Yennefer of Vengerberg (all spoilers)

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Yeah, that's where I got this quote from. Was there anything written that contradicts this quote or did I misunderstand it? (serious question, as I have read the books in german)

You got it right about Yennefer and other sorceress advisors manipulating royal marriages and such. As for Ciri getting married to the prince of Kovir, Ciri goes there herself at the end to find out what it is they want with her, and she agrees to do it. But circumstances change quickly in Rivia when she goes to say goodbye to Geralt.
 

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Nothing that explicitly contradicts, nothing that explicitly proves. Rather indirect contradictions.

Nor Francesca, nor Philippa, nor hermit Sheala never worked with Yen on such topics as it seems from their dialogues with her and their attitude.

No signs of Yen's political activity were ever given in the books. Although she lived in Vengerberg, no one claimed that she has influence even on Demavend (Radcliff was a court mage-advisor). She became a member of Mage Council only after Sodden, few years ago - no info on her activities there given, as well.

Plan about Tankred was developed after creation of Lodge, so Yen has nothing to do with it.

This is what I remember as well.
 
"a deep connection" - which never existed in the first place and was basically invented by CDPR. I mean, they liked each other but that's it.
What CDPR did here, is basically producing something that never took place in the story, which is a 'deep' relationship between Ciri and Vesemir while completely ignoring something that is as canon as it can get (Yen/Ciri) - without any explaination whatsoever.
She spent two years learning in Kaer Morhen, which means she really got used to them. Considering the fact she spent as much time with Yennefer (two years), she could really develop deep emotional connections with witchers.

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No signs of Yen's political activity were ever given in the books.
Her coworking with Dijkstra at least. Being in the Council can also be considered a political activity.

About this timeline you wrote - that's true, she certainly has nothing to do with Falka etc, but she could take part in stories with Calanthe and Pavetta. Though we'll never know for sure, so there really is no point in arguing, I believe.
 
"a deep connection" - which never existed in the first place and was basically invented by CDPR. I mean, they liked each other but that's it.
What CDPR did here, is basically producing something that never took place in the story, which is a 'deep' relationship between Ciri and Vesemir while completely ignoring something that is as canon as it can get (Yen/Ciri) - without any explaination whatsoever.

It would be totally fine if Ciri wasn't so 'enthusiastic' about Vesemir and then still showed some sadness over his death. Or if it was just Geralt - because after all, we are him, not Ciri -and Vesemir means 100% more to Geralt than to Ciri. THAT would be closer to reality.

Didn't we have that argumentation yesterday? I think we are spinning in circles. I explained they did it because it serves the plot of Witcher 3.
You will tell me that it contradicts the books (with which I only partly agree)
I will tell you that I would be surprised if of the 4+ million witcher 3 purchasers even 100k have read the books and that the Witcher games lore is different from the books lore anyway (White Frost) and we will end up at the beginning.
 
Her coworking with Dijkstra at least. Being in the Council can also be considered a political activity.

Oh, I wish to know more about that, too, two of my favourite characters were working together

but she could take part in stories with Calanthe and Pavetta. Though we'll never know for sure, so there really is no point in arguing, I believe.

If she even did it, she worked separately and in complete secrecy from other sorceresses, including Francesca's genetic team. Very bold assumption once again.
 
Aside from all the ingame explanations about the distanced relationship between Ciri and Yennefer, what do people think about the reasons, why CDP did this?
Nobody can tell me they just overlooked the mother/daughter relationship between Ciri and Yennefer from the books.They are book experts, who made three games based on them. CDP remembered that Triss calls Ciri "sister" (imo pretty pretentious as Triss doesn't deserve to be a sister for Ciri) and she calls Vesemir "uncle". Imo it was a conscious decision to not let Ciri say "mother" to Yennefer. Another indication is the dream sequence scene in which they replaced Yennefer with Vesemir, because they thought Vesemir standing at the balcony might be more important for the plot.
. Imo it would just take away from the special relationship between Geralt and Ciri if a in comparison to these two, secondary character like Yennefer, has an as special and deep connection to the main character of the game (Ciri) as the hero and playable character (Geralt).
Might this be the reason?
 
Aside from all the ingame explanations about the distanced relationship between Ciri and Yennefer, what do people think about the reasons, why CDP did this?
Nobody can tell me they just overlooked the mother/daughter relationship between Ciri and Yennefer from the books.They are book experts, who made three games based on them. CDP remembered that Triss calls Ciri "sister" (imo pretty pretentious as Triss doesn't deserve to be a sister for Ciri) and she calls Vesemir "uncle". Imo it was a conscious decision to not let Ciri say "mother" to Yennefer. Another indication is the dream sequence scene in which they replaced Yennefer with Vesemir, because they thought Vesemir standing at the balcony might be more important for the plot.
Might this be the reason?

But would it take away anything? Why? It's not a race, not a rivarly thing - Ciri loves Yen as much as she loves Geralt (at least the Ciri I know from the books), showing her this love in the game wouldn't demean her relationship with her daddy, come on. Also it's obvious that we'd like to see max one scene of that happening, or even one line - like "I missed you mother (or without 'mother'), "good to see you" etc - nothing more. So still Geralt would spend much more time with Ciri, as he's the main protagonist.
 
Aside from all the ingame explanations about the distanced relationship between Ciri and Yennefer, what do people think about the reasons, why CDP did this?
Nobody can tell me they just overlooked the mother/daughter relationship between Ciri and Yennefer from the books.They are book experts, who made three games based on them. CDP remembered that Triss calls Ciri "sister" (imo pretty pretentious as Triss doesn't deserve to be a sister for Ciri) and she calls Vesemir "uncle". Imo it was a conscious decision to not let Ciri say "mother" to Yennefer. Another indication is the dream sequence scene in which they replaced Yennefer with Vesemir, because they thought Vesemir standing at the balcony might be more important for the plot.
Might this be the reason?

I see zero explanations in the game.

Those can be just budgetary or simple technical scene creating limitations. Thankfully those can be mended.
I am willing to bet on either it being a fault of writing OR one of those two reasons.

From what I know, Ciri calls Yen Mother in Polish.
 
It's not like CDP likes to explain important plot ploints anyway. Even after 2 playthrought I'm still not sure what Eredin actually wanted from Ciri. At least not in a way that is logical.
It's not like that is any good excuse in the first place. The lacking writing of CDPR is the prime reason why we talk about the topic here. ;)

But the reason why she doesn't trust Yennefer 100% is sufficiently explained imo. You just have to add together several conversations and behaviors.
The conversation between Phillipa and Geralt in the sunstone cave. The conversation between Ciri and Yennefer on the boat and the conversation between Ciri and Geralt outside of Novigrad. Furthermore the (from my point of view) rather confidiental behavior between Emhyr and Yennefer, at least too confidiental for two rather secretive characters like the emperor and the sorceress. Though spending more than 6 months together probably had some impact.
So I still have no idea about why there is distrust between Ciri and Yen from the very beginning. You care to explain?

The only possible reason is Yen's collaboration with Emhyr but it's nowhere explained that Yen had some secret agenda beyond just finding Ciri. And if anything, Ciri should blame Geralt for the very same thing...

And the cave? That's just some wild theories by Philippa. Nothing of that is true. On the opposite, if you romance Yen in TW3 she offers to Geralt just before the end to leave all politics and just settle down with him somewhere. That is a clear contradictin to Philippa's theories in the sunstone cave. It's all just bullshit imo. And if Ciri had just some basic brains and emotional maturity she'd know that...

It's extremely unlikely that Yen would ever do anything to harm Ciri. May I remember you that her mother complex is her major driving force. She would do everything for her child. No force - especially not Emhyr - could change that. If Ciri believes that Yen could somehow turn on her she's either extremely stupid and ungrateful or something really serious must have happened between them - something that isn't shown or even indicated in the game. It's imo just bad characterization. Ciri is a badly written character in TW3, basically a spoilt egoistic brat without any real depth... :eek:uch:

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Ok, they lived in the city and Geralt hated it. What else? When he got sick of it , he just left her without a single word - instead of, I dunno, talking about a problem like an adult.

You can't "talk like an adult" to Yen. She doesn't make compromises. Either Geralt agrees with that or Yen gets furious, sometimes in such intensity that it's a danger for health and life. Geralt knows that quite well and he says in great clarity several times in the books. That's the point. She does whatever she thinks is good. Period.
 
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You can't "talk like an adult" to Yen. She doesn't make compromises. Either Geralt agrees with that or Yen gets furious, sometimes in such intensity that it's a danger for health and life. Geralt knows that quite well and he says in great clarity several times in the books. That's the point. She does whatever she thinks is good. Period.

...or Geralt just didn't want to speak of it. About what he feels and wants in a relationship. His lack of willingness to be 'emotionally-open' was one of the main reasons why their relationship didn't work before Ciri came to the picture. And why Yen decided to leave both him and Istredd. I'm not saying that Yen is not to blame, she is, but for other reasons and as much as Geralt.
 
Aside from all the ingame explanations about the distanced relationship between Ciri and Yennefer, what do people think about the reasons, why CDP did this?

Simplification.

I hate to say it but they just pretend like nothing ever happened between Yen and Ciri in the books and that Yen is "only" Geralt's love interest. I guess it's because they would have to explain that relationship to everyone who doesn't know the book and they just wanted to avoid the hassle and additional effort. So they changed the lore to make Yen and Triss just two acquaintances who happen to like each other.

A second - much wilder - guess that might add to that is that the story is probably written almost exclusively by men - for a predomintently male audience. Video games are notoriously weak in depicting not only realistic female characters but female topics in general. Topics like family interactions, motherhood and stuff like that are rarely of any importance in video games. It seems to me like such more subtle tones get often cut first in a video game narrative that has a ton of limitations. And I think that many male writers in video games have only little "feeling" for female topics or it's at least very low key on their priority least in terms of narrative topics. Like the whole sexuality issue, the topic of motherhood (Yen's most basic driving force as a character!!) is just stripped completely from the game. It's not mentioned in a single word which is pretty sad because you can't understand the relationship between her and Ciri without that. Think about it for a second: is there any specific "female" topic in the game or at least a topic that you would classify as "more female than male"? I don't think so. TW3 is a 100% male-centric story like pretty much every other western AAA video game and it's a shame. Both Ciri and Yen lose by that focus as characters. But - like always - that's just a thought I have, so it's only my humble opinion. ;)
 
...or Geralt just didn't want to speak of it. About what he feels and wants in a relationship. His lack of willingness to be 'emotionally-open' was one of the main reasons why their relationship didn't work before Ciri came to the picture. And why Yen decided to leave both him and Istredd. I'm not saying that Yen is not to blame, she is, but for other reasons and as much as Geralt.
My post wasn's meant as an excuse for anybody and it was not meant to blame anyone. Butit IS very clearly implied in the game how Yen reacts to stuff Geralt says that she doesn't like or support. From a narrators's perspective, not Geralt's one exclusively...

That Geralt is unable to express his feelings is absolutely right. It's the other side of the medal, his contribution to why the relationship was so stormy and ill-fated. But it was by far not only his fault.
 
...or Geralt just didn't want to speak of it. About what he feels and wants in a relationship. His lack of willingness to be 'emotionally-open' was one of the main reasons why their relationship didn't work before Ciri came to the picture. And why Yen decided to leave both him and Istredd. I'm not saying that Yen is not to blame, she is, but for other reasons and as much as Geralt.

No, he can't. He can almost never say what he thinks... Why do you think their relationship didn't work? Because it was stormy? She left them both, yes, but then she decided she wants Geralt more... Yea, Geralt is sometimes really bad at relationships... One example is when he invited Triss to teach Ciri first. Not only he hurt Triss extremely bad by giving her false hope, but also hurt Yennefer...
 
No, he can't. He can almost never say what he thinks... Why do you think their relationship didn't work? Because it was stormy? She left them both, yes, but then she decided she wants Geralt more... Yea, Geralt is sometimes really bad at relationships... One example is when he invited Triss to teach Ciri first. Not only he hurt Triss extremely bad by giving her false hope, but also hurt Yennefer...

Geralt is TERRIBLE at relationships, esp with women :p He hurt not only Triss. But also Essi, Fringilla....
 
In the Lady of the Lake, when Ciri and Yen see each other for the first time again (at the top of the stairs, after Ciri killed Bonhart and Geralt Vilgefortz), how does Ciri call Yen exactly in the Polish original?

From what I remember(and I read it some time ago) it's "mamusiu" ('mommy' in English)
 
From what I remember(and I read it some time ago) it's "mamusiu" ('mommy' in English)

Yeah, what I thought. It's "Mamilein" in German, the direct translation of "mommy" and "mamusiu". :)

But while we're already at it: how does Yen call Ciri repeatedly in BoE in the Polish original? It's translated differently in the German and English version. In the German version it's "Eulchen" ("owlette") while it's something else in English.
 
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Geralt is TERRIBLE at relationships, esp with women He hurt not only Triss. But also Essi, Fringilla....

Well, you are right, he hurt many women, but I don't and never will feel sorry for Fringilla. She played with Geralts feelings, only delaying him from finding Yen and Ciri. I'm actually happy he lied to her about the location of Vilgefortz and that he left her. She was only lying and playing with him, its her fault she fell in love with him... :p

BTW could you please quote the part from the books when Geralt slept with Essi? I somehow missed it and always thought he didn't sleep with her...
 
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