It feels to me at least like there was some sort of internal struggle between the notion of choice and a fixed singular vision of death. Personally i hope from the debacle, we'll see more re-commitment to choice/consequence as that's the CD Red i'm interested in giving my money to.
It feels to me at least like there was some sort of internal struggle between the notion of choice and a fixed singular vision of death. Personally i hope from the debacle, we'll see more re-commitment to choice/consequence as that's the CD Red i'm interested in giving my money to.
Redemption from what? I think you're inserting a story of a greater purpose just because the protagonist dies. The entire driving force of the story is saving yourself -- you don't decide what you're going to do with your time left, the game tells you once you make the decision on the rooftop.
What's the dramatically satisfying conclusion in an RPG where you try to save yourself and ultimately fail?
There isn't a good variety of ending permutations, and my major complaint is that the V the game gives you at the end is not something you can necessarily predict by the choice you make on the rooftop. How was I supposed to know that to get an ending with River I'd have to whore myself out to Johnny for act 3 and have the ending tell me that V becomes a detached bitch? HMU with an ending that features River without having to let Johnny use your body for any side quests. I can save you the time though.
permutations are not always available the world and the characters also have a say. You only know three groups with a decent chance of keeping you alive. But that may mess up your love life.
you gotta decide whats more important to V, fighting Johnny, or being with River. You only know 3 groups that ll help you, and each requires something in return. Thats the central question the game asks, whats important to you. The V who picks nomads, their opportunities to stay alive are going to be outside the city. They don't have strong city relationships. Analogy: you got 3 job opportunities, but your significant other doesn't want to leave town. Whats more important?
they aren't going to spoiler the whole ending by telling you what the results of your choices will be. You can try other choices easily via reloading. I agree, sometimes the blurb is deceptive, but even if they improve it, its not going to tell you everything that changes.
Also, I seen a river/sun ending clip, didnt seem like it has to go poorly.
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It does have to go poorly. No matter what to do, in The Sun V will always sound depressed and both Kerry and River will say that V have been acting cold and distant. Not only them, all of V's friends say the same thing. All that because we made one decision in the rooftop. They don't have to tell us everthing, but where is my choice? Why can't I choose how my V would react to those people? Plus the only endings where V can stay with Kerry or River are endings that are more bitter than sweet, while if you romanced Panam or Judy you get to see a sweet and hopeful ending, riding in the sunset. How is that fair? Kerry and River already have less screen time that Panam and Judy and on top of that they don't have a single satisfying ending.
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uhh I think you are overestimating that. V literally just recovered from almost dying, and someone they hung out with for 2-3 weeks is gone, and they are planning a life threatening mission to space.
the LIs are like, hey, wsup, you ok? you been quiet recently. By the time the convo is done, it can be pretty warm.
thats not like v has become an evil ahole, or now exists in a pit of darkness. V got a lot goin on, the LI's noticed, thats all
One of the major themes of the Sun ending is that in "choosing" glory, V has sacrificed all of her relationships in the pursuit of becoming a legend. It isn't just the LIs that comment on it.
Maybe. But like I said, if you do the Star ending romancing Panam or Judy you can avoid that bitter feeling while if you romanced Kerry or River you can't, no matter what ending you choose.
I think the reason that these things in the Sun ending bother me that much is just a consequence of how the Male RO's were treated, you know? Like, they already have less content and on top of that they also have some pretty bitter endings.
there's an option to say its more about survival than glory.
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I dunno, by the end of the convo Kerry and river seemed good to go. Honestly I think Kerry was pretty well done/well served as a character. River... ehh fell flat for me. Maybe its because all of Kerry's missions are focused on character, whereas the other guys got a lot of plot/combat stuff.
Judy and Panam have a lot of content, but panam doesn't get a lot of charachter development, And Judy's screen time is mostly Evelyn's tragedy.
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i'm a heavy duty roleplayer, a character i make needs to have some thought process to make decisions, so on my last playthrough (this is the one where i went with the secret ending), in my mind (yes call it head canon if you like) v was going over her options, she was about to go with the aldecoldos till johnny pointed out that all she'd be doing was getting all her friends killed by throwing them at arasaka, in response she ponders: "i've only got a few hours to live, not enough time to make a plan, let alone execute one, going in with a small unit under these circumstances doesn't look good, likely get everyone killed anyway, and i'm not going to sit on this roof top and wait to die either, might as well walk into saka tower an try killing my way to mikoshi, at least this way i'm only risking my own neck". and from the dialogue that seems to be a reasonable conclusion to make regarding what v is thinking, what motivation may be lurking under her skin, imho. now, if v was allowed to express concern for the lives of their friends as a motivating factor, seems to me that v shouldn't be railroaded into becoming a jackass concerned only with making it big, in several points during the main quest v was given the opportunity to say basically (i'm paraphrasing here), "yeah, starting out all i wanted to do was make it big, become a legend, now i see it was just a childish fantasy, i'd settle for a quiet life at this point". now, note i said this isn't actually said in game at all, but it's the gist of a few conversation options throughout the game, seeing as v is able to express similar feelings through the game, this v did, so in my mind making it big was no longer a goal to her, and hadn't been for some time. i'm just waking up, sorry if this doesn't track well, just some spare thoughts, maybe i should wait till i've actually woken up to post. lol
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About character development of the 4 LI´s, I´d say Judy got the most. Kerry as I heard changes his sight of things, so he was affected by V too. River also, who came back to be a family first guy, instead of fighting crime in a place where it seems a waste of time to do so. I think Panam here got the least development, because she doesn´t seem to change much due to interactions with V.
I don't exactly disagree, though I kinda meant time focused on the character's self rather than their actual "character development" from a literary stance. My understanding of Judy as a character is most defined by Evelyn's tragedy. Panam, its more about just action, Kerry, its actually just about Kerry.
I guess that depends on what you mean by development. There is an entire ending that might as well be called the Panam ending.
Yeah to me as a design choice its shockingly badly thought through. Complete opposite of what i would have expected from CD Red based on past history.
Yes, I know. It´s the one I took ´cause of Judy. And to my understanding during the credits there is no call from Panam(doesn´t really bother me), a lovely little message from Judy, trying to express her feelings, which she has problems with(but that´s ok, kinda cute) and a message from Mitch who says something like: "I dunno what you´re doing or what you´re up to, but you can always count on us." That hints me that you, if romanced Judy, are not with the nomads anymore, but you can count on them if needed.
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The Path of Glory can still have an happy ending, when started with don't fear the reaper!
I didn't made the concert in red dirt bar and the last mission with Judy pyramid song.
So at least no one dies, V gets back into his body and maybe there is a cure, brought to you by Mr. BLUE EYES.
A new cloned body or whatever.
So at the end, Judy is still in night city, you don't know that she is lesbian.
And all your friends wait for your comeback.
So with path of glory via don't fear the reaper. All options are still on going!
Maybe Johnny isn't complete erased from your mind. Because at the end you hear the samurai song.
So I want to play the space mission and see what's going on with Mr. Blue Eyes.
The Kerry missions can still be played when back from space. And the Johnny Data isn't lost, it is still alive with alt.
So no problem to get him back into the mindset.
Maybe that's the cure, a Johnny V Mix uploaded.
So the body accepts engram and V is still present.
At last nothing has happened! All options still available
I didn't made the concert in red dirt bar and the last mission with Judy pyramid song.
So at least no one dies, V gets back into his body and maybe there is a cure, brought to you by Mr. BLUE EYES.
A new cloned body or whatever.
So at the end, Judy is still in night city, you don't know that she is lesbian.
And all your friends wait for your comeback.
So with path of glory via don't fear the reaper. All options are still on going!
Maybe Johnny isn't complete erased from your mind. Because at the end you hear the samurai song.
So I want to play the space mission and see what's going on with Mr. Blue Eyes.
The Kerry missions can still be played when back from space. And the Johnny Data isn't lost, it is still alive with alt.
So no problem to get him back into the mindset.
Maybe that's the cure, a Johnny V Mix uploaded.
So the body accepts engram and V is still present.
At last nothing has happened! All options still available
Okay, got you. Still you look at Judy, she overcame tragic losses and wasn´t eaten up by the city. Even though her plan for revenge came back to haunt her, she took risk what she never wanted before(like Konpeki BD). She always believed of the good in people and I like that thought, but as she learned of mostly Maiko, that´s not always the case. Specially not in NC! She was able to leave this shit behind her. With help of V, but that counts for the others as well.
River was a guy that became a cop, due to what happened to him in his childhood, when his parents were murdered. He did it to protect his family and others from that sort of crime, but lost connection to his family on the way. Then after V helping with the Rhyne case, River realised that the cops in NC aren´t really into justice! I mean there is so many corrupted cops in this place...jeez. Kerry thanks to V realised that he had done some really bad decisions and confronted himself with his fears, winning over them in the end to live on.
It´s just Panam that to me doesn´t really get anything new to her.
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Isn´t there still the possibility that Alt was just trying to force you into giving Johnny your body, so that she could have a loyal servant in the human world?! Meaning the death clock named by her would be fake and only the Arasaka one would be real.
V spends majority of the game's story fighting for their life so how can choosing how to face death be the main theme when the player character does the exact opposite throughout most of the story, and this very choice only happens at the end?
V is still alive in most endings. I don't understand why people are so quick to write them off. Especially when we have no clue when those expansions are even going to take place. There's nothing from stopping the writers to explore other themes with V.
I'll have to disagree as I feel they're not satisfying. All the pain and struggle V goes through amounts to failure no matter what you do and right until Alt/Hellman/Takemura deliver bad news V believes they've made it. The endings where V lives have no finality to them. If CDPR decided to put the endings and last months of V's life on rails we should actually get to see it but it just ends.
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Good evening everyone,
I've now spent over 100 hours in this game. And I have to say that this game just knocks me out. It's sad to see that your own character just dies away and you don't have the slightest chance to defend yourself against it. Every currently playable ending is just plain dark and sad. The relationships with the respective characters are ... well how should I put it ... too sensitive. What I am writing here has already been summarized by many from the community in exactly the same way or in other words. But there is one thing I have to do with the developers and everyone who even has anything to do with the game. God damn it ... The mixture of how this storyline is structured with reference to the (probably self-produced music) Please correct me if I'm wrong, it's just awesome. This music was chosen so appropriately that the goose bumps overwhelmed me and I feel the decisions of the characters 100%. And you know it every time, no matter how often I play it, that I don't feel like it anymore, how it ends each time and as I said that you can't do anything yourself to save your character or the others. because no matter what I choose, I feel guilty for every answer I get and only wished I didn't have to answer those answers but to save the characters, help and make them happier.
But I know that developing something is not easy, I don't have a clue about it myself and I can imagine that some suggestions or things are simply not feasible.
Last but not least something positive: Kudos to everyone involved in the game Cyberpunk 2077. At the beginning, I wasn't convinced by this game to buy it, but it was 200% worth it. I'm glad this game came out despite its flaws and bugs, it was well worth the money.
[Translated with Google translator]
I've now spent over 100 hours in this game. And I have to say that this game just knocks me out. It's sad to see that your own character just dies away and you don't have the slightest chance to defend yourself against it. Every currently playable ending is just plain dark and sad. The relationships with the respective characters are ... well how should I put it ... too sensitive. What I am writing here has already been summarized by many from the community in exactly the same way or in other words. But there is one thing I have to do with the developers and everyone who even has anything to do with the game. God damn it ... The mixture of how this storyline is structured with reference to the (probably self-produced music) Please correct me if I'm wrong, it's just awesome. This music was chosen so appropriately that the goose bumps overwhelmed me and I feel the decisions of the characters 100%. And you know it every time, no matter how often I play it, that I don't feel like it anymore, how it ends each time and as I said that you can't do anything yourself to save your character or the others. because no matter what I choose, I feel guilty for every answer I get and only wished I didn't have to answer those answers but to save the characters, help and make them happier.
But I know that developing something is not easy, I don't have a clue about it myself and I can imagine that some suggestions or things are simply not feasible.
Last but not least something positive: Kudos to everyone involved in the game Cyberpunk 2077. At the beginning, I wasn't convinced by this game to buy it, but it was 200% worth it. I'm glad this game came out despite its flaws and bugs, it was well worth the money.
[Translated with Google translator]
Yeah, I think that DeShawn's question to V; "how do you want to go out: blaze of glory or old and grey?" was not really about how you want to die (unless Dex is psychic), but rather how do you want to live.
Personally? I would have told Dex that my V wants to die an old lady surrounded by loved ones, but I didn't get that choice. V was pretty much being swept along on Jackie's big quest to become a legend in the beginning, and then their main drive was to simply survive. I get that some people like the idea that V ultimately is choosing how they die, but I didn't want my V to choose to die. I really wish we could have expressed that we weren't suicidal in the Sun ending, because it felt incredibly fatalistic, and I don't like that my only choice to feel hopeful about V's future is to choose the Star ending, when I don't want to involve the Aldecados in taking on Arasaka, and I would have chosen to stay in Night City if it were a choice explicitly given to V.
I completely finished the main storyline and chose the ending where V leaves Night-City with Panam and Aldecaldos. I really loved my character and I don't want to see ending where V dies. I want to see the DLC where V will find salvation. I really liked Night-City and this atmosphere. I completed the game in 30 hours and I want to play more. But knowing that I will continue from the checkpoint before the final, I don't want to play. It's really sad that all the endings show that V's efforts were useless. I hope CDPR will understand that it was very stupid to make such a plot. Yes, the story is very cool, but.. I want to see the continuation of V's story.
Sorry for grammatical mistakes
[Translated with Google translator]
Sorry for grammatical mistakes
[Translated with Google translator]