Why i think this game deserves more praise despite the issues

[Ayinde_Palmer]

But honestly I think you could say that about almost all features, the game doesn't require you to be able to use different weapons, just a single gun is fine. Why bother with letting you get different cars, just make it like a single "batmobile", gigs not really needed, romantic options is not required either, as you have the main quest so just follow that.

But when we talk RPG, people expect that you can change weapons and armors, that the world at least to some degree tries to immerse the player into it. Look at how many lore items are in the game, TV shows talking about what is going on, why is that needed?

To me, sure you could cut all the way into the bone in a RPG game, and remove all things that is not immediately important for the main story, but overall it ruins the experience.

Take Fallout 4, when they decided that it was a good idea to cut the dialog system to an almost bare minimum, removing most of the options for interacting, asking questions and get clarifications from NPCs, because they worked on the assumption that players wouldn't care to read these things anyway. That alone decreased the RPG quality of the game a whole lot, compared to former Fallout games.

CDPR did kind of the same in CP, and even worse in some degree, simply by using different colors for you responses, because yellow mean push the story forward and blue means get information. So you basically only have 2 options in CP, where most yellow options lead to the same thing anyway. The mere fact that the player is made aware which options push forward dialog, is ruining a lot of the RPG elements in my opinion, because you as player might not especially choose to say stuff based on what you feel you should, but rather because you ought to say blue before yellow, as you might miss out on things otherwise.

RPG games I would assume is one of the most difficult types of games to do well, but cutting down features as the solution, is not something that benefits them in my opinion.

I think a lot of it also comes down to how they structure their games, because we know that you as player can buy food from certain NPCs, so that functionality is already in the game. So couldn't that feature or AI simply have been copied or applied to all food vendors? We know that you can sit on certain chairs, yet most of them you can't, why isn't such feature simply copied to all chairs, when added to the game world with a standard animation of V sitting down. It might not be used a whole lot, but since the feature is already implemented and they still have to add all the chairs to the world, it shouldn't be that huge a problem.

The biggest issue, is that the food/drink system is not very well implemented in the game, to the point where it is useless. If they however had made sure that it was and eating and drinking for instance lasted a lot longer, so you only had to eat and drink a few time a day, but the benefits were much greater and had a much higher cost than it has now, it could be a useful feature in my opinion. Like certain food increasing "Amount of street cred earn" others "Chance to critical strike" and so forth, but you could only have one of these buffs at the time. But the various systems in the game doesn't really play well together, like food being made obsolete simply from being able to spam healing items.

I'm not saying nothing matters, I'm saying the game doesn't suck, just because you can't sit everywhere. When you add a feature, you decide how it effects the game, and the costs (development time and also ingame resources). Food could easily have mattered more, but they probably decided managing food buffs or rebuffs wasn't that fun. So the food is mostly just for flavor/setting but if you want to use it, it gives a significant general buff. I did use a lot of food early in my first playthrough though because I was underpowered. As for sitting, there may be resource costs for interactables, and there is also UI effects, such as clutter for F key interactions. Having more F key things makes it harder to move/pick up/interact with npcs. So they measure that versus making more sitable objects.


different yellow options actually do matter by the way, and while there would be more unknown if you didn't know which options would make the convo progress to a different path, there's also an advantage that the player can feel safe sometimes to get more info. Also for those that want to go faster, they can. It has pluses and minuses

 

[Mentos3]

what i would like to see... is the new explorer gameversion ubisoft put in AC Odyssey and Valhalla
a map without quest symbols...
you get the quest while getting close to them

it did feal bad in AC... but i think it would be great in Cyberpunk

Why it feel bad in AC? I like it and -in this point I'm D'Accord with you- it would've been nice for CP, too (and a few other map/questlog-improvements).
What is the diffenerence? Tell me

 

[Aasimar-X]

Why it feel bad in AC? I like it and -in this point I'm D'Accord with you- it would've been nice for CP, too (and a few other map/questlog-improvements).
What is the diffenerence? Tell me

dunno... maybe its the setting
you get a call from a fixer/NCPD when your in the neighborhood
you run/drive around a lot in cyberpunk...
would have also be nice the otherway around.. like hey Wakako.. do you have a job for me...
but i know thats not the way fixer work... a fixer picks the right runner for the client

in AC you also run around a lot...
but for me it did feal like.. i only go there to see if something is there...
dunno.. hard to discribe...
but some places in AC where so far off the routes that you would normaly not travel there...

 

[ArvGuy]

I guess its because I played the game differently than you.
my first char was almost all hand to hand, and a crafter. I looked at the crafting system and realized you can get more parts than you spend if you craft smart, and turn parts into whatever you need.

sadly I didn't realize you couldn't craft cyberware, so my first damage upgrade, gorilla arms wouldn't be available until street cred 20. So basically, loot barely mattered, it was mostly for parts/money, and if I really needed to I could make parts, quests generally gave enough money since I didnt need to buy stuff often.

so I upgraded every once in awhile, and generally enjoyed trying to come up with builds. in my other playthroughs, I figured out the game, and you can basically find legendary gear and iconics from specific content that you upgrade/change mods, so loot ain't that important even for gun chars I played.

as for the side quests, I realized blues are essentially unecessary, and didnt just look at quests as being about killing, most of them are little mini stories that give you insight into the world and npc lives. you read emails, over hear convos and read shards. So for me each quest was the puzzle of how to survive a gunfight with just fists, and figuring out what the story was on each case. I also mostly do quests as I feel interested, not as a checklist, so its mostly exploration for me, when they get kinda rote, I do something more focused

I still haven't done everything because I made new chars, different builds/identities, and usually ended the story around level 30-35. It was surprising how things take on a new light when I played dif. Its also surprising how things changed without you knowing. Meredith is killed if you don't side with her(you can find the body). If you tell Anna the cops betrayed her, she apparently goes to war with them instead of or in addition to skipping town. Many npcs get cemetery stones if they died. I could threaten woodsman that he'd end up like jotaro, if I did that quest.

for me the games got a lot to delve into, I learn new things all the time and a lot of different ways to approach things. Its not infinite, but I'm generally amazed how much work was put in. There are definite flaws, lots of perks/items don't work, shops crafting recipes are bugged. Can't replay a lot of side stuff you might want to, like competitions. The main story is really dense after the first time, and not as skippable as I'd like. There's also ways I'd improve/expand some of the content but overall, the game ranks high for me.

My first V was a gunner. Started out wanting to go the assault rifle path, but pistolero was just too crazy. Then she came upon those tech revolvers. Ping plus tech revolver pistolero. Then she stumbled over the hammer. GG, hostile people. For a while. Then I ran to a different area and hostile people started resisting those headshots. And from then on it is somewhat perdictable.

My second V is a quickhacker. Not very dependant on weapons, really. Anything works with legendary short circuit, and contagion doesn't care about weapons, reboot optics doesn't care, system reset doesn't care. But it's hard to not pick up all that stuff and then eventually the inventory fills up and you get stuck with a choice of whether to keep using the cool iconic for style or some random weapon that just dropped that has way higher DPS. Or maybe branch into some other weapon, because why not have a bit of change?

But in both cases I end up with the same problem of the game making it hard to build an identity around a particular piece of equipment. The first character is at a direct disadvantage when doing so, the other totally bypasses the whole concept of skill so aggressively that everything is super effective.

Johnny has a special gun. Lizzie has a special gun. Why can't V?

 

[Ayinde_Palmer]

My first V was a gunner. Started out wanting to go the assault rifle path, but pistolero was just too crazy. Then she came upon those tech revolvers. Ping plus tech revolver pistolero. Then she stumbled over the hammer. GG, hostile people. For a while. Then I ran to a different area and hostile people started resisting those headshots. And from then on it is somewhat perdictable.

My second V is a quickhacker. Not very dependant on weapons, really. Anything works with legendary short circuit, and contagion doesn't care about weapons, reboot optics doesn't care, system reset doesn't care. But it's hard to not pick up all that stuff and then eventually the inventory fills up and you get stuck with a choice of whether to keep using the cool iconic for style or some random weapon that just dropped that has way higher DPS. Or maybe branch into some other weapon, because why not have a bit of change?

But in both cases I end up with the same problem of the game making it hard to build an identity around a particular piece of equipment. The first character is at a direct disadvantage when doing so, the other totally bypasses the whole concept of skill so aggressively that everything is super effective.

Johnny has a special gun. Lizzie has a special gun. Why can't V?

gear is upgradeable even with no crafting, though I will say its currently implemented poorly outside of iconics, because you can never upgrade # slots, and upgrading base stats is really expensive the higher you go past picking it up. Turns out though even the non iconics tend to have unique properties, where you may prefer them to Iconics.

if I was trying to mod it, I'd probably make the item cost for upgrading be fixed based on item level instead of number of upgrades, and overall lower the costs. Id also add a reroll upgrade that rerolls slots and other randomized stats

if I was going to redesign it, id have all the bonuses be customizable, and sure why not nameable, and choose some of the skins

But yeah usually I end up settling on a weapon for awhile. Upgrading it, or crafting new versions of it. For me loot is basically money or part fodder. If I get crafting I hunt specs, when I don't have crafting, I usually target a specific weapon. And at certain parts of the game I just stop picking it up, if I don't need money. Kinda sucks that loot is kinda meh most times, but I prefer that over it being super important for the game. Plus, people who don't play like me may actually use them

And yeah, I quit my damage quick hacking char because it made encounters boring. But some people love that style. Its good to have options. Id say for quick hacker though, the cyberware, and quickhacks matter, so thats the upgrades that are cool for that style.

But yeah its really up to the player to find the right lines on being OP, and set their own rules for combat, there are definitely styles that get powerful with very little investment/difficulty

 

[Mobster100]

I'm not saying nothing matters, I'm saying the game doesn't suck, just because you can't sit everywhere. When you add a feature, you decide how it effects the game, and the costs (development time and also ingame resources). Food could easily have mattered more, but they probably decided managing food buffs or rebuffs wasn't that fun. So the food is mostly just for flavor/setting but if you want to use it, it gives a significant general buff. I did use a lot of food early in my first playthrough though because I was underpowered. As for sitting, there may be resource costs for interactables, and there is also UI effects, such as clutter for F key interactions. Having more F key things makes it harder to move/pick up/interact with npcs. So they measure that versus making more sitable objects.


different yellow options actually do matter by the way, and while there would be more unknown if you didn't know which options would make the convo progress to a different path, there's also an advantage that the player can feel safe sometimes to get more info. Also for those that want to go faster, they can. It has pluses and minuses

But if you as V had to only eat two times a day and you received a buff from it, then to me at least it wouldn't be annoying and the buff would be meaningful, compared to just healing a bit and it lasting 7 minutes or how long it is now. The two system wouldn't interfere with each other, one is for healing the other is for a buff, which could work together with whatever build you are going, or it could be more of a general buff, but that is for you as player to decide.

Often when people criticize the game, it quickly gets misunderstood as them thinking that the game is just awful. I don't think that is the case, I really enjoyed most of my time in the game, but I also want to be realistic and say that it could be so much more than it is. Which is not to be understood as me wanting to have a go at it, but because I want them to improve it and make it into a much better experience than what it is.

In my opinion all the random food or almost all of it that you collect from the game should be removed and moved to the food stands. V shouldn't be a character collecting or "marking" stuff like that as being worth picking up. Instead items you picked up should or could be various components that you could use for crafting, meaning expand this system a great deal, so its not only "common", "uncommon" etc. components, but a lot more detailed, both in regards to armor, weapons and ammunition, grenades etc. Could even add a system such as found in Fallout 4, where you could track them. Other items could be valuables which you would simply sell for money, not like ashtrays etc. But stuff that would make sense to have a value in CP, maybe insider documents that you could sell to some groups of people, some more general that you sell to everyone, quest items and so forth.

Even broken implants, you could sell to ripperdocs, rare BDs you sell to those that deals with them. It just all very generic at the moment with no depth to it. You normally find like 100s of more or less the same weapons and armors, just with a different color and slightly better stats decided by your level.

Street creds, doesn't really have any purpose in the game, besides being a hidden "progression" wall, ripperdocs ought to be interested in selling their stuff to people, that is after all how they make a living, so the implants might as well be "locked" behind a price wall rather than street cred. They also talked about there being "blackmarket" ripperdocs in the game, haven't really noticed any of those that sell special stuff. They could add those as well, and you could earn trust with them, either by doing missions for them making you do some shady things or make it so you could get them through other means, like striking a deal with Militech or whoever sell them, if the player don't want V to do bad things. So many options for expanding on things and make them more interesting in my opinion.

In regards to dialogs, I honestly, think that CDPR should simply say, that if people just want to rush through our game, well then maybe the game is not for them and they can play GTA or something else. This is a RPG game with complex mechanics for a specific group of people that enjoy these things. To me that is one of the issues, that they want to satisfy everyone, but land somewhere in the middle of not really satisfying anyone, because those that want a nice action game, complain about the shooting mechanics. Personally I think the shooting is fine and enjoy it, except for the smart and tech weapons and the quickhacking as these systems are broken in my opinion. But for regular weapons I think it's fine. The driving mechanics works fine for me as well (driving in 1st person), except the minimap being zoomed in to much and I would prefer having a line showing me where to go when I look out the window, so I don't have to keep looking at the minimap.

But since they have aimed at all possible groups, people will complain about everything, and to me I want to stick to what they said the game original would be, which is RPG first and action later. So for me, the action part of the game is ok to be a bit below standard if it improves the RPG aspect of the game. I never wanted CP to be another GTA game, but a complex and in depth RPG game where choice matters much more than they do now. I don't want to be handheld through the dialog of which options will get me as quickly as possible through the dialog as possible. I want to make the choices that I think is right at the moment, based on what makes sense and not because one option is marked blue and the other yellow.

 

[Ayinde_Palmer]

But if you as V had to only eat two times a day and you received a buff from it, then to me at least it wouldn't be annoying and the buff would be meaningful, compared to just healing a bit and it lasting 7 minutes or how long it is now. The two system wouldn't interfere with each other, one is for healing the other is for a buff, which could work together with whatever build you are going, or it could be more of a general buff, but that is for you as player to decide.

Often when people criticize the game, it quickly gets misunderstood as them thinking that the game is just awful. I don't think that is the case, I really enjoyed most of my time in the game, but I also want to be realistic and say that it could be so much more than it is. Which is not to be understood as me wanting to have a go at it, but because I want them to improve it and make it into a much better experience than what it is.

In my opinion all the random food or almost all of it that you collect from the game should be removed and moved to the food stands. V shouldn't be a character collecting or "marking" stuff like that as being worth picking up. Instead items you picked up should or could be various components that you could use for crafting, meaning expand this system a great deal, so its not only "common", "uncommon" etc. components, but a lot more detailed, both in regards to armor, weapons and ammunition, grenades etc. Could even add a system such as found in Fallout 4, where you could track them. Other items could be valuables which you would simply sell for money, not like ashtrays etc. But stuff that would make sense to have a value in CP, maybe insider documents that you could sell to some groups of people, some more general that you sell to everyone, quest items and so forth.

Even broken implants, you could sell to ripperdocs, rare BDs you sell to those that deals with them. It just all very generic at the moment with no depth to it. You normally find like 100s of more or less the same weapons and armors, just with a different color and slightly better stats decided by your level.

Street creds, doesn't really have any purpose in the game, besides being a hidden "progression" wall, ripperdocs ought to be interested in selling their stuff to people, that is after all how they make a living, so the implants might as well be "locked" behind a price wall rather than street cred. They also talked about there being "blackmarket" ripperdocs in the game, haven't really noticed any of those that sell special stuff. They could add those as well, and you could earn trust with them, either by doing missions for them making you do some shady things or make it so you could get them through other means, like striking a deal with Militech or whoever sell them, if the player don't want V to do bad things. So many options for expanding on things and make them more interesting in my opinion.

In regards to dialogs, I honestly, think that CDPR should simply say, that if people just want to rush through our game, well then maybe the game is not for them and they can play GTA or something else. This is a RPG game with complex mechanics for a specific group of people that enjoy these things. To me that is one of the issues, that they want to satisfy everyone, but land somewhere in the middle of not really satisfying anyone, because those that want a nice action game, complain about the shooting mechanics. Personally I think the shooting is fine and enjoy it, except for the smart and tech weapons and the quickhacking as these systems are broken in my opinion. But for regular weapons I think it's fine. The driving mechanics works fine for me as well (driving in 1st person), except the minimap being zoomed in to much and I would prefer having a line showing me where to go when I look out the window, so I don't have to keep looking at the minimap.

But since they have aimed at all possible groups, people will complain about everything, and to me I want to stick to what they said the game original would be, which is RPG first and action later. So for me, the action part of the game is ok to be a bit below standard if it improves the RPG aspect of the game. I never wanted CP to be another GTA game, but a complex and in depth RPG game where choice matters much more than they do now. I don't want to be handheld through the dialog of which options will get me as quickly as possible through the dialog as possible. I want to make the choices that I think is right at the moment, based on what makes sense and not because one option is marked blue and the other yellow.

I like crafting in many games, and while this one has flaws, I don't like the very specific crafting systems, so while for you thats a plus, for me it would be a minus. You tend to get tons of items you don't need, cluttering inventory, and searching for something specific. Also, I look at this as being more Sci fi, and you breaking stuff down into chemical parts, which something else can use thats like a more advanced 3d printer. One of the radio News ads even mentions they have an even more advanced one that can create whatever you can imagine.

the streetcred only items are considered black market items, or items only reserved for special people. It actually turns out that most the cyberware we use isn't readily available, some corporate people describe us as having corporate level implants. And thats why npcs will run and yell cyberpsycho if you hoverjump and powerjump. Its also why Victor doesn't have much good cyberware, because he refuses to buy from scavs and shady dealers. Pacifica cyberdoc usually only sells to vdbs, and he has a bunch of exclusive int/netrunner based goods. So while they don't explicitly tell you, they are selling you rare stuff, and certain goods only corporations keep for themselves

I think that smart weapons and quickhacking, though OP are added for RPG purposes, they offer certain players a more narrative based fighting solution that don't require great skills, or responses. Having read a lot of peoples responses, I have also realized that many people have a newer, more specific understanding of what rpg means, that is not what it has meant before. This is probably why many people feel they were lied to, because they interpret rpg as something else. Most people here seem to think of rpg, as what I would call sandbox. And some others think rpg means the game should have an immense amount of branching options to be called rpg. (which I personally have never played, most rpgs i played have similar level to this game)

I think, based on the number of people saying this, the community may need to get some new words to describe games, maybe rpg means something new now.

also I didnt really notice what blue and yellow means, and I don't think it matters much, i still pick whatever fits what I think the character would say. After all, its not new that somethings move the convo forward and others provide new information. The only difference is its more clear. There are blue convos that lead to new dialog anyhow. There is also pre existing knowledge opening up new options, some blue and some yellow. Like, I read the email, or You heard what happened to Jotaro, etc. The convo choices In this game are way deeper/more nuanced than I'm used to in other games like mass effect or skyrim. There even convos that only appear depending on how you act, like if you were in stealth, or choked someone out, or if you don't pass a certain area. Or if you say nothing at all.

 

[CS554]

I think, based on the number of people saying this, the community may need to get some new words to describe games, maybe rpg means something new now.

I think it might be for the better if we kept our focus on mechanics and functions. Like what enable what.

I recall reading Mass Effect forums back in the day and this all "what is an RPG" and what is this and that meta were very present there back then and I don't know if all that discussion achieved anything ever.

For me for example, gun play, even with some perks in Annihilation tree doesn't work, I really enjoyed how I could build very effective character for close quarters combat, I could one shot / two shot enemies even on last stages. I prefer combat that doesn't drag forever with bullet spong enemies.

So what's called then, who's interpretation we are using of what? There is this whole thing "I think Van Gogh is, like totally Art Deco, because I came up with some very convoluted excuse" or "because I just can feel that in my head man, must be right".

We can get dragged into these battles forever, but I'm failing to understand how any of this can provide feedback that could be actually useful to enhance player experience.

 

[Mobster100]

I like crafting in many games, and while this one has flaws, I don't like the very specific crafting systems, so while for you thats a plus, for me it would be a minus. You tend to get tons of items you don't need, cluttering inventory, and searching for something specific. Also, I look at this as being more Sci fi, and you breaking stuff down into chemical parts, which something else can use thats like a more advanced 3d printer. One of the radio News ads even mentions they have an even more advanced one that can create whatever you can imagine.

I don't like the crafting system in CP, first of all because its to slow and restricted. Had to mod it to make it even slightly possible to work with. But even when you have crafting materials in CP you either hit a level wall or it becomes so expensive compared to simply using a weapon you found.

Its also why Victor doesn't have much good cyberware, because he refuses to buy from scavs and shady dealers. Pacifica cyberdoc usually only sells to vdbs, and he has a bunch of exclusive int/netrunner based goods. So while they don't explicitly tell you, they are selling you rare stuff, and certain goods only corporations keep for themselves

Im pretty sure that is incorrect, he sells all the stuff like mantis blade, nanowire and the different legs etc. They might be poor quality, but this is what he sells:

Arms

Rare
Item	Requirements	Description
Gorilla Arms	Cost: $15,250 20 Street Cred	66-81 Damage +27-33 Physical Damage 2.50 Attack Speed +10% Bleeding Chance Gorilla Arms charge with each attack. When you perform a strong attack they deal bonus damage based on the charge level. You can also force open locked doors and rip turrets from their bases
Mantis Blades	Cost: $15,350 20 Street Cred	61-75 Damage +33-40 Physical Damage 2 Attack Speed +10% Bleeding Chance Mantis Blades allow you to slice and dice your enemies, they also unlock the ability to leap towards a target and deal massive damage.
Monowire	Cost: $15,450 20 Street Cred	98-120 Damage +40-49 Physical Damage 2.50 Attack Speed +10% Bleeding Chance The Monowire charged when equipped but not used in combat. Attacks with a charged wire deal bonus damage based on the charge level, and charge level declines with each attack.
Projectile Launch System	Cost: $15,450 20 Street Cred	Requires Smart Link Cyberware to use The Projectile Launcher allows you to unleash various powerful projectiles dealing various types of damage as well as causing explosions and applying status effects. Explodes on impact and deals major physical damage. Charged shots increase damage, the explosion radius and chance to dismember.

Legs

Rare
Item	Requirements	Description
Reinforced Tendons	Cost: $45,000	Press jump while in midair to perform a double jump
Fortified Ankles	Cost: $45,000	Hold Jump to charge the power of the jump, and then release to jump further

This is probably why many people feel they were lied to, because they interpret rpg as something else.

I think people feel lied to, because of what the trailers and information given to us by CDPR said. If you look at these trailers, its like they are talking about a completely different game, compared to what is actually in it. At least to me, that is what annoys me, not their definition of what an RPG game is suppose to be.

I think the definitions of what an RPG game is, is fairly straightforward, and to me its best illustrated by looking at different games and how the studios have decided to categorize them on Steam:

TITLE: Grand Theft Auto V
GENRE: Action Games, Adventure

TITLE: Fallout 4
GENRE: RPG

TITLE: Divinity: Original Sin 2 - Definitive Edition
GENRE: Adventure, RPG, Strategy

TITLE: Cyberpunk 2077
GENRE: RPG

Common for all the RPG titles is character creation and that you can develop them. Some people might have issues correctly categorizing them, but I don't think the genre should change due to that, then people ought to learn what the difference is. What makes GTA different from Fallout 4 for instance? The Witcher and so forth.

Sandbox doesn't really have anything to do with RPG, again GTA is sandbox but an adventure game.

 

[Ayinde_Palmer]

I don't like the crafting system in CP, first of all because its to slow and restricted. Had to mod it to make it even slightly possible to work with. But even when you have crafting materials in CP you either hit a level wall or it becomes so expensive compared to simply using a weapon you found.


Im pretty sure that is incorrect, he sells all the stuff like mantis blade, nanowire and the different legs etc. They might be poor quality, but this is what he sells:

Arms

Item	Requirements	Description
Rare
Gorilla Arms	Cost: $15,250 20 Street Cred	66-81 Damage +27-33 Physical Damage 2.50 Attack Speed +10% Bleeding Chance Gorilla Arms charge with each attack. When you perform a strong attack they deal bonus damage based on the charge level. You can also force open locked doors and rip turrets from their bases
Mantis Blades	Cost: $15,350 20 Street Cred	61-75 Damage +33-40 Physical Damage 2 Attack Speed +10% Bleeding Chance Mantis Blades allow you to slice and dice your enemies, they also unlock the ability to leap towards a target and deal massive damage.
Monowire	Cost: $15,450 20 Street Cred	98-120 Damage +40-49 Physical Damage 2.50 Attack Speed +10% Bleeding Chance The Monowire charged when equipped but not used in combat. Attacks with a charged wire deal bonus damage based on the charge level, and charge level declines with each attack.
Projectile Launch System	Cost: $15,450 20 Street Cred	Requires Smart Link Cyberware to use The Projectile Launcher allows you to unleash various powerful projectiles dealing various types of damage as well as causing explosions and applying status effects. Explodes on impact and deals major physical damage. Charged shots increase damage, the explosion radius and chance to dismember.

Legs

Item	Requirements	Description
Rare
Reinforced Tendons	Cost: $45,000	Press jump while in midair to perform a double jump
Fortified Ankles	Cost: $45,000	Hold Jump to charge the power of the jump, and then release to jump further

I think people feel lied to, because of what the trailers and information given to us by CDPR said. If you look at these trailers, its like they are talking about a completely different game, compared to what is actually in it. At least to me, that is what annoys me, not their definition of what an RPG game is suppose to be.

I think the definitions of what an RPG game is, is fairly straightforward, and to me its best illustrated by looking at different games and how the studios have decided to categorize them on Steam:

TITLE: Grand Theft Auto V
GENRE: Action Games, Adventure

TITLE: Fallout 4
GENRE: RPG

TITLE: Divinity: Original Sin 2 - Definitive Edition
GENRE: Adventure, RPG, Strategy

TITLE: Cyberpunk 2077
GENRE: RPG

Common for all the RPG titles is character creation and that you can develop them. Some people might have issues correctly categorizing them, but I don't think the genre should change due to that, then people ought to learn what the difference is. What makes GTA different from Fallout 4 for instance? The Witcher and so forth.

Sandbox doesn't really have anything to do with RPG, again GTA is sandbox but an adventure game.

also in rpg is every final fantasy game, xenogears, chrono trigger, near automata, monster hunter world.... clearly its a big category, but whatevs

uhh, id say my choices and char creation potential was way greater here than divinity, and I really enjoyed divinity.

as for Viktor, hes got no legendaries, only a few epics. And there's an email from some scavs were he threatens to break their faces if they come around offering parts again. But the overall point is the level of cybernetics available to us is abnormal. We have MAX ATTACK level cybernetics, and they are seen as unstoppable killers. The guy in rivers quest with inexplicably high end parts, that implies he must have had a rich/connected backer, is basically some mantis blades. We generally go toe to toe with cyberpychos that have clearly killed multiple well trained people, LT mower? thats just some tech EMP joints, we can buy those. How many cops we see hover jumping? Gorilla Arms usually only on corporate security.

There are also specific quests only triggered by how much street cred we have.

Post automatically merged: Jan 17, 2021

I think it might be for the better if we kept our focus on mechanics and functions. Like what enable what.

I recall reading Mass Effect forums back in the day and this all "what is an RPG" and what is this and that meta were very present there back then and I don't know if all that discussion achieved anything ever.

For me for example, gun play, even with some perks in Annihilation tree doesn't work, I really enjoyed how I could build very effective character for close quarters combat, I could one shot / two shot enemies even on last stages. I prefer combat that doesn't drag forever with bullet spong enemies.

So what's called then, who's interpretation we are using of what? There is this whole thing "I think Van Gogh is, like totally Art Deco, because I came up with some very convoluted excuse" or "because I just can feel that in my head man, must be right".

We can get dragged into these battles forever, but I'm failing to understand how any of this can provide feedback that could be actually useful to enhance player experience.

my main point wasn't someone is right and someone is wrong, but more that everybody has a different understanding of the same words, which leads some people to feel lied to. They showed gameplay thats pretty much what we got, but the words is where people understood something different

anyhow, you are right, regardless we can't change or probably even agree on terms just by ourselves, it just evolves over time

As to the mechanics, I never went indepth with shotguns or the machineguns, I would imagine they can be OP if built right, everything else I tried could. I'll give it a shot. Might be due to headshot being the focus of most Guns...

 

[CS554]

my main point wasn't someone is right and someone is wrong, but more that everybody has a different understanding of the same words, which leads some people to feel lied to. They showed gameplay thats pretty much what we got, but the words is where people understood something different

anyhow, you are right, regardless we can't change or probably even agree on terms just by ourselves, it just evolves over time

I wasn't criticizing you by any means. I was just trying to point out that discussion about what terms mean has been going on for years and I guess it will.

Single player story driven games I suppose has always had this, no definitive cornerstone. Racing, planes, in the end always comes down to is physics. Multiplayer shooters, it's about builds and so on.

What I have been following this discussion, OP just wanted to express his opinion, I was very glad to see that and then there were other people too. No product can ever be enhanced based entirely on negative critique. For a lot of people what this game has to offer, it has worked.

 

[Mobster100]

my main point wasn't someone is right and someone is wrong, but more that everybody has a different understanding of the same words, which leads some people to feel lied to. They showed gameplay thats pretty much what we got, but the words is where people understood something different

I think it depends on how willing people are to compromise with what they said to be honest.
I have created a small video here with some of the things that were said in the trailers, and I honestly don't think people can argue against it. They might be willing to accept or ignore it, but the general understanding of what is said here, is that choices matters a lot. Which we know they don't, we also know that the crowd system is not very complex compared to other games. No one forced them to say these things, but they did and that is what they wanted people to know. And anyone interested in RPG are going to react to these statements, because most find these extremely important in RPG games.

 

[CS554]

I didn't watch the video, I don't see the relevance for my situation. I haven't followed gaming media for ages and while I was aware of Cyberpunk 2077 for years, I didn't follow the hype. My experience with game, it is what it is, it doesn't retroactively change no matter what was possibly promised or not.

There is work to be done though. I have made few posts to relevant topics, but say high body mid damage shotgun / LMG build with a lot of staying power, might work out just fine, once they fix perks.

Such build could be very good for elder gamers, or people who don't shooters that much, as it would be slowly plodding your way areas, but it wouldn't be as essentially reaction sensitive as some other builds.

 

[Ayinde_Palmer]

I think it depends on how willing people are to compromise with what they said to be honest.
I have created a small video here with some of the things that were said in the trailers, and I honestly don't think people can argue against it. They might be willing to accept or ignore it, but the general understanding of what is said here, is that choices matters a lot. Which we know they don't, we also know that the crowd system is not very complex compared to other games. No one forced them to say these things, but they did and that is what they wanted people to know. And anyone interested in RPG are going to react to these statements, because most find these extremely important in RPG games.

uh the ones they show do have effects, if you choose to pay Royce, or reveal the tracer militech attacks, maelstrom team up with you Meredith dies, (no one night fling)Royce is at the club in the final chapter. Or you can give them the bad credit, gilshrist dies you fight maelstrom and Royce in a giant robot. You can free brick and he helps you in the club. You can kill Royce for pulling a gun on you. VDB you can side with netwatch, they raid and kill the vdbs, you can side with vdbs then kill them yourself, you can walk away and leave em be.. These are actually examples of decisions you make that effect the game world.

 

[I_Willenbrock_I]

uh the ones they show do have effects, if you choose to pay Royce, or reveal the tracer militech attacks, maelstrom team up with you Meredith dies, (no one night fling)Royce is at the club in the final chapter. Or you can give them the bad credit, gilshrist dies you fight maelstrom and Royce in a giant robot. You can free brick and he helps you in the club. You can kill Royce for pulling a gun on you. VDB you can side with netwatch, they raid and kill the vdbs, you can side with vdbs then kill them yourself, you can walk away and leave em be.. These are actually examples of decisions you make that effect the game world.

And how do those decisions influence later gameplay?
I mean. Aside from possibly getting the "best" katana in the game? You see them in the Totentanz iirc but the story does not significantly change, because all this characters are throwaway characters.

 

[Ayinde_Palmer]

And how do those decisions influence later gameplay?
I mean. Aside from possibly getting the "best" katana in the game? You see them in the Totentanz iirc but the story does not significantly change, because all this characters are throwaway characters.

the story takes place over 1-3 months, not everything you do effects you directly or you can easily see results, but effects the world. If you see everyone except V as a throw away character, and nothing that happens to other groups as mattering, than yeah it doesn't matter.

But I would say destroying the top leaders of the VDBs would be pretty noticeable for the people of Pacifica, Who I hear will be agro after. Meredith dying, is a pretty big effect for that character's story. Royce's leadership style vs Brick. Pan am never leaves the aldecados, and you change the whole course of their path. Tygers or independent clouds(deaths of Tom and roxy), and wether Judy leaves or stays. Delamain reset, dead with 7 crazy AI roaming the world, or fused together with something to accomplish past the blackwall.

I get that you look at it as, if this doesn't directly impact my character's short term story to a large extent, it doesn't matter but it sure impacts the world.

 

[Mobster100]

uh the ones they show do have effects, if you choose to pay Royce, or reveal the tracer militech attacks, maelstrom team up with you Meredith dies, (no one night fling)Royce is at the club in the final chapter. Or you can give them the bad credit, gilshrist dies you fight maelstrom and Royce in a giant robot. You can free brick and he helps you in the club. You can kill Royce for pulling a gun on you. VDB you can side with netwatch, they raid and kill the vdbs, you can side with vdbs then kill them yourself, you can walk away and leave em be.. These are actually examples of decisions you make that effect the game world.

I know that these specific quests have certain impacts on the game and might slightly change things, which is really cool and exactly in line with what you would expect from what the speaker is saying.

The issue is that these are presented as if it is the norm, with comments like "And this is just one quest", "Shows how complex the quest can be in Cyberpunk", "Every choice you make will change how the game plays out" that to me is extremely misleading, remember we as player only know what is told to us in these trailers at this moment in time or what other information CDPR gives us.

Its sort of like me making a game and tell you that in my game there is the most complex character customization in a RPG game to date and whatever you choose will severely change how your character plays throughout the game. And then when I release the game, none of these things have any impact in the game whatsoever except for one or two quests. The rest of the quests simply uses a 50% chance of going your way or not, regardless of what stats you chose. Then that would be misleading as well and you would expect these stats to play a significant role in the game, because that was what I told you.

Otherwise I should have said that for a few quests, these stats will matter, but for the most part they don't.-

If you look at the trailer from Divinity you can see how you sell your game with accurate information, if you have played the game I think you would agree that it is pretty much spot on:

 

[I_Willenbrock_I]

the story takes place over 1-3 months, not everything you do effects you directly or you can easily see results, but effects the world. If you see everyone except V as a throw away character, and nothing that happens to other groups as mattering, than yeah it doesn't matter.

But I would say destroying the top leaders of the VDBs would be pretty noticeable for the people of Pacifica. Meredith dying, is a pretty big effect for that character's story. Royce's leadership style vs Brick. Pan am never leaves the aldecados, and you change the whole course of their path. Tygers or independent clouds(deaths of Tom and roxy), and wether Judy leaves or stays. Delamain reset, dead with 7 crazy AI roaming the world, or fused together with something to accomplish past the blackwall.

I get that you look at it as, if this doesn't directly impact my character's short term story to a large extent, it doesn't matter but it sure impacts the world.

Nope.
Unless you needed 2 to 10 weeks to get the prologue and act one done.

You have one or two weeks according to Vic. Did you even listen to what people in the game tell you?

And no. The effect of not helping Stout is not having a one night stand. That's it. Militech plays no deeper role in the upcoming missions.

 

[Ayinde_Palmer]

Nope.
Unless you needed 2 to 10 weeks to get the prologue and act one done.

You have one or two weeks according to Vic. Did you even listen to what people in the game tell you?

And no. The effect of not helping Stout is not having a one night stand. That's it. Militech plays no deeper role in the upcoming missions.

like I said, you only consider what directly effects you, not the game world, or characters. I consider screwing the whole community of Pacifica, and handing netwatch a huge win, a pretty big deal.

Also, Vic assumes two weeks, he gives a rough guess. There is no way Vic could know exact time, its not a time bomb. And its not something he even fully understands.

If you count all the wait a days, and do all content, it probably goes over two weeks. the other two weeks, is how long id guess the lockdown lasts. But I guess you could do that part fast, or slow.

 

[I_Willenbrock_I]

like I said, you only consider what directly effects you, not the game world, or characters. I consider screwing the whole community of Pacifica, and handing netwatch a huge win, a pretty big deal.

Also, Vic assumes two weeks, he gives a rough guess. There is no way Vic could know exact time, its not a time bomb. And its not something he even fully understands.

If you count all the wait a days, and do all content, it probably goes over two weeks. the other two weeks, is how long id guess the lockdown lasts. But I guess you could do that part fast, or slow.

But it has no impact on the game.
It does not matter if you help netwatch or the voodoo boys, because the game World does not change in the game. Your headcanon does not make it real in the game.

Saying that Vic is wrong with his assumption (after scanning you) is simply ignoring what the game tells you. Especially when you take into account that hellman says the same thing.