Suggestions how to make Viy not dumb

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I think we can all (90+%) agree that Viy is indeed the stupidest designed card in history of Gwent (and if not then please say your candidates for this infamous tittle, I'd love to hear them). The reason being that it's a very boring card, why? Well you are super limited with what you can use it for. You either build THAT ONE BRAINLESS DECK, OR it has absolutely no utility outside of it. And we all agree (I THINK) that that one deck of playing and consuming THE SAME CARD OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN is fairly dull (oh and for being so dull I should also mention that it GIVES A STUPENDOUS AMOUNT OF POINTS!!! ).
I am of the opinion that thinking of a much smarter and more interesting card design would be a very easy task that any average person (capable of at least creating a forum account) should be able to do. Let's put my theory to the test in this thread. :)

Here people can suggest their own design of Viy, how would have YOU made this card work to add to the MO deck variety.

I will suggest 2 of my ideas below. :)

Viy (11P).png

Now I think this is a much more interesting design and it gives MO some removal potential since it could also consume enemy units! You can boost it up so it can consume a higher unit and opponent can damage it to bring it's consumption ceiling down. If the opponent doesn't interfere with it in 1 turn, it's order ability could for example take out an average 7 power defender while gaining his points resulting in a 14 point swing plus no more defender. It also gives the opponent the opportunity to counter it with damage and then you can boost it back up maybe... BUT it can't simply be locked by a cheap 4 power NG lock for example cause it has Veil and it can't be poisoned too which allows it's survivability to hold up to the fact that it's 11 provisions and goes tall thus is a prime target. Also lore-wise the main thing about Viy is THAT IT CANNOT BE SUBDUED AND IT CANNOT BE CONTROLLED.
Pretty stupid how this thing is just consume food in the game lol, when in fact IT IS THE ONE THAT SHOULD BE DOING THE CONSUMATION OF OTHERS!

Now I present to you another suggestion:
Viy MASTER.png


Now personally I think both of these represent a significant improvement over the Viy we currently have BUT I allow you fair reader to be the judge AND I encourage people to post here their own rework suggestions! :D Go wild (just not too wild lol)!

You don't need to use the card creator like I did, you can just use simple text to write a comment, I decided to go a step further cause I am kinda passionate about the game so I don't mind taking the time to make this extra effort. But if you want, you can do it here: https://gwentcard.online
And you can find a HD pic of Viy on the internet on google images to use. :)

PS: Okay my 2nd suggestion was a joke xD but the point is that the 1st suggestion allows a MUCH MUCH more dynamic use of the card, it's not one-dimensional like the one we actually have rn. I am fairly certain you could do many fun things with it.
 
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Guest 4375874

Guest
Easy....Remove it from the game.

Signed....A MO player :beer:


Any card that can't be interreacted with will be a problem for the game, any attempt to balance it will kill it because that's just the nature of the design. It's an unimaginative mechanic and unfortunately suggests the devs are too limited in what they think Monsters are capable of.
 
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My Vincent Meis would like to have a word with you. Jokes aside, I like this design, if nothing else just to put Viy in the driver seat (instead of being everybody's snack).
Well a lot of MO tall cards could fall prey to Vincent Meis lol, Golyath, Speartip Sleeping or not sleeping, Yighern... hell, even Viy in R3 when they play it as their last card so it stands there unboosted. :]
 
Easy....Remove it from the game.

Signed....A MO player :beer:


Any card that can't be interreacted with will be a problem for the game, any attempt to balance it will kill it because that's just the nature of the design. It's an unimaginative mechanic and unfortunately suggests the devs are too limited in what they think Monsters are capable of.
No need for completely removing it from the Game just move it to a different Faction like I suggested already in another Thread, but yeah sometimes you really think that the Devs are still stuck in the the open Beta Version when they create Cards like Viy or NG Highroll Cards where it was balanced back then around not having Leader or Consume charges available in the same turn you would play Viy or in the NG Highroll Case by only being able to target Silver or bronze Unit's.
Even if it's more of Meme, I wouldn't really consider Arnaghads interaction with Sukrus a healthy one and I'm also not really sure if Skellige desperately needed another Control tool like that. Considering that Viy is still problematic in combination with all the cheap consumes available to Monsters, I wouldn't mind if Viy and Arnaghad would switch skills. Both Skills kind of belonged to the other Faction during Open Beta anyway (Skellige Strengthening Mechanic) which would mean more support for selfwound and Hym while removing the problem that you can't interact with the Card because it get's instantly consumed and jumps back in the Deck, while for Monsters it was kind of the old Imlerith: Sabbath skill anyway (instead of getting Armor for damaged units he could get some Armor on Dominance or Devotion) I guess it would be mainly used as a additional support for Kelly Carapace Decks but additionally it would give Monsters a bit more Control without a possible non healthy Sukrus interaction.
 
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Well a lot of MO tall cards could fall prey to Vincent Meis lol, Golyath, Speartip Sleeping or not sleeping, Yighern... hell, even Viy in R3 when they play it as their last card so it stands there unboosted. :]
Oh, absolutely, but there's extra spice in setting your version of Viy to 1 power, especially because consuming 0-power units can be quite tricky.

On a more serious note, if the lore suggests Viy is that much uncontrollable (I never read the books or played any Witcher games, so I'll take everyone's word on it), I feel her ability should not be order-based, as that allows the player to set her off as desired. Maybe something more on the lines of Alzur, who's triggered by certain events on the board. I'll try to come up with a Viy model later on, regardless of how useful it might be.
 

Guest 4375874

Guest
No need for completely removing it from the Game just move it to a different Faction like I suggested already in another Thread, but yeah sometimes you really think that the Devs are still stuck in the the open Beta Version when they create Cards like Viy or NG Highroll Cards where it was balanced back then around not having Leader or Consume charges available in the same turn you would play Viy or in the NG Highroll Case by only being able to target Silver or bronze Unit's.
Moving it to another faction would kill it just the same since other factions don't have sure ways to destroy it, maybe SK could through self damage but I don't think they need more power. The sad thing is, they didn't give MO a witcher card so it would have nothing left. From the WOTW expansion Viy is the only card that sees any real play while the other factions have auto include cards both bronze and golds. Same thing happened with the previous one, frost is all but dead. It's like they don't know what to do with MO.
 

Guest 4375874

Guest
Ok so after giving it some thought, here's my suggestion. TBH I think Viy should either be removed or changed to a bronze card in which case it would be too similar to succubus. However you try to balance Viy it will either be really good or really bad because of how it's designed so I think it should just be removed.

This still feels a little strong, I had another idea but I felt this was the least overtuned but now If the opponent has last say then it plays for 12 and if you have living Armor in hand it also plays for 12. Those are situational but I'll still have to give it some thought.

Viy_Final.jpg
Viy__True_Form.png
 
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There are 3 issues with Viy:

- There's no point cap.
- The growth rate of 3 per consume turns every tutor into a card that gets far more value for its provision cost than normal.
- The opponent gets no chance to interact with Viy if played properly.

My solution to all of this is for Viy's growth function to become an order.

You could play Viy with tutors over and over to consume it for 7 points each time, or leave it on the board for a turn to get the 3 point base growth but risk a lock. More setup required to hide it behind a defender or keep purify cards on hand. It becomes a far more strategic card with lots of potential growth but more risk. Given how valuable a card it can become, I think some risk is necessary...

Most likely this will result in Viy being played behind a defender in R1 and raised to 10 or 13 points where it'll then stay for the remainder of the game. Still a very potent card, but not nearly as oppressive as it currently is.
 
I would just add a counter of 2 to Viy and decrease the amount of points it grows by to 2.

This would make it somewhat similar to Dettlaff: Higher Vampire.

Over 2 consumes it would give 7+9 points plus 11 points power Viy returning to the deck. So under normal circumstances it would play for 27 points for 14 provision (for comparison, the Haunt generates 16 points on its own for 14 provision - 4 points Desert Banshee + 2 points from its passive ability + 5 points Barghest + 5 points Nightwraith).

Detlaff plays for 15 points and costs 10 provision, but does not require tutors, only consumes and can be entirely utilized within one turn. Viy requires both and in this form usually 3 turns, so naturally should play for more points than Dettlaff. 15 vs. 27 points play and 10 vs. 14 provision cost.

Or:

Viy.png


As Viy was a huge creature, it should have significant power, and as it was immune to magic, it should have some sort of immunity (paradoxically though, cards with Immunity can still be removed by Curse of Corruption, which is a Spell). For 14 provision points we should expect a bit more than high power and immunity, hence the melee option, which again, gives significant point play, but exposes Viy to damage and other sorts of removal.
 
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