And no effort has been made to include them. @Sardukhar and I disagree on what makes an RPG but I'm pretty sure we can agree that most of the core elements that make an RPG a character (vice player) centered game have not been included in CP2077.
I'd have to know more about the systems. I think we agree 2077 will have less visible systems, or crunch, than most PnP RPG.
Witcher was a -very- character-centered game series. Rarely have I played a game where I so clearly inhabited a character and thusly I roleplayed far, far more than in, say, Skyrim. Or even most old school iso RPGs, where I was Bland Man of Abilities and Convo Choices. Couldn't tell you how my BG2 Monk was really different from my PoE2 Monk.
Your definition of a character centered RPG seems mostly mechanical. As you know, I consider the mechanics of an RPG nearly completely disposable, having run many a game without them. Where people role-played for many hours.
Anyway, this is a thread about ammunition in 2077, so back to topic, I think?
I think the ammunition in 2077 will fall into weapon categories and be modifiable from there. I'd like 7.62, 5.56, 6.5 mm etc but that is a level of fidelity unnecessary to simulate a Dark Future.
Totally true concerning Witcher 3. Geralt had a pre-set personality, you had a certain amount of room to alter his demeanor (mercenary, asshole, nice guy) but his core personality was what it was.
I tend to center on the mechanical because it's the clearest and easiest RPG concept for most people to grasp. Are the characters stats/skills used to determine outcomes or are the players. Geralt wasn't the player, he had his own personality, morals, and pretty much "Joe Friday" (The Dragnet TV series, he was rather famous for his "Just the facts Ma'am" line) attidude.
I'm also not expecting individual calibers, since damage modifiers (armor piercing, physical vs chemical vs fire ... as seen by the armor/protective types shown on gear) seem to be based on the weapon, not it's ammunition, and it seems we have an unlimited number of magazines there's no reason to deal with ammo types.
Yes. The gun nut in me hates unlimited mags. The gamer in me is SUPER GRATEFUL. Carrying 10 30 rnd mags around, taking up inventory space, urgh.
I think we'll have limited ammo, though, and mods for the ammunition.
Well, this is late, so not really a suggestion at this stage, but just a discussion for the future.
Why do games focus on guns instead of ammo? Truly, I think a much better way of creating good (especially physical) gun mechanics is to create ammo that does a base damage, damage type (AP, hollow point, incendiary, EMP...whatever), and then develop delivery packages for that ammo type. Sort of...like guns...if I'm understanding how modern firearms are developed.
So, I'll pick the type of damage I want to do (up-front stopping power, elemental, non-lethal, etc.) then choose a weapon that handles that damage the way I want for my character or the situation at hand (precision, sustained fire, area saturation, etc.) Thus, the "gun" doesn't do any additional damage, it simply affects things like rate of fire, accuracy over range, how quickly I can hoist the weapon to sight targets, the amount of recoil I have to deal with, how likely the weapon is to overheat and jam, etc.
"Skills" and "Abilities" then manage the secondary concerns. Training with pistols mitigates the spread of bullets when fired quickly. Training in rifles means I can snap the sights up more quickly and maybe auto-drop-and-switch to a pistol if I run out of ammo. Training in heavy weapons lets me ready, reload, and clear jams much more efficiently. However, nothing affects the "damage" I cause except switching ammunition types.
And that creates some fun, as Sard mentions, with managing inventory and bringing what I know I'll need to get the job done "my (character's) way". I think that's easier to balance and more immersive than, "This pistol does +20 more DPS than that one. Because it's blue, not green."
Different casings and cartridges and everything!! 
Remember how good ammunition was in Deus Ex?
The devs made a terrible choice in the sequel Invisible War. In IW every weapon had the same ammunition. Terrible!
That mistake was not repeated in the prequels.
Remember how good ammunition was in Deus Ex?
The devs made a terrible choice in the sequel Invisible War. In IW every weapon had the same ammunition. Terrible!
That mistake was not repeated in the prequels.
In some cases I'd say ignorance, in CP2077s case I'd guess simplicity.
CDPR seems to be going out of it's way to simplify everything possible in CP2077. They had a perfectly good template in CP2020 but at every turn went action/shooter game. Don't overwhelm the player with decisions or mechanics; keep it streamlined so the action doesn't suffer, pick the weapon you want to use (thus the type of damage and "special" [i.e. shoot thru walls or bank shots] ability you wish and don't worry about ammo ... it's unlimited), almost all "skills" improve your combat performance (no need to waste many, if any, on non-combat abilities ... just use your body as a battering ram), dodge or deflect bullets!
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I would love it if the spent shell casings [ejecting brass] stay on-screen for a little while, just so I can revel in the little details of the firefight
Tough cookie. I voted Deus Ex style because it really offers variety but then I realized that depending on playstyle you will likely either need only a handful of ammunition for surprise situations or become a walking armory like Ivan. Still, it's nice to have at least some variety.
I like shooting but I don't like keeping my eyes down instead of front of me so I can pick up those damn ammo .
Oh Yawn...the loot is more ammo....
I do recall that Ammo had more importance in horrors survivors games (of the past) . Where you had to becareful not to go overkill , save your ammo , use your knife instead..(RE Serie) .
But in games like this , say like in Fallout 4 . Its mostly a chore . forcing you to carry more weapons because you have different ammo for each kind of gun , so you don't own a donkey..you become the mule .
On that front I liked Mass effect and how it did it . Different guns , no ammo . And the piercing of shield and armors are abilities .
Oh Yawn...the loot is more ammo....
I do recall that Ammo had more importance in horrors survivors games (of the past) . Where you had to becareful not to go overkill , save your ammo , use your knife instead..(RE Serie) .
But in games like this , say like in Fallout 4 . Its mostly a chore . forcing you to carry more weapons because you have different ammo for each kind of gun , so you don't own a donkey..you become the mule .
On that front I liked Mass effect and how it did it . Different guns , no ammo . And the piercing of shield and armors are abilities .
I don't really have an opinion on the ammo vs. weapon-centric debate, but I will say, I absolutely hate the concept of magic damage. Gun A magically does more damage than Gun B because it's Legendary, or 5 Levels Higher.
It blows my mind that the game is this close to release and I STILL have absolutely no idea how many of those gear systems are being carried over from The Witcher 3.
I do think it's very important for Ammo to not be infinite. I hate infinite ammo in games. Completely unrealistic and boring to me. It's almost worse when you just have a lot of ammo (so much so that it's basically infinite and you have to actively go out of your way to use it up).
I want ammo to matter. I do NOT WANT my V to run around with 60 billion rounds of ammunition per gun. I want to run out of ammo at the wrong moment, and be forced to use my head instead of my twitch skills. Or, at least, use twitch skills in a different way (out of ammo? improvise, grab someone else's gun or try to close the gap for a melee finisher).
It blows my mind that the game is this close to release and I STILL have absolutely no idea how many of those gear systems are being carried over from The Witcher 3.
I do think it's very important for Ammo to not be infinite. I hate infinite ammo in games. Completely unrealistic and boring to me. It's almost worse when you just have a lot of ammo (so much so that it's basically infinite and you have to actively go out of your way to use it up).
I want ammo to matter. I do NOT WANT my V to run around with 60 billion rounds of ammunition per gun. I want to run out of ammo at the wrong moment, and be forced to use my head instead of my twitch skills. Or, at least, use twitch skills in a different way (out of ammo? improvise, grab someone else's gun or try to close the gap for a melee finisher).
Not a fan of the Legendary, Supremely Accurate, Indestructible Glock of Vanquishing eh? Once upon a time item names were complete sentences. Sorry, couldn't help myself
.On the nature of ammo... I went with option #4, or different cartridges and variants. Mainly because it offers further gearing customization and choices.
I don't see a huge point for major ammo limitations though. I could see that in a post-apocalyptic centered survival game. Say, Metro Exodus. In CP2077, not so much. Unlimited ammo would be kind of odd but constantly fearing you'll run out of your six remaining bullets sounds out of place.
Because its not FPS it will be immersion breaking regardless. Might even see one gun doing 2x damage of another while both being same model and shooting same 7.62x39 bullets...
We know nothing about so many things. And while during previous E3 the build some things could have been in flux now we must be able to get answers about how the game will play.
Limited ammo makes all the skills, preparation, environment, weak-points etc. etc. matter. Otherwise you can just shoot at everything with generic assault riffle until they die. Such play-style being viable would make combat loop too simple to allow sufficient replay-ability.
By picking first person and the setting CP2077 set itself to be spiritual successor of original Deus Ex. By having simplified systems such as universal ammo it would be instead spiritual successor of... Invisible War.