Novigrad

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Ah, Lordran, what a great place to get lost in. Looking for secrets only to get lost and find new ones, or nasty creatures. A maze of adventure and good times, as was navigating the labyrinths in the bowels of Sosaria. I got lost soon as I left the boat in Morrowind and enjoyed exploring those strange lands--expect the flying things they can go straight to hell.

I can only say I pity the man who loses his way to the Novigrad Brothel.
 
The ONLY game where getting lost makes sense is Thief and that's because it adds to the intrusion factor, you're not supposed to be there, every other case is bullshit.

In Dark Souls, you're supposed to be a lost confused undead trying to make sense of the world around you while being trapped in it. It's another game where being lost is part of the game. There's a lot of hints of where you're supposed to go , if you get lost you either die or find loot. It adds to the feeling of being in a losing struggle against the world.
 
On a more serious note..

I get lost every time I play a game that has towns/cities: Vizima, Lion's Arch(new and old style), Vivec City, the Imperial city, Silvermoon, Ogrimmar, just ti name a few.

I got lost completely in every one of those places and many more. Then I got less and less lost until I can still to this day take you right to the bastard, Gentleman Jim Space. I can navigate all these places better than downtown Birmingham.

What would the fun be if you knew exactly where everything was from the get go.
 
I think the size of this city is the perfect size as is. In terms of this video game world/land, it is huge... It does not need to be the real world size of NewYork.
I have faith that the devs know what they are doing way better then us. We are looking at an image that is still from a distance. I even see room for a petting zoo.
In CDPR We Trust. :)
 
One of the great aids to exploration I think is that the map does not appear until you've travelled through an area, and in the wilderness outside Flotsam for instance the map is intentionally vague, meaning that it takes shoe leather, time and effort to traverse and memorise the dangerous places. The forest outside Flotsam was a great place for getting lost, especially when night was coming in, suddenly the monsters would be swarming and Scoiatael arrows flying, actually made night a dangerous time when you wanted to be behind Flotsam's high walls. For me anyway.
 
One of the great aids to exploration I think is that the map does not appear until you've travelled through an area, and in the wilderness outside Flotsam for instance the map is intentionally vague, meaning that it takes shoe leather, time and effort to traverse and memorise the dangerous places. The forest outside Flotsam was a great place for getting lost, especially when night was coming in, suddenly the monsters would be swarming and Scoiatael arrows flying, actually made night a dangerous time when you wanted to be behind Flotsam's high walls. For me anyway.

That amount of getting lost is acceptable and I agree with what you said.

What I don't agree with is getting lost for 30 minutes or more like in bad 90s games. God, some of those games...
 
I agree that a 'fog of war' map is almost always acceptable in games with exploration. Helps you go along searching every look and cranny.

If a developer can make getting lost fun for thirty minutes, why not? If there be monsters to slay, ruins to explore and maidens to to be had?. I'm not saying we should always be getting lost, but why not every so often to break up the monotony.
 
I think the size of this city is the perfect size as is. In terms of this video game world/land, it is huge... It does not need to be the real world size of NewYork.
I have faith that the devs know what they are doing way better then us. We are looking at an image that is still from a distance. I even see room for a petting zoo.
In CDPR We Trust. :)
I have 0 doubt about Novigrad, it's big for sure.
 
I agree that a 'fog of war' map is almost always acceptable in games with exploration. Helps you go along searching every look and cranny.

If a developer can make getting lost fun for thirty minutes, why not? If there be monsters to slay, ruins to explore and maidens to to be had?. I'm not saying we should always be getting lost, but why not every so often to break up the monotony.

What you are describing is not getting lost...getting lost means walking around an area, unable to progress/get out after you've done everything in it OR being unable to find your way in a place, like a city, 5 times after you've already been there. How does that sound fun?!

That is NOT fun, at all.

Go play some bad 90s games and you'll see...

I have 0 doubt about Novigrad, it's big for sure.

Far bigger than anything we've seen in Skyrim. Hopefully this sets the new standard.
 
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Well, we could have fog of war as in an undetailed rough map (provided, we got it through dialog), with rough locations marked of important sights and then, once you walk there, it becomes more detailed, as it gets replaced with our characters memory and observation.
 
Well the first thing you described is definitely not being lost, that's just being stuck.

Let me put it this way now that I have Assassins Creed on the mind from another thread.

Do you ever really know where you're at in a city in one of those games? Probably not. Why? Because you're constantly running around going back and forth. Sure there are a few areas that*recall, but usually you're on the fly. Yes, you have markers that show you where to go next or events nearby, but how often do you take a path that you take multiple times?

You are constantly are lost in the cities of those games because of the expansiveness of the city and opening of new areas. Will you ever remember a particular route you took five hours ago? I didn't.
 
No, but landmarks and distinctive areas are subtle ways to give you a rough idea where you are, without the need for objective markers.
 
I hope the cycle from day to night is alot slower than it was in TW2. I want at least another hour of sunlight, unless it is real world time now that would be even more awesome.
 
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No, but landmarks and distinctive areas are subtle ways to give you a rough idea where you are, without the need for objective markers.

Here's an example we might agree on: Fallout 3.

Now, for those of you who haven't played Fallout 3 - all five of you - it's a very open-world game, with two remarkable points: 1) you can pretty much walk anywhere you want at any point in the game once you've left the tutorial zone (you will get atrociously murdered if go step in the wrong zone though, but you're still free to try); 2) there's a quicktravel system that allows you to blink from one place to another provided you've explored said place.

What I found awesome with exploring the world in Fallout 3 was that while I very much did get lost, I always had something to help me - without relying on a map - figure out where I was. Some times it was the Potomac river. Other times it was a monument, or some sort of unusual hotel.

So whenever I was out in the open, I could easily know where I was headed. Once I was in an urban zone, however, I felt like I was really in a major city: the underground metro tunnels running all over the place, the large avenues, small backstreets.... I had a general sense of direction, as in "Oh I can see the Washington Monument from here, that's where I want to go", but from one blocked street to another collapsed building, both crawling with supermutants, it was tough. And I loved. Every. Minute. Of. It.

I wouldn't expect the same experience from the Witcher. Novigrad may be a large city, it isn't a deserted megalopolis like Nuked-Washington. But that feeling of wandering without being lost, that's something golden I very much hope to find again.
 
No, but landmarks and distinctive areas are subtle ways to give you a rough idea where you are, without the need for objective markers.


That's not even what I was getting at but regardless we'll agree to disagree.

What we can agree on is that the topic of Novigrad has been LOST in the getting lost debate.
 
I wanted to find a clever photo to commemorate such wit. Turns out "Clever" is the name of some sort of jockstrap company, many of which are mostly transparent and oh so tight.
 
Here's an example we might agree on: Fallout 3.

Now, for those of you who haven't played Fallout 3 - all five of you - it's a very open-world game, with two remarkable points: 1) you can pretty much walk anywhere you want at any point in the game once you've left the tutorial zone (you will get atrociously murdered if go step in the wrong zone though, but you're still free to try); 2) there's a quicktravel system that allows you to blink from one place to another provided you've explored said place.

What I found awesome with exploring the world in Fallout 3 was that while I very much did get lost, I always had something to help me - without relying on a map - figure out where I was. Some times it was the Potomac river. Other times it was a monument, or some sort of unusual hotel.

So whenever I was out in the open, I could easily know where I was headed. Once I was in an urban zone, however, I felt like I was really in a major city: the underground metro tunnels running all over the place, the large avenues, small backstreets.... I had a general sense of direction, as in "Oh I can see the Washington Monument from here, that's where I want to go", but from one blocked street to another collapsed building, both crawling with supermutants, it was tough. And I loved. Every. Minute. Of. It.

I wouldn't expect the same experience from the Witcher. Novigrad may be a large city, it isn't a deserted megalopolis like Nuked-Washington. But that feeling of wandering without being lost, that's something golden I very much hope to find again.

Thank you for exemplifying what I meant with far greater eloquence. That is exactly what I meant.
 
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