Let's talk about narrative, choice & consequences [SPOILERS]

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Let's skip for a moment all the bugs and crashes, how the AI is so stupid that it makes all the different builds just flavour and not real strategies, how the game behaves like a looter shooter that forces you to dress as a clown to get proper stats (devs said they were aware of this but apparently they forgot while making the game), all the exploits, how un-interactive the (beautiful) city is, the fact CDPR literally threw shit on console gamers (there's no other word to define the base consoles versions) and whatnot. We feared this was coming as soon as we saw the 2018 demo after playing the witcher 3, so we had the antibodies.

What really hurts is what comes totally unexpected. TW3 had similar problems, but its excellence in the narrative made us enthusiastic about the game. Choice and consequences (C&C) were not that big (in particular if compared with W2) but significant and had those short videos that explained the results. It required a lot of suspension of disbelief when doing side quests instead of looking for Ciri, and not helping an NPC only led to missing the opportunity to do some content. But everything was written so well that we closed an eye or two.

Does this sound familiar to a recent game?

Now, the real problems here are that cyberpunk was advertised as a shorter game but with significant choices that lead to completely different playthroughs, and its narrative (in particular for side missions) is not as good as W3's.

The main quest is very short for an RPG. It lasts 27 missions, and if you take away all those where you just talk or braindance you get maybe 15 missions. The plot is nice, it has some nice set pieces, endings are interesting because they force you to choose how to die (except the fact that you become a legend only if you surrender to johnny and let him do the job, and that misty tells you the corpo/mikoshi ending is bad while it's the only one that gives you the hope to get a body again) BUT it's extremely linear and all side quests do not change it at all except for the last mission. It was not what they sold us during the awful marketing campaign and the maelstrom mission remains unmet throughout the whole game. I still haven't found any consequence to spare sasquatch, ADAM SMASHER (the game ends as soon as soon as you defeat him!!!), helping the netwatch agent only leads to bad results (even if he says you'll meet again, cut content?), you spare oda and you'll get only a couple of dialogue lines...

Lifepaths are extremely short (maybe 20 minutes each?) and what you have left with are few dialogue options for the flavour which have no effect in the main quest and just a little in few side quests.

You can do all the romances with no differences except for the fact you get a sex scene if you have the right "gender" requirements, otherwise "let's just be friends". Which is fine, but we want something more from a game that promises C&C. Give us some unique quests or events, give us something!

On the other hand, if you don't help the NPCs at all (which is still a choice!) you don't get anything. This can be fine to some extent, but it's not fine when it comes to the relationship with Johnny. That goddamn engram is killing you and the game itself warns you that it will change your personality. I think the most logical thing is to ignore him as much as possible and take those pills every time he is talking (and you can't except for scripted moments). BUT NO. First time he appears he wants to kill you, second time he wants to be your best friend, he's changed his mind "because reasons". And he does want to become your friend, as you can see in ALL the endings, even if you ignore him throughout the whole game.
So if, for some reason, you decide to listen to the cancer in your brain and become best buddies, you get the rogue ending and her questline, Kerry's questline, the secret ending, and all johnny's gear. If you ignore him, you don't get anything. GIVE ME SOMETHING, I'M ROLE-PLAYING! Change the story, even just the final mission or a specific ending or questline, stop him for intervening in dialogues, I don't know, bt not just a couple of dialogue lines. Make the game reactive to my choices. Give me consequences that are not just "oh, I guess you won't play this chunk of the game and get nothing else in exchange". "Role-playing game first and foremost", CDPR said that millions of times, but we got a goddamn looter shooter with dialogues.

And then we have the usual problem of a game bloated with side content that you shouldn't do for any reason according to the main quest, absolutely not intertwined with it. Also, the narrative of this content is very basic and not comparable to W3's side quests. Some topics are interesting and very cyberpunk, but all you have are a couple of shards to read for each event. Cyberpsychos are not even close to W3's hunts in terms of narrative, while basically the same concept. The blue "random" events are totally useless.

Of all the problems the game has, narrative and C&C are the ones that really prevent it to be liked by customers. CDPR can fix loot, bugs and crashes, interactivity (maybe AI?), but it's too late to change story and C&C if not minor and superfluous things.
 
It has been mentioned the umpteenth time in this forum. The missing features, no consequences lifepath or decision in mission (only a few countable when TW3 has a ton more) are mind boggling. I trusted CDPR and pre-ordered for the "immersive" open world RPG they advertised.

Now I've learnt my lesson.
 
All I ever wanted when I played was 2 things, and I was willing to do whatever it takes:
1. Get rid of Johnny and his nagging
2. Survive

Both impossible in this visual novel.
Its honestly all smokes and mirrors.
Illusion of options having a impact as youre actually on rails looting and shooting towards the tragic end that you cant stop.
 
I think it would have been better if CDPR told us from the start that just like in a book we have no choices. And for the story we will make no impact in the long run.
Because yeah, I think the game is great in so many ways but the narrative? You're just coming along for the ride and have no saying in anything. Johnny is the winner and V is the loser. Maybe they should have made us play as Johnny instead for most of the time because the game is about him. V is just the fluff.

I've been told that this is totally Cyberpunk though, that the lead character always dies. Can't say I agree and I'm a big fan of the setting.

I guess CDPR wanted their own variation of a dark and depressing ending. To tell players that hey, everything will go down the drain in the end. Get used to it.

I just wish they had been upfront about this from the start that there is no hope and no future. Only death. Fitting for 2020 I guess.
 
I think it would have been better if CDPR told us from the start that just like in a book we have no choices. And for the story we will make no impact in the long run.
Because yeah, I think the game is great in so many ways but the narrative? You're just coming along for the ride and have no saying in anything. Johnny is the winner and V is the loser. Maybe they should have made us play as Johnny instead for most of the time because the game is about him. V is just the fluff.

I've been told that this is totally Cyberpunk though, that the lead character always dies. Can't say I agree and I'm a big fan of the setting.

I guess CDPR wanted their own variation of a dark and depressing ending. To tell players that hey, everything will go down the drain in the end. Get used to it.

I just wish they had been upfront about this from the start that there is no hope and no future. Only death. Fitting for 2020 I guess.

Wait, nope, at this point, have. And basicly 2 choices and BOTH hard choices what ll change your future in - maybe - DLCs, sequences, etc.
 
Wait, nope, at this point, have. And basicly 2 choices and BOTH hard choices what ll change your future in - maybe - DLCs, sequences, etc.

Can't see any kind of DLC or expansion that happens after the ending with V. If anything it's more likely about another character. Or Johnny in V's body. But then you basically have a new character because Johnny has a set personality that differs from V's.
 
Can't see any kind of DLC or expansion that happens after the ending with V. If anything it's more likely about another character. Or Johnny in V's body. But then you basically have a new character because Johnny has a set personality that differs from V's.

Top secret on tag, dont read if u dont finish all endings:

V with another body (have a ending point to this).
 
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