Yen Or Triss?

[Hamilton1358]

What are the points/quests that when completed will force me to decide?

The deciding factor for both romances is telling Yen/Triss you love them. With Triss it's in the mission called Now or Never(you also have to kiss her during A Matter of Life and Death), with Yen it's The Last Wish. If Geralt says he loves them both, they'll both dump him later on. So choose only one if you want your Geralt to end up with either. You can also choose to not romance either, romances are optional. Both quests can fail at certain points, Last Wish after you go to KM for the first time and Now or Never a bit later. The game will notify you when you reach a critical point in the story when a number of quests can fail.

In my opinion, that points that she is very attached to high society and a wealthy life style, it's how her personality is. It's so strong that she forgets that trauma in months for the sake of that opportunity.

I don't think that is the reason Triss is into politics. Money and wealthy lifestyle usually just come with it. While she most certainly prefers that kind of lifestyle, Triss had no problem living in squalor for months and dealing with Novigrad's underground. It is not the desire for wealth that drives her into doing that, but her idealism and imo an honest desire to help others.

 

[Shivansps]

I couldn't disagree more. If I only looked at TW3, I wouldn't find Triss nowhere near as appealing as I do now. A part of why I like her character are the flaws she has and the mistakes she makes. It's what makes her such a complex and realistic character. TW3 is her redemption chapter in a way, but to the new players especially, she can seem like a perfect little goody two-shoes and there is more to Triss than that. Add books to the mix and you have a well rounded character that shows a nice variety of human flaws and emotions, good and bad.

About the whole Triss/Lambert theory, I don't buy it one bit. I made a detailed post that explains how I see it, so I'll just link that instead of repeating myself
http://forums.cdprojektred.com/threads/119321-Yen-Or-Triss?p=2922361&viewfull=1#post2922361

mmmm maybe i did not explained it well, its not about her as a character, you are right in that point, TW2 develops her character A LOT... so does TW1, althought there she plays the cannon romance and bichy role, that is later given to Yen in TW3.

Its hard to explain, but the problem is, im not sure if Triss can be trusted, she seems to be using Geralt even more than Yen, not sure how to said it, but via Triss Geralt seems to be the Lodge plaything, we all remember the TW1 mirror escene, her TW2 actions are strange and suspicious, minimum, and her interactions in TW3 with Philippa, seems to be way too friendly, and i feel she is up to something in Kovir...

And most couples whould have no survived that Triss hidden the fact she was a member of the Lodge in TW2, and that may be the reason of why they ended after TW2.

I could make a very long post explaining it point by point why i feel that way, but i just dont want too because its pointless.

 

[exylon92]

And most couples whould have no survived that Triss hidden the fact she was a member of the Lodge in TW2, and that may be the reason of why they ended after TW2.

There's actually very stupid incositency here. As I posted before in Witcher 1 few people mention that Triss is in the Lodge. Hell, if you choose to side with no one Triss talks about the Lodge with Foltest in front of Geralt. Then Witcher 2 came and suddenly everyone have amnesia

 

[SylvanWolf]

mmmm maybe i did not explained it well, its not about her as a character, you are right in that point, TW2 develops her character A LOT... so does TW1, althought there she plays the cannon romance and bichy role, that is later given to Yen in TW3.

Its hard to explain, but the problem is, im not sure if Triss can be trusted, she seems to be using Geralt even more than Yen, not sure how to said it, but via Triss Geralt seems to be the Lodge plaything, we all remember the TW1 mirror escene, her TW2 actions are strange and suspicious, minimum, and her interactions in TW3 with Philippa, seems to be way too friendly, and i feel she is up to something in Kovir...

And most couples whould have no survived that Triss hidden the fact she was a member of the Lodge in TW2, and that may be the reason of why they ended after TW2.

I could make a very long post explaining it point by point why i feel that way, but i just dont want too because its pointless.

Well, Yen set out to save Margarita, and demanded Emhyr var Emreis to grant amnesty to all members of the lodge. She did far more for the members of the lodge than Triss in TW3. In TW2, if you chose to save Triss, she turned against the other members of the lodge at the summit (and she was expelled from the organization due to lack of trust).
So no, doesn't seem like valid reasons to distrust her.
About using Geralt and not telling him about Yennefer, well, watch this video from TW2:
https://youtu.be/S2WhP3bWPbg?t=38s
She may refer to that relationship as "toxic", but she did still tell him. Also, she did try to help him to restore his memory (simply she was alone at this and didn't really know how.. First real attempt would be with the rose of remembrance, yet interrupted by Letho. And not telling about Yennefer could also be blamed on other witchers, Dandelion, Zoltan and perhaps someone else as well, who I can't remember now..
She still used him, sure, and had betrayed Geralt in the past, yet she wasn't all THAT bad..

 

[Hamilton1358]

mmmm maybe i did not explained it well, its not about her as a character, you are right in that point, TW2 develops her character A LOT... so does TW1, althought there she plays the cannon romance and bichy role, that is later given to Yen in TW3.

Its hard to explain, but the problem is, im not sure if Triss can be trusted, she seems to be using Geralt even more than Yen, not sure how to said it, but via Triss Geralt seems to be the Lodge plaything, we all remember the TW1 mirror escene, her TW2 actions are strange and suspicious, minimum, and her interactions in TW3 with Philippa, seems to be way too friendly, and i feel she is up to something in Kovir...

And most couples whould have no survived that Triss hidden the fact she was a member of the Lodge in TW2, and that may be the reason of why they ended after TW2.

I could make a very long post explaining it point by point why i feel that way, but i just dont want too because its pointless.

While I don't deny that Triss hasn't been honest with Geralt on several occasions, I do think she more than proved her loyalty by the end of TW3. The mirror scene in TW1 has her talking to a fellow sorceress(Keira, I guess) mostly about Foltest and court related schemes and the Geralt part I assume relates to keeping info about Yen and Ciri, but considering how TW1 plot went its way to exclude them, it can very well be that at that point Triss plans to use Geralt to help Lodge's plans in some way or just strengthening her position in Temeria. However when that conversation happens, Geralt and Triss aren't exactly in a relationship yet so there is still room for growth in the way she treats him.

By the time of TW2, Triss' relationship with Geralt has grown and she separated herself from the Lodge a bit. She later says how they stopped inviting her to the meetings and how they didn't approve of her relationship with Geralt. Throughout TW2, Triss knows stuff about the Lodge she is not telling Geralt, but in her defense she lacks concrete evidence to implicate the Lodge at that point and she is definitely not working with them. Even Philippa says that when it comes to Lodge's plans, Triss is as innocent as a child and that she had no role in them. What also goes in favor of Triss' loyalty is how she takes Geralt's side at the end of TW2 and goes against the Lodge. Her loyalty to them in the past has been almost unquestionable and she even went against Geralt, Ciri and Yen for it. So this imo is a huge step for her character. Also if you go and rescue Triss in TW2, you can confront her about the Lodge and choose to either trust her or not so I guess that's up to each player to decide.

Her being friendly with Philippa in TW3 is nothing unusual for me considering the circumstances. Even though she was disillusioned by the Lodge, they are still her former allies and seeing them get hunted and killed by Radovid is not something she wants. It is only natural she would be more sympathetic toward Phil then Radovid in the crystal scene. Also when talking about getting the Lodge back, Phil doesn't even mention Triss. Only when Margarita asks about her, she says they'll see, so that also shows to me that she is not making any new schemes with them and that she has taken a different path. I also don't think she has some evil plans in Kovir and based on her behavior in TW3, I don't doubt her loyalty to Geralt. Sure, she can still be scheming at times, but it's a common trait among sorceresses and not something I take particularly against her.

 

[SylvanWolf]

Her being friendly with Philippa in TW3 is nothing unusual for me considering the circumstances. Even though she was disillusioned by the Lodge, they are still her former allies and seeing them get hunted and killed by Radovid is not something she wants. It is only natural she would be more sympathetic toward Phil then Radovid in the crystal scene. Also when talking about getting the Lodge back, Phil doesn't even mention Triss. Only when Margarita asks about her, she says they'll see, so that also shows to me that she is not making any new schemes with them and that she has taken a different path. I also don't think she has some evil plans in Kovir and based on her behavior in TW3, I don't doubt her loyalty to Geralt. Sure, she can still be scheming at times, but it's a common trait among sorceresses and not something I take particularly against her.

If you give the crystal to Yennefer after the Last wish quest, Yennefer acts pretty much the same way as Triss would, if you choose to give the crystal to her.

 

[exylon92]

I'll just add that she really feels guilt. When Geralt reply to her that he never felt manipulated she quickly changes the topic. If you let her be tortured later you can ask her about Menge and her nails. In both dialogues she's becoming defensive and even angry, like she can't bear the thought that after everything Geralt is still worried about her, mix it with certainty that he must be already with Yen, suffering and regret that they are not together anymore and I'm inclined to say that she's more complex character in W3 that people think.

 

[Hamilton1358]

There's actually very stupid incositency here. As I posted before in Witcher 1 few people mention that Triss is in the Lodge. Hell, if you choose to side with no one Triss talks about the Lodge with Foltest in front of Geralt.

Also, Leuvaarden mentions them and Radovid plain out tells Geralt about the Lodge and Triss being a member. So yeah, when analyzing the plot of the whole trilogy, TW1 sometimes makes things hard. Another strange detail is when Geralt asks Dandelion who was there when he died and Dandelion replies your loved ones and friends without even feeling the need to mention Yen or Ciri. He mentions several people from Geralt's life in other occasions, like Cahir, Regis or Angouleme.

If you give the crystal to Yennefer after the Last wish quest, Yennefer acts pretty much the same way as Triss would, if you choose to give the crystal to her.

Even though Yen was never captivated by the Lodge or their ideas, it still makes more sense for her to be sympathetic toward her fellow sorceresses. Yen also seems genuinely upset about Sile and wants to at least give her a painless death. So whoever you give the crystal to, the reaction and the feelings shown are mostly out of solidarity.

 

[exylon92]

Also, Leuvaarden mentions them and Radovid plain out tells Geralt about the Lodge and Triss being a member. So yeah, when analyzing the plot of the whole trilogy, TW1 sometimes makes things hard. Another strange detail is when Geralt asks Dandelion who was there when he died and Dandelion replies your loved ones and friends without even feeling the need to mention Yen or Ciri. He mentions several people from Geralt's life in other occasions, like Cahir, Regis or Angouleme.

Now that you mentioned it I remember that when he is telling Geralt about his death he actually mentions Ciri but not by her name, only "she", but Geralt doesn't even inquire who "she" might actually be.

 

[Hamilton1358]

Now that you mentioned it I remember that when he telling Geralt about his death he actually mentions Ciri but not by her name, only "she", but Geralt doesn't even inquire about it.

Here's Dandy's quote: "I saw her tell them to bring you on a boat, and there was a unicorn, and Milva, Cahir and Angouleme, and Yarpen and Zoltan --we all witnessed it"

So not only is he not mentioning Yen and Ciri but he also mentions people who weren't there and basically lying to his amnesiac friend for no apparent reason. Now that I think about it, Dandelion should take the same amount of blame about keeping Geralt's past a secret as Triss does, if not more. At least Geralt never asked Triss openly about anything specific from his past and she has an angle of wanting to seduce him. What's Dandelion's excuse? And for an amnesiac man, Geralt is awfully uninterested about asking questions about his past and he even shuts down the conversation about it on few occasions.

But those are TW1 inconsistencies it's best try to pretend don't exist. It was CDPR's first game and they probably didn't know how everything will turn out story wise.

 

[exylon92]

Here's Dandy's quote: "I saw her tell them to bring you on a boat, and there was a unicorn, and Milva, Cahir and Angouleme, and Yarpen and Zoltan --we all witnessed it"

I thought that by "her" he mentioned Ciri but I could be mistaken.

What's Dandelion's excuse?

He doesn't sleep with Geralt so suddenly it's okay I guess.

 

[Hamilton1358]

I thought that by "her" he mentioned Ciri but I could be mistaken.

Yeah, I agree, but considering he doesn't exactly shy away from mentioning names, it makes zero sense he wouldn't mention the people closest to Geralt. Everyone keeping quiet about Yen and Ciri and CDPR cutting them from the game completely was a design choice for TW1 for whatever reason. It turned into an interesting subplot for Triss and imo benefited her arc, but with others it just makes no sense. It is what it is, and I think we've drifted offtopic anyway

 

[exylon92]

It is what it is, and I think we've drifted offtopic anyway

Yeah, back to the topic. So I really like Triss romance, but I can understand why some people choose Yen, and it all boils down to preference and... Oh, since that we mentioned W1 writing I really don't mind it. Like you said it was first CDPR game and they really created amazing game. W1 has this unique feel to it that you can't quite recreate in W2 and W3... I honestly tried to say on-topic

 

[The.GreyMatter]

I'll qoute myself here about Kovir stuff.

Originally Posted by exylon92
It's not a big deal after all. I guess everyone had a moment like this. Not confessing to Witcher of course. Just buliding up courage to talk about something.

To me, it is. Like I said before she had the chance to start it from scratch with me, start to build a 100% honest relationship. If she needed to hide such an important information because she was "building courage" it means she doesn't fully trust him, or in his love. When you really trust someone you'll always put the cards over the table, be completely honest, because you trust that your lover will undertsand and back you up no matter what. After all they went through keeping him in the dark about her plans just reinforced the feeling I experienced in W2. I see that as a lack of confidence from her side.

But that's just my interpretation.

And why she shouldn't jump again? She's young, succesful and can do a lot of good. It's never stated that she forgets the trauma

It isn't? Well, to me it is. She seems very happy with the chance and if she doesn't say she is, at least, scared about jumping in politics again after she almost got killed cause of it and she is getting into it again to me it's obvious that she forgot about all she went through. Even Geralt gets suprised when she tells about it, so he probably thought the same.

Why she shouldn't? Well, to start: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OkAGOtvcdmk

Look at all (books too) that high society and politics caused to her, after all that she accepts the first offer that appeard in her life. Months after almost die because of it.

Even if she likes wealthy lifestyle there's nothing wrong with that, but it's not like she does everything for money.

I also never said that there is something wrong in that, I'm saying that she is really attached to it.

---------- Updated at 10:20 PM ----------

I don't think that is the reason Triss is into politics. Money and wealthy lifestyle usually just come with it. While she most certainly prefers that kind of lifestyle

It is not the desire for wealth that drives her into doing that, but her idealism and imo an honest desire to help others.

I think it's both, she didn't need to be a court mage to save all those mages in Novigrad so it's not the only way to help others. Ciri also is an idealist and wants honestly to help the folk, but I think she would try to do that as a witcheress instead of as Empress anyday.

Triss had no problem living in squalor for months and dealing with Novigrad's underground.

She was living in the comfort flat actually, she moved to that shitty place right before Geralt arrives in Novigrad. So she spent a month there, at most. But comfort is not exclusivity of Triss, pretty much any sorceress doesn't like to live like a peasant. I'm talking about politics, high society and being very wealthy (like is said she became).

 

[Hamilton1358]

If she needed to hide such an important information because she was "building courage" it means she doesn't fully trust him, or in his love. When you really trust someone you'll always put the cards over the table, be completely honest, because you trust that your lover will undertsand and back you up no matter what. After all they went through keeping him in the dark about her plans just reinforced the feeling I experienced in W2. I see that as a lack of confidence from her side.

I disagree about her not trusting Geralt, but I agree about her not trusting his love. Based on the previous experience with Geralt and even her reaction when he tells her he loves her, Triss needing time to fully embrace Geralt's love seems in line with what I would expect from her. I also agree it's a confidence problem on her side. But I don't see it as a trust issue in their relationship.

I think it's both, she didn't need to be a court mage to save all those mages in Novigrad so it's not the only way to help others.

I can agree with that, but I don't think her primary motivation for helping them was securing a better position for herself or cuddling up to Tancred. When she started helping them, the situation was unpredictable and imo there was no personal gain at sight. Yet, unlike what other members of the Lodge did and went into hiding, Triss decided to fight for others and risk getting caught. Of course, when the opportunity arose, Triss took it, as expected. Triss having political ambitions is part of her personality, but I think the motivations that drive her go beyond money or power and that is one of the things I like about her and what I think separates her from most sorceresses.

She was living in the comfort flat actually, she moved to that shitty place right before Geralt arrives in Novigrad. So she spent a month there, at most. But comfort is not exclusivity of Triss, pretty much any sorceress doesn't like to live like a peasant. I'm talking about politics, high society and being very wealthy (like is said she became).

You have a point, but I think it's probably more than a month, six months passed since TW2 and when Geralt first meets her, she seems very in element with the lifestyle she leads, so I would guess it's been a few months at least. I could be wrong about this though, I don't remember if it was mentioned in game.

About luxury and comfort, I agree and sorceresses enjoying that particular lifestyle is nothing unusual, but I don't really think it is Triss' top priority to live like that even though she would naturally prefer it.

W1 has this unique feel to it that you can't quite recreate in W2 and W3

I agree, TW1 atmosphere and soundtrack still make it feel very unique even though it hasn't exactly aged well in some other regards. I still love the game though, I'm replaying it right now.

 

[mulzi]

Out of curiousity, can someone explain this to me, as I'm confused on the time line here: Yen comments on Triss and Geralt's year long escapades with the bed in Kaer Morhen. Vesmeer has a few comments on knowing Triss at Kaer Morhen (prologue, when they speak on geralt's dream and Vesmeer guessed it was triss rather than Yen). And Lambert knew Triss at kaer Morhen.

So if the witchers were at KM with Geralt and Triss during their relationship/amnesia, why did none of the witcher's clue Geralt in on Yen?

 

[Riverdragon]

Proberly because they were relieved :wazzzup:

 

[Rafaelbw]

As soon as Geralt was on his feet, Kaer Morhen was attacked, and right on the other day all the witchers split up and leave the place. No time at all to talk. Dandelion, Zoltan? They all thought that Geralt was dead, and so Yen. One week after the events of TW1, Zoltan and Dandelion left Vizima, and Geralt was with Triss at Foltest Court, then one month later the events of TW2 take place, Geralt starts having Flashbacks, and remembers Yen(and Triss tell him of her and Ciri).

 

[Gilthoniel]

why did none of the witcher's clue Geralt in on Yen

Why? Because CDPR writers decided to do so...they didn't mention even Ciri!!! I guess the characters had some kind of amnesia too

CDPR said it themself: "they were afraid" to include Yennefer/Ciri in their early game because those are complex characters. Not sure if they mean that other characters aren't soo complex. Weird explanation...

The Yennefer Challenge

Yennefer has a huge arc in Andrzej Sapkowski’s Witcher novels, and CD Projekt Red was intimidated to tackle such a complex character in the games. “We avoided introducing her in the first two games partly because she was such an important character that we were afraid of bringing her to the picture,” says senior writer Jakub Szamałek.
For Geralt’s last big journey, CD Projekt Red finally got over its fear and brought her in, but she wasn’t the easiest character to make players understand and like. “Yennefer is difficult character for many reasons,” says writer Karolina Stachyra. “She’s well known to the readers of the saga, and fans had their own expectation according to that character. We needed to face them, which is always very challenging. Second of all she is ironic and sarcastic, often hard to coexist with, and very smart (sometimes even impertinent), so it was another challenge to make her likeable.”
“Yennefer is really a mean character in the books,” Szamałek adds. “In the beginning, she seems to be a difficult character and you might even dislike her, but when you finish reading the books, you almost certainly end up liking her. The problem is we had to recreate this. We couldn’t make Yennefer likeable from the first minutes of your interaction with her because it would make her seem and feel like a very different character from the book.”
Stachyra says the team had intense discussions on whether or not to make her personality warmer, but ultimately decided against it because they wanted to stay true to what made her special – the part of her that Geralt loved the most. However, they also worked in scenes to show Yennefer’s softer side, like when she sees Ciri at Kaer Morhen and runs and kisses her cheeks. “For someone so preoccupied with her appearances and with how she’s perceived, you can see at this very moment she drops all the pretenses and her guard and she’s basically herself,” Stachyra says.

 

[exylon92]

To me, it is. Like I said before she had the chance to start it from scratch with me, start to build a 100% honest relationship. If she needed to hide such an important information because she was "building courage" it means she doesn't fully trust him, or in his love. When you really trust someone you'll always put the cards over the table, be completely honest, because you trust that your lover will undertsand and back you up no matter what. After all they went through keeping him in the dark about her plans just reinforced the feeling I experienced in W2. I see that as a lack of confidence from her side.

But that's just my interpretation.

You said it yourself. Lack of confidence =/= lack of trust.

I think it's both, she didn't need to be a court mage to save all those mages in Novigrad so it's not the only way to help others. Ciri also is an idealist and wants honestly to help the folk, but I think she would try to do that as a witcheress instead of as Empress anyday.

I could just rewrite what already was posted, but I'll just say that it shouldn't really matter in which path you choose to help other as long as you won't allow yourself to become corrupted along the way.

She was living in the comfort flat actually, she moved to that shitty place right before Geralt arrives in Novigrad. So she spent a month there, at most. But comfort is not exclusivity of Triss, pretty much any sorceress doesn't like to live like a peasant. I'm talking about politics, high society and being very wealthy (like is said she became).

There's still nothing wrong in that. Wealth, high society and politics comes naturally with her position. Would it be better if she accepted her position and lived in a shed? As I said already both Yen and Triss were written very well. They both have their agendas and they don't need Geralt to live their lives. By the way that's little of topic but I tend to roleplay heavily too

I agree, TW1 atmosphere and soundtrack still make it feel very unique even though it hasn't exactly aged well in some other regards. I still love the game though, I'm replaying it right now.

Truest words have never been spoken.