Dragon Age: Inquisition

[Unkindled]

They are not "powerful and athletic"; Roland, Jeanne d'Arc or Achilles weren't "powerful" and "athletic", they are heroes and legends with one-sided personality and morale.
But of course you can think it's "anime shit" and it could be a little bit of that.


What did I say about people not being able to go out of their comfort zone in gaming licences?

The characters in DA during combat all seem very powerful and athletic to me... Hawke saws through multiple enemies at once with his ridiculously long swords, and the rogues are practically ninjas.

And I have no idea what you said about it, and I really don't care, as it doesn't change what I said. Someone mentioned earlier how they could've stayed with Origin's theme, or go in the opposite direction, and that's what they did. Not smart in my opinion.

 

[Scryar]

Would EA please get someone who actually knows shit about the franchise? This guy has clearly never played a DA game before.

Good to know that the game is hard though...or maybe he just sucked.

Actually that's their marketing. EA invited (paid flight, shelter etc.) some non-rpg youtubers wih a decent amont of followers to play their game. The guy who showed the first video only plays battlefield,counter strike and other shooters. Seems they want to get a piece of the FPS cage. I think that's pretty smart. They will reach some people who usually are not interest in rpgs and otherwise wouldn't hear anything about the game. CD Project Red should do something similar and maybe invite some youtubers with a big following base to poland to show their game, before it releases.

 

[EliHarel]

Well, looking at a player who doesn't know the franchise is way more interesting and possibly a bit more objective in my opinion.
Not the case here because he was invited by EA, but I've seen vids of people who were allowed to record their gameplay in some conventions, and it's interesting to have their opinion as newcomers.

Agreed. I don't mind hearing commentators who aren't well versed in the world. It offers a fresh angle.

I'm pretty sure Skyrim had a lot of influence over this. Having possibly infinite health potions in your inventory in an open world and/or semi open world games is nonsense in Skyrim. This is a smart and obvious answer to that mistake.

I'm not sure what you mean? I was just remembering the discussion in our boards about auto-refilling potions, good or bad, and hearing that health potions automatically refill in Inquisition when resting reminded me of that.

 

[Unkindled]

Actually that's their marketing. EA invited (paid flight, shelter etc.) some non-rpg youtubers wih a decent amont of followers to play their game. The guy who played the first video only play battlefield,counter strike and other shooters. Seems they want to get a piece of the FPS cage. I think that's pretty smart. They will reach some people who usually are not interest in rpgs and otherwise wouldn't hear anything about the game. CD Project Red should do something similar and maybe invite some youtubers with a big following base to poland to show their game, before it releases.

Please god, no. I get the thinking of attracting new people, but I want the opinions of players who actually know a thing or two about RPGs and Witcher so I can learn more. You wouldn't get a soccer mom to tell you how a V8 engine runs in an old school mustang, would you?

 

[Cheylus]

I'm not sure what you mean? I was just remembering the discussion in our boards about auto-refilling potions, good or bad, and hearing that health potions automatically refill in Inquisition when resting reminded me of that.

Ha ok. I just thought "refilled potions when in a refuge" makes more sense in an open or semi-open world game than having an infinite stash of them.

edit: I feared all dragons would have the same abilities, design and environments (like DA:O and most of Skyrim). Looks like it doesn't happen after all, a very good thing.

 

[Scryar]

Please god, no. I get the thinking of attracting new people, but I want the opinions of players who actually know a thing or two about RPGs and Witcher so I can learn more. You wouldn't get a soccer mom to tell you how a V8 engine runs in an old school mustang, would you?

Sure, but it would be smart from CD Project Reds viewpoint. We will buy Witcher 3 anyway, not matter what they show us in the next 4 1/2 months. And this doesn't mean all they show in the next months should be played by people who have no clue about the game. Bioware showed a lot of gameplay and most of it was played by them.

 

[EliHarel]

Seems like a fairly smart move to me. The people keeping close watch of the development aren't the intended audience of these videos, and that's alright. A company can and should reach out to different targets in different ways. Besides, I didn't feel it was bad commentary anyway. I even got a few tidbits of information I didn't hear before (the potions and the fast traveling).

 

[Unkindled]

A few tidbits of info verses how much one of us could've given... One can reach out to someone that's more knowledgeable as well as stretching out. I play FPS games and RPGs. They could've found someone like that, that does videos for more varied genres. I doubt they're hard to find.

Why does it need to be either or?

 

[Cheylus]

He plays every type of games according to his channel and he has played DA:O and DA2 according to his first video.

 

[EliHarel]

A few tidbits of info verses how much one of us could've given... One can reach out to someone that's more knowledgeable as well as stretching out. I play FPS games and RPGs. They could've found someone like that, that does videos for more varied genres. I doubt they're hard to find.

Why does it need to be either or?

I'm not even sure what's being discussed, honestly.

I don't know what are EA's considerations. I'm just speculating that they felt certain people can draw attention of players who otherwise wouldn't be interested in this game or genre. This guy from the WikiGameGuides gives a simple first impressions of his experience. The channel has over 200,000 subscribers, so I'm guessing EA fancied that, and from a brief glimpse it covers various different games, so I'm guessing the audience is varied, as well.

I'm kind of forcefully trying to dissect the "situation", because... I don't really understand why there even is a situation? Just people giving their impressions - as much of them as EA allows, when they're paying for everything. I don't understand the "either \ or" comment, either.

And again, I didn't find any fault with the WikiGameGuides commentary. What was missing from it?

Edit: When I wrote "tidbits of new information", I meant that as a good thing, since many of the videos with BioWare commentary didn't really tell me anything I didn't know before.

 

[Unkindled]

It's simple, really. Why does it have to be someone who is either experienced with rpgs and the series or someone that is not.

He can't really do a good job on speaking of the balance of the difficulty, how it compared to boss battles of the past, how the combat compares to DA 2, something that we can't always tell just from watching it. Actually playing it is necessary to tell how the game truly feels, which we'd get a better understanding of from someone experienced in RPGs, not someone that's used to playing shooters.

There's a lot of small details one experienced with the game could give. I could write an essay on the differences of Skyrim, Morrowind and Oblivion, and I could tell people who have played more traditional rpgs how Skyrim stacks to that, which in that aspect, it doesn't, and isn't at all a traditional rpg, whereas someone who is used to FPS games, all they'd say is "dude, combat's pretty sick, bro, those finishers were dope! The dragon came down and was like roar and whoosh!"

He plays every type of games according to his channel and he has played DA:O and DA2 according to his first video.

Ah k, that works. The others claimed he didn't like the first guy.

 

[Aes Sídhe]

I'd say the reasoning behind getting FPS'rs to play is because they recognise they've deliberately made a game that is more like a FPS (yes its in TP but the gameplay is extremely FPS like). This may be to draw new people in, or it may be because they know they have already lost their previous fanbase, but there can be little doubt about the new direction they have taken the game.

Similar reasoning is behind the large release of info this time, they know they have a lot to prove, and have a lot - perhaps even the future of the company - riding on this. There can be very little doubt preorders are at a much reduced magnitude than they are used to, for obvious reasons, this is the conclusion people on this thread came to when they began the PR onslaught.

 

[Unkindled]

I'd say the reasoning behind getting FPS'rs to play is because they recognise they've deliberately made a game that is more like a FPS (yes its in TP but the gameplay is extremely FPS like). This may be to draw new people in, or it may be because they know they have already lost their previous fanbase, but there can be little doubt about the new direction they have taken the game.

Similar reasoning is behind the large release of info this time, they know they have a lot to prove, and have a lot - perhaps even the future of the company - riding on this. There can be very little doubt preorders are at a much reduced magnitude than they are used to, for obvious reasons, this is the conclusion people on this thread came to when they began the PR onslaught.

I agree completely, and that really is at the heart of my concern. I do not NOT want Witcher to start casualizing their games more to appeal to wider audiences. This I understand is inevitable to a certain degree, but it doesn't have to be to the extent of Dragon Age. I just worry about them taking that direction. There arguably already were changes like that from Witcher 1 and 2, but it wasn't so severe that I didn't enjoy it. A lot of it I actually liked, but lets not get crazy. Attracting new fans means eventually catering to new fans. Simple as that.

 

[Cheylus]

More stuff. Without commentary though. Haven't watched it yet, because better rez aren't up yet.

 

[EliHarel]

It's simple, really. Why does it have to be someone who is either experienced with rpgs and the series or someone that is not.

It doesn't. I'm not sure where that impression was formed.

He can't really do a good job on speaking of the balance of the difficulty, how it compared to boss battles of the past, how the combat compares to DA 2, something that we can't always tell just from watching it. Actually playing it is necessary to tell how the game truly feels, which we'd get a better understanding of from someone experienced in RPGs, not someone that's used to playing shooters.

If it's someone who hasn't played the previous games, then no, he can't make the comparison. But if this is a video intended to draw an audience who hasn't touched the previous games, that ability to compare isn't relevant. A potential buyer of the game who hasn't played the former ones doesn't care about that comparison, I suppose.

But I think we're making up this issue in our minds. Where did this happen? What reason do we have to believe this will happen?

Is it possible we're actually talking about different channels\videos? Because I'm not seeing any actual case of someone commentating without having a clue. I know about rechyyy's, the guy associated with CS videos, but his DA:I footage included no narration anyway, so it doesn't matter. Then there's WikiGameGuides, with this video,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=muFiASIhlo4#t=245

Which I don't see any problem with, or any reason to believe this guy isn't familiar with the genre in general or the series in specific. He even says at 04:02 how health doesn't regenerate, like "so many RPGs and shooters do", and at 12:13 he makes a reference to Skyrim and DA1+2, to compare them to DA:I.

I think what spurned this discussions was this post:

Actually that's their marketing. EA invited (paid flight, shelter etc.) some non-rpg youtubers wih a decent amont of followers to play their game. The guy who showed the first video only plays battlefield,counter strike and other shooters. Seems they want to get a piece of the FPS cage. I think that's pretty smart. They will reach some people who usually are not interest in rpgs and otherwise wouldn't hear anything about the game. CD Project Red should do something similar and maybe invite some youtubers with a big following base to poland to show their game, before it releases.

But I suspect that we're at this point debating over something baseless. Unless there's a video I'm missing here? Again, I see no fault with WikiGameGuides commentary. He referred to previous games, to level differences, to area of effect attacks (or not), to his rogue playstyle, a bit of the map, and some more.

There's a lot of small details one experienced with the game could give. I could write an essay on the differences of Skyrim, Morrowind and Oblivion, and I could tell people who have played more traditional rpgs how Skyrim stacks to that, which in that aspect, it doesn't, and isn't at all a traditional rpg, whereas someone who is used to FPS games, all they'd say is "dude, combat's pretty sick, bro, those finishers were dope! The dragon came down and was like roar and whoosh!"

Yeah. Agreed on the first half. I just don't see why it's wrong that these recent videos don't do that. I feel you're criticizing the video for choosing one purpose - which is simple hands-on impressions - instead of another purpose. I find that weird. Videos have different purposes, for different audiences.

I also think you're a bit romanticizing it. How often do you get promotional material that goes into such "essay-worthy" detail? In fact, how often do you get non-promotional material that goes into such depth? That doesn't happen often. Usually people settle for very general and simple references. "It's like this in that, different in this, and overall you'll like\dislike". And Wiki did that, briefly.

Lastly, I don't get the point of depicting someone used to FPS games as juvenile. What more, again, I see no concrete example of this happening, from the videos posted so far in this thread anyway.

 

[Unkindled]

You're making this a lot more complicated than it needs to be. Yes I'm referring to the one video, but I was referring to the other guy in this thread shown as well. There were two recently. I'm saying that Bioware shouldn't be having people simply making videos to get the word out basically to new gamers, but also be considering those that already have played their previous games to give them a better idea of how the game is compared to the past, since unlike Witcher, another buy isn't a guaranteed thing for a lot of us. That's mostly it.

As for the FPS comment, I play FPS games, I know a lot of the fanbase and how they are, and it's not about being juvenile, it's simply about how they react to what they see based on what they're used to. This is honestly a common reaction from newcomers to things rpg esque. It's not about being juvenile, it's about how one reacts to something based on what they're used to. I'm being honest, here.

A final point is that @Aes Sídhe nailed it with what he said about the devs catering to a new audience because they know their core game experience is much different. I know that, most of us here know that, and Bioware knows that, which is what I was basically getting at. What sparked things for me was the comparison of this to Witcher, and saying witcher should do the same thing. I don't want that at all, because I fear that this tact would also eventually lead to more changes to suit new audiences a lot more than is needed.

The discussion may be pointless simply because the second guy has played DA O and 2 before, unless Bioware has restricted what he could say and what he should say in his video as part of the agreement of him playing their game. It's very possible and we've already seen it:

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/vid...-of-Mordors-Promotion-Deals-with-Plaid-Social

So that's the real point.

edit:
I don't like this, regardless whether you think it's smart or not, because the point of it is obviously to cater to new audiences. Seems harmless until you look and see it's because they know they've made many of their changes for new audiences mainly, hence their PR and advertising tactics. People wishing they'd do this for Witcher are asking to open Pandora's box. Attracting new audiences is fine. Catering to them, not so much.

 

[Cheylus]

We've seen at the very least four hours of footage of that game and we're seeing even more now, more than one month before release.
It helped me making a decision and understanding the game and it convinced people on this topic that DA:I was or wasn't for them. If you haven't set your mind about the game yet then it might mean it's not for you; 4 hours should be more than enough to get an opinion, whether you're new to Dragon Age or not.
I'm not clever enough to say if they're showing so much because they're desperate or confident or neither.

I know this topic produced legions of redundant posts about the 15 min romances, 4 .jpg showing the characters and three 140-characters quotes, but we also had some interviews of the writers, explanations about the crafting, agent management mechanics or Skyhold nobody cared about.
I remembered someone on this forum saying he hates BioWare because he trusted them when he preordered DA2. At the very least, they showed something like one short hour of the game some days before its release. The Signature Edition incentives were a disaster ("grab it before it disappears"), the demo (released too late and revealing major plot points) was a disaster and the dev had nothing to say about the game except 5 buzzwords. I feel like it's different and better this time.

And I'm pretty sure those people signed an agreement about what they can or can't say, that's a common and basic thing when you're in this kind of deal. I've myself agreed to not say anything bad about the Keep by signing a NDA (as the device keeps on evolving and changing week after week) and that didn't mean I was forced to say something good either. Here, I've seen shameful glitches, heard some reserve against the controls and seen lengthy buggy videos without commentary; that's enough to qualify as something reliable to me.

 

[Unkindled]

Agreeing not to say anything bad isn't an agreement to say things good, but it's close. But anyway, that's not the point of what I was getting at. The point was their catering to new audiences. If he can't say anything that can be potentially considered bad, that could close off a lot of topics. The differences of this and previous games for example can be potentially locked off besides what they want to be shown, like graphics, unless you give a positive and inaccurate spin to it. Which I think is exactly what they want.

All I'm saying is I don't want this kind of thing for CDPR, whether you find it acceptable or not. It's a sign that the developers thought more of new audiences rather than their fans, and that to me is always a bad thing. I can understand developers seeing this as a good thing, because money. But how the heck can a fan ever look at this, smile and say "Yes, I want the developers catering to new audiences that don't know jack about this rpgs, let alone Witcher"?

 

[addar]

what i really hate is this copy-paste texture of grass, i know there must be some kind of reuse but this look like default ground from modul creator
or and im not very please with this lazy dialgues, where is my bioware's cinematics feel its really feels like mmorpg

 

[Unkindled]

Meh, the environment to me actually looked pretty good, when you could really see it. That is, after all the fighting and magic pony farts dissipated. You can't be that detailed in a game with a big environment.