Should V be a Youtuber?

[KakitaTatsumaru]

Not sure what you are going to quote from. Edgerunners are mercenaries. Sometimes they work as a Trauma Team, sometimes as Corporate Operatives or protect citizens, but generally Cyberpunk Teams are just that - mercs. They take ( typically violent) odd jobs for money. And occasionally try to make things better.

You can check Night City if you like for the section on Edgerunners as a not-bad guide. Cyberpunk isn't about Survival, it's about Style and Substance and Making It Big. The Rules are:

1.Style Over Substance.
2.Attitude is Everything
3.Always Take It To The Edge
4.Break The Rules.

Mike Pondsmith summed it up thusly:

"The best Cyberpunk
games are a combination of
doomed romance, fast
action, glittering parties, mean streets and quixotic quests
to do the right thing against alI odds. It's a little like Casablanca with
cyberware ... "


You can of course run a Cop game and/or a Rockerboy or Media game and those are fun, but the basic Team structure is, yeah, taking jobs for money. Even in a Media or Rockerboy game, the Solos and Nomads and Netrunners that are hired as protection and data experts are...mercenaries. Services For Sale.

Edit: you do realize that for the Team to stay together, they need money. THAT'S why you do jobs. If you read the entire section you quote, the listed Teams are Corporate, Bands, actual armed-force Mercenaries ( cammo, guns, etc), Gangs, and so on. They do these jobs -because- they need money. Cops, TT, you name it - everyone wants to get paid. Money money money.

Except for Nomads, who are Family. Gross.

And your quotes, although correct, are how you -start- the PCs together. They aren't definitive to how the game goes and nor do they supercede the core tenets of Cyberpunk - Style, Edge, etc.

Actually aren't you playing another edition of Cyberpunk than C2020 (or maybe using tons of books aside from the base one)?
That would explain things, cause for example even "edgerunners" name doesn't ring a bell to me.

Besides, money isn't a problem for every players, actually if money was the point then my character would never join the team.

 

[EngryEngineer]

Actually aren't you playing another edition of Cyberpunk than C2020 (or maybe using tons of books aside from the base one)?
That would explain things, cause for example even "edgerunners" name doesn't ring a bell to me.

Besides, money isn't a problem for every players, actually if money was the point then my character would never join the team.

Not sure where edgerunner first officially gets used, but on page 93 of the base book they provide a rule for hiring yourself out as a merc before you even leave character creation. Aside from that, in the section you quoted it cites team types, merc is one of those, but if we are being practical Trauma Teams, Gangs, & Nomad Packs all effectively function as different scales of mercenary, it is mostly the difference of being hired as a "mercenary team" vs being hired to sort out neighborhood issues, or which people you are willing to risk your wellbeing and ammo supply to protect/revive. So half of the team suggestions are not relying on a central authority to determine work (like corp/cop/band/media), and will mostly be hired independently. In the unlikely chance that they survive awhile and become established, the team types other than mercenary can become pretty restrictive or even dangerous as it ties interests to a specific location, ideology, or employer. These connections are all liabilities in a highly volatile and dangerous cyberpunk world, and over time it is pretty much inevitable that you will have to choose your life or your tenuous connection.

Then there are the example scenarios in the core rule book:
Scenario 1: team hired by Biotechnica to escort shipment
Scenario 2: team hired by fixer as bodyguards
Scenario 3: team hired to protect media station
Scenario 5: team hired to disconnect illegal taps
Scenario 6: hired by nomads to protect against corp harrasment
Scenario 8: hired to rob materials broker
Scenario 9: hired to infiltrate and install hardware
Scenario 10: hired by infocomp to get their specialist back
Out of 10 suggested scenarios in the core rulebook, 8 of which are essentially external/temporary/mercenary hires by an outsider. Of the 2 not included, 1 is a heist job which isn't being hired for but a merc group would absolutely do because there is a good possibility for a pay day, and the other uses the idea that the team are probably mercs as a primary source of tension and the plausibility for the set-up.

So yeah, the book is full of ways in which the players can be something other than mercs, but then everything feeds into them being independent and for-hire in a mercenary capacity.

 

[KakitaTatsumaru]

So I should consider myself lucky that my game master never tried that, cause it would essentially have caused an "I don't care" reaction from at least me and the corpo guy.

 

[EngryEngineer]

So I should consider myself lucky that my game master never tried that, cause it would essentially have caused an "I don't care" reaction from at least me and the corpo guy.

Sure, and that's the beauty of a tabletop game is that every group can customize their experience for the people at the table. You don't have to play a game where you pick up jobs as disposable/deniable assets, you can play whatever fits your group instead. That said, if you are looking at an adaptation, or even looking at joining a different table top group, you have to consider how the game is generally interpreted, not just your own personal experience. You never know, what appears to be a free agent/merc premise may (and probably does) include much more depth than that surface judgement.

 

[ROSFIX]

It's so funny how normally we talk about the nonsense in YouTube nowadays. "sitting 10 minutes and talking about how my dog pooped in my bed" and getting 10,000$ for this while the quality creativity doesn't matter anymore? Noice one meit
But as my parents say... work for your name and after - it will work for you. True...true..true

 

[Sardukhar]

That would explain things, cause for example even "edgerunners" name doesn't ring a bell to me.

Really it should. Really, really it should.

Anyway.

V, at least the V we see in the demo, is the traditional Cyberpunk 2020 edgerunner. Stylish, dangerous and cool. She's not a cop, a corp or a soldier.

Unless the format is changed a lot, I think we will see this template for the player as opposed to a Media ( the 2020 name for reporters, broadcasters, journalists) or a Rockerboy, either of which a youtuber might fit into.

We also aren't seeing the 2020 Roles as per the 2020 book either, but a more flexible version.

In all cases, money is a prime motivator, since it brings or makes much easier survival, power and fame.

If you aren't motivated by money in Cyberpunk 2020, not sure what to tell you. Your GM is super kind? You don't need food? Both?

 

[KakitaTatsumaru]

Really it should. Really, really it should.

Anyway.

V, at least the V we see in the demo, is the traditional Cyberpunk 2020 edgerunner. Stylish, dangerous and cool. She's not a cop, a corp or a soldier.

Unless the format is changed a lot, I think we will see this template for the player as opposed to a Media ( the 2020 name for reporters, broadcasters, journalists) or a Rockerboy, either of which a youtuber might fit into.

We also aren't seeing the 2020 Roles as per the 2020 book either, but a more flexible version.

In all cases, money is a prime motivator, since it brings or makes much easier survival, power and fame.

If you aren't motivated by money in Cyberpunk 2020, not sure what to tell you. Your GM is super kind? You don't need food? Both?

We were two in our team (me as a rockerboy an the corpo) to have 10 in our special abilities meaning 12000 eurodollars a month (I even started with 24000 eurodollars), all because of the basic creation rules.
My GM attacked me on that on an adventure (and he did the same to the corpo guy on another one), but I managed to go through. But end up killed because I was becoming too dangerous considering my influence over the mob (but not until late in the campaign, so I don't consider my character flawed because of that death).

We were actually all unknowing half-brother/sisters of the same dying rich man and the "legitimate" son wanted to be sure he would get all the old man's wealth, meaning we (and some NPCs) had to die.

 

[EngryEngineer]

We were two in our team (me as a rockerboy an the corpo) to have 10 in our special abilities meaning 12000 eurodollars a month (I even started with 24000 eurodollars), all because of the basic creation rules.
My GM attacked me on that on an adventure (and he did the same to the corpo guy on another one), but I managed to go through. But end up killed because I was becoming too dangerous considering my influence over the mob (but not until late in the campaign, so I don't consider my character flawed because of that death).

We were actually all unknowing half-brother/sisters of the same dying rich man and the "legitimate" son wanted to be sure he would get all the old man's wealth, meaning we (and some NPCs) had to die.

 

[Maelcom404]

So I should consider myself lucky that my game master never tried that, cause it would essentially have caused an "I don't care" reaction from at least me and the corpo guy.

Well, probably because your GM wasn't "Meany Cyberpunk" enough.
In my game, you'd thank me for a Job like those.

Night City isn't a sweet place to live and if it is, it's because you worked your ass off for it (and fear about risking losing your privilege at every corner).
If you start your character, you're a no one, a piece of shit, whatever you may be a, corporate, a rockstar, or anything, no one needs you in Night City...

"What, my job isn't good enought for ya? Fine, go sleep in a cardboard Mrs Princess, I've 5 bums behinds you waiting for their turns."
(just a way of talking, not being agressive on ya haha)

You think in the gameplay demo the Militech Corpo waited for V to sweetly talk her about the maelstorm?
V had the luck to be first, but would've she waited, the job would've ran under her nose and she'd to get another one, probably worse than the one she'd missed.

You'll probably pass a few "I don't care" job "I'm too talented for this", then having the shittiest week of your life (hunted, racketted, beaten down, etc...) because you're basically no one (and since everything is pricey; you'll quickly need some quick cash).

You'd beg me for a job after one or two hours of game.
Source: the few players in my game that though Night City waited for them with open arms...

It's just like real life (excepted in cyberpunk, you play a piss-poor-desperate dude, not the top of the leader, it has no sense otherwise).

Either you have a job, and well, you're at the top, you're no "cyberpunk".
Either you're a nobody, and since there are no job or anything, it's just like nowadays, you've rent to pay, so you'll do whatever you can to get some cash.
Also, most of the "Kewl and interesting, I do care jobs", will come with a lots of malus points (having wrong people on your back etc...), it's all about balance.

If tomorrow you're broke and you're like "I don't care about working at Burger King", well, that's how you start a nice homelessness carreer, so it should be the same in Cyberpunk, even worse.

And being an homeless dude nowadays is awful enought, just push the nightmare further and you'll have an idea how it can be in Cyberpunk 2020 (being hunted by dudes wanting to kill you to sell your organs at the bodybank? No one will whine for a dead bum)

Reason why you have to really nail it in the head of your player.
You're nothing, either you find the first less-shitty job you can, either you create something to get money (deal drugs, braindance, whatever), but you can't move Night City, it's Night City which will move ya...

You refused that job? Fine, don't have any money left, you sleep in the street, a bunch of homeless dudes figths you, you lose, ends up wounded, someone takes you to the hospital you pass out.

Then you wake up and learns that "Mr Jameson" from Infocomp read your data and you seems like an interesting person to hire, don't worry they already paid for your treatments, now, you'll have to work for them (if not, they'll just activate the poison capsules in your blood? Don't trust him? Just try him out...)
That's how it plays out most of the time, you can't "not care", because everything is after you in a way or another, and being broke just means you'll be a victim.

On the cool side, it helps creating "tension", not fake one or played one, but a real "I've had so much trouble pushing my character to the present point, I won't let them fuck me over", and sometimes also helps players picking on each other (just to save their asses), and that's beautifull.

They do have to work as a team, but because they want to... At the same time, they're free to fuck on their partners if they need too, but with every hard stuff they've been throught, they'll know what to expect, so it's not as simple or "black & white", it's really adds weight to every choices you'll make.

The real and interesting jobs comes around when you're "Someone", with a solid reputation and people can trust you and knows you, before, it's just a crap-eating fest with suicide missions and not-so-fancy-jobs, but it's how you make your character grows over time, starting by delivering pizza's in shitty part of town and ending as a cyber-assassin a few years later (In game obviously, RL, it all depends how you play it all out, who you'll get in touch with and what you plan for your character, but you go the idea).

Now, if it's for a "one shot" game, I don't care, but if you want to get a character from scratch, it's way more interesting to start as nothing, just equal to the lowest bum you'll come across and making your way up slowly, then you'll really appreciate all your cool tech and privilege.
It's less "shocking" when you start as "Adam Jensen" in his ivory tower rather than coming from the gutter up to it (or you can do the reverse, starting from up, getting in the gutter and making your way back up), but in all scenario, you need to have your hand "forced" otherwise... it's not really cyberpunk.

Like, if you're in trouble with a corporation (like, Arasaka), you won't just go to their adversary (Militech) one and be all "help me".
If you never did anything for them, any crap job or whatever, they won't move, they'll just be "Heh, leave us alone, we don't want touble".
Now, if you forced yourself in shit jobs (and made them well) for a few interesting people, they'll tends to be more easy to convince, cause you seems way more useful (and most likely, you'll have contacts in saids corps/fixers that you wouldn't if you never had anything to do with them).

In Cyberpunk, you're a "merch", not in a Soldier of Fortune way, but you don't have a "one sided job", it's more about seizing every oportunity that shows up, if you don't you'll quickly get stuck (and then get in a lot of trouble, no cash, hard street life, etc...)

That's why a Cyberpunk GM needs to be a (funny) asshole, otherwise it's not as fun.
Life always sends you troubles when you needs it the less, so it should feel the same there.

"Why are the cops always checking on us when we're stacked with corporate guns and explosives?"
"Well dunno bro, that's probably karma"

 

[KakitaTatsumaru]

Well, probably because your GM wasn't "Cyberpunk enough".
In my game, you'd thank me for a Job like those.

Night City isn't a sweet place to live and if it is, it's because you worked your ass off for it (and fear about risking losing your privilege at every corner).
If you start your character, you're a no one, a piece of shit, whatever you may be a corporate or anything, no one needs you in Night City...
What, my job isn't good enought for ya? Fine, go sleep in a cardboard Mrs Princess, I've 5 bums behinds you waiting for their turns.

You'll probably pass a few "I don't care" job "I'm too talented for this", then having the shittiest week of your life (hunted, racketted, beaten down, etc...).

You'd beg me for a job after one or two hours of game.
Source: the few players in my game that though Night City waited for them with open arms...

It's just like real life (excepted in cyberpunk, you play a piss-poor-desperate dude, not the top of the leader, it has no sense otherwise).

Either you have a job, and well, you're at the top, you're no "cyberpunk".
Either you're a nobody, and since there are no job or anything, it's just like nowadays, you've rent to pay, so you'll do whatever you can to get some cash.
Also, most of the "Kewl and interesting, I do care jobs", will come with a lots of malus points (having wrong people on your back etc...), it's all about balance.

If tomorrow you're broke and you're like "I don't care about working at Burger King", well, that's how you start a nice homelessness carreer, so it should be the same in Cyberpunk, even worse.

Reason why you have to really nail it in the head of your player.
You're nothing, either you find the first less-shitty job you can, either you create something to get money (deal drugs, braindance, whatever), but you can't move Night City, it's Night City which will move ya...

What you say doesn't work for rich characters, cause you can be rich from start.

But maybe you are using some house rules, and it's ok, but in a C2020 P&P game following the rules of the game you can start rich.

Last possibility: You are the kind of GM which lacks any form of roleplay liberty, playing favorite with players who goes the way you wants and striving (well, in C2020 I should more say "striving more than usual") against players who doesn't goes your way. Then I would not play with you, because those kind of GM also tend to be kind of moody when I prefer having a good time while playing (and I precise that me "having a good time" as nothing to do with my character having a good time, just that the atmosphere around the table should be about people having a good time together).

 

[Maelcom404]

What you say doesn't work for rich characters, cause you can be rich from start.

But maybe you are using some house rules, and it's ok, but in a C2020 P&P game following the rules of the game you can start rich.

Last possibility: You are the kind of GM which lacks any form of roleplay liberty, playing favorite with players who goes the way you wants and striving (well, in C2020 I should more say "striving more than usual") against players who doesn't goes your way. Then I would not play with you, because those kind of GM also tend to be kind of moody when I prefer having a good time while playing (and I precise that me "having a good time" as nothing to do with my character having a good time, just that the atmosphere around the table should be about people having a good time together).

Sure you can start rich, with your 10 points in your special ability, it's not a house rules, it's actually applying all the lore, and using the rules to push it, not the otherway around.

I had a friend who started as a 10 corpo, head of his own corporation.
No problem, I just followed the mood explained in the corpo books, you can see there that, if you're a street punk, other punks will pick on you, here, if you're a big corporate, it's other corporations that'll pick on you (to steal you contracts, infrastructures, and just eat you to get bigger).
Just as in real life, sometimes you win, and some other times you'll stumble other someone way tougher than you, and you'll be eaten, and that's what happened to him, he had his place burned down (luckily escaped a trap) and got all his life turned upside down and ended in the street, then teamed with other players to get revenge (roleplay included, etc...).

The whole plot was that a bigger European corp (that was barely known here in US) saw his corp and wanted to get it by obscure way (crushing it down and getting back it's knowledge for them), simply because it was way cheaper than just having a meeting and buying them the knowledge.

Now, sure my corporate dude started rich, with his brillant sallary, but do you think he kept it after having his whole corporation crushed down? Nope, it lasted a few games, he spent it all in fancy stuff ("hey guys! I'm rich"), and then just had barely anything and slept in coffins, but that was a MOTIVE for him to push back up, just like it's a MOTIVE for the lower punk to not deal with street dirt any longer.

I do put a lot of roleplay actually, but rules aren't "stuff sets in stone", like in Monopoly.
I let my player set his corporation and gave him all the freedom he wanted (things I grant all my players the same way), now, with all that, I just sets it in the dark and ultraviolent lawless world of Cyberpunk (in which people just wants to eat you up, it's not a house rule, it's explained all over the source book).

So yep, you can start rich, but the trouble will be way more intense, what for a street punk could lead to a knife fight, for a high end corp, it could lead to a global corp war or just having bombs placed at the right time-right place by the enemy.

Sure, if you play a detective, a cop, in a kinda middle-class area, you can play the moody card and all, but if I've a corp, and a few solos and a rockstar, I'll have to adapt to something more rock'n roll... Just because it's way more interesting for them, we're not playing "The Sims", have my corp have meeting and paying taxes all game, it would be boring (even tho we do have those things and love to roleplay those), but since it's cyberpunk "it has to go wrong at some point".

Look at Hardwired, Neuromancer, Snow Crash, etc.... Even Ghost In The Shell, or Akira.

It all works like that, plotwise, you start with a "stereotype" (with the salary, and special points), you have your CEO corp, your street punk (akira), your cybercop (GITS), your panzerboy (Hardwired), your top notch netrunner (Neuromancer),etc...
The story starts, following his daily routine (Robocop : Murphy being a cop, doing cops things), and then BAM, the world falls on your face.

Case thought it would be a good idea to accept Armitage job but never knew it would put him in such messy dangers, Cowboy in hardwired had to get underground because a whole corporation wanted him dead, just because he was in the wrong job (which was just a routine one, from his/your point of view), Murphy never asked to be put in a microwaved called "Robocop", and had to deal with all the nasty stuff from that.

It's all about the world turning against you, YOUR world (Case, the netrunner, who thought he could own the cyberspace had his ass handled by the meaniest AI ever), revolves and you go to extreme oposite all the time.
Extreme calm to extreme violence, extreme poverty to extreme richesses, etc...
It's what Cyberpunk is about and I DO let my players all the freedom (and even way more) all the time, but we're set in a world, and IMO, the setting goes over the rules you start your character with, you start your character a way, but then he lives his life in Night City, and there, everything can happens.

You can be set in an apartment complex, during an investigation, with very heavy moody roleplay, the sun slowly fading throught the windows as all the tech slowly glows in the dark.

You then decide to leave the place to go get some ramen, Blade Runner style, but since it's Night City...
There are huge chances that, rolling a random encounter, you may, just by getting out of the building, stumble over a boostergang streetfight, blasting some hardcore punk on a cyber-ghettoblaster and you'd be stuck in the middle the loooongs minutes before Police comes to put the bodybags out.

(If you're playfull, add a few citizen shooting in, turning the whole thing in a riot and have your character trapped in it Escape New York style. Your characters didn't ran when they could? Too bad...
You can imagine an emergency system like in Dredd 2012, blocking every access and some people really pissed about the punks doing their crap every weeks and you'be stuck in it.
Is it your player's fault? nope but it's what a "living" world may feel like, sometimes you have to deal with unexpected things that goes beyond your control and have to adapt)

Now you can flee or fight, you're free, but the world will keep moving the way it does, the character you play is "among it" not controlling it, that's how I set it, the setting is so rich and interesting, you can't just limit it to a simple line and dark athmosphere, you're free to do whatever you want to do, but the world is as it is, having a 10special ability as a Corp, or a Cop, or whatever, those are just "skills" in which you've some inner talents for, but it's not because you're a super CEO that you'll keep getting paid if you live in a cardboard (which always happens at some point, it's cyberpunk), and even there, you're not "stuck" in the bottom, you'll do a few jobs to get new skills (guns? melee? or anything), and get some cash and keep the story going to get your revenge or get back up to the top.

There are no "high" if there are no "low".
Cyberpunk is sets in our real world, even if you're the smartest person in the world, just hangging up at Apple's HQ and asking them to hire you as their new boss, they'll most likely be "Who the fuck are you?... Security?".
So, you have to flesh out all of that, just to make the player feel the world, not just random numbers on a sheet of paper.
Now, you're 100% free, but each player, having the same character, like a 1 vs a 10 cop, won't have the same gameplay.
A 1 should be a low grade cop, dealing with all the ugly street stuff, a 10cop should have to deal with the corruption and corporate level of police stuff...

Now, you're a lvl 10 cop (special ability), Night City is controlled by corporations, Police is officially not, but unofficialy "kinda", they're happy to have some "bonus budgets" to close their eyes on some stuff, given how shitty the job is, it's understandable.
Then, if you keep it realistic, you can either get corrupted, but a pirate media will most likely expose you at some point (that you want it or not, you're a big fish choomba) and you'll have to deal with people's outrage (getting spitted on in the street, etc...), or you can go against the corruption, but then the Corps will probably want you dead and replaced.
You can also try to ignore both, but since it's "how things works", well... You'll always have to deal with it at some point, at different level and will have to do a choice about it... And that's how your "lvl 10" cop, can go from the top to the bottom in a matter of a few choices.

That's freedom, but the whole world has it's freedom too, which sometimes (often?) works against yours.

Well, that's just how I feel the game was aimed to.

 

[KakitaTatsumaru]

Well, that's the difference between you and my GM: You choose the danger level by comparing it to the character special ability level, my GM choose it by how many character point he gives you to make your character, then treat all the players equally (bad).

You doesn't seems to treat your players equally, you treat them by their build.
You are basically saying: Do an optimized powerhouse while keeping your special skill low, so you'll be stronger while not having to face great dangers.
That's what you are basically saying to your players.

Besides, not having to play merc doesn't mean you are playing "The Sims", or I don't remember being chased day and night by someone rich and powerful in "The Sims", while still having to deal with other deadly things. C2020 universe doesn't need merc jobs to be dangerous.

 

[BaalNergal]

Sure, if you play a detective, a cop, in a kinda middle-class area, you can play the moody card and all, but if I've a corp, and a few solos and a rockstar, I'll have to adapt to something more rock'n roll... Just because it's way more interesting for them, we're not playing "The Sims", have my corp have meeting and paying taxes all game, it would be boring (even tho we do have those things and love to roleplay those), but since it's cyberpunk "it has to go wrong at some point".

The Sims. You seriously compared a Cyberpunk game to the Sims.

Okay, I have to ask: Have you actually played the Sims?

 

[Sardukhar]

What you say doesn't work for rich characters, cause you can be rich from start.

But maybe you are using some house rules, and it's ok, but in a C2020 P&P game following the rules of the game you can start rich.

Nope. You can't. Dunno why you think that. Super nice Ref maybe?

IF you start with special ability 10 as a Medtech ( and don't have the skills to back that up, because you don't have that many points at start) and you are one of the 1/3 that roll 3 months pay at start, AND sell out to a Corp for 10 grand of cyber, AND get some really sweet Lifepath rolls, you might have almost 50,000 eb at start plus 10 grand in cyber.

This is not rich.

Suure, you can afford a luxury sedan - one. At 40 grand. Or a sportscar - at 24 grand - and even some clothes and a few months of housing, insurance, etc.

But you can't afford those AND serious weapons or gear or cyber. We're talking what rich people own: AVs. Ospreys. Full bioware suites. 10,000 eb railguns.

These are 100 of thousands of EB.

Now housing. A 3 bedroom house in the US now is about 8 rooms after dining room, kitchen, bathroom, not counting garage or basement or study.

A mansion has roughly 30 rooms.

In a moderate zone, it costs 2400 eb per month for your house.

If you want that same house in a Corp zone, it's 4800 eb.

Executive is 7200 eb per month.

Apartments and condos cost 30% more, but often have less rooms. But are safer.

And that's just a house or apartment.

A rich person lives in a mansion. In at least the corp zone. Soooo... 18,000 eb per month. 27,000 eb PER MONTH for the Executive areas.

And that's just the mansion. Just the first of several. And boats and cars and planes and...

At 50,000 eb start and 10,000 eb in cyber you are NOT rich in 2020.

This is base book numbers.

You can't start rich - you can start either with a fancy toy and little to no money, or lots of money for smaller toys.

Also, if your Ref lets you take Special Ability 10 and you don't get the all the skills to back that level of pay up ( not just Medtech 10, but all the skills a top-rank Specialist would have, far far more than starting skills allow), the core book advice is to go ahead and waste min/maxing players.

 

[Garrison72]

The idea that V is so banal and has nothing better to do than upload Youtube vids...jesus people. This is ridiculous. OP knows it.

 

[Snowflakez]

No thanks. Just animalfather trolling as usual.

 

[BaalNergal]

No thanks. Just animalfather trolling as usual.

Hey! That's my job!

 

[Sardukhar]

Hey! That's my job!

animal was here first. He's been here for yeeeeeears. And trolled magnificently quite a few times. His unbanned status is because he starts a lot of discussion and he's amusing to me.

FOR.

NOW.

 

[Lilayah]

 

[BaalNergal]

animal was here first. He's been here for yeeeeeears. And trolled magnificently quite a few times. His unbanned status is because he starts a lot of discussion and he's amusing to me.

FOR.

NOW.

Well, I'll just have to solve this dilemma with him the Tyranid way.