Why are barrels so useless

[VoodooX]

Why are barrels so useless

First off - I love Witcher and gwent and I wan't to see this game be as great as possible. But I have some questions about the barrel mechanic and the direction of the game in general. I get that this is a "FREE" to play game, and and microtransactions are needed to sustain it. So far I haven't bought a single barrel(keg, whatever people call them) for real money, so I wonder are they as useless in terms of getting decent cards as the ones I buy for in game currency? If so what's the point of this, just put a price on the game of 20-30$ and be done with it, or at least make the barrel mechanic worth it or even let us just buy scraps for real money and craft the cards we really want to use. (and for all that is good on this earth shut that stupid troll up or at least make a sound slider just for him - he is annoying as hell)

 

[4RM3D]

VoodooX

Hi and welcome to the forums.

The kegs bought with money are the same as the ones you get as a reward.

The F2P / P2W discussion is one of the most popular ones spreading over countless threads, ranging from players that think the game is P2W to players that actually think the game is not P2W enough.

I'll give a quick summary:

1) F2P is a business model applied to a variety of games; some successful, some not so much. Turning the game into yet another B2P (buy to play) isn't the solution. So no, you can't "just be done with it", especially with collectible games.
2) Free kegs should have the same content as paid kegs because you don't want the game to become P2W. That's why the suggestion in this thread is actually a bad idea.
3) Even with the sup-par drops, there are still reasons why you want to buy kegs, as explained in this thread.
4) The mother lode of discussion takes place in this thread that questions whether or not Gwent is pay to win. This post gives a quick explanation of the situation.
5) Not related, but still good to know. Take a look at the forum index for some more interesting threads.

I'll leave this thread be for now and see if it actually goes anywhere. If not, I might merge or close it later.

 

[supafreaky]

well that pretty much covered everything....... although buying kegs is pretty much buying scraps, with the potential of getting a keeper in there.

 

[Flowneppets]

Yea buying kegs is like buying scraps once you have a halfway complete set of bronzes. Each keg equals a minimum of 35 scrap value. The average is higher tho due to rares, epics and legendaries drops. Even if you have super bad luck and get nothing particularely useful out of a 60 pack you can craft about 3 legendaries from the scraps.

 

[Flood31]

I agree with 4RM3D. RNG plays a big part of any game that has collectibles like Gwent, Hearthstone or TES:L. If we all got the cards we wanted then the game would die out rather quickly as you wouldn't need to play it to finish colelcting the cards you wanted. I have purchased many a pack in HS and got naff all cards that I got rid of and used the mats from them to make the cards I wanted but I have still got free packs and got some nice legendary cards in there (Ragnaros, yummy!).

Buying kegs is good as not only does it help sustain the game but the milled cards will allow you to make the cards you wanted.

 

[X_Blaze_X]

I also agree buying kegs RNG is vitally important .

IMO CDPR have kind of shot themself in the foot by making ore and scraps to readily accessible.

Also IMO 2 things i would like to is is they lower the rewards of ore and scrap and limit crafting to only common cards.

I feel this will renew the incentive to actually buy packs,
make rarity actually mean something again
and make this a "collectable" game again and not ... a "LOL i'm just going craft whatever deck I want game."

fyi.. also not responding to any pro-ftp attack comments to this suggestion.,

 

[supafreaky]

I don't really think they shot themselves in the foot. Sure, ore and scraps are readily available, but if you want to play more than a single style, with a single faction, it costs a LOT of scraps. I started with a weather deck but I felt it was kinda cheap so I switched to consume. That means I have to change up my gold and silvers. 800 scraps per gold card takes a long to time to gather is you don't spend cash. Now imagine how many you need if you want decent decks in several factions? CDPR are probably going to do just fine.

 

[X_Blaze_X]

I don't really think they shot themselves in the foot. Sure, ore and scraps are readily available, but if you want to play more than a single style, with a single faction, it costs a LOT of scraps. I started with a weather deck but I felt it was kinda cheap so I switched to consume. That means I have to change up my gold and silvers. 800 scraps per gold card takes a long to time to gather is you don't spend cash. Now imagine how many you need if you want decent decks in several factions? CDPR are probably going to do just fine.

i have never milled ( even nilf i wont makes a deck out of that but i felt like milling them just out of spite ) i have used all factions in competition at one point ( again except nilf) nor have i spent any of my ore ... i am doing exceedingly well for the time I have spent in this game (81 hours now according to gog)

for more detail regarding this please view my personal thread . I will be updating it again closer to ob release date ...whenever that is.

 

[VoodooX]

I see how you wouldn't want the game to be pay to win but I just get infuriated when opening 10 kegs in a row gives me at best a couple of silver cards I already crafted just a few minutes ago so I get even more infuriated with that. I opened a tonn of kegs and not a single leader card dropped( probably over 40 kegs from the time I started playing gwent every day). Sure I got a lot of cool gold cards(4-5 at most from all of theese kegs) but half of them I scraped to craft the actuall cards I would use. So I still think geting scraps should be at least faster(don't get me wrong I would love to buy a load of kegs even for my own money but If they behave the same way then there is no point for me in doing it just out of a simple statistical analysis)

 

[Flowneppets]

At the current size of the collection and my experience from opening quite a few kegs i would estimate that you have to go through 4-500 kegs for a complete collection, keeping in mind that returns are diminishing the more cards you already posess, meaning the most progress comes from opening around the first 200 kegs. When i have to reopen my kegs for OB i will share my results.

 

[zambasshik]

Compare this to the giants. MTG. Packs are cheaper, free, and allow you create any card for free. Gwent wins here. Hearthstone. Similar crafting potential, but decreased cost of crafting AND the choice of your last card. Gwent wins again by a landslide. I think its pretty balanced between the f2p and the pay lead

 

[Tir_na_Lia]

I don't think the devs shot themselves in the foot at all, actually they are applying an effective "competitive approach" to their decisions, based upon the terms offered by other CCG like Magic and HS.

If you do not like card games in general, you won't become interested in Gwent regardless the playstyle or F2P conditions.
But if you are a card game player, you'll very soon draw comparisons between Gwent and other popular similar games, and as soon as you do, you'll realize these conditions are better and Gwent "is better".
I have seen countless threads where once the above comparison is done, basically the discussion ends.

I remember this "business model" from when I studied macroeconomics at the university, it's pretty effective as long as the awareness among the customers is high and communication runs fast and reaches most of them.
Instead on just focusing upon quality, you mainly compete by "setting the bar" above your competitors.
I'm not surprised, Witcher 3 was created with a similar idea in mind...aside from being a successful game, the DLC are both cheaper and more enjoyable than most games' DLC in general, so everytime you draw a comparison you'll feel you have not been cheated, scammed, or moneygrabbed.

And they build this "credit of trust" which gives them a good reputation and keeps their customers satisfied and willing to support CDPR in the future.
I hope this post does not sound like a criticism, I actually like some who makes a successful business without disappointing the fans .

Kinda derailed, sorry, I was lost on my uni reminiscence.

 

[lunatyyk]

Guys what is the ratio for Legendary/kegs? Ive bought 60 kegs and got 1.... 1 freaking legendary is that normal? I mean this is very very low number. I know rng and stuff but paying 80 bucks for 1 legendary and bunch of cards that give little scraps is unrewarding.

 

[Flowneppets]

Guys what is the ratio for Legendary/kegs? Ive bought 60 kegs and got 1.... 1 freaking legendary is that normal? I mean this is very very low number. I know rng and stuff but paying 80 bucks for 1 legendary and bunch of cards that give little scraps is unrewarding.

That sounds very unfortunate. Afaik you should get one every 20 kegs or so on average.

 

[metalmaniac21]

Guys what is the ratio for Legendary/kegs? Ive bought 60 kegs and got 1.... 1 freaking legendary is that normal? I mean this is very very low number. I know rng and stuff but paying 80 bucks for 1 legendary and bunch of cards that give little scraps is unrewarding.

AFAIK it's 3% to get a legendary from a keg. And nothing like pity timer in Hearthstone (1 legendary every 40 packs 100%) seems to present in Gwent so far. Anyway, epics are more likely to be in kegs, so it's better to unkeg them and collect scraps to craft much needed legendary.

 

[MrWhiteMale]

AFAIK it's 3% to get a legendary from a keg. And nothing like pity timer in Hearthstone (1 legendary every 40 packs 100%) seems to present in Gwent so far. Anyway, epics are more likely to be in kegs, so it's better to unkeg them and collect scraps to craft much needed legendary.

In 2016 I had some stats: Legendary 6.8%, 1 per 15 kegs avg; Epic 25.5%, 1 per 4 kegs, Rare 103%. That was the beginning of the closed beta.
In January 2017 it was about 4%,30%,102.5%.
I dont count leggendries anymore, but it seems like latest drop rates are about 1.5-2.0 times lower for legendaries than it was in the beginning, and epics dont drop every 3-4 kegs, usually every 6-8 kegs.
I guess newest drop rates are 2-3% legendaries, 10-15% epics (definitely dont goes above 15% in latest kegs), 102.5% rares.

 

[VoodooX]

Wow that's a lot of replies - a big thank you to all who replied, really helping me out here. But I am concerned about the wipe, when all the decent cards I got just dissapear I may drop the game. I won't be able to play as much and get more scraps faster to craft and buying kegs will get me the same bad or useless cards. I really don't feel like wasting a month or two on grinding for scraps that much.