Skyrim is a sandbox, Witcher is an excellent story. Nothing to compare here. 
I don't know exactly why CDPR decided that all the players should have the same level (around 35) by the end of the game. Probably, because of the two upcoming big DLCs. Experience is awarded in a way that you either do main quests or you do side quests - the result is the same, i.e. as far as I can remember, overall amount of exp for main and side quests is roughly the same.
On my first playthrough I decided to do all the side quests in Velen before going to Novigrad and as a result I got zero experience for Novigrad's quests. Then I did all the quests in Novigrad and Oxenfurt (spelling might be wrong here as I'm playing Russian version of the game) and similar thing happened with Skellige. Nevertheless, my Geralt was at level 37 by the end of the game. On my second playthrough I'm mixing main and side quests and still outlevel about a half of them too quickly. So, if CDPR really wanted all the players to end the game at level 35, they did their job very well. Then again, experience is not a problem here, but very low difficulty of gray quests is.
Lore wise I have no problems with Geralt receiving small to zero amount of exp for killing monsters. After all, he did regain his memory. So exp awarded for storyline quests primarily is OK for me. But there has to be some motivation for doing side quests. Again, lore wise it should be money. Furthermore, it should be the main source of money in game, IMO. For those who want to go storyline only there already are quest items awarded in the process, so they won't need much money anyway. But right now witcher contracts reward is humorous, compared to amount of money one can raise from looting (which should be a bad thing, really, think of the "Killing Monsters" cinematic ).
So everything is closely interconnected here. Personally, I won't mind if all the loot was completely broken, cost 1 gold, inflicted 1 damage (had zero resistance if it is armor) and could be repaired only by blacksmith for considerable amount of money. Of course, this will effectively make all the bandits a nuisance, as killing them would yield zero reward, but aren't they like this already? Besides, they could still carry some amount of money and food. This way doing witcher contracts for money would make a sense. And second reason for doing these should be the challenge and unique ingredients for potions/crafting. And of course there already is a great story behind each and every of these, so I'm completely satisfied by this part.
I don't know exactly why CDPR decided that all the players should have the same level (around 35) by the end of the game. Probably, because of the two upcoming big DLCs. Experience is awarded in a way that you either do main quests or you do side quests - the result is the same, i.e. as far as I can remember, overall amount of exp for main and side quests is roughly the same.
On my first playthrough I decided to do all the side quests in Velen before going to Novigrad and as a result I got zero experience for Novigrad's quests. Then I did all the quests in Novigrad and Oxenfurt (spelling might be wrong here as I'm playing Russian version of the game) and similar thing happened with Skellige. Nevertheless, my Geralt was at level 37 by the end of the game. On my second playthrough I'm mixing main and side quests and still outlevel about a half of them too quickly. So, if CDPR really wanted all the players to end the game at level 35, they did their job very well.
Then again, experience is not a problem here, but very low difficulty of gray quests is.Lore wise I have no problems with Geralt receiving small to zero amount of exp for killing monsters. After all, he did regain his memory. So exp awarded for storyline quests primarily is OK for me. But there has to be some motivation for doing side quests. Again, lore wise it should be money. Furthermore, it should be the main source of money in game, IMO. For those who want to go storyline only there already are quest items awarded in the process, so they won't need much money anyway. But right now witcher contracts reward is humorous, compared to amount of money one can raise from looting (which should be a bad thing, really, think of the "Killing Monsters" cinematic
).So everything is closely interconnected here.
Personally, I won't mind if all the loot was completely broken, cost 1 gold, inflicted 1 damage (had zero resistance if it is armor) and could be repaired only by blacksmith for considerable amount of money. Of course, this will effectively make all the bandits a nuisance, as killing them would yield zero reward, but aren't they like this already? Besides, they could still carry some amount of money and food. This way doing witcher contracts for money would make a sense. And second reason for doing these should be the challenge and unique ingredients for potions/crafting. And of course there already is a great story behind each and every of these, so I'm completely satisfied by this part.
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It seems the motto of "listening to our fans" is just for propaganda purposes and CDPR stick to whatever they want no matter what. :no:thumbdown:
if not, then why nothing has changed after so many complains ?
I could bring up a couple of more examples but they're not related to this thread.
But they are listening, TW1&2 are perfect examples of that. They can't satisfy everyone, though, because different players have different view of the game and balance. I believe they're aware of all the problems, but they need time to find a good and working solution before starting to make significant balance changes. And it's not that easy. I have a lot of experience with modding and I can say that balance is a real pain, so I do understand why it isn't patched yet. Modders have a luxury of experimenting and even breaking the game and its balance but developers don't. Anyway, I don't think that insulting CDPR would do any good.
but developers don't. Anyway, I don't think that insulting CDPR would do any good.Another thread was opened about this and a mod directed us here so here I am. My question is why do they basically say you can't be over this level at the end but you can be as low a level as you can make it and survive? Why make the option be either play multiple times through most of the same stuff or play a bunch of side quests for basically no exp and worthless loot? If I want to do it all and be level 90 when I'm done with the main quest why does it matter in a fully single player game?
I was was pretty bummed when I started a quest that was green, halfway through I leveled up (not realizing the quest became grey then) and when I finished I got basically no exp. didn't understand a reason to put a limit like this on a single player game. Read though this and still don't understand why I can't just play being a Witcher God if I want to be level whatever the max would be if you did everything possible. So what if it makes it easy, it's only affecting me.
Oh, and I do love this game, I'm just ranting while waiting for the patch to get here to start over again. So it's not so much a "this is horrible " comment, more of a "this is just unnecessary to hold people back" comment.
I was was pretty bummed when I started a quest that was green, halfway through I leveled up (not realizing the quest became grey then) and when I finished I got basically no exp. didn't understand a reason to put a limit like this on a single player game. Read though this and still don't understand why I can't just play being a Witcher God if I want to be level whatever the max would be if you did everything possible. So what if it makes it easy, it's only affecting me.
Oh, and I do love this game, I'm just ranting while waiting for the patch to get here to start over again. So it's not so much a "this is horrible " comment, more of a "this is just unnecessary to hold people back" comment.
Because that's break every rules in an RPG, it would be unbalanced, and it would make you a Power Player.
In other words, it would be a shitty design.
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Because it would be STUPID.
Just for that. It would be really stupid change a good design in a bad one just because someone have complaints about it.
first of all it's not just someone. also note that this decision put players into shackles by forcing them to choose specific quests and this contradict their own vision of open world games.
in most RPGs, xp gain for completing quests and killing enemies are fixed; but xp requirement for level advancement increases gradually. this system has proved itself over the years. however for some mysterious reasons CDPR decided to do almost the opposite.
With this logic, any build that makes you a Power Player should be nerfed? What's the difference between being over leveled a lot with an average build or being slightly over leveled with the best build possible? Either way your walking through stuff without a challenge. Your "shitty design" theory is really opinion. I have played RPGs before most that post here were probably playing with anything besides a rattle and given an RPG is a Role Playing Game I find it odd that you would think you concept of "shitty" would be the beat all to end all of what's right. That kind of flys in the face of role playing doesn't it?
What system? The level scaling. That has proved nothing besides the fact that it doesn't work.
And no, open world games doesn't mean that you can choose what you want to do. Open world is just a tool for the quest design, nothing more than that.
This is the reason why TES is a broken mess.
And, just for saying, Gothic works in the same way.
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It's not a theory. You have a final boss that, let's say is around level 35.
Now, the system doesn't allow you to be overlevelled for that boss at the end of the game.
But...if every quest gives you full XP reward, then at the end of the game, you will be absolutely a GOD. Because you would fight that 35 level boss when you are at 45 level or more.
And a dev can't even set that final boss to an higher level, because this would mean that, if you do only the main quest, you would arrive at that boss absolutely underlevelled.
It's simply a matter of balancement.
This system keeps the levelling system balanced because, if you have already levelled with the main quest, you will not level up further with low level side quest.
Is it perfect? No, it's not.
For example, all the side quest in Skellige should have a level over the 20th, while now some of them have a 12-15 level.
Or the quest with Lambert in Novigrad, should have been divided in two phases. Level 11 when you meet him, and level 20 when he send you to Skellige.
Now or Never, Cabaret and the quest for Dijkstra about the regicide (when you found Thaler) are level 14, while they should be level 18/19.
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It has, and this conversation proved that you simply don't like the system and are trying to root out a reason for yourself.
Edit: level scaling means that enemies will become more powerful each time the player advances to a new level. this is completely different from what I've described in my earlier post.
An open world with no artificial boundary but with harsh punishment for exploring !
this is what the quest journal says:
don't go after this quest for now, because then you're gonna level up and end up with grayed out quests and I shall slap your face with 5 xp instead of 250. so any player has basically two choices. either play the game the way "quest journal" dictates or kicked in the . . . with 5 xp afterward.
main quests are about 40% of TW3 and it's completely apparent that if someone had ignored the rest, he/she missed a lot; xp, equipment and potion upgrades included. so he/she should be under leveled. however even that has its own solution, you can always change the difficulty settings on the go.
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But...this is exactly what are you complaining about.
If you are underlevelled doing only the main quest....you are forced to do the side quests...isn't this what you don't like? Be forced to do something without have freedom?
Yeah, but if you play for the XP, you are doing wrong, man. If you play a pen&paper session, and the master see that you are playing only for the experience points, he kicks you out of the game.
XP are a reward, but not the point of the quest.
In order to fix this "problem", it's not necessary to change the entire system (in a bad way). It's more simple to rebalance some areas and quests.
As I said before, there are some quest in Skellige between level 12-15, which will be greyed out when you reach Skellige. Now, because the main quest is level 18. the side quests in Skellige should be over the 20th level.
In Novigrad there are Now or Never, Cabaret and the quest for Dijkstra which are level 14, but are unlocked after or near the end of the main quest in that area, while you are around level 17-18. So, those side quests should be level 18.
The quest with Lamber start at level 11. But then, it should end there, and another side quest should start, level 20, where he send you to Skellige.
This would prevent most of the side quest to be greyed out following the main quest, without changing the system.
Why its wrong can you explain ? as per I know this is RPG game & in RPG games XP is the most important thing & because of xp only we are leveling up & so that I can enjoy further things in game so why should I not play for xp ?
Why you are trying to force your thinking on us by saying "if you play for the XP, you are doing wrong, man." ??
I do not even want an exaggerated high Lv, I have not maximize all the skills, but I would like in the last battle can carry the best equipment.
But above all, I will not be penalized for not permanently to follow in an open world game the main quest.
A friend wanted to, with the purchase, waiting for the Game of the Year Edition. But he changed his mind by this system.
I myself would also waive all free DLCs to get rid of this nuisance.
Sorry for my bad english. Was translated with Google.
But above all, I will not be penalized for not permanently to follow in an open world game the main quest.
A friend wanted to, with the purchase, waiting for the Game of the Year Edition. But he changed his mind by this system.
I myself would also waive all free DLCs to get rid of this nuisance.
Sorry for my bad english. Was translated with Google.
It's nothing like that. xp is part of the reward and cutting that reward for just being over leveled is a pain in the . . .
lets say that there are two quests available for level 15 and 25 respectively; you are level 20 and want to complete both of them. if you pick the later quest first, you'll level up to 21 and end up with a grayed out level 15 quest with 5 xp. but if you do it the other way around, everything will be fine. isn't that a big problem ?
by the way, no one is forced to do side quests and explore the world; the easiest difficulty made sure of that.
P.S: it seems we should agree to disagree on this matter.
lets say that there are two quests available for level 15 and 25 respectively; you are level 20 and want to complete both of them. if you pick the later quest first, you'll level up to 21 and end up with a grayed out level 15 quest with 5 xp. but if you do it the other way around, everything will be fine. isn't that a big problem ?
by the way, no one is forced to do side quests and explore the world; the easiest difficulty made sure of that.
P.S: it seems we should agree to disagree on this matter.
I played Pen&Papers (videogame RPG are simply an expansion of those games) and even RPG on chat. I learn from there and people there teach me that XP are just a reward, but not the point of the quest. That you should play for the quest itself, and even if there aren't XP, nothing change. It's from the quest that you have enjoyment, not from the XP. Playing a quest because of the XP, is an MMO like approach to the game.
And there is even another, but not less important, implication. Playing a quest or refuse a quest for the XP is metagame. Because you are role-playing basing all on your knowledge, and not on Geralt's knowledge (or your character in general). Which translate the game in metagame, means that you are breaking the rules.
It's like...the "outside" in football.
Are you really know what you are talking about ? Ok for a second lets think that you are right then why we have this quest out of level & 5 xp thing if the game is really not about xp ? Then I think CDPR should give us a fix xp for all quests as its all about quest enjoyment Right ??
Another thing if we don't get xp from quests its not possible for us to level up & wear proper weapon / armor for high level quests so then how you going to complete the quest & specially on Death march difficulty ?
Ok now my point... What if you worked hard & your boss gives you half salary ? are you going to feel happy & going to say Its ok Enjoying work is the important thing salary is not.... Right ?? Nope Enjoying work [ quest ] is a different thing but getting proper salary [ XP ] is satisfaction so everything in game is important as all things are depending on each other & Witcher 3 is open world game so I think they should give us a that much freedom to do the quest when ever we want.
If doing quest in proper level going to give us proper xp then how this same thing going to unbalanced the game if they give that same xp on completion of those quest at any time ????
Still haven't had anyone who's saying the holding back if exp makes sense. Just because YOU don't want to be over leveled doesn't mean others should be held back. I don't like that you can be super powered if you build the perfect build so let's get the devs to nerf any build that is able to play without any challenge? What's the difference? Again tell me what it effects if I'm level 50 when I get to the main boss? They list the level requirements. I KNOW I'm over leveled. I KNOW the main boss will be easy if I'm over leveled. If that's how I want to play let me. If this was a multiplayer game I get it, being a solo game putting limits on it just makes no logical sense.
You can exploit how the synergy of some skills work to make a character that can cake walk the game and that's accepted no one cares, but even help you want the exp that's actually supposed to be given from a quest, that's to over powered? Names zero sense.
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This is your opinion. If you take all rewards away from quests I don't think most are doing them. Let's understand the first few are fine, but the 20th time you asked to do basically the same thing, and you get no rewards? No one is doing that. Hell a Witcher doesn't do anything for free! Why would I? Witchers don't get "exp" because they were trained from the get go, they don't need to get "whirl" they learned it in their training to be a Witcher that doesn't translate into a good game if you start with every skill so loot/exp is the carrot on the stick, without it I'm not doing contracts and side quests because they aren't that interesting. Some are ok, but most are typical go get this/kill this quests that you do in any RPG. So to say exp isn't the point is a bit false as I see it. If I'm not advancing in some way I don't understand why I'd play an RPG. Might as well play a FPS.
You can exploit how the synergy of some skills work to make a character that can cake walk the game and that's accepted no one cares, but even help you want the exp that's actually supposed to be given from a quest, that's to over powered? Names zero sense.
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This is your opinion. If you take all rewards away from quests I don't think most are doing them. Let's understand the first few are fine, but the 20th time you asked to do basically the same thing, and you get no rewards? No one is doing that. Hell a Witcher doesn't do anything for free! Why would I? Witchers don't get "exp" because they were trained from the get go, they don't need to get "whirl" they learned it in their training to be a Witcher that doesn't translate into a good game if you start with every skill so loot/exp is the carrot on the stick, without it I'm not doing contracts and side quests because they aren't that interesting. Some are ok, but most are typical go get this/kill this quests that you do in any RPG. So to say exp isn't the point is a bit false as I see it. If I'm not advancing in some way I don't understand why I'd play an RPG. Might as well play a FPS.
So Geralt takes a contract for XP? Or for coin?
In the first case, as I said, is metagame.
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1) You are not working hard in low levelled quest, so your point is out of place.
2) You can never do all the side quests in their proper level.
And again, balancement of a game , expecially of an RPG, is more important than your enjoyment.
If because of you guys, they change the system and so they break the entire balancement, just because of your satifaction, then I will equally piss off.
I actually answer this. He takes it for coin, he doesn't need "exp" because he has all the skills. He doesn't have to get perks or skills to unlock other skills. So the concept doesn't translate well from books to game I've never read the books, but is there ever a time when he's done with a take and he all the sudden says "yes! I can now whirl!"? I highly doubt it. So the exp argument not only doesn't work, but with your argument I should start the game with every skill he can doin the books? Clearly that wouldn't make for. Good game, the reason it won't? Because people want to advance. They want to feel like they are progressing. That's why your "exp isn't the reason to quest"theory is just wrong IMO.