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As I said many times, it's obvious that the Roche Path is canon but I don't remember nobles of Temeria supporting Nilfgaard except for Mary Louise La Valette
There is a side quest in Act 3 where Geralt can learn that Count Maravel conspired with Nilfgaardians to bring them the royal children. There were like two major players - Count Maravel (who wanted children to be delivered to Nilfgaardians) and Baron Kimbolt (who wanted the children dead, but his plans were thwarted by Maravel). So it may make sense that after Natalis' defeat and with the occupation of Temeria, the faction around Count Maravel may deliver Anais to Nilfgaardians. Also, their mother Baroness La Valette would probably favour her daughter to be under the Emperor's protection (as Anais would one day ascend the throne of semi-independent "Nilfgaardian" Temeria).
Interesting thing is that Aryan La Valette and his cause was favourably regarded by Saskia (and she tried to intervene in the Prologue, but that could be under the influence of Phillipa). I think that Saskia would indeed reach an arrangement with Emhyr regarding Upper Aedirn.
In prologue Saskia wasnt controlled by Philippa yet so she did it because she liked how Aryan was standing up to tyranny.
And being on Iorveth´s side, I have no idea what happened to the kids. I googled something but they are so insignificant in Iorveth´s story and thats okay : D
And being on Iorveth´s side, I have no idea what happened to the kids. I googled something but they are so insignificant in Iorveth´s story and thats okay : D
So I am about to finish my Roche path run with what I consider the most W3 world-state friendly choices made (Aryan alive, Henselt dead, Anais saved and with John Natalis, not sure about Letho yet) and I have decided to do Iorveth path run. What would be the most W3 world-state friendly choices there? I guess Aryan alive, Stennis dead and Saskia saved from the curse? Radovid has to have some reason he goes berserk on magic users and non-humans in W3 and in both Roche and Iorveth path this might relate to the success of Shilard's plan (in case of Geralt saving Anais/Phillipa (Saskia by extension) instead of Triss).
I guess that what happens if Iorveth path is canon, is the creation of Free Upper Aedirn state that probably joins Nilfgaard on its own accord when the invasion happens (as I think Saskia will be offered some good terms by Emhyr). Radovid kills Henselt on his own and thus even if Temeria was divided between them, it ends up being Redanian protectorate. Radovid might see it fit to restore Temerian symbols and probably even its "army" facing the full scale Nilfgaardian invasion. I think that if Geralt takes Iorveth path, then Anais enventually ends up under Nilfgaardian protection anyway (as she would be the perfect head of the semi-independent Temeria in case of Nilfgaard wins scenario - from books we know that this is the way Nilfgaard manages some of the conquered realms). As Geralt does not know this, it makes sense he even does not inquire about her when talking to Roche (that would be like second thing to ask for Geralt coming from W2 Roche path, especially if he helped his bro to save her from uncle Dethmold, at least in my view).
All in all, it seems like Roche path is intended to be the canon one (Temerian army is still more plausible under John Natalis as regent taking care of Anais scenario, Henselt can die on Roche path and both Aedirn and Kaedwen could be more or less screwed etc. etc.), but there are such huge omissions making it plausible in a way for Iorveth path to be quite probable as well. Potentially, those omissions or plot-holes that remain considering Roche path repercussions in W3, could be very well explained away by Iorveth path to some degree. Still, Roche is in W3 acting like best friend forever (this still might make some sense even if Geralt took Iorveth path and probably killed Letho), while Iorveth is missing and rumoured dead (is it also in case of Iorveth path save import?).
W2 is a great game, so I am looking forward to Iorveth path run anyway, and I guess I will be doing at least two runs of W3, one with Roche path import, the other with Iorveth path import. I hope that CDPR will address some of the continuity issues for both paths.
I guess that what happens if Iorveth path is canon, is the creation of Free Upper Aedirn state that probably joins Nilfgaard on its own accord when the invasion happens (as I think Saskia will be offered some good terms by Emhyr). Radovid kills Henselt on his own and thus even if Temeria was divided between them, it ends up being Redanian protectorate. Radovid might see it fit to restore Temerian symbols and probably even its "army" facing the full scale Nilfgaardian invasion. I think that if Geralt takes Iorveth path, then Anais enventually ends up under Nilfgaardian protection anyway (as she would be the perfect head of the semi-independent Temeria in case of Nilfgaard wins scenario - from books we know that this is the way Nilfgaard manages some of the conquered realms). As Geralt does not know this, it makes sense he even does not inquire about her when talking to Roche (that would be like second thing to ask for Geralt coming from W2 Roche path, especially if he helped his bro to save her from uncle Dethmold, at least in my view).
All in all, it seems like Roche path is intended to be the canon one (Temerian army is still more plausible under John Natalis as regent taking care of Anais scenario, Henselt can die on Roche path and both Aedirn and Kaedwen could be more or less screwed etc. etc.), but there are such huge omissions making it plausible in a way for Iorveth path to be quite probable as well. Potentially, those omissions or plot-holes that remain considering Roche path repercussions in W3, could be very well explained away by Iorveth path to some degree. Still, Roche is in W3 acting like best friend forever (this still might make some sense even if Geralt took Iorveth path and probably killed Letho), while Iorveth is missing and rumoured dead (is it also in case of Iorveth path save import?).
W2 is a great game, so I am looking forward to Iorveth path run anyway, and I guess I will be doing at least two runs of W3, one with Roche path import, the other with Iorveth path import. I hope that CDPR will address some of the continuity issues for both paths.
After finishing the game, I actually think that the Iorveth path and saving Triss probably makes the most sense if you're trying to reconcile everything. Geralt being a hero of Vergen is referenced at least a couple of times, whereas there isn't a word about Geralt's actions from the Roche path. Also, if you do the Iorveth path and explain to Roche that you're doing it because your friend is in danger, he actually winds up being pretty sympathetic (for Roche) and either way he helps you out later. Iorveth's complete absence is also explained by the fact that if you choose to save Triss instead of lifting Saskia's curse, Iorveth gets mangled real badly and it's said that it'll take him months to recover.
I imported a Roche save, incidentally.
I imported a Roche save, incidentally.
I have not come across any references to my Geralt being a hero of Vergen and I´m playing with Iorveth´s save.
IIRC I got one reference to it in the quest to unlock the master swordsmith and I think Geralt and Zoltan said something about a fight bringing back memories of Vergen as well. The latter comment really only makes sense if you took the Iorveth path.
After finishing the game, I actually think that the Iorveth path and saving Triss probably makes the most sense if you're trying to reconcile everything. Geralt being a hero of Vergen is referenced at least a couple of times, whereas there isn't a word about Geralt's actions from the Roche path. Also, if you do the Iorveth path and explain to Roche that you're doing it because your friend is in danger, he actually winds up being pretty sympathetic (for Roche) and either way he helps you out later. Iorveth's complete absence is also explained by the fact that if you choose to save Triss instead of lifting Saskia's curse, Iorveth gets mangled real badly and it's said that it'll take him months to recover.
I imported a Roche save, incidentally.
It may be that it is just not possible to reconcile everything. The thing is that since Iorveth path decisions influence W3 world state only marginally (as most important things - Henselt dead, situation in Temeria etc. etc. - happen offscreen in-between W2-W3), it may be that there are less inconsistencies (regarding how things stand in W3 world) with Iorveth path.
You have a point with Iorveth, but he could also be knocked out of action in-between W2-W3. And it seems that not only is there not the Conclave that is supposed to be established if Geralt rescues Triss, but that Radovid is taking the anti-magic backlash of Loc Muinne to another level.
On another matter, it seems that Roche defaults to Blue, so that would point to John Natalis/Anais ending (...and I am not sure right now how is that on the Iorveth path, but he joins John Natalis on a recon mission, right?...so it may fit Iorveth path as well).
I wonder how is it with "hero of Vergen" thing...did you get this in your Roche save? And is it one of the default things as well (like if you play with no import and no simulation)? Because that would point heavily towards Iorveth path... As for memories of Vergen with Zoltan, well, it might not contradict Roche path, as you meet Zoltan there on the barricades doing the last stand thing and he points you to Iorveth desperately fighting in the Castle. Still, even if you save Iorveth, I can not see how Roche path can lead to this "hero of Vergen" title. Can anyone confirm this (Toyen did not apparently encountered it in a Iorveth save)?
Anyway, W3 is awesome as it is, though these continuity touches are needed to make it really shine for us who sticked with the Witcher trilogy from beginning.
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Oh found the Vergen reference.
Searched like 10 videos and it seems you only get this dialogue option on Iorveth´s path as most did not have it. (Why would so many people go with Roche anyway? Thats upsetting! : D)
Its here at around 41:00 - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p9mA2jTyIL4
The dwarf says "Excellent work in Vergen."
Oh and I also found Zoltan´s Vergen reference here - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CDyhWh8PEgI
At around 1:25
PLOT TWIST: The guy doing this play-through is playing with the default world state and Zoltan still makes Vergen reference which only makes sense if you went with Iorveth so here we have proof that Iorveth is (more likely) canon! : )
Considering he did not import his decisions of course but who knows.
Searched like 10 videos and it seems you only get this dialogue option on Iorveth´s path as most did not have it. (Why would so many people go with Roche anyway? Thats upsetting! : D)
Its here at around 41:00 - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p9mA2jTyIL4
The dwarf says "Excellent work in Vergen."
Oh and I also found Zoltan´s Vergen reference here - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CDyhWh8PEgI
At around 1:25
PLOT TWIST: The guy doing this play-through is playing with the default world state and Zoltan still makes Vergen reference which only makes sense if you went with Iorveth so here we have proof that Iorveth is (more likely) canon! : )
Considering he did not import his decisions of course but who knows.
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Thanks for the links, Toyen. After reading your thread (My-choices-from-TW2-and-their-consequences) it seems to me that we can sum up the probable world-state as such:
* not saving Triss on either path
- W3 takes into account the possibility of the Conclave being established in a way, but it makes Radovid seem like crazed idiot, which he was most certainly not
- on the other hand, Radovid at Loc Muinne we see when taking not saving Triss option is exactly the pre-W3 Radovid we might expect given how he behaves in W3 (and we see he has had reasons for such a course of action)
- Triss mentions the massacre at Loc Muinne regardless of the actual choices taken in W2 (there is no pogrom if Triss is saved and she does not seem to mean the dragon havoc thing going on there, as it was rather limited in scope thanks to Geralt)
* from then on it is a mess...or rather something of a mix of Roche/Iorveth path consequences
- Geralt mentioning Vergen in a way that seems to not imply his brief encounter with Zoltan on the barricades there that takes place on Roche path (i.e. it seems to point to Iorveth path where Zoltan and Geralt fought together)
- Rose of Rememberance in Triss' house seems to point to Roche path (but just slightly... what are the odds that she would keep it through the magical statue compression and stuff?), but even if it might not present pro-Roche point, it is still a lore-breaker for Iorveth path
- Roche's men mentioning that Geralt and Roche are killing kings, then this would be like total breaker for Iorveth save import
- Phillipa mentioning that she lost control of Saskia after the war broke out (in save imports with Saskia saved from the curse by Geralt himself... like Philippa would not know it) - implying Iorveth path, saving Triss choice
- the White Orchard missions show the Temerian army met Nilfgaardian invasion, which would be kind of unlikely in any other scenario than Roche path, Anais given to Natalis (or at the very least Anais given to Radovid who would then keep formalities of "independent" Temeria to make his hold on it easier - but in any case Anais has to be saved) as Temeria either disintegrates into baronies on Henselt dead, Triss saved path, or is divided between Redania and Kaedwen on Iorveth path and Roche path, Henselt alive, Triss saved, it would be a bit of a stretch to suppose that Radovid after defeating Henselt and annexing Kaedwen, including Kaedwenian part of Temeria, somehow decided to restore Temeria as a formally "independent" kingdom with its Flag and all... (like why?)
-- the fate of Temeria was a big deal in W2 and here we have in W3 the actual world-state with Temeria falling only to the Nilfgaardian invasion regardless of choices and consequences of W2 (once more, the only plausible scenario in W2 for this state of affairs is Roche path, saving Anais, or at the very least Henselt dead, saving Triss path, with former Temerian baronies uniting under Natalis against invaders - in any case this is a heavy bias towards Roche path)
The only plausible way out of this is that since the invasion begins already during the Loc Muinne summit, all the choices and consequences there actually do not have any lasting value at all. So on Iorveth path the kings of Redania and Kaedwen might decide to partition Temeria between their kingdoms, but as Nilfgaardian invasion proceeds they have no time to implement their accord, and Temeria, still somewhat alive as a kingdom, mounts defensive action against Nilfgaardians under John Natalis and looses. The partition of Temeria between Redania and Kaedwen thus never happens, as there is no time to implement it. Instead Radovid mounts attack against Kaedwen while the remnants of Temeria are under Nilfgaardian onslaught. Why he would do that though in such a situation? Maybe Henselt was indeed acting in Nilfgaardian interests (as is heavily hinted in W2).
This (i.e. Act 3 choices do not matter at all or very little, as the invasion begins already during the summit) still leaves potential breakers, albeit small ones (Geralt commenting on being at Vergen with Zoltan vs Roche's men commenting on Geralt and Roche doing the kingslayer stuff, plus there is the Rose of Rememberance thing etc.).
Still, it would be nice to somehow get an update dealing with what happened to Anais, Saskia, Iorveth et al.
* not saving Triss on either path
- W3 takes into account the possibility of the Conclave being established in a way, but it makes Radovid seem like crazed idiot, which he was most certainly not
- on the other hand, Radovid at Loc Muinne we see when taking not saving Triss option is exactly the pre-W3 Radovid we might expect given how he behaves in W3 (and we see he has had reasons for such a course of action)
- Triss mentions the massacre at Loc Muinne regardless of the actual choices taken in W2 (there is no pogrom if Triss is saved and she does not seem to mean the dragon havoc thing going on there, as it was rather limited in scope thanks to Geralt)
* from then on it is a mess...or rather something of a mix of Roche/Iorveth path consequences
- Geralt mentioning Vergen in a way that seems to not imply his brief encounter with Zoltan on the barricades there that takes place on Roche path (i.e. it seems to point to Iorveth path where Zoltan and Geralt fought together)
- Rose of Rememberance in Triss' house seems to point to Roche path (but just slightly... what are the odds that she would keep it through the magical statue compression and stuff?), but even if it might not present pro-Roche point, it is still a lore-breaker for Iorveth path
- Roche's men mentioning that Geralt and Roche are killing kings, then this would be like total breaker for Iorveth save import
- Phillipa mentioning that she lost control of Saskia after the war broke out (in save imports with Saskia saved from the curse by Geralt himself... like Philippa would not know it) - implying Iorveth path, saving Triss choice
- the White Orchard missions show the Temerian army met Nilfgaardian invasion, which would be kind of unlikely in any other scenario than Roche path, Anais given to Natalis (or at the very least Anais given to Radovid who would then keep formalities of "independent" Temeria to make his hold on it easier - but in any case Anais has to be saved) as Temeria either disintegrates into baronies on Henselt dead, Triss saved path, or is divided between Redania and Kaedwen on Iorveth path and Roche path, Henselt alive, Triss saved, it would be a bit of a stretch to suppose that Radovid after defeating Henselt and annexing Kaedwen, including Kaedwenian part of Temeria, somehow decided to restore Temeria as a formally "independent" kingdom with its Flag and all... (like why?)
-- the fate of Temeria was a big deal in W2 and here we have in W3 the actual world-state with Temeria falling only to the Nilfgaardian invasion regardless of choices and consequences of W2 (once more, the only plausible scenario in W2 for this state of affairs is Roche path, saving Anais, or at the very least Henselt dead, saving Triss path, with former Temerian baronies uniting under Natalis against invaders - in any case this is a heavy bias towards Roche path)
The only plausible way out of this is that since the invasion begins already during the Loc Muinne summit, all the choices and consequences there actually do not have any lasting value at all. So on Iorveth path the kings of Redania and Kaedwen might decide to partition Temeria between their kingdoms, but as Nilfgaardian invasion proceeds they have no time to implement their accord, and Temeria, still somewhat alive as a kingdom, mounts defensive action against Nilfgaardians under John Natalis and looses. The partition of Temeria between Redania and Kaedwen thus never happens, as there is no time to implement it. Instead Radovid mounts attack against Kaedwen while the remnants of Temeria are under Nilfgaardian onslaught. Why he would do that though in such a situation? Maybe Henselt was indeed acting in Nilfgaardian interests (as is heavily hinted in W2).
This (i.e. Act 3 choices do not matter at all or very little, as the invasion begins already during the summit) still leaves potential breakers, albeit small ones (Geralt commenting on being at Vergen with Zoltan vs Roche's men commenting on Geralt and Roche doing the kingslayer stuff, plus there is the Rose of Rememberance thing etc.).
Still, it would be nice to somehow get an update dealing with what happened to Anais, Saskia, Iorveth et al.
Yeah not saving Triss makes more sense since there are at least 2 references to the massacre even if it did not happen.
The fate of Temeria to me does not matter at all, even if it was independent it would still not be powerful enough to fight Nilfgaard (mainly because they don´t have a dragon on their side like Pontar Valley does, "wink wink") so whats the big deal.
Its just one big mess, I´d wish to see the consequences addressed more in the future patches/expansions but I doubt this will happen.
The fate of Temeria to me does not matter at all, even if it was independent it would still not be powerful enough to fight Nilfgaard (mainly because they don´t have a dragon on their side like Pontar Valley does, "wink wink") so whats the big deal.
Its just one big mess, I´d wish to see the consequences addressed more in the future patches/expansions but I doubt this will happen.
Because it's a standalone
http://www.technobuffalo.com/2015/01...play-designer/
“We didn’t want to go too overboard and alienate people,” Monnier said. “It was really important to make Witcher 3 a standalone game.”
http://www.technobuffalo.com/2015/01...play-designer/
“We didn’t want to go too overboard and alienate people,” Monnier said. “It was really important to make Witcher 3 a standalone game.”
http://www.technobuffalo.com/2015/01...play-designer/
“We didn’t want to go too overboard and alienate people,” Monnier said. “It was really important to make Witcher 3 a standalone game.”
Who said that? I can't open the link
Who said that? I can't open the link
http://www.technobuffalo.com/2015/0...ld-hunt-interview-with-the-gameplay-designer/
CD Projekt Red’s Senior Gameplay Designer, Dominic Monnier
http://www.technobuffalo.com/2015/0...ld-hunt-interview-with-the-gameplay-designer/
CD Projekt Red’s Senior Gameplay Designer, Dominic Monnier
Fuck... If I had known this, I wouldn't had bought The Wicther 3. When I was buying it I was expecting the end of a saga and not a standalone game.
The only word that could define this situacion is SCAM
...
“We didn’t want to go too overboard and alienate people,” Monnier said. “It was really important to make Witcher 3 a standalone game.”
This would explain why some of the enforced world-state facts are the way they are (and kinda seem to be a blend of both Roche and Iorveth path choices, something impossible to achieve in W2) regardless of imported save. I understand that it was not quite feasible to take into account W1 choices (e.g. in W3 Thaler lives no matter what) but CDPR should take W2 into consideration as its choices were supposed to be of great consequence for the whole world-state back when it was released.
The only plausible excuse is that the W2 choices and consequences that were supposed to matter (especially Act 3 choices) in fact matter very little as any political and power arrangements did not last as the Nilfgaard invaded already during the summit of Loc Muinne. Still, there seem to be a sort of default results that actually did happen in W2 for W3 to has the world-state it actually has.
I am still interesting in finding the most lore-friendly way of W1 and W2 "canon" to arrive at the world-state W3 implies by default (and I do not mean the non-import, non-simulation "default", I mean the default states that are set regardless of the actual import).
So can we get a Witcher 3b which is an actual continuation of TW1 & TW2? Since TW3 is a "stand-alone" game. TW3 should be called The Witcher: Wild Hunt. The Witcher 3 should be an actual continuation of the first two games.
The only plausible excuse is that the W2 choices and consequences that were supposed to matter (especially Act 3 choices) in fact matter very little as any political and power arrangements did not last as the Nilfgaard invaded already during the summit of Loc Muinne. Still, there seem to be a sort of default results that actually did happen in W2 for W3 to has the world-state it actually has.
It's true that Nilfgaard began the invasion almost at the same time of the events of Loc Muinne but between that moment and the beginning of The Witcher has passed 6 months. I can't believe that the Free State didn't have time to prepare or Temeria would be defeated. Especially when it was one of the most powerful kingdoms in the North
---------- Updated at 04:25 PM ----------
http://www.technobuffalo.com/2015/01...play-designer/
“We didn’t want to go too overboard and alienate people,” Monnier said. “It was really important to make Witcher 3 a standalone game.”
This deserve it's own thread. Just saying