Cyberpsychosis and you: how should it be implemented?

[blank_redge]

Cyberpsychosis and you: how should it be implemented?

So, you wanna get that chrome, but don't wanna get all metal in the face, nahmean chombatta?

I like the idea of introducing cyberpsychosis in the game, but I'm not sure how that'll translate from PnP into a PC/console game.

If it's a stand-alone game, maybe what your character perceives / what's actually happening "flashes" back and forth, but I don't know how much that would affect the production schedule / if CDPR have the resources available for that.

In a co-op, the only thing I can think of is having certain dialogue restricted / special dialogue only avaiable to someone who's gone off the deep-end (if the game is dialogue-driven), and/or certain groups going auto-hostile towards you.

Thoughts?

 

[testsubject013]

simple dialogue and NPC reaction to the protagonist

 

[videopete]

Well, I think a good way to simulate cyberpsychosis is to take a page from Justice League Doom. Replace all of the characters with something that looks hosttile, including animations, strip the world down to wire frame, now you see the world as hostile and just different forms of data. Then throw in voices so your ability to judge the situation in rational manner is compromised. These are a few ideas.

 

[CadetSF]

Definitely a drastically different playthrough/reactions if you hit cyber-psychosis. A great example of just how different things can be would be the reactions and options an extremely low INT player would get while playing Fallout 1 and 2.

 

[hismastersvoice]

Whatever they choose to do, I'm afraid they'll have to make it pretty obvious you're on a psycho train. Like, it would obviously be cool if they could make a random NPC assault you on the street, forcing you to defend yourself, perhaps with lethal force, only for you to wake from this brief trip to find out the guy was just selling crab cakes on the corner and you sold him a Bigripp up the ribcage. Thing is, it would ruin the players ability to interact with the game world and ultimately make the game less enjoyable.

I like the wire-frame idea. It denotes clearly that the player is on a ride through hell, but at the same time gives the devs enough tools to try and fool the player into making bad choices.

 

[Sardukhar]

Ooooh! Good forum topic!

I'm not sure - you can do either changing dialogue options ( I love this one in it's many guises, because I love Vampire bloodlines and Planescape Torment and Fallout), as your Humanity drops OR you could do an altered world-view, maybe people reacting with more hostility or what-have you. Make it clear your are in a violent machine place. Or any combination of the two! Good fun.

Cyberpsychosis is actually a side-effect of what CP2020 calls Technoshock. It's part of a whole package of non-benign responses the human mind and psyche has to living in the suddenly-advanced 21st Century. It can be brought on by cyber, by drugs, by pre-existing mental conditions...you can go cyberpsycho or you might just drop into a fugue state while watching NN54.

We're arguably seeing some of this happen now - media saturation combined with the new virtual world of social networking is creating a new world view and sudden intimacy with things happening a long way away. Now you talk to the people there, read their thoughts and watch their videos.

Humans have utilized extra-somatic memory for years - when you put somethig in a book, that's what you are doing. Now we're storing large parts not only of our skills and memories outside ourselves, but even our personalities. We are become what we present, maybe more now than ever.

Cyberpsychosis is really what happens when you look in the mirror and what you see is so totallyat odds with what your mind says you should see that something snaps and everything that doesn't look like you think it should, becomes the enemy, the repugnant, wrong.

That's one way to look at it anyway.

 

[username_3641554]

I would make cyberpsychosis just like the PnP, altering the character's perception of the world.

You would see people attacking you, pickpocketing, a couple that's really making out would see as a couple fighting and getting physical, the old lady crossing the street is a crazy mutant looking for blood. And once everything is done you see all the bodies and all the shit.

Also the TV news could show what you really did. Using security footage and really making you paranoid.

 

[thepurespecies]

The easy way to use Cyberpsychosis for a gameplay stand point. Is have unique dialogue options and well as plot choices. Like the darkside in KOTR.

Me personally, I think you should reach a point where your completely messed up. Like how Xee Thot said. Maybe make that how you join the Psycho Squad. They could be the only ones to help you think straight again

 

[johnny-silverhand]

Make it affect dialogue. Depending of the situation (humanity too low), make it force a combat situation in a place where could be used negotiation otherwise.

If they implement a system for both stimpack and cyberware's health regen, make the stimpack less effective for characters with too much cyberware, I'm sure that CDPR can balance it in a interesting way.

If your humanity is low, make random situations in the game where your character could attract the attention of authority, if it is VERY low, make us worry about facing a Psycho Squad.

An example of a game that "in my opinion" had an interesting humanity system was Vampire Bloodlines.

 

[johnny-silverhand]

I would make cyberpsychosis just like the PnP, altering the character's perception of the world.

You would see people attacking you, pickpocketing, a couple that's really making out would see as a couple fighting and getting physical, the old lady crossing the street is a crazy mutant looking for blood. And once everything is done you see all the bodies and all the shit.

Also the TV news could show what you really did. Using security footage and really making you paranoid.

Now this is the kind of idea that CDPR needs to implement in the game. I really liked it.

Hallucinations to make you "accidentally" kill civilians. Hell yes!

 

[Sydanyo]

Empathy 3: Emotionless and cold.
Empathy 2: Chilly, forbidding and distinctly unpleasant to others.
Empathy 1: Violent, sociopathic and vicious. Must fight against violent, murderous urges.
Empathy 0: Game over.

In my view, the only problematic one is EMP 1. EMP 2-3 will simply change your dialogues and the way people act towards you, easy to do. EMP 0 you're done for, no need to think about it because you can't play anymore.

EMP 1 could be that if you fail some internal roll against controlling your rage, you may suddenly draw your gun and shoot the closest innocent bystander, or something similar.

 

[chromie92]

Look at Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines. When your characters gets really hungry for blood or your humanity is low you would occasionally lose control of your character and they would start killing anyone be it another vampire or a cop.

This plus some ideas from here could be something.

 

[Sablehawk]

I like you version C.Macleod ... as far as the implementation that's a harder question. I'm not a game designer but there would have to be lots of random variables in there to give folks the chance to be cyberpsychotic but at the same time there should be lots of things that keep you grounded so you don't lose it.

Family, honor, spiritual beliefs, religious beliefs, etc. Because without a grounding system there would probably be LOTS of cyberpsychos in the game. And that would get really sucky really quick.

 

[uptonogood]

I suggest looking at Spec Ops: The Line. Many scenes were hallucinations but due to Walker's desires to be a hero and the players, they don't stand out.

Some hallucinations are obvious, others aren't.

 

[blank_redge]

I like you version C.Macleod ... as far as the implementation that's a harder question. I'm not a game designer but there would have to be lots of random variables in there to give folks the chance to be cyberpsychotic but at the same time there should be lots of things that keep you grounded so you don't lose it.

Family, honor, spiritual beliefs, religious beliefs, etc. Because without a grounding system there would probably be LOTS of cyberpsychos in the game. And that would get really sucky really quick.

In the PnP game, there's ways to recover points in humanity. Usually involves therapy of some kind.

While that might make it a bit "Sims"-ish, I think it'd be a good counter-balance against just stocking up on the cyber, and being the walking Kill-o-matic overnight.

 

[Garrison72]

simple dialogue and NPC reaction to the protagonist

To this I would add instability. Have reality lie to us in subtle ways, but allow the player to root these illusions out, be they visual or verbal. That way a Cyberpsycho can actually cope the way a drug addict or alcoholic can. If the game rips complete control from our hands it would only be frustrating.

 

[wisdom000]

I think as you get closer and closer to the edge, maybe around the 20% humanity loss mark, you choudl start having "episodes". These can be trriggered by things like pedestrians bumping into you, or too many people in the background talking, or taking minor damage...

During an episode, your vision takes on a scarlet hue ad the people lose definition and become a bit fuzzy..., social interaction takes on a negative modifier, the noise is the background becomes an annoying buzz. When you hit the 10% humanity mark, your character has the chance of randomly going apeshit at the slightest provocation... someone in a bar bumps into you, a pedestrian insults you..... suddenly control of the character is removed, as you go on a rampage... cops show up, kill the snot out of you... or you just end up massacreing a bunch of innocents... or both... You can choose to watch it unfold, and maybe you can even control the direction the character moves... or not... but you are powerless to stop the violence... and the consequences. You wake up some time later, you don't know where you are and there is blood on your hands...


If your emp drops to zero... well, game over...hope you had a save close...

Of course therapy should be available, and expensive, to regain some lost humanity... Drugs may help some too...

 

[Sardukhar]

I think as you get closer and closer to the edge, maybe around the 20% humanity loss mark, you choudl start having "episodes". These can be trriggered by things like pedestrians bumping into you, or too many people in the background talking, or taking minor damage...

Of course therapy should be available, and expensive, to regain some lost humanity... Drugs may help some too...

Yeah, this bears repeating. AND EXPENSIVE. I'd hope there is no "magic potion" for regaining Humanity. Cyber has to come out, drugs and therapy go in, and you hope for the best.

Then when you need to aug up some more later, heh heh heh.

 

[wisdom000]

Yeah, this bears repeating. AND EXPENSIVE. I'd hope there is no "magic potion" for regaining Humanity. Cyber has to come out, drugs and therapy go in, and you hope for the best.

Then when you need to aug up some more later, heh heh heh.

Oh, and even the best and most expensive therapy can only get you back 50% of your lost humanity... Chrome is a harsh mistress squiddies...

 

[johnny-silverhand]

I don't like the idea of therapy or any other way to recover humanity in the game except by, maybe, removing some cyberware, and even though, I think there should be some penalty for that. Like you remove the cyberware, but don't recover all humanity that this piece took away from you.

I know that the PnP have a system for that, but it takes a lot of time to recover a single point of humanity, some times YEARS.

This therapy idea, even if expensive, would motivate people to grind their cyberware up to ridiculous level. Players would make munchkin characters that would be completely out of place.

No. Thank you.