My favourite game, now dead

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It's funny though, cause they could fix some of these issues pretty easily. For instance, why not put mods back into clothing but make their strength and available number depend on rarity? For instance, a blue jacket has no mods slots, an epic variant has one, and a legendary variant has two - maybe even three. This would resolve the issue where clothing and its tiers feel useless and make mods more worth investing into.

They could have given cyberware modslots instead of random stats and had the mods drop from enemies instead of clothing, leaving the clothing to the stores and purposeful containers mostly. They would have probably stuck random mods in those slots randomly anyway though, like really random you know for the random replay random value...

I think the mods in general need more variety. There's barely a game left here, by the time you get what you want you are (or at least I am) just annoyed because 3/4 mods are kinda trash or super niche. They took away elemental choices from most of the guns, power = fire if you want and tech = shock etc when it comes to mods now. Are we excited for all those possibilities chooms?

It's been about 20 or so rerolls since I've seen a decent combo of cyberware stats, and I'm not even shooting for perfection. Couple pieces with carry capacity or aim speed are probably never going to be any better than that due to the other two stats and I guess that's fine. I just hate the process. I guess you are supposed to go pure weapon sales to stock up on extra cyberware to reroll from the start of the game until you can't anymore. Only then should you actually focus on components so you get the maximum number of chances at decent stats.

I know I'm absolutely trashing on someone's new favorite change to the game but for me this was 5 steps backwards off a cliff. It just makes me want to ignore it, or cheat so I can get it over with. Fresh starts, rather than long games were how I had fun and that means it needs to have a certain flow.

Menu roulette, especially as tedious a version of it as this just ain't it.
 
This is a pretty long post, since it's all of my thoughts (or what I can think of right now) thus far on the new state of the game. I agree that CDPR went too far with changes and should have just left aspects of the game alone. For starters, what is essentially infinite stamina (out of combat), health and health items, and grenades. Sprinting, vaulting, and jumping out of combat now no longer require stamina. I find that to be immersion-breaking. Pre-2.0 patch, the base level stamina was already impressive, and you could sprint a good distance even before upgrading your stamina through leveling up and different levels of cyberware. Now, the bionic lungs that increased stamina are pretty much pointless, unless you get into extremely long firefights (if they're even still in the game - I haven't found them yet). But I do like that firing weapons depletes stamina - that was a creative move that makes sense when you consider how to control recoil.

Moving onto health - I have to say that I deeply dislike the reworked health system. Before (until you acquired certain perks), your health wouldn't regen out of combat - you had to eat food. I liked this because it increased immersion and made the food vendors more relevant. Now they're mostly pointless. You can always eat food right before a fight to give yourself a small health increase I suppose, but there are more powerful health boosters anyway. I also really do not like the health booster cooldown system. They should have just left the old health system alone - where the amount of maxdocs and bouncebacks you could use depended on how many were in your inventory. It encouraged looting and exploration. I suspect it was changed because people whined about being able to spam maxdocs or bouncebacks during fights - just like when people whined about there being too much stuff to pick up, so CDPR early on took away part of the incentive for exploration. Way back in the earliest days of Cyberpunk, you could grab a Grad early on a high-rise next to Victor's clinic. You couldn't use it without a body level of 10, but you could still get it - but that went away. There was an easy fix that could have been implemented by players and could have allowed the devs to leave the health system and loot locations alone: don't pick up stuff, and/or don't use the health boosters in firefights if spamming them makes it too easy. Same with what we had with grenades: don't want too many grenades in your inventory/don't want to spam them? Don't pick them up/buy them from merchants/craft them. The spamming argument is kind of moot anyway, as there is an animation that has to play out, whether it's throwing a grenade or using a health boost. So the rate is limited. There were plenty of times I was killed in the middle of using a maxdoc or bounceback - one time the animation finished, but my health bar hadn't refilled, so I took damage and died. Basic point - the grenade, health, and stamina system should have been left alone.

For crafting, I have to say that it is a major disappointment, when it comes to crafting components and therefore, so much else in crafting. The ability to buy crafting components from merchants should never have been taken out of the game. For weapons and cyberware tier upgrades, I see how they kind of mitigated it with auto-dismantling "broken" weapons you loot. But the resources you get from that are pretty minimal. Even dismantling higher tier weapons doesn't fetch that much compared to crafting higher tier weapons and increasing cyberware tiers. But for crafting quickhacks? It was a major mistake removing the ability to buy the components from merchants. I'm in the same boat with other people I've seen on here - I have the blueprints for a bunch of Tier 3 quickhacks, but I can't even craft one, because the only place I can get Tier 3 quickhack crafting components is from access points, or from crafting Tier 3 components from Tier 2 components. But, doing the math, it takes 30 Tier 3 crafting components to craft a Tier 3 quickhack. It takes five Tier 2 quickhack components to craft 1 Tier 3 quickhack component. So it takes 150 Tier 2 components to craft 1 Tier 3 quickhack. And there are 10-12 Tier 3 quickhacks. So that's 1,500 Tier 2 components minimum, from only crafting. True, you can get Tier 3 components from APs like I already said, but they amount you get is 15 Tier 2, 5 Tier 3 (and I'm in Act 2). So the crafting requirements just increase exponentially (i.e. for Tier 4 and 5 components), while the yields from APs decrease. As for health boosters and grenades, you can't even craft those anymore. As for upgrading equipment, I don't really have an issue with being able to upgrade only Legendary items. Long story short though, they should have just left crafting alone.

Now armor - I do think the system with cyberware armor is pretty cool. However, it should have been supplemental to clothing armor - not a replacement. Clothing (except for a few different pieces like visors, gas masks, netrunner suits, and ballistic vests, which offer minor buffs) is now completely pointless, as are clothing vendors. It doesn't offer anything. You could run through the entire game naked and it wouldn't make a difference. I honestly don't even know why clothing still has a quality aspect of Common, Uncommon, etc. Never have I ever played an RPG where clothing does not have an armor value. Even the Division games, and Outriders, which are looter-shooters, have armor values for equipment. It would have made much more sense to nerf clothing armor values somewhat and add the cyberware armor aspect so that there was a balance between the two and people wouldn't be super OP with armor. Overall, a terrible decision to remove the armor value from clothing.

Next, the attribute trees, skill categories, general xp, and street cred xp. Oh boy. First, I do like the inclusion of perks for vehicles, and the character perks in general seem pretty cool. However, I do not like the fact that you have to reach a minimum of level 9 in an attribute category before you can start to use the higher-level perks in that category. I like to form a kind-of jack-of-all-trades character. So I increase each attribute tree mostly evenly (with a small preference given to body and tech to access certain areas early on). Pre-2.0 patch attribute level requirements for perks didn't really matter that much, since you could start to branch out fairly early in each attribute tree and try different things at low levels. Now you have to either mostly sacrifice progressing some attribute categories or be almost halfway through the hard-level cap to level them evenly to level 9. I'm at level 17, and I only have three level 8 attributes, and two level 7s, so I'm still at the bottom-level perks for every attribute and won't be able to start using any level 9 perks until I'm level 20. If I were to continue this way, I wouldn't be able to use any of the level 15 perks in any category, and certainly not any level 20 perks. Of course, this wouldn't be an issue if we had a level cap of say, 100 and a NG+, but I'm not expecting either of those for a while. Oh well, I guess that's what mods are for. As for the skill categories, I'm in agreement that those should have been left alone, for the most part. It was much more fun before, having 12 skill categories to progress, instead of five that are kind of ambiguous on how you progress them. The only change(s) I would have liked to have seen for the skill categories would have been either to increase the skill xp yield for skill actions (i.e. getting more skill progression xp for athletic actions) or lowering the xp threshold requirements from one level to the next in the skill categories so that the skills could be progressed at a reasonable pace. Again, I like to progress all of the categories, so I wasn't running around the Pre-2.0 patch game with a shotgun, pistol, or rifle the whole time. For general character xp and street cred xp, either the xp yield for completing missions, gigs, police scanner missions, and getting kills needs to be reduced, or the amount needed to increase street cred level and character level needs to be increased. Even though I'm in Act II, I'm already level 17 and have a street cred of 21 - and I've only done 21 activities (gigs, side missions, story missions, police scanners, and cyberpsycho sightings combined, plus a few random encounters with enemy NPCs). I've barely cleared the Watson section of the map, and been nowhere else.

For weapons, I like the new tiered system - I like how the stats increase from Tier 1 to 1+ to 2 and so on. I also like that body requirements for weapons are no longer a thing. I think the new cyberware value approach is cool and interesting, with the possibility of becoming a cyberpyscho an element. I like the improved stats on weapons, their attachments, and cyberware as you increase their tiers. I generally like the quickhacking (though I haven't delved super deep into it). I think the quickhack stacking is a cool concept, as well as the traceability by enemy netrunners. I wouldn't have altered the effect of Reboot Optics, though. Before, it blinded enemies. Now, it just messes with detection and their aim a little bit. The only other issue I have with hacking is the AP minigame. The cyberdeck I'm running now supposedly has a buffer capability of six, but when I access an AP, it only gives me 5 buffer slots. So I don't get what the deal is with that. I enjoy the increased challenge with sword and fistfights. I wouldn't have made knife throwing an automatic perk, but I'm still enjoying it.

For vehicles, I like the autotrader kiosks, even if I haven't bought any cars from it yet, and I like the added camera view on vehicles. I'm really impressed with how much vehicle handling has improved, as well as the AI drivers in the game (for the most part lol). I like the gang car chases you can get into with or without police involved. And for that matter, the whole police response system is a great improvement.

In conclusion, unfortunately, I'm having a pretty hard time enjoying Cyberpunk as much as I used to. The devs just overhauled and changed so much that they should have just left alone or only changed a little. And then there are changes that should have happened that didn't. I'm still holding out and hoping that we'll eventually get a NG+ and increased hard level cap, and I'll see what PL is like, but right now, I'm leaning towards reverting back to the last pre-2.0 patch and installing a bunch of mods.
 
I have zero interest in having shoot outs with cops, but the game constantly forces this upon me.

For that, you can thank the people who complained about the game not being GTA. I have a friend who argued with me over Cyberpunk countless times, and for him, no matter how good the story, characters and quests are, it was irrelevant because the game didn't have "a police system like San Andreas".

Well, here you go...
The dev time that went into something as pointless as that could've been spent on, for instance, proper intergration of vehicle combat into existing content. It's unbelievable to me that Claire's racing quests don't utilize it.
 
Idk, game is now harder and therefore more fun, previously hacking was so overpowered it was joke.

Irronically the changes seem to mirror the popular netrunning mods, e.g. enemy netrunners now using other hacks on you and your position getting revealed is straight from AI Netrunning Overhauled :)
play against cheaters and do not cheat in online game
you will love it
 
I wanted the new content. The new systems ultimately bored me.
I've stopped playing.

It's emotionless response, I'm not angry, upset etc.
I thought I would make it through the PL content before it happened, I overestimated my capacity for monotonous gameplay.

If there was a way to have the original game with the new content, that would elicit an emotional (happy) response, but as it is I just stopped after having my fill of "meh".
 
I wanted the new content. The new systems ultimately bored me.
I've stopped playing.

It's emotionless response, I'm not angry, upset etc.
I thought I would make it through the PL content before it happened, I overestimated my capacity for monotonous gameplay.

If there was a way to have the original game with the new content, that would elicit an emotional (happy) response, but as it is I just stopped after having my fill of "meh".

Since you're emotionless about this, I assume you're able to have a decent conversation about this without going into obviously emotionally charged answers that so many have provided before.

What was less monotonous about the old systems?

V had no skill to speak of - the skill tree was largely just passive small incremental % upgrades.
Netrunning was as thoughtless as it could be.
By level 25 the game posed little to no challenge to anyone and by 35 posed no challenge at all. On very hard.
Itemization was that of a mediocre looter shooter.
Cyberware was largely fine but rather uninspired compared to it's description in lore.

I'm genuinely asking here - because you mentioned being in an emotionless state over all this - what made the previous system less monotonous, exactly.

I'm really asking. Not trying to diminish your opinion or anything of the sort. Just a genuine, emotionless, conversation about why you think the previous system was less monotonous.
 
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Surprised this thread is still around. I guess people really do get used to anything and facing change is hard... Funny how the new ending is precisely about this. Not saying that the gameplay couldn't be improved further, but 2.0+ gameplay is objectively better than pre-2.0 gameplay.
 
Still have not played PL yet.

I look up guides, try a new build, and I keep stopping and restarting a new character, at just about the heist mission. “Do I really want to do that mission with this build?” No, no I don’t.

The new netrunning is just terrible to play, in my opinion. 1.63 felt much better.

The closest I have come is a blade build, but I am not really enjoying that either.

Pistol, shotgun…, nothing feels as fun to play as it did before the update.

I really miss 1.63 netrunning. I want to play that game again.
 

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Still have not played PL yet.

I look up guides, try a new build, and I keep stopping and restarting a new character, at just about the heist mission. “Do I really want to do that mission with this build?” No, no I don’t.

The new netrunning is just terrible to play, in my opinion. 1.63 felt much better.

The closest I have come is a blade build, but I am not really enjoying that either.

Pistol, shotgun…, nothing feels as fun to play as it did before the update.

I really miss 1.63 netrunning. I want to play that game again.
I don't know what platform are you playing on, but reverting to 1.63 couldn't be any simpler for PC players.
In my mind, there's no expansion worth trudging through steadily unpleasant gameplay. None. :p
New netrunning being THIS terrible to play is the result of 6-7 separate changes to game's core mechanics and realistically speaking, there's no chance of pre-2.0 ever returning. They'd need to annul every single one of those changes...
 
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V had no skill to speak of - the skill tree was largely just passive small incremental % upgrades.
Netrunning was as thoughtless as it could be.
By level 25 the game posed little to no challenge to anyone and by 35 posed no challenge at all. On very hard.
Itemization was that of a mediocre looter shooter.
Cyberware was largely fine but rather uninspired compared to it's description in lore.
Honestly. 1.63 on Hard was actually Hard. I tried it, was really pushed. I'm now playing Hard and 2.0x and it's really simple. I'm standing there, being shot by HMG's and Smart weapons by multiple people, and my cyberware is instantly healing me, adrenaline is giving me a health buffer, my armour is taking a load of damage, mitigation is lowering the damage I'm receiving. It's not at all Hard. I die very rarely, as opposed to the many deaths in 1.63.

The argument that 1.63 was easier is a false one. 2.0x has made everything simple. I'm a combat monster wading through dozens of enemies and coming out with barely a scratch.
 
Honestly. 1.63 on Hard was actually Hard. I tried it, was really pushed. I'm now playing Hard and 2.0x and it's really simple. I'm standing there, being shot by HMG's and Smart weapons by multiple people, and my cyberware is instantly healing me, adrenaline is giving me a health buffer, my armour is taking a load of damage, mitigation is lowering the damage I'm receiving. It's not at all Hard. I die very rarely, as opposed to the many deaths in 1.63.

The argument that 1.63 was easier is a false one. 2.0x has made everything simple. I'm a combat monster wading through dozens of enemies and coming out with barely a scratch.
2.0 is designed so that a combat build is still strong. It's just that non-combat builds can no longer rely on spam healing to be combat builds.
 
2.0 is designed so that a combat build is still strong. It's just that non-combat builds can no longer rely on spam healing to be combat builds.
Not sure what you call a non-combat build in a combat based game, but you kidding? It's easier in 2.0x. In 1.63 you at least had attribute requirements to get certain pieces of cyberware, now you can just load up on x% reduced damage, heal on kill, +x% armour, +x% mitigation strength, +x% mitigation chance, heal automatically with bio-monitor.. it doesn't matter what you decide now, you can smash your way through with no troubles.
 
Not sure what you call a non-combat build in a combat based game, but you kidding? It's easier in 2.0x. In 1.63 you at least had attribute requirements to get certain pieces of cyberware, now you can just load up on x% reduced damage, heal on kill, +x% armour, +x% mitigation strength, +x% mitigation chance, heal automatically with bio-monitor.. it doesn't matter what you decide now, you can smash your way through with no troubles.
Maybe looking at Cyberpunk 2077 as a combat-based game is the problem here? There's plenty of different stealth approaches that don't involve neutralizing everyone.
 
V had no skill to speak of - the skill tree was largely just passive small incremental % upgrades.
Not entirely true, but also, let's not pretend the new system is any better. The majority of perks are still % based, with only 2-3 "actions" per tree. Even then, there is a clear bias towards some trees like Reflex and Body, whereas things like Cool and Tech got the short end of the stick.

The main difference is, 2.0 forces you into pre-determined playstyle archetypes, whereas 1.6 allowed complete freedom to do whatever you wanted as long as you had the necessary attribute points. That type of freedom is sorely missing in 2.0 for me.

Itemization was that of a mediocre looter shooter.
And how is it better now? Clothes that provide zero stats and can no longer be modded, with item rarites that serve absolutely no purpose beyond giving you crafting materials and bloating the game.

Weapons with mods that you cannot remove, and a clear emphasis on Iconics. Once you've found your ideal iconic, which is easy because there's a ton of them, there's no need to care about other weapons.

In 1.6, although the stats felt a bit inconsequential, at the very least I spent time comparing items to see which ones benefit me better.

Cyberware was largely fine but rather uninspired compared to it's description in lore.
Cyberware is excellent in 2.0, no arguments there. One of the few things they actually got right.
Plus, I really like that you're not incentivized into building the Tech tree in order to interact with Cyberware. You can, and it does provide small bonuses, but it's not a requirement like Crafting was in 1.6.

I'm genuinely asking here - because you mentioned being in an emotionless state over all this - what made the previous system less monotonous, exactly.
More playstyle freedom. That's about it.
And for those of us who want to play Stealth, more interesting Stealth options.
 
Maybe looking at Cyberpunk 2077 as a combat-based game is the problem here? There's plenty of different stealth approaches that don't involve neutralizing everyone.
Sure, there are Stealth options, but that's not going to help when you've got Smasher and Hansen to deal with, Stealth won't get you far there. I'm playing Stealth / Pistol / Blade at the moment, and I can stealth through fine, but that severely reduces your skill levels, loot and eddies. It's useful for getting the drop on enemies, but I wouldn't suggest it as a full time play style.
 
Sure, there are Stealth options, but that's not going to help when you've got Smasher and Hansen to deal with, Stealth won't get you far there. I'm playing Stealth / Pistol / Blade at the moment, and I can stealth through fine, but that severely reduces your skill levels, loot and eddies. It's useful for getting the drop on enemies, but I wouldn't suggest it as a full time play style.

Bosses support stealth combat. Like I said, you seem to have a very narrow perspective on what the game can provide. Try branching out a little more... I'm sure you'll find other games within Cyberpunk 2077.
 
But as far as I know, only base game ones. For Phantom Liberty bosses, Gabe decided that stealth is for suckers.
Well, I don't think you'll be sneaking through the Chimera, that's for sure. But give the guy some credit, the Cerberus is in there too. Then again, bosses level scale now too...
 
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Bosses support stealth combat. Like I said, you seem to have a very narrow perspective on what the game can provide. Try branching out a little more... I'm sure you'll find other games within Cyberpunk 2077.
That's cool, didn't know that was possible, I've always been under the impression once the alert is active that the enemy hunt you down. Unless you run half a mile away. Though I've never tried those other grenades, will have to give them a whirl, never thought flash was worth it.
 
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