Worries For Character Creation

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You can see your body, legs, and hands when you look down. This is not a floating camera.

I know what they said. I don't believe it yet based on what I have seen so far and feel it might be shelved at the end. I hope I am wrong but I just don't believe it.
 
I know what they said. I don't believe it yet based on what I have seen so far and feel it might be shelved at the end. I hope I am wrong but I just don't believe it.

Uhm. Okay. There's no conceivable reason for them to shelve it, though, and there's nothing we've seen that suggests this isn't the case.

If you've already modeled and animated the body and legs (which they have), why on earth would you back out of a statement like this? This is such a weird fear.
 
Sept 5/18 Kyle Rowley: "You can see your feet (And body) but we don't allow prone atm. "

I don`t think this ( and a lot of statements ) is clear , is this looking down or when sliding ?

This is the statement I have heard and one other by Rowley, and my interpretation so far is that you will be able to see your feet and body for preset animations like sliding, sitting in certain cutscenes like the ripper doc and taxi ride we saw, and so forth, but not just standing still in the city looking down at any time you want. (prone V with no movement just trying to look at ground) In the first gameplay demo on more than one occasion V looks down towards say a dead body that was shot and you never see her feet once. You can interpret it other ways though.
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Uhm. Okay. There's no conceivable reason for them to shelve it, though, and there's nothing we've seen that suggests this isn't the case.

We've seen nothing to indicate they have actually done this yet. All down looks are preset animations and not natural in gameplay yet at all. The statements - at least the two I have seen - are also clear hedges without being very specific and clear what it actually means to see feet/body. If it involved 100% POV down at all times to see your body/feet while walking anywhere in the game world (to see that at all times basically) they would say so in that specific way. Also, easiest things to shelve with time running short are things like V's animations for her hands manipulating things versus just a click, and dealing with POV animations that can be simplified or changed that don't really hurt the story. (and it wouldn't so it's something you can shelve)
 
This is the statement I have heard and one other by Rowley, and my interpretation so far is that you will be able to see your feet and body for preset animations like sliding, sitting in certain cutscenes like the ripper doc and taxi ride we saw, and so forth, but not just standing still in the city looking down at any time you want. (prone V with no movement just trying to look at ground) In the first gameplay demo on more than one occasion V looks down towards say a dead body that was shot and you never see her feet once. You can interpret it other ways though.
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We've seen nothing to indicate they have actually done this yet. All down looks are preset animations and not natural in gameplay yet at all. The statements - at least the two I have seen - are also clear hedges without being very specific and clear what it actually means to see feet/body. If it involved 100% POV down at all times to see your body/feet while walking anywhere in the game world (to see that at all times basically) they would say so in that specific way. Also, easiest things to shelve with time running short are things like V's animations for her hands manipulating things versus just a click, and dealing with POV animations that can be simplified or changed that don't really hurt the story. (and it wouldn't so it's something you can shelve)

If you say so.
 
Sept 5/18 Kyle Rowley: "You can see your feet (And body) but we don't allow prone atm. "

I don`t think this ( and a lot of statements ) is clear , is this looking down or when sliding ?

I'll add briefly that one other possible iteration to interpret "prone" is that if V stops moving, your legs and feet disappear but if you start walking again, you might possibly then again see your body/feet as the perspective tweaks once you start moving. So that is certainly another way to possibly interpret it.
 
Did you draw that? :oops:
I wish! Pinterest is a wonderful place my friend. Where great artist 👩‍🎨 thrive! Exotics done right! I was really hoping that V could become an Exotic too. In part to see how her friends and family would react to the change in her appearance...

44151AFA-AAE7-4A3C-B8FF-10511F2AB960.jpeg
49D15270-53F8-4096-A9EE-3595A0E8E7B8.jpeg
ADB9B7EE-C65D-4AC6-A3EC-C3B0BD628144.jpeg
A48187EA-7B49-4B28-97F1-724A52E87DA8.jpeg

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I'm kind of already assuming I will not be able to see my character third-person except in menus or a mirror (no cutscenes at all with dialogue and maybe tiny snippets with preset cut scenes only like when you first enter apartment perhaps) and I also already assume I will not be able to look down all the time at my body/legs/feet at all (except preset animations in specific situations like vaulting, sitting down for specific scenes, etc) while just walking normally, so I am really not too concerned about character customization that much right now. I think character customization is less important the less often you will actually see your character.

I haven't even seen the simple act of V's hands manipulating like say elevator buttons (no V hand to push button, it just clicks on with your mouse) so I kind of feel like it's going to be a floating head with arms only at times. I still hope though for character customization that you can have some level of preset slider options that allow a lot of different looks for V.
The FPP used where V and Dexter Deshawn first meet in his car was outstanding in the Gameplay Demo. I felt like I was watching a major Blockbuster Movie! But Mike Pondsmith and everyone else have often spoke of how important it is to be fly and stylish in Night City. Kind of seems pointless if our protagonist/avatar is going to practically be invisible most of the damn time...😒

Deus Ex: Human Revolution and Mankind Divided merged FPP with TPP. Cyberpunk 2077 can do it too!
 
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So i am a bit confused seems that there are people that are totally versus presets. I mean. Seriously?
In what world a underdeveloped character creator based on preset is better than a character creator based on presets plus sliders? Sometimes i fail to understand certain logic.

Concerning the FPP.
Yes it was answered you could see your body leg feet but still if the cam is not in the head of your character but on the chest is still a lot unrealistic and gamey and prospectively worse. I posted some screens that shown that in the demo the eyes of V were not in the head but in the chest at this point to me is not better than being a floating head the effect is similiar if not equal.
 
But a number of people do. For example, anyone that managed to make a good looking character in a BioWare game would post a pic of that character and immediately get hit with requests of how they made that character.
Yesssssssssss You understand how difficult it was to get a good looking character, you understand meeeeee

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So i am a bit confused seems that there are people that are totally versus presets. I mean. Seriously?
In what world a underdeveloped character creator based on preset is better than a character creator based on presets plus sliders? Sometimes i fail to understand certain logic.

Concerning the FPP.
Yes it was answered you could see your body leg feet but still if the cam is not in the head of your character but on the chest is still a lot unrealistic and gamey and prospectively worse. I posted some screens that shown that in the demo the eyes of V were not in the head but in the chest at this point to me is not better than being a floating head the effect is similiar if not equal.
I will help make things clear. (I'm good at explaining this :))

Sliders and Presets are the exact same code/software of information.

The only difference is how they are presented, and how they are labeled, and how precise those settings are.

Good setting presentation is EXTREMELY important for character creation because it directly affects the players ability to create a high quality character in game to their liking. If the settings are not presented in a good way, the player has much difficulty making the character well.

Think of it like this: You give a player a good controller or keyboard, they will likely be able to play the game well.

BUT!: if you give the player a bad controller or keyboard, they will have very bad problems. The game is VERY GOOD, but the controller and keyboard is bad? It wont matter, it will be all problems. (just a funny example, not saying good or bad)


So: here we have Two different GUI (general user interface) representations of the SAME SETTINGS, SAME CODE.

O------------------------------------- (classic slippery slider)

and

[1]-[2]-[3]-[4]-[5]-[6]-[7]-[8]-[9]-[10] (preset bar or as Secretz calls them "sectioned sliders")

Okay so:

O------------------------------------- (classic slippery slider): This is a long line of hidden buttons where each " - " represents a button/setting for example. The only button the player is given is a very slippery (SLIDE-Y) (SLIDER) button. This button is very imprecise, and not accurate. The player is given little (but essentially none) reference points, percentage numbers ??/100% or context to know what " - " setting button that they are actually resting the "O slider button" onto. This is a problem because the player can never be sure what setting they are actually selecting.

and

[1]-[2]-[3]-[4]-[5]-[6]-[7]-[8]-[9]-[10] (preset bar or as Secretz calls them "sectioned sliders"): This is a long line of visible, clearly marked and labeled buttons. On a classic slider, all of the settings are " - " but on the preset bar or Secretz sectioned sliders (just the name I'm using for it) every single " - " is now given a numbered button [1] or [10] (but this could go all the way up much higher.) There is no singular slippery button, because now each button is clearly labeled and numbered [1]-[2] and each setting is now its very own individual button. want to press [1]? you press on [1], and [1] is selected. Bingo! :) The player knows which setting is selected, and can actually write down their exact configuration and save it and share it with others too! :D


I assume that realistically, the character creation page would look something like (and this is just my guess based on some CDPR stuff lots of people saw, but CDPR said they were still changing everything)



[1]-[2]-[3]-[4]-[5]-[6]-[7]-[8]-[9]-[10] faces

[1]-[2]-[3]-[4]-[5]-[6]-[7]-[8]-[9]-[10] facial features

[1]-[2]-[3]-[4]-[5]-[6]-[7]-[8]-[9]-[10] hair style

[1]-[2]-[3]-[4]-[5]-[6]-[7]-[8]-[9]-[10] hair color

[1]-[2]-[3]-[4]-[5]-[6]-[7]-[8]-[9]-[10] tattoo

[1]-[2]-[3]-[4]-[5]-[6]-[7]-[8]-[9]-[10] body type

[1]-[2]-[3]-[4]-[5]-[6]-[7]-[8]-[9]-[10] body shape changers 1

[1]-[2]-[3]-[4]-[5]-[6]-[7]-[8]-[9]-[10] body shape changers 2

[1]-[2]-[3]-[4]-[5]-[6]-[7]-[8]-[9]-[10] body shape changers 3

[1]-[2]-[3]-[4]-[5]-[6]-[7]-[8]-[9]-[10] scars

[1]-[2]-[3]-[4]-[5]-[6]-[7]-[8]-[9]-[10] muscle tone

[1]-[2]-[3]-[4]-[5]-[6]-[7]-[8]-[9]-[10] height

Etc, etc, etc.

(it would go on and on for a long way, or have multiple pages that look like this. Again just my guess. and the options don't have to stop at [10], they could go to [20] or [100] even. It's up to CDProjektRed:D

Edit after Secretz called them "sectioned sliders". To clarify: !!! When I use the name "preset bar" I don't mean like a giant WIDE preset that takes over the entire character or even a large portion of them. I mean EXTREMELY small details on the character as little micro-presets that are so tiny, that they are little options for individual little parts of the character.
Like multiple different preset options for different looking hands, or different looking Glute muscles for V (LOL) gotta have that character customization! No sarcasm! but still funny.
Snowflakez also mentioned ( and we both agreed it would be cool) if there was a combination of what was already mentioned above (this whole post sorta) and to not minimize that in any way, but essentially add upon ON TOP of, as extra deeper and even more precise options, Basically a percentage controller. So you could pick a nose, and change visible listed percentages in any direction to further change it as if it was a slider, but not a slider, I think I understood something more like left and right [<]_##%_[>] buttons and the up down version also[ v ]_##%_[ ^ ] and maybe even and in and out button for changing the optional thing in question from another dimension like [ o ]_##%_[ O ] or the size of that part like [ - ]_##%_[ + ] X,Y,Z axis and size all being able to be changed if needed, so that you could type in any percentage value you wanted and clearly see what number percentage it was currently on, So preset bars/sectioned sliders all with supplemented bonus percentage-slider-button-type-inside-slots.
Thank you all for your thoughts and stuff, I feel like CDProjektRed is listening to us from the shadows and going "mm hmm mm hmm!! yes yes! we hear you!" Maybe I mean, I can't really know lol. I hope they do hear us :D They are really cool :D
 
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Yesssssssssss You understand how difficult it was to get a good looking character, you understand meeeeee
lol! Well, it's not so much it was difficult as it was that some people didn't want to spend time creating a character and just wanted to get to the game ASAP with a preset, but the built-in presets were, well...fugly. Directions to recreate the good looking character someone else spent time making in way less time than it would take to experiment and do it yourself is the only reason I could see someone wanting sectioned sliders over free form sliders during character creation.
 
There's no conceivable reason they wouldn't let you see your body at all times (in FPP). They obviously animated it, because you can see yourself in mirrors.

Depends on the camera position in FPP. It can cause issues depending how it is handled. It is definitely non-trivial. Imagine for example a case where the camera was located in place of a character models head, and the head would be just invisible. Therefore if you looked down, you would be looking down inside your own throat and chest cavity. It is obviously possible to have the view proper and realistic, I am just saying handling the FPP camera is not trivial. It can have same kind of clipping issues as the TPP camera, only with the players body instead of walls. I bet that CDPR doesn't allow prone position atm because the camera most likely clips inside the ground in that position.
 
Depends on the camera position in FPP. It can cause issues depending how it is handled. It is definitely non-trivial. Imagine for example a case where the camera was located in place of a character models head, and the head would be just invisible. Therefore if you looked down, you would be looking down inside your own throat and chest cavity. It is obviously possible to have the view proper and realistic, I am just saying handling the FPP camera is not trivial. It can have same kind of clipping issues as the TPP camera, only with the players body instead of walls. I bet that CDPR doesn't allow prone position atm because the camera most likely clips inside the ground in that position.

I'm beginning to really buy this logic -- the clipping in prone position possibly being a challenge. I think if you can get a good body/legs POV when walking but losing it when stopped, it's probably not a material issue of concern.
 
lol! Well, it's not so much it was difficult as it was that some people didn't want to spend time creating a character and just wanted to get to the game ASAP with a preset, but the built-in presets were, well...fugly. Directions to recreate the good looking character someone else spent time making in way less time than it would take to experiment and do it yourself is the only reason I could see someone wanting sectioned sliders over free form sliders during character creation.
Ah, I see. I should really call them "sectioned sliders" MUCH better name for what I mean. Thank you :D 100% agree.

Edited (or editing) probably done from when you finally read this- the post from before so that it includes what you mention and also what @Snowflakez said.
 
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I am curious if tatoos will be an option. I like the idea of having them as a style option but I doubt characters will ever be topless since clothing is an important part of the game.
 
Good example there! Perhaps some articles of clothing have a transparent section in it so you can still be wearing it and see a tatoo or body mod.
 
I hope the game has enough freedom that V will be allowed to be customized (in character creation) as well as also the rest of the game (and constantly always able to re-enter character creation mode whenever they want so they can keep customizing with all the controls and features from the starting point of character creation) and I also hope the game has enough freedom to allow V to wear even nothing if they feel like it. I think it would be interesting or even funny depending on the context. I just like games that have the balls to have that much freedom. I wont use it all the time, but I hope it is an option that I can use if I choose to. Maybe enemies will assume V is unprotected only because they are naked, and try to shoot or stab V, but they will be caught off guard because V's body is bullet proof and a total killing machine, totally surprising all the enemies and defeating them. Very interesting.
 
I am curious if tatoos will be an option. I like the idea of having them as a style option but I doubt characters will ever be topless since clothing is an important part of the game.

Tattoos were an option in the 2018 demo ( glowing tattoos ) all though it wasn`t shown where on the body but you can guess the usual places.
 
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