I'm all for them to put story first which creates very different characters and tied in to the whole game. However throghout the game I feel this disparity between how male attractiveness is regarded compared to women's: There isn't a male dancer in the Afterlife or anywhere with propper sexy outfit; Sandra Dorsett is naked but the scavs turned shy on stripping males from the 2018 demo to release, the romances are quite dispar. It's like they avoided intimacy with males. And that is actually lore/story-unfriendly in a society that objectifies everyone and everything. So in this case it's not just for the sake of the story but actually a bias in my opinion. The best remark on this I heard from Madqueen: they do need a horny female director for these things
Oddly enough, in TW3 you can see male prostitutes and strippers in the brothels, sometimes even being oggled by male customers. Funny that this is present in a medieval world and not in a futuristic, decadent dystopia in which it's more than okay for both genders to go whoring and every (legal) sexual taste is accepted and displayed openly
Let imagine one example (very basic)
An expansion with a bunch of quests totally unrelated with the base game LI quests, where V's LI is implied (for help, assist, discuss, flirt, whatever) and which take place just before the point of no return (for have Kerry as LI available). In my opinion it's the easy way to do a single expansion who can please almost everyone.
- If V doesn't have a LI, new characters are introduced and should be a LI at the end (named "Simon" or "Vanessa" for example), no problem.
- If V have a LI (whatever the one Panam, Judy, Kerry or River), it's V's LI who is here, no problem.
- If V doesn't have a LI and River is dead (it mean that V don't care about River and River is definitly not a LI for V...), new characters are introduced and should be a LI at the end (named "Simon" or "Vanessa" for example), no problem.
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There's a link somewhere in this thread, one of the writers talked about how Takemura came in too late in the development cycle for them to follow through with their plans on a romance for him (unless that's what you're referencing, in which case just ignore me lol)
I'd have taken Takemura, Vik, or even freakin' Saul if it meant I didn't come out of this game feeling like I paid $60 for an interactive reminder of the blind spots in most game devs' "artistic vision."
Usually, video game developers create additional content for characters with their survival in mind. Think for example, Mass Effect. Everyone except for Liara can die, but there's still content for characters whose survival is dependent. And this is coming from a team that prioritized straight male gamers. Personally, I don't think that River's survival being dependent might have an affect on future content for him, because the people who let him die are in a minority. But at the same time, who knows with CDPR.
The problem is that a lot of us don't have much faith in CDPR to treat additional male love interests fairly. If they introduced new ones in the expansion, I'd be surprised if the male character was finally being treated equally to his female counterpart. I mean, it's a little suspect how there's no bisexual male hookup like there is one with Meredith.
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That's not what I point out
Like I said, I'm only talking about why I find the "possible River death" as a good point which should also have been added for all the other LI. And that it could have no impact on a futur expansion who could include V's LI (if in your save River is dead, I suppose that you don't care if he doesn't appear later in an expansion...)
After since I post here, I always agree there is disparities...
IMO River having a death outcome isn't a problem that needs a solution. It just signals that it is less likely that he'll be an important character in expansions. It's not impossible to work around a dead character, but it's not so simple for this game due to so many localizations.
It was mentioned here in speculation because content is still being developed at this time, and I think the general reason for all of this thread's feedback is that we want to have the kind of experience that other people had, and hope that it can still be accomplished.
It was mentioned here in speculation because content is still being developed at this time, and I think the general reason for all of this thread's feedback is that we want to have the kind of experience that other people had, and hope that it can still be accomplished.
I think that character's death should be a realistic outcome of their actions, but because the danger they put themselves in varies, some deaths wouldn't be realistic but only there for the sake of having it as an option. This applies to Judy, and especially Kerry who tend to avoid more life threatening scenarios (scavs torture dungeon being an exception for Judy).
Then you have a character like Panam who repeatedly puts herself into danger, and the worst that happens to her is some shrapnel scars. I'm not saying that Panam should die, absolutely not, but she gets saved by plot armor in situations where death could have been an optional bad outcome (rescuing Saul, attacking Arasaka in the nomads ending) whereas River is screwed.
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Especially for Kerry who "only" blow up the US Crack van is already a "all new adventure".
For Judy, she could try to free the Clouds without V, be betrayed by Maiko and Tygers could execute Tom, Roxanne, Judy and maybe also Maiko for the example. Which would prove Johnny right that there is no way it will work.
In my mind, it can make sense
If I'm understanding right, are you saying an expansion that adds a new questline, and as a side bonus also unlocks the LIs as possible companions or gives them more interactions? Because that's a possibility that might make everyone happy, but it didn't sound like "everyone being happy" is the goal.
That's why I'm not optimistic about it. If things had played out differently, maybe I'd have some faith in it. This doubling, tripling down on "we gave everyone the best content we could within The Vision" instead of just acknowledging it sucked and has some bad implications has zapped all the faith right out of me. Why would they ever correct it if they can't even acknowledge it's broken? What I'm getting from these streams is it sounds like they just shouldn't have made a character that could be four different sexualities if they didn't want to "tick boxes." I'm feeling like they advertised that all four would be available to get my money and now-- a year later-- we're hearing "we actually never intended them to be equally good or satisfying, that's the fun of it." Ridiculous.
"The important part is that River is in the game" sure sounds like "box ticking" to me, why can't he just say they messed up instead of laughing and saying "you can't please everyone"?
An expansion with "old" LI involved (whatever the one) or a possible new ones if V doesn't already have one .
If its the same quest lines for all the LI (no difference at all and quests who are not related to the "main game LI" quests) possibly new LI for those who don't like the current ones, everybody should be "happy". Honestly, those who are not "happy" with that, it's a lost cause...
When you want sell something "well", it's always a little bit the goal, even more if some/many players were not satisfied by main game. It's already happened
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Or how V is surprised that there is male moxxies, or that a job as a barman in gay club is someway "quirky" for some reason, in a world where there is places like Clouds.
So... I am playing Skyrim after having for a few days when it first came out and taking it back because it would take way too much time.
And i have to say while getting married is, "Super easy, barely an inconvenience" it is better than the relationships in CP77
You have a store that can generate money and a follower to help with quests if you pick the right spouse and its a 10 year old game. I know its sized is vastly smaller but i think CDPR should of used it as an inspiration of what type of relationship they could build for
And i have to say while getting married is, "Super easy, barely an inconvenience" it is better than the relationships in CP77
You have a store that can generate money and a follower to help with quests if you pick the right spouse and its a 10 year old game. I know its sized is vastly smaller but i think CDPR should of used it as an inspiration of what type of relationship they could build for
Oh yeah it's (very) easy, if I remember, you just need to have a Mara necklace on you and it's fine. I don't know if CDPR must take insparation by this "feature"... Honestly, I hope not
I remember cracking so many jokes about that back in the day...Oh yeah it's (very) easy, if I remember, you just need to have a Mara necklace on you and it's fine. I don't know if CDPR must take insparation by this "feature"... Honestly, I hope not
Romance in Skyrim was so ridiculous. I regretted marrying that guy from the werewolf guild the minute I came home and was greeted in this sappy and subservient way that didn't fit his personality (as it was) at all.
I checked out the timestamp from Pawel's video and it makes me cranky. I get that you want to be artistic and not hit any "quotas", but it is interesting how CDPR managed to cater to the demographic group of straight guys with both Judy and Panam so hard even though that is possibly the most boring and unartistic group to cater to in a Cyberpunk game. I would have respected them if they had made V pansexual, or explored concepts like what sexuality and romance even means in a world where you can reshape your body and mind quite easily. That would have been interesting and artistic. But no, instead they focused on Panam and her ass and on hot lesbian action with Judy and then have the gall to claim it was for artistic reasons and not because that's what straight male players are into (mostly) and they don't give a damn about ther rest of their players.
it's so very artistic that there is no male bisexual fling, that the male "strippers" are a bad joke and that River`s and Kerry's romances are way undercooked. They bothered with patching Judy's dopplegänger in her apartment after she was supposed to leave for her roadtrip, but they did not bother rescuing River from the limbo he's been stuck in since the end of his questline. How very artistic.
Maybe it would be the best if they just shut up about it instead of trying to justify it with "The Vision". It's hard not to get angry when "The Vision" always works against women and queer people.
I regretted marrying that guy from the werewolf guild the minute I came home and was greeted in this sappy and subservient way that didn't fit his personality (as it was) at all.I checked out the timestamp from Pawel's video and it makes me cranky. I get that you want to be artistic and not hit any "quotas", but it is interesting how CDPR managed to cater to the demographic group of straight guys with both Judy and Panam so hard even though that is possibly the most boring and unartistic group to cater to in a Cyberpunk game. I would have respected them if they had made V pansexual, or explored concepts like what sexuality and romance even means in a world where you can reshape your body and mind quite easily. That would have been interesting and artistic. But no, instead they focused on Panam and her ass and on hot lesbian action with Judy and then have the gall to claim it was for artistic reasons and not because that's what straight male players are into (mostly) and they don't give a damn about ther rest of their players.
it's so very artistic that there is no male bisexual fling, that the male "strippers" are a bad joke and that River`s and Kerry's romances are way undercooked. They bothered with patching Judy's dopplegänger in her apartment after she was supposed to leave for her roadtrip, but they did not bother rescuing River from the limbo he's been stuck in since the end of his questline. How very artistic.
Maybe it would be the best if they just shut up about it instead of trying to justify it with "The Vision". It's hard not to get angry when "The Vision" always works against women and queer people.
as a non human imagine how we felt when all options were humanRomance in Skyrim was so ridiculous.
I checked out the timestamp from Pawel's video and it makes me cranky. I get that you want to be artistic and not hit any "quotas", but it is interesting how CDPR managed to cater to the demographic group of straight guys with both Judy and Panam so hard even though that is possibly the most boring and unartistic group to cater to in a Cyberpunk game. I would have respected them if they had made V pansexual, or explored concepts like what sexuality and romance even means in a world where you can reshape your body and mind quite easily. That would have been interesting and artistic. But no, instead they focused on Panam and her ass and on hot lesbian action with Judy and then have the gall to claim it was for artistic reasons and not because that's what straight male players are into (mostly) and they don't give a damn about ther rest of their players.
it's so very artistic that there is no male bisexual fling, that the male "strippers" are a bad joke and that River`s and Kerry's romances are way undercooked. They bothered with patching Judy's dopplegänger in her apartment after she was supposed to leave for her roadtrip, but they did not bother rescuing River from the limbo he's been stuck in since the end of his questline. How very artistic.
Maybe it would be the best if they just shut up about it instead of trying to justify it with "The Vision". It's hard not to get angry when "The Vision" always works against women and queer people.
Yeah, like overall impression I got that you can't even roleplay V character that not interested in woman, but you can easily play as v that not interested in men,