recode this game so a new player can buy a used version but you now pay us x amount to do so. How long can they stand to do this?
Extreme game prices say goodbye to your $60 games you may now have to pay $70 - 100 depending on the fees charged by publishers, over head for the company, and exactly how much profit do they the company need to now recoup in order to stay in business?
Say goodbye to your extra income both for used games and your own paycheck if you aren't the type to spend $60+ on hot new games every month and its considered a rare splurge for you to pay such a price because you buy used there is no more or fairly limited used for you to purchase at your budget friendly price tag. Also if you needed an extra $25 bucks in the past you could've sold your games to get this fast now with used game recode application you won't be able to do that at all. How much do you all love those trade in values? We may not have even those penny on the dollar trade ins either.
Your friends live at your home! Hope you love guests if you trade games alot it'll get expensive in food, electric bills, and so fourth.
Privacy is gone kenict watches you at worst data minds the crap out of you at best do you currently hate how you browse for shoes for an hour then move to browsing for furniture and see nothing but shoe ads? Or do you hate seeing your friend's face on a tiny little ad in the side bar of your screen saying how much Grieg loves smoothie maker 5000? This is all data mining being done to you right now, they know you have friends and who those friends are thanks to facebook, twitter, myspace, ect if your friends photo is shown marketing to you you'll check it out even if in reality that friend knows nothing of the smoothie 5000. Your data on preferred shows, games, and possibly even how many times you played that exercise game will all be used to gear ads to you both on your computer and in your TV commercials. We see you play lots of exercise, yoga, and sports games Tom are you trying to lose weight? Try this product. Your info will be sold all about town and more.
There could be more downsides but those would be for you draw based off of the info available. Its basically do you not mind all this or do you when buying your next console.
OK I think I've covered everything if I remember anything more I can post it here.
I really hope that CDPR takes a stand and drops support of XBOX platform: at least at game's launch. I understand that it is alienating a part of demographic, but it would be an extremely clear message against destructive anti-consumer practices, very much in spirit of fairness we've grown so used to with CDPR/GoG.
wsmieszek said:
I prefer they did not do as you asked, I prefer the route they have already taken in allowing consumers who choose to buy an Xbone the same right to play it at same time as everyone else on PS4 and PC, ideally I would love for WiiU players and Mac players to be able to play it too but the TW3 team does not have infinite resources to create it for all platforms at same time so maybe they will get a version of it when possible.
I see no reason to punish those gamers who buy an Xbone by denying them a great game on top of the punishment already receive from Microsoft in the form of their poilcies, even if I myself do not plan to buy a Xbone. Think of it this way. CDPR are not supporting the Xbone, they are supporting your fellow gamers and consumers who happen to buy an Xbone as they have done with Steam and Origin for PC that both have forms of DRM.
They are about giving people the freedom to choose where they buy it and if want a DRM free version they offer you the chance to go down that path if wish via GoG. They should no more remove their product from Xbone anymore so than removing it from Steam or Origin, let the consumer decide which he or she wishes to buy it on and allow a DRM free version for those who prefer that route.
They are about giving people the freedom to choose where they buy it and if want a DRM free version they offer you the chance to go down that path if wish via GoG. They should no more remove their product from Xbone anymore so than removing it from Steam or Origin, let the consumer decide which he or she wishes to buy it on and allow a DRM free version for those who prefer that route.
Dragoonlordz said:
1. No gamer with a clear mind right now will buy a XBox One especially not in europe.
2. This is not anymore an option of choice this is a matter of privacy and restrictions Microsoft wants to force on this Industry.
3. Developer and publisher need to take a stance here. This is about the future of this industry you should try to be neutral about this whole issue.
4. Witcher 3 got the coverage of dozens of sites because they praised the behind doors demo like no other game at this Years E3. The only thing that the MS bought was this controversy. And I will say it again. The people who are not gamers and saw this game at the stage show will have already forgotten it because there was no other media coming out and it is still a long way to go.
5. The message about MS buying these developers came from a source that was spot on with all the other stuff that he said. So yeah I would better believe him. Hell Major Nelson the MS community guy even announced MGSV on his twitter as exclusive and only went back when people called him out for that.
And another thing:
And this alone is forbidden in Australia and European countries. They normally can not even do that so they surely will get sued here. Again this is not about offering choice this about the future of the whole industry.
Dragoonlordz said:
Dragoonlordz said:
I understand where you're coming from Dragoonlordz, but I'm thinking exactly what darji so aptly laid out in his post:
This is not about individual gamers, but taking a stand regarding one of the most terrifying possible futures of the industry.
To support XBox One would be to cast a vote in favour of:
- Corporations entirely owning the content and rights ascribed to your account.
- Your gaming being absolutely dependent on checking-in with the corporation on a scheduled basis.
- Purchasing a product with a definite end of lifecycle - once the servers are down, it's done (Think producers being able to further control when you purchase a new console)
Hardly ideal turn of events, at least from my perspective. Many people invested in analysing the industry are not upset so much by the online requirement (Steam does it, in a far superior way), but by the effect it will have on the industry in the long run. This is basically heading for 1984, but forty years later.
Whenever I hear anything about "taking a stand", I am wondering whether people are trying to dump on CDPR something that is not their job. It's like having them to proxy "a stand" they should be taking themselves - as consumers, rather than watching from the sidelines and commenting. If "other people" do not want to and M$ is still (pretending to be) too happy with their money - try to convince them rather than a developer.
CDPR is already doing exactly what should be done on their end: offering *an option* (hardly anyone else does), adding some guerilla actions (and facing consequences in courts). That's more than enough. What would be the point of leaving entire market to make a point customers themselves should be making? Are we really that lazy or that convinced "other people" are too stupid for their own good? Even if second option is true, CDPR should not be expected to babysit them.
Be careful what you wish for anyway. Sony is nobodys friend, their relaxed stance around DRM and lower pricing happened because M$ is both present and strong as a competition. There was a jugular to go after. You do *not* want to see a Playstation after eg. M$ dismantles or sells console division. Who's going to compete and keep them in check - Wii U? Ouya?
CDPR is already doing exactly what should be done on their end: offering *an option* (hardly anyone else does), adding some guerilla actions (and facing consequences in courts). That's more than enough. What would be the point of leaving entire market to make a point customers themselves should be making? Are we really that lazy or that convinced "other people" are too stupid for their own good? Even if second option is true, CDPR should not be expected to babysit them.
Be careful what you wish for anyway. Sony is nobodys friend, their relaxed stance around DRM and lower pricing happened because M$ is both present and strong as a competition. There was a jugular to go after. You do *not* want to see a Playstation after eg. M$ dismantles or sells console division. Who's going to compete and keep them in check - Wii U? Ouya?
Here is fresh news... so CDPR sawed us the pc version of the game??? with dual gpus?
http://img818.imageshack.us/img818/3280/zu9f.jpg
above is the xbox one @E3
and the news came out... (guess)from an NVIDIA VIP who captured it with his mobile.. Here is the original source of the news. https://twitter.com/JazRignall
They definitely use a single (dual) GPU, is very fat and long. So its 1x 7990 gpu
http://img818.imageshack.us/img818/3280/zu9f.jpg
above is the xbox one @E3
and the news came out... (guess)from an NVIDIA VIP who captured it with his mobile.. Here is the original source of the news. https://twitter.com/JazRignall
They definitely use a single (dual) GPU, is very fat and long. So its 1x 7990 gpu
Ploutonas said:
Most E3 games regardless of home console platform are generally shown running on PC though from what I understand given even if game is for Xbone or PS4 it is still developed using PC connected to the dev console. It was also mentioned in another thread that they haven't began optimization yet so it is understandable would require higher spec than when released.
Yeah but this is a lie.. I mean, the final product, wont look like that.. The high end gpus use x16 multiplier, they use chipsets and fx that consoles cannot do...
Wii U was the only legit console @e3 ?... And the freezing issues in ps4, was a bad dvd in pc? I looks like sony used an actual ps4, because even the Unreal Engine 4 demo is ditched down from an actual PC version. My point is, sony didnt sell us Pc graphics this time.
Its bad, they lie to us... That makes me even more happier with wii U, because you never compare a console with a PC.. Pc is the catalyst, the ultimate platform.
Wii U was the only legit console @e3 ?... And the freezing issues in ps4, was a bad dvd in pc? I looks like sony used an actual ps4, because even the Unreal Engine 4 demo is ditched down from an actual PC version. My point is, sony didnt sell us Pc graphics this time.
Its bad, they lie to us... That makes me even more happier with wii U, because you never compare a console with a PC.. Pc is the catalyst, the ultimate platform.
Yep, mark me down as another who was surprised (read extremely disappointed) to see CDPR pimping Microsoft.
The quality of the graphics are not related to the GPU in the that PC, they are related to the software code or game settings for same reason why when you play a 8bit graphics game on your PC there is not Cyrsis level graphics in that game as in it's down to the game coding. While the speed of the graphics is GPU related the rest is related to the game coding.
So my guess is what was shown was the game version for the Xbone that has been developed using the Xbone dev console hooked up to the PC back at the studio. The amount of textures, quality of the visuals are same quality will get on Xbone due to how the version was programmed the GPUs are only rendering what the game code allows and if that game code is the Xbone versions which was developed for Xbone dev console back at office then it's fine by me.
The only difference I think is by running the Xbone version on PC means won't get the freezing and stuttering that happened on the PS4 titles shown however that in itself is not a major issue because both the PS4 and the Xbone version including PC ones are yet to be optimized fully for each platform. I could be wrong though but if what I think is right then I have no problem with it. If they were showing the PC version I would expect the game software to incorporate vastly much features and textures etc programmed for the GPU to render and show. I am however just guessing.
So my guess is what was shown was the game version for the Xbone that has been developed using the Xbone dev console hooked up to the PC back at the studio. The amount of textures, quality of the visuals are same quality will get on Xbone due to how the version was programmed the GPUs are only rendering what the game code allows and if that game code is the Xbone versions which was developed for Xbone dev console back at office then it's fine by me.
The only difference I think is by running the Xbone version on PC means won't get the freezing and stuttering that happened on the PS4 titles shown however that in itself is not a major issue because both the PS4 and the Xbone version including PC ones are yet to be optimized fully for each platform. I could be wrong though but if what I think is right then I have no problem with it. If they were showing the PC version I would expect the game software to incorporate vastly much features and textures etc programmed for the GPU to render and show. I am however just guessing.
Its not an IBM to use an emulator, if that is your point. They just take the pc code, ditch the settings and vuala. But surprisingly, all xbox one games showed @E3, they did use AA multiplier...
wait gonna watch some trailer at 1080p and confirm it 100%.
PS4 didnt use AA in their games (an example is killzone)..
edit: The witcher 3 using AA, no way to be xbox one.. (its not CDPR fault), it was microsofts responsibility. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZ_G6XiHoUA
Metal gear solid also using lots of AA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QWlNOljw-PA
The models and environment in the games have no lines, is very smooth and they dont use FXAA (fxaa creates bluring to cover up lines) no flaws..
So basically Sony went safe this time and they used actual ps4 hardware power.
the other games mostly are CG
Here is killzone 4 in ps4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ygj_Xaqmijo (no AA) and ps4 is about twice as x1.
wait gonna watch some trailer at 1080p and confirm it 100%.
PS4 didnt use AA in their games (an example is killzone)..
edit: The witcher 3 using AA, no way to be xbox one.. (its not CDPR fault), it was microsofts responsibility. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZ_G6XiHoUA
Metal gear solid also using lots of AA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QWlNOljw-PA
The models and environment in the games have no lines, is very smooth and they dont use FXAA (fxaa creates bluring to cover up lines) no flaws..
So basically Sony went safe this time and they used actual ps4 hardware power.
the other games mostly are CG
Here is killzone 4 in ps4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ygj_Xaqmijo (no AA) and ps4 is about twice as x1.
Ploutonas said:
My point was that even if you play a 1990's game on modern PC it still looks like a 1990's game regardless of what GPU you have because it's down to the code in the game not the GPU, if the game shown was coded for the Xbone for running on the dev consoles supplied by Microsoft for designing games on that platform then I have no problem it being run on PC at the show.
It runs faster on PC but does not look better if coded for console. The same could be applied to a version shown on PC which is coded for the console. Now I do not know what status of AA was in the showing because I have not micro-analysed the videos in that much detail or have analysed what the consoles do and do now offer as features on their GPU's. I am speaking in general.