Vrihedd Sappers

[pngpl]

Vrihedd Sappers

Hello guys.
First of all I should congratulate the developers for being awesome.
Now let's get to the point.

Although you recognized this card was not so good and changed it, I fell these changes were on the wrong direction. Here are my two complaints about it:

1) It kills variety

Vrihedd Sappers is now an 8 strength card which remains hidden for two turns. There's also an other 8 strength card called Vrihedd Brigade that has no ability.
The problem is that now the latter is completely overshadowed by the Sappers card. Vrihedd brigade is a card that was rarely played anyway, but now with this change there is not a single reason to use it.

2) Identity problem(?)

The same complain i would also make for Kaedweni Siege Support card. It has an ability that someone would expect from a medic or a healer, not someone whose expertise is to bring down castles.

If i am not mistaken sappers were supposed to build fortifications, create obstacles for the enemy, or clear the path for their army. Now with 8 strength are more like heavy infantry who can beat the redanian "elites", blue stripe commandos, 3 divisions of PFI, heavy cavalry etc etc... With sappers like that it should be NR that is hiding in the forest not ST.

Sappers should provide utility not raw power.

To sum it up: Just like the siege support card, their abilities do not fit their role.

3) My suggestion:

Completely rework this card. Instead of providing raw power, sappers could be used to "booby trap" the battlefield.

Nerf their strength to the ground and give them an ability like this:

"Play a random ambush card from your deck" , or give them a "unique" ambush card that can be played using them (Just like some cards spawn neophytes, sappers could spawn a weak ambush card). I'd like to hear your suggestions in this matter.

That way sappers would have an ability that "fits their role" while making them a useful card that is played in ambush decks, and at the same time they would be "unique".

What do you think?

*Sorry not a talented writer in english, hope my post is easy to read.



[h=1][/h] [h=1][/h]

 

[frbfree]

I actually kinda love the change to Sappers. It sounds like you have less objection with the card and more of an objection with the name. It would defeat the purpose of an ambush card, if the opponent knew what ambush card you were playing. So having them played face up and putting an ambush card into play is silly, since people would know what it was. They won't play a random ambush card, because I highly doubt anyone wants ST to thin any quicker. (except ST players) It would also mean that Fireball Trap would be the only Loyal Bronze ambush. There simply wouldn't be enough in the deck to make a pulling ability work.

The Sappers 8 Strength makes an all ambush deck playable, where before you had to play dragoons if you wanted to really play with ambush creatures. I think it's better than fine. But if you want to change the name, I guess it wouldn't bother me.

 

[Archpriest]

Just to cut the what sappers are supposed to do "stuff" - Medieval sappers were digging tunnels and bringing walls, building down. So, 2 turns unrevealed fits perfectly

About your suggestions:
1. FireBall is there already. So... no.
2. Playing an ambush card from your deck would signal:
a. you played a sapper
b. this isn't Toruviel, Ciaran or Shirru
c. you played another ambush card.
That's a clear "no".

I like the way the card works now, finally something interesting for Scoia instead of killing the faction's uniqueness.

 

[pngpl]

Actually to rephrase what i proposed, is to make sappers play as an elven mercenary but for ambush cards( as the devs said they plan to add more of them), not to place them as an ambush card that calls an ambush card but anyway...
I do not consider it a bad card itself but I do not like that it overshadows completely another card (that i never played anyway) and the current ability it has would be more fitting for another bronze card which could be created in the future.

It is not a balance issue but more of an issue of "design choice", if it can be called that way.

Off course that is only my opinion.

Edit : Yes as frbree said that would thin the deck of ST and i understand that this maybe should not happen, and yes you are again correct that if they do not play a random card, this card would be too predictable and therefore useless. So yes I would prefer to give the current ability to a new card and find the sappers a more fitting role, which could be completely different for what i proposed. But again, I do not have a balance issue.

 

[Archpriest]

The design is fine as well, imo.

 

[pngpl]

The design is fine as well, imo.

It is fine but not perfect because there's the first issue that was overlooked and although it's importance is trivial, I think it needs to be resolved.

Let's say we let sappers as they are. I am okay with that honestly.

We have two different bronze cards:

Sappers and Vrihedd Brigade. They have both the same strength but Sappers have an extra ability. Right now there is absolutely no reason to use Vrihedd Brigade under any circumstances.

What is the point of having two choices if only one of them is practically useful?

This card renders useless another card, you cannot call that "good".

And to avoid any misunderstandings I am not complaining about the game I really enjoy playing it.

It is just a small detail that I think it should be corrected, although I feel I have pressed for it for too long.

 

[KasumiGoto]

It is fine but not perfect because there's the first issue that was overlooked and although it's importance is trivial, I think it needs to be resolved.

Let's say we let sappers as they are. I am okay with that honestly.

We have two different bronze cards:

Sappers and Vrihedd Brigade. They have both the same strength but Sappers have an extra ability. Right now there is absolutely no reason to use Vrihedd Brigade under any circumstances.

What is the point of having two choices if only one of them is practically useful?

This card renders useless another card, you cannot call that "good".

And to avoid any misunderstandings I am not complaining about the game I really enjoy playing it.

It is just a small detail that I think it should be corrected, although I feel I have pressed for it for too long.

I'm guessing it's because if you and your enemy have both 0 cards in round 3, Sapper is a dead draw since it won't reveal itself.

 

[Tamacountry13]

There's a time and place to use it because it doesn't give you instant value.
If you both have 5 cards and your opponent has 5 more points then you, If you play the Sappers your forced to play another card to win the round.
This isn't the case with Vriheed Brigade