I'm not into it

[Nevver_]

This is my initial reaction so take it with a grain of salt...

One of the things I loved about this game is that it wasn't terribly complicated and I didn't have to spend much time with a spreadsheet analyzing the mechaics of the game. For example, why was the DPS figure trashed? Why do I now have to calculate this shit myself? And armor/clothes? Okay, you updated it but... wtf? And, yeah, before anyone chimes in, I DID start a fresh playthrough.

Look, I have spent A LOT of time playing this game and definitely got my money's worth, but it's no longer the same game that I enjoyed.

That's all. I'm not going to bitch and rant, more thann I already have in this post, but what the fuck?

Post automatically merged: Sep 22, 2023

I. Fucking. Hate. This. Update.

 

[Tokenn77]

The DPS was a nice simple way to compare weapons, although it sometimes misled. IMO, now just look at the weapon stats and see how much red there is on the 5 lines describing the weapon. The more red, the more inferior the weapon, esp as regards damage.

You don't say how early you are in the game...armour is mostly cyberware now, so check out what's available at ripperdocs. You can buy or otherwise acquire actual armour vests and the like, although they are pretty weak in the early game. Still, a vest with a 5 rating increases your overall armour number by good percentage. Presumably these numbers improve as you progress. I'm more interested in whether clothing has other useful properties...reducing fall damage, quickhack cooldown and etc.

 

[vonkarolinas]

Tokenn nailed it. People rely waaaaaay too much on dps. DPS isn't overall damage.

 

[Ironymaiden]

Playing on the Easy difficulty is always an option. No need trying to pad your ego or prove something. You're also just wrong about the complexity. The game is much less complicated and more streamilned than ever before now. Crafting is much simpler, perk tree is more intuitive, weapons don't secretly scale with levels, etc. It's just that you got too used to the old systems and now are lazy to learn a big chunk of new information. But in denying that, you're missing out on a lot of fun. Embrace changes and move on.

 

[caracal555]

The game is much less complicated and more streamilned than ever before now. Crafting is much simpler, perk tree is more intuitive, weapons don't secretly scale with levels, etc.

That is not a good thing. They streamlined too much for the sake of streamlining. Because I think the designers of 2.0 lost perspective of what players want. What keeps players playing a game is depth and complexity.

For example siftin through lare amounts of loot after a gunfight, that was a good thing. A player could choose to only do a quick check or check every corpse. That was "streamlined" because the devs thought it would distract from the main game. However what is the main game? For me the choice of spending more time looting is an important part of the main game.

I think in general the devs think that players care about the complex cutscenes with idris elba and keanu over anything else. However 99% of the gameplay time (especially after beating the main quest) is the systemic gameplay.

 

[LeKill3rFou]

That is not a good thing. They streamlined too much for the sake of streamlining. Because I think the designers of 2.0 lost perspective of what players want.

Ok, you weren't there on the forum since release I assume...
Pretty much everything they added/changed in this update were things quite heavily requested... I quote : "Perks are meaningless, crafting is annoying, leveled items are bad, NCPD is the worst and so on".
So no, even if I'm not pleased with everything, CDPR rather listen what people wanted and asked

 

[caracal555]

Ok, you weren't there on the forum since release I assume...
Pretty much everything they added/changed in this update were things quite heavily requested... I quote : "Perks are meaningless, crafting is annoying, leveled items are bad, NCPD is the worst and so on".
So no, even if I'm not pleased with everything, CDPR rather listen what people wanted and asked

However what if they only listened to the people who complained on the forum? I think there was a quiet majority of players who may have liked a specific feature whose feedback they never read, because people tend to post more about stuff they don't like.
For example perks are 80% gamey filler. Especially in 2.0 One of the big perks for using machineguns is that your gun fires faster as you lose stamina:

I play this game as a tactical shooter with using cover. and the LAST thing I would want is the realistic difficulty of using a heavy weapon like a machine gun to have its drawbacks being removed AND making the gun shoot faster. It's lik the devs took everything that makes a weapon system engaging and fun, then BORDERLANDIZED it by designing the perk tree so that all fun of using these weapons is progressively removed the more you level it.

Now I am stuck with avoiding the body skill tree because I like using shotguns and lmgs, because I dont want my gun to shoot faster the longer I fire or ammo to be magically refilled after a kill.

What keeps cyberpunk fun is the core of realism behind all the cyber stuff. Realistic car driving, guns, taking cover in gunfights. And that perk tree appears to turn it into witcher 3.

 

[LeKill3rFou]

However what if they only listened to the people who complained on the forum? I think there was a quiet majority of players who may have liked a specific feature whose feedback they never read, because people tend to post more about stuff they don't like.
For example perks are 80% gamey filler. Especially in 2.0 One of the big perks for using machineguns is that your gun fires faster as you lose stamina:
View attachment 11363065

I play this game as a tactical shooter with using cover. and the LAST thing I would want is the realistic difficulty of using a heavy weapon like a machine gun to have its drawbacks being removed AND making the gun shoot faster. It's lik the devs took everything that makes a weapon system engaging and fun, then BORDERLANDIZED it by designing the perk tree so that all fun of using these weapons is progressively removed the more you level it.

Now I am stuck with avoiding the body skill tree because I like using shotguns and lmgs, because I dont want my gun to shoot faster the longer I fire or ammo to be magically refilled after a kill.

What keeps cyberpunk fun is the core of realism behind all the cyber stuff. Realistic car driving, guns, taking cover in gunfights. And that perk tree appears to turn it into witcher 3.

In fact, I didn't play in 2.0 yet, I don't have any opinion about the changes for now... So I won't argue about how good or bad the changes are
I always play as stealth gun/netrunner and as far as I understood, it no longer possible. I'll see soon enough.

But saying CDPR didn't listen players, is not true, knwoning most of what they changed were frenquently requested.

 

[warlock75]

However what if they only listened to the people who complained on the forum? I think there was a quiet majority of players who may have liked a specific feature whose feedback they never read, because people tend to post more about stuff they don't like.
For example perks are 80% gamey filler. Especially in 2.0 One of the big perks for using machineguns is that your gun fires faster as you lose stamina:
View attachment 11363065

I play this game as a tactical shooter with using cover. and the LAST thing I would want is the realistic difficulty of using a heavy weapon like a machine gun to have its drawbacks being removed AND making the gun shoot faster. It's lik the devs took everything that makes a weapon system engaging and fun, then BORDERLANDIZED it by designing the perk tree so that all fun of using these weapons is progressively removed the more you level it.

Now I am stuck with avoiding the body skill tree because I like using shotguns and lmgs, because I dont want my gun to shoot faster the longer I fire or ammo to be magically refilled after a kill.

What keeps cyberpunk fun is the core of realism behind all the cyber stuff. Realistic car driving, guns, taking cover in gunfights. And that perk tree appears to turn it into witcher 3.

This is entirely how I feel about the new system, it removes the realism and makes it too 'gamey'. How the hell does my gun fire faster, and I stop it bucking around, when I'm getting tired? That's just the example given, but there are so many of these things that don't 'feel' right to me. Make the perks at least understandable in real world terms, this isn't a fantasy game where you can handwave things because 'magic', it's more grounded in reality. Or should be.

 

[Ironymaiden]

However what if they only listened to the people who complained on the forum? I think there was a quiet majority of players who may have liked a specific feature whose feedback they never read, because people tend to post more about stuff they don't like.
For example perks are 80% gamey filler. Especially in 2.0 One of the big perks for using machineguns is that your gun fires faster as you lose stamina:
View attachment 11363065

I play this game as a tactical shooter with using cover. and the LAST thing I would want is the realistic difficulty of using a heavy weapon like a machine gun to have its drawbacks being removed AND making the gun shoot faster. It's lik the devs took everything that makes a weapon system engaging and fun, then BORDERLANDIZED it by designing the perk tree so that all fun of using these weapons is progressively removed the more you level it.

Now I am stuck with avoiding the body skill tree because I like using shotguns and lmgs, because I dont want my gun to shoot faster the longer I fire or ammo to be magically refilled after a kill.

What keeps cyberpunk fun is the core of realism behind all the cyber stuff. Realistic car driving, guns, taking cover in gunfights. And that perk tree appears to turn it into witcher 3.

"i play this game as a tactical shooter" well, there you go. How is that the fault of the game developers? You are trying to play the game at your own definition of fun and complain that it isn't working. It's just naturally not feasible for every game, especially for a game like Cyberpunk 2077. Because it's not realistic, despite what you believe. This world is to its core based on a techno-magical fantasy. How does the LMG increase its firerate as your stamina goes down? Oh i don't know, maybe it connects to your Biomonitor through your Ballistic Coprocessor and increases the firerate according to your thought process and adrenaline levels. And why does it do it? For fun, because you're an Edgerunner; style over substance, baby. Who gives a fuck what is a fictional explanation for a game mechanic in a fictional techo-magical futuristic game, where you can stare at people and their head explodes in a firework of sparks? The main thing important for a game mechanic is if it's interesting, fun to use and think about.

 

[Stuart_Renton]

The whole stats for the weapons is annoying, I preferred the DPS single stat before 2.0

 

[cammoking123]

However what if they only listened to the people who complained on the forum? I think there was a quiet majority of players who may have liked a specific feature whose feedback they never read, because people tend to post more about stuff they don't like.
For example perks are 80% gamey filler. Especially in 2.0 One of the big perks for using machineguns is that your gun fires faster as you lose stamina:
View attachment 11363065

I play this game as a tactical shooter with using cover. and the LAST thing I would want is the realistic difficulty of using a heavy weapon like a machine gun to have its drawbacks being removed AND making the gun shoot faster. It's lik the devs took everything that makes a weapon system engaging and fun, then BORDERLANDIZED it by designing the perk tree so that all fun of using these weapons is progressively removed the more you level it.

Now I am stuck with avoiding the body skill tree because I like using shotguns and lmgs, because I dont want my gun to shoot faster the longer I fire or ammo to be magically refilled after a kill.

What keeps cyberpunk fun is the core of realism behind all the cyber stuff. Realistic car driving, guns, taking cover in gunfights. And that perk tree appears to turn it into witcher 3.

I don't even think they make tactical shooters anymore. Do they? The last one I remember playing was SOCOM on the PS2. It's an extremly niche genre. I don't know what to tell you. I think you're just playing the wrong game if that's what you're looking for. When it comes to combat, Cyberpunk is a fast-paced action game through and through. They can change a lot of things, but they're not changing the games very genre.

 

[-Nailes-]

But saying CDPR didn't listen players, is not true, knwoning most of what they changed were frenquently requested.

I know that many people complained that there were too many grenades, I expected them to remove some of those. Not remove all and create a 'pocket grenade factory'.

I agreed that there were to many and only ever carried 4-5. I left some in my stash and dissablembed the rest. Appearantly now I carry unlimited grenades, just wait for the production line to give you another.

"i play this game as a tactical shooter" well, there you go. How is that the fault of the game developers? You are trying to play the game at your own definition of fun and complain that it isn't working. It's just naturally not feasible for every game, especially for a game like Cyberpunk 2077. Because it's not realistic, despite what you believe. This world is to its core based on a techno-magical fantasy. How does the LMG increase its firerate as your stamina goes down? Oh i don't know, maybe it connects to your Biomonitor through your Ballistic Coprocessor and increases the firerate according to your thought process and adrenaline levels. And why does it do it? For fun, because you're an Edgerunner; style over substance, baby. Who gives a fuck what is a fictional explanation for a game mechanic in a fictional techo-magical futuristic game, where you can stare at people and their head explodes in a firework of sparks? The main thing important for a game mechanic is if it's interesting, fun to use and think about.

He is playing the game he was given 3 years ago. It worked just fine and now feels completely different to what it was. Its a valid complaint. The game developers changed the game or the definition that made it work for him.

Cyberpunk is dark and dystopian. Its the future you dont really want to be in. Night City is an amazing to drive around in game, but in the back of my mind always remind myself that I would never go there if this city was real. Because its one step away from hell.
Making it a magical fantasy ruins that because its isnt. Because it changes the experience.

There is a certain 'suspension of disbelief', I can accept cybernetics(we are close to those irl) and the like. Things have to be believable within a world. 'pocket grenade factories' or staminaloss for firing guns and what not just dont work. The guns in the game are modelled along a realistic logical model and now been turned into what you reffered to as techno-magical fantasy. magic is great and believable in a world like Skyrim, but doesnt belong in Cp2077.

 

[LeKill3rFou]

I know that many people complained that there were too many grenades, I expected them to remove some of those. Not remove all and create a 'pocket grenade factory'.

I agreed that there were to many and only ever carried 4-5. I left some in my stash and dissablembed the rest. Appearantly now I carry unlimited grenades, just wait for the production line to give you another.

Like I said, I wouldn't argue about how good or bad changes are, I didn't play myself yet and I won't until Phantom Liberty release
I won't probably like everything they change anyway... My "usual" play style stealth/netrunner suppressed Overture is no longer possible if I understand... But it's a good reason to try something else.
I never played with sandi/blades, so I'll probably go for that and I'm pretty sure I'll have fun.

Beside, I'm mainly interested by Phantom Liberty than any changes they introduced in the 2.0. Changes are good, generally, but a whole new adventure in Night City... Damn nothing could prevent me to have fun for something I wait since almost 3 years

 

[gregski]

My "usual" play style stealth/netrunner suppressed Overture is no longer possible if I understand...

I would say it still is, it's a bit more demanding on the planning side, you need to be more careful and deliberate.

 

[MartineDee]

...

Holy shit! You've played this basically over 4x longer than me. Respect.

 

[Ironymaiden]

I know that many people complained that there were too many grenades, I expected them to remove some of those. Not remove all and create a 'pocket grenade factory'.

I agreed that there were to many and only ever carried 4-5. I left some in my stash and dissablembed the rest. Appearantly now I carry unlimited grenades, just wait for the production line to give you another.


He is playing the game he was given 3 years ago. It worked just fine and now feels completely different to what it was. Its a valid complaint. The game developers changed the game or the definition that made it work for him.

Cyberpunk is dark and dystopian. Its the future you dont really want to be in. Night City is an amazing to drive around in game, but in the back of my mind always remind myself that I would never go there if this city was real. Because its one step away from hell.
Making it a magical fantasy ruins that because its isnt. Because it changes the experience.

There is a certain 'suspension of disbelief', I can accept cybernetics(we are close to those irl) and the like. Things have to be believable within a world. 'pocket grenade factories' or staminaloss for firing guns and what not just dont work. The guns in the game are modelled along a realistic logical model and now been turned into what you reffered to as techno-magical fantasy. magic is great and believable in a world like Skyrim, but doesnt belong in Cp2077.

"Fantasy" isn't fireballs, or a desired reality. It's an idea, an imagination, a fictional reality you live through. It doesn have to be positive. You find yourself fascinated by all kinds of fantasies, positive, negative or neutral, plausible or implausible, and your own interpretation of them might influence you feelings and believes ablout them. You might believe that Cyberpunk is realistic, or at least plausible, but things you base it on are shaky at best. Sci-fi technology IS magic, because both operate on the basis of fantasy - an imagined idea.

"Suspention of disbelief" is something that is diffrerent for everyone. Sometimes you just lack imagination or knowledge. You say you can't believe in stamina loss when firing a gun, but have you ever shot from an LMG? I believe it's pretty heavy on your arms. And the weapons aren't modeled in a style of real guns becasue the game is trying to be realistic, but because a player needs to distinguish between weapons and cat toys.
The exact explanation for rechargeable grenades doesn't matter in this circumstance, because it's a videogame, that doesn't have to operate on real world logic, because it's trying to direct player feelings first. It might as well be a pocket grenade printer, or it's just videogame logic for picking them up from corpses. If Cyberpunk tried to be realistic at all possible points, it would be an unfun experience for the vast majority of players, and it would lose its identity all same, because it would be muddled in systems upon systems trying to approximate some definition of realism.

Your feelings about the game are valid, but those preconceptions are preventing your from having a fun and fresh experience. Open your mind just a little bit, and let it in.

 

[MartineDee]

What blows the most is going from uber powerful 1.63 literal NC deity to the new system and starting from scratch on top of that. That would blow on some level even if done fully voluntarily. This update, however, is nothing but voluntary for us who have been playing the previous game since the day one, and have mastered it.

From my angle, tho, there is one burning question: is the Dry Pass still there or not?

 

[LeKill3rFou]

I would say it still is, it's a bit more demanding on the planning side, you need to be more careful and deliberate.

Previously, a suppressed Overture was pretty much the only reliable stealth handgun, because if you didn't "one-hot" enemies, every other enemies were alerte, aware of your position and most often enter in combat right away. Meaning your stealth approach instantly failed.
But not sure I'll try, I really want to go on something new

 

[EMT-Fields]

Same here. I probably don't have the same amount of hours as you, but I think I have a significant amount. I personally don't like this update as well. But I already did everything, so I'll probably just move on. I hope the next game turns out better than this one. Hopefully being more of an actual RPG rather than an action adventure.