[Spoiler Alert] About the endings

[AikoHayashi]

I believe that the endings where V has 6 months to live are more like "to be continued" story. There are enough hints in some of the endings about this.
I miss a good ending in the sense that there is no ending, where no one of V's friends will feel betrayed or mad with V or bring more unnecessary deaths and this could be easily achieved without going against the main principles of the characters and being cheesy.
I think that the game gives in general mostly a positive and bright feeling. If Cyberpunk was a city without crimes/problems I don't know what the game could be about, picking flowers or delivering pizza maybe? There are enough people in the world of Cyberpunk, who want to change things to something better, even the fixers' requests go mostly over rescuing people or handle assholes who kill people for their implants or for creating BDs. In some cases, V can even allow the "target" to escape, but those are things for another discussion.

 

[Paul_Leach71]

I'm OK with bittersweet, but the endings are little too bitter for me. The whole game you are trying to save yourself and it's ultimately futile. Sure you make a difference to those friends you have but the bleakness of the endings left a bad taste in my mouth. I'm not saying I wanted a super happy ending but death in all of them kind of sucks.

Life is futile, you're going to die no matter what you do. What matters is the manner in which we do so. Dex hints at this, in fact the game is littered with subtle suggestions along that very line of thought. You're going to die at the end, nothing will change that, so the terms on which you die - yours or someone else's, suddenly gains greater significance. CDPR have plumbed the depths of ontology in this game. (Much like CP2020 used to.)

 

[Hammerstein]

Life is futile, you're going to die no matter what you do. What matters is the manner in which we do so. Dex hints at this, in fact the game is littered with subtle suggestions along that very line of thought. You're going to die at the end, nothing will change that, so the terms on which you die - yours or someone else's, suddenly gains greater significance. CDPR have plumbed the depths of ontology in this game. (Much like CP2020 used to.)

Dex also hints at a quiet life as a nobody. And the closest thing to get that is to sell out to Arasaka, betray Johnny and become a faceless corporate stooge again.

And we know how that plays out....

The game's endings and the lack of meaningful choice are trash. The "hero" is sent on a futile milk run, constantly following red herrings and false promises. It goes against everything that Pondsmith said about Cyberpunk, especially this quote:

When I wrote Cyberpunk back in the day, the idea was to show a dark mirror of the world we have been shaping since the 1980s. It was a warning, yes, but I also made all of you the heroes of this dystopian world. You weren’t there to be ground underfoot like Rick Deckard, or exploited and enslaved like Roy Batty. You were there to grab the wheel, steal the power, break the strangleholds of the corrupt and gun down the thugs they sent to crush you. You were, and still are, the heroes of the Cyberpunk Dark Future. I’ve shown you a way. It’s up to you to use it.

Go into this next decade fearlessly, savagely, cleverly, recklessly. It will fall to you and those like you, to face down the megacorps, the corrupt politicians, the thieves of privacy, honor and freedom itself and make our Dark Future a better one.

You can do this. I know you can.

Countdown to the Dark Future: Mike Pondsmith

Each day this year, we have celebrated the impending arrival of the real year 2020 with a fact about the Cyberpunk universe. We call it Countdown to the Dark Future. Cyberpunk 2020. Actual 2020. Ge…

rtalsoriangames.com

 

[Naglafar2183]

Life is futile, you're going to die no matter what you do. What matters is the manner in which we do so. Dex hints at this, in fact the game is littered with subtle suggestions along that very line of thought. You're going to die at the end, nothing will change that, so the terms on which you die - yours or someone else's, suddenly gains greater significance. CDPR have plumbed the depths of ontology in this game. (Much like CP2020 used to.)

I am not sure I'd say life is futile no matter what, but I agree it's important how you spend the time you have.

I still think in a game about relationships, never giving up and beating impossible odds (how many times a was V supposed to die?) the endings were a little too dark. It kind of goes against the whole concept of never giving up the game pushes.

I have some of the same issues with lack choice in the endings the post above me outlined as well. If you do the Sun, and Panam asks you to leave, you should be able to leave NC then. Same in the Star, you should be able to decide to stay after helping the aldecaldos, for Kerry or River, or even just to help out NC.
I think these were consequences of rushed development and the writers pushing a certain narrative. I personally loved the game anyways though, as well as the overall narrative that writers came up with.

Post automatically merged: Feb 20, 2021

Dex also hints at a quiet life as a nobody. And the closest thing to get that is to sell out to Arasaka, betray Johnny and become a faceless corporate stooge again.

And we know how that plays out....

The game's endings and the lack of meaningful choice are trash. The "hero" is sent on a futile milk run, constantly following red herrings and false promises. It goes against everything that Pondsmith said about Cyberpunk, especially this quote:

Countdown to the Dark Future: Mike Pondsmith

Each day this year, we have celebrated the impending arrival of the real year 2020 with a fact about the Cyberpunk universe. We call it Countdown to the Dark Future. Cyberpunk 2020. Actual 2020. Ge…

rtalsoriangames.com

I think cyberpunk changed since Pondsmith originally created it. It started out as punk rockers vs corpos and saving the world, and evolved to be about not saving the world but saving your friends. I believe Pondsmith even said as much, but I cant find the interview now.

 

[Buckadoz]

Dex also hints at a quiet life as a nobody. And the closest thing to get that is to sell out to Arasaka, betray Johnny and become a faceless corporate stooge again.

And we know how that plays out....

The game's endings and the lack of meaningful choice are trash. The "hero" is sent on a futile milk run, constantly following red herrings and false promises. It goes against everything that Pondsmith said about Cyberpunk, especially this quote:

Countdown to the Dark Future: Mike Pondsmith

Each day this year, we have celebrated the impending arrival of the real year 2020 with a fact about the Cyberpunk universe. We call it Countdown to the Dark Future. Cyberpunk 2020. Actual 2020. Ge…

rtalsoriangames.com

Damn, the "you can't save the world but you can save yourself" line gets used every couple of pages here, but I think we should use "you aren't here to be ground underfoot like Deckard" more.

Edit: I should say to the extent that the "purpose" of cyberpunk is talked about. I think at a certain point the idea of arguing over whether or not a story can end well solely because of the genre of world it takes place in is a silly concept in general.

 

[OG_VELI]

I still think in a game about relationships, never giving up and beating impossible odds (how many times a was V supposed to die?) the endings were a little too dark. It kind of goes against the whole concept of never giving up the game pushes.

The way I see it, is that V only gives up if they give away their body and life to Johnny (he even mentions that himself) or let their personality be uploaded into Mikoshi. Otherwise, V keeps fighting one way or the other.

 

[Guest 4519094]

They invented it for the ending in order to justify the choice of giving V's body to Johnny... because if there isn't a drawback to the player taking back their own body, why would they ever give it to Johnny?

Seen accusations about writers forcing the story or forcing the hand of the player for every single ending bar the one where you ... stay on the roof.

Also, after meeting alt the first time my first character specialized in hacking for two reasons
1) prepare to go with alt when somehting goes wrong as every plan tends to (was pleasantly surprised when i found out hanako thinks the same way )
2) prepare to still be somehow useful even if V ends up in a wheelchair, had no idea how the game would end but felt like they'd make you put the life of your friends on the line .. so at least be able to hack people (if only that worked on smasher, still remember equiping cyberware malfunction for that last mission just for that bastard)

cutting to the chase that first character happily went with alt and would have even if she could have fixed the body,

Also, sending Johnny in the body instead of V was just as rough, clearly HE DOES NOT WANT to go back, and seeing how he copes with it ... can understand why, but regardless that horrible world needs more Johnny Silverhand,
so everything is in it's right place .... after all.

 

[Guest 4412420]

If it wasn't for the no spamming rule I'd suggest using a gif of Ramsay Bolton wiggling a sausage in response to every "this is cyberpunk there are no happy endings".

The Witcher series are dark fantasy where happiness is also seemingly impossible yet Geralt gets a happy ending and he's not doomed to die in any of the games. If Geralt can get a happy ending despite how cruel and horrible the Continent is, why can't V?

 

[theBlackDragon]

They invented it for the ending in order to justify the choice of giving V's body to Johnny... because if there isn't a drawback to the player taking back their own body, why would they ever give it to Johnny?

That would have made sense if it wasn't the exact same in the Arasaka ending. As I see it there really is no reason for them to give V the exact same time-to-live in that ending, except for the possibility to continue on from it.

Hell, even if you choose Mikoshi they could easily bring you back.
After all, if you walk that path you've proven to be capable (you offed Smasher), trustworthy (had ample opportunities to kill Hanako), loyal (doubly so if your V started as Corpo...), and, if you saved him, Takemura trusts you. I'd argue that in such a situation Arasaka has a lot to gain by bringing V back. Assuming they just don't want to spend the resources on V at that point it'd be easy enough to create a situation where V's talents would be a great benefit (eg. escalate one of the slumbering wars with a competitor)

The only endings that are points of absolutely no return are joining Alt (though there's always the option of some deus-ex-machina, but given how it's impossible for Alt herself that sounds like it would really need to stretch things...), and suicide (well, still got that biochip in your head, so ... who knows? *wink* *wink* *nudge* ).

 

[Tofujunky]

If the biochip was still an issue, V wouldn't be dying in The Devil ending. That's just my opinion, but I believe that the problem is now the damage it caused not that it continues to hurt V because as you said it's gone in The Devil ending but V's chances weren't improved by its removal at all.

Yeah the issue it seems that V's brain is being rewired by the engram and her body is rejecting it. There was no way to avoid death in the 6 months. I don't blame the Arasaka doctors, doesn't look like anything could have helped.

 

[Buckadoz]

That would have made sense if it wasn't the exact same in the Arasaka ending. As I see it there really is no reason for them to give V the exact same time-to-live in that ending, except for the possibility to continue on from it.

The spirit of putting an expiration date on V is the same: it's still an artificial ass-pull that's only purpose is to force you to consider an option that you wouldn't if there was no cancer ex machina.

 

[Restlessdingo32]

Come on, you can't actually believe that. The scene where he and Smasher comes back up to find Saburo dead in the penthouse made it so obvious he knew Yorinobu killed his old man. I don't think he even needed to use the scanner in his fancy Arasaka optics in order to deduce that Saburo was strangled, not poisoned.

When he called Yorinobu after getting V out of the landfill and said he found Saburo's killer, he was playing a mind game with Yori, pretending to be loyal in order to find evidence of the truth so he could present it to Arasaka's board and have Yorinobu ousted. His only mistake was thinking Yorinobu wouldn't see through this and send assassins after him.

Honestly, I wasn't sure. V wakes up in a garbage dump after eating one to the grill. I don't doubt Takemura knew something was amiss. Your interpretation here is as good as any.

The point wasn't intended to bring up whether Takemura knew what the deal was at this point in the game.

Spoiler: Tangents are Fun

Against my better judgement.... Takemura struck me as a very disciplined and devout protector of Saburo. It's clear I must go off on a tangent and drive this point home. For an individual to reach the level of discipline required to be this devoted to a cause, fanatical even, is impressive.

None of the words used here are meant to be derogatory. A parent viewing their child this way, or a willingness to do anything for them regardless of personal cost, is the same philosophy in a different light. That is a noble cause to be fanatical about.

In my opinion it's disagreeable to view Saburo this way (even though I can understand the motivation). Not because the root philosophy is "wrong". The philosophy is neutral until you assign context to it. It's questionable because it's Saburo Arasaka. It'd be very much in line with questioning a fanatical conviction to support a ruthless slaver. The philosophy itself isn't the disagreeable part. It's the ruthless slaver part.

The point was to suggest Takemura didn't know how V fit into everything. They had just met. To me it does not fit to assume his primary concern was the welfare of V during this introduction. It's far more likely, given the above interpretation of Takemura's character, he was concerned about the fate of Saburo more than V at this moment.

Later, yes, Takemura and V can develop a bond via their ongoing relationship. I certainly felt my V bonding with him. My V's perspective transitioned from initial apprehension to friendship. This is why I chose to save him when presented with the opportunity.

Where I get confused is with the notion V ever explicitly told Takemura they were going to side with Arasaka. I cannot recall V making this commitment in dialogue with Takemura. Perhaps there are options in those interactions where V does so and I missed them.

Basically, my V never intentionally wanted to betray Takemura. Even though my V may have performed actions directly opposing Arasaka. I suppose it could be seen as a betrayal, to some extent. Particularly if Hanako dies as a result. It's not as if the intent was to deviate from the Hanako plan to hurt her or Takemura though.

In hindsight, it's yet another area the game could have handled better. It's another individual element coupled to the rooftop decision. I'm trying to think of other games where so much was lumped into one decision this way and drawing a blank (not saying they don't exist). The worst part is how many ways those other elements could have been independently explored further.

 

[GVArcian]

That would have made sense if it wasn't the exact same in the Arasaka ending. As I see it there really is no reason for them to give V the exact same time-to-live in that ending, except for the possibility to continue on from it.

It's the same justification as in the Star/Sun endings. Why would you ever choose to put yourself inside Mikoshi if your body's fine after removing the relic?

From the perspective of game design, the Devil ending needed a binary choice just like the other endings so as to not have more or less choices than those endings, and you can't have a choice between "Win" and "Win but in red" since that would make the Devil ending seem like the "right" choice compared to the other endings, which is why they went with a variation of the DNA factor from the other endings to justify why V will die and why it might be in their interest to put a copy of themselves inside Mikoshi to wait for a suitable, genetically compatible body for that engram copy.

 

[rippercityransom]

The spirit of putting an expiration date on V is the same: it's still an artificial ass-pull that's only purpose is to force you to consider an option that you wouldn't if there was no cancer ex machina.

Even knowing V's brain is rotting like an old banana doesn't make me want to give Johnny the body, and he was my buddy. It's a poor motivator if they're going to put a potential cure tease in the end, no one I played the game with wanted to give the body up.

 

[Buckadoz]

Even knowing V's brain is rotting like an old banana doesn't make me want to give Johnny the body, and he was my buddy. It's a poor motivator if they're going to put a potential cure tease in the end, no one I played the game with wanted to give the body up.

Oh yeah for sure, I liked talking to Johnny but I'd never do the Johnny ending even if there was no cure tease and V could only last another 5 minutes in the body. I really get the feeling that they didn't expect people to be all that skeeved out by letting Johnny use V's body. It's ironic that the "fuck corpos dude" rockerboy is actually responsible for the grossest thing that can happen to V in a game so focused on "corpos bad".

 

[Tofujunky]

Honestly, I wasn't sure. V wakes up in a garbage dump after eating one to the grill. I don't doubt Takemura knew something was amiss. Your interpretation here is as good as any.

The point wasn't intended to bring up whether Takemura knew what the deal was at this point in the game.

Spoiler: Tangents are Fun

Against my better judgement.... Takemura struck me as a very disciplined and devout protector of Saburo. It's clear I must go off on a tangent and drive this point home. For an individual to reach the level of discipline required to be this devoted to a cause, fanatical even, is impressive.

None of the words used here are meant to be derogatory. A parent viewing their child this way, or a willingness to do anything for them regardless of personal cost, is the same philosophy in a different light. That is a noble cause to be fanatical about.

In my opinion it's disagreeable to view Saburo this way (even though I can understand the motivation). Not because the root philosophy is "wrong". The philosophy is neutral until you assign context to it. It's questionable because it's Saburo Arasaka. It'd be very much in line with questioning a fanatical conviction to support a ruthless slaver. The philosophy itself isn't the disagreeable part. It's the ruthless slaver part.

The point was to suggest Takemura didn't know how V fit into everything. They had just met. To me it does not fit to assume his primary concern was the welfare of V during this introduction. It's far more likely, given the above interpretation of Takemura's character, he was concerned about the fate of Saburo more than V at this moment.

Later, yes, Takemura and V can develop a bond via their ongoing relationship. I certainly felt my V bonding with him. My V's perspective transitioned from initial apprehension to friendship. This is why I chose to save him when presented with the opportunity.

Where I get confused is with the notion V ever explicitly told Takemura they were going to side with Arasaka. I cannot recall V making this commitment in dialogue with Takemura. Perhaps there are options in those interactions where V does so and I missed them.

Basically, my V never intentionally wanted to betray Takemura. Even though my V may have performed actions directly opposing Arasaka. I suppose it could be seen as a betrayal, to some extent. Particularly if Hanako dies as a result. It's not as if the intent was to deviate from the Hanako plan to hurt her or Takemura though.

In hindsight, it's yet another area the game could have handled better. It's another individual element coupled to the rooftop decision. I'm trying to think of other games where so much was lumped into one decision this way and drawing a blank (not saying they don't exist). The worst part is how many ways those other elements could have been independently explored further.

Takemura is never directly told by V that they wish to "join Arasaka". He persistently recommends V side with them, if you save him. I believe based on the extra corpo dialogue in throughout the Devil's ending, V implies they are reluctantly siding with Arasaka to make things right in addition to saving their life. V mentions this both to Misty and Saburo if you choose the corpo options. It's not like V is running back to them with open arms, it's more about V wanting to make a deal with them and fix their wrongs against them, in hopes that is makes things better for those affected by their decisions. In the epilogue, V is definitely upset by Yourinobu's fate, afraid of Saburo, obviously worried about becoming their property.

Takemura wants V to go into Mikoshi to save their life, but he knows it also means they would "surrender to Arasaka" too. And that would mean he can continue their friendship (romance or mentor relationship depending how you view it). He wants V to make the decision without the influence of his personal wishes, that is why he is cryptic and impersonal during the conversation. Basically reciting what seems to be scripted answers to your dialogue questions and providing limited information (Hellman does the same but I feel it's motivated by his own shady intentions that actual concern ) . He will not reveal what his new duty is or that he wants to meet you for dinner unless you sign. And only if you do so based strictly on whether you are willing to place your trust Arasaka.

Therefore, signing the contract is how he interprets V "joining" Arasaka. You're "surrendering" to them in an honest fashion based on your own will and not due to outside influence.

And yeah he is being manipulative with V in the end, but it's not on behalf of the desires of Saburo it is behalf of his personal desires, and of course so he can keep giri.

Post automatically merged: Feb 21, 2021

Oh yeah for sure, I liked talking to Johnny but I'd never do the Johnny ending even if there was no cure tease and V could only last another 5 minutes in the body. I really get the feeling that they didn't expect people to be all that skeeved out by letting Johnny use V's body. It's ironic that the "fuck corpos dude" rockerboy is actually responsible for the grossest thing that can happen to V in a game so focused on "corpos bad".

That's really the irony though isn't it? One thing to note about Johnny is that he isn't really "corpos bad" he is really just "Arasaka bad". I mean he enjoys blowing up the Kang Tao buildings but otherwise he never talks about the other corps.

Post automatically merged: Feb 21, 2021

It's the same justification as in the Star/Sun endings. Why would you ever choose to put yourself inside Mikoshi if your body's fine after removing the relic?

From the perspective of game design, the Devil ending needed a binary choice just like the other endings so as to not have more or less choices than those endings, and you can't have a choice between "Win" and "Win but in red" since that would make the Devil ending seem like the "right" choice compared to the other endings, which is why they went with a variation of the DNA factor from the other endings to justify why V will die and why it might be in their interest to put a copy of themselves inside Mikoshi to wait for a suitable, genetically compatible body for that engram copy.

I don't think it's presented as the "win" ending, it's presented as a "win *but at the price of your soul, freedom, and seeing your friends on earth" ending. I think they really want corpos to take this path for future DLC so they needed to give you a reason to take it other than to tempt those who want Goro to show them his real food.

 

[Ayinde_Palmer]

That would have made sense if it wasn't the exact same in the Arasaka ending. As I see it there really is no reason for them to give V the exact same time-to-live in that ending, except for the possibility to continue on from it.

Hell, even if you choose Mikoshi they could easily bring you back.
After all, if you walk that path you've proven to be capable (you offed Smasher), trustworthy (had ample opportunities to kill Hanako), loyal (doubly so if your V started as Corpo...), and, if you saved him, Takemura trusts you. I'd argue that in such a situation Arasaka has a lot to gain by bringing V back. Assuming they just don't want to spend the resources on V at that point it'd be easy enough to create a situation where V's talents would be a great benefit (eg. escalate one of the slumbering wars with a competitor)

The only endings that are points of absolutely no return are joining Alt (though there's always the option of some deus-ex-machina, but given how it's impossible for Alt herself that sounds like it would really need to stretch things...), and suicide (well, still got that biochip in your head, so ... who knows? *wink* *wink* *nudge* ).

its interesting, because in the devil ending, I think choosing survival is choosing mikoshi. I think each ending presents V with a life or death choice, but in Arasaka, life is presented as mikoshi. It also still has V as an engram..

But, its the devil ending, so maybe its a lie.

joining alt is not really a point of no return I think, But nobody from that side is particularly cool with overwriting peoples consciousness. Alt doesn't seem to have strong interest in getting a body anymore regardless.

Post automatically merged: Feb 21, 2021

Oh yeah for sure, I liked talking to Johnny but I'd never do the Johnny ending even if there was no cure tease and V could only last another 5 minutes in the body. I really get the feeling that they didn't expect people to be all that skeeved out by letting Johnny use V's body. It's ironic that the "fuck corpos dude" rockerboy is actually responsible for the grossest thing that can happen to V in a game so focused on "corpos bad".

Johnny isn't responsible for what happened to V. V is probably the most responsible for what happened to V, with arasaka coming in second for inventing the tech. And I think they knew, the Johnny option is for those who felt like Johnny was a bro, or those who would give up a shortened life for someone else living a long one.

BTW, Johnny's hates corpos in general(ever since he deserted in the corporate war), but Arasaka was the dominant Corp in night city in his time, and then they kidnapped his girlfriend, tried to kill him twice, then killed her body, and 10 years later he finds out they trapped her mind. So yes, he has a very specific reason to hate Arasaka more than others, but he still hates corporations in general.

 

[Tofujunky]

its interesting, because in the devil ending, I think choosing survival is choosing mikoshi. I think each ending presents V with a life or death choice, but in Arasaka, life is presented as mikoshi. It also still has V as an engram..

But, its the devil ending, so maybe its a lie.

joining alt is not really a point of no return I think, But nobody from that side is particularly cool with overwriting peoples consciousness. Alt doesn't seem to have strong interest in getting a body anymore regardless.

Post automatically merged: Feb 21, 2021

Johnny isn't responsible for what happened to V. V is probably the most responsible for what happened to V, with arasaka coming in second for inventing the tech. And I think they knew, the Johnny option is for those who felt like Johnny was a bro, or those who would give up a shortened life for someone else living a long one.

BTW, Johnny's hates corpos in general(ever since he deserted in the corporate war), but Arasaka was the dominant Corp in night city in his time, and then they kidnapped his girlfriend, tried to kill him twice, then killed her body, and 10 years later he finds out they trapped her mind. So yes, he has a very specific reason to hate Arasaka more than others, but he still hates corporations in general.

That makes more sense about Johnny, but even in the past memories he never talked about corps in general, just Arasaka.

I really don't feel sorry for Alt, she invented a tech that kills souls and imprisons their engram. It's worse she got kidnapped, she is a decent person, but I couldn't generate much sympathy for her for developing this evil tech. And it's not really talked about much in the game, because it is told through the lense of Johnny's feelings about the world.

In Devil's ending Mikoshi is definitely about survival for V. For the player, it's about the possibility of a DLC corpo path, or with Takemura still in the game. Takemura letting V know they will see each other again is after V's decision to go to Mikoshi. It's important to V to see a close friend again but it did not factor in the decision to go to Mikoshi and Takemura didn't want it to either. Was just a moment of hope for V. That's what I meant

 

[Ayinde_Palmer]

That makes more sense about Johnny, but even in the past memories he never talked about corps in general, just Arasaka.

I really don't feel sorry for Alt, she invented a tech that kills souls and imprisons their engram. It's worse she got kidnapped, she is a decent person, but I couldn't generate much sympathy for her for developing this evil tech. And it's not really talked about much in the game, because it is told through the lense of Johnny's feelings about the world.

In Devil's ending Mikoshi is definitely about survival for V. For the player, it's about the possibility of a DLC corpo path, or with Takemura still in the game. Takemura letting V know they will see each other again is after V's decision to go to Mikoshi. It's important to V to see a close friend again but it did not factor in the decision to go to Mikoshi and Takemura didn't want it to either. Was just a moment of hope for V.

Well as for alt, they don't get into her backstory much in game, after all Johnny was pretty bad at being in a relationship with her, he doesn't know much about it.

but according to cyberpunk red (supposed to be cannon to 2077, though who knows if that will change)

But she actually didnt develop soul killer to kill people. It was initially being developed to save people and run the net more safely, but the company she worked for turned it into a weapon. Arasaka wanted to get soulkiller, but make it able to kill/capture remotely (it used to require a large facility in person) So they kidnapped alt, made her write a more deadly version then used it on her. She foresaw this though, and wrote soulkiller to accept only her as controller, as well as hacking Arasaka to escape. Johnny coming indirectly stopped her from returning to her body. And she escaped with the improved version of soulkiller out of their grasp for awhile. The soulkiller they use by 2077 is a different one Hanako recreates with pieces of info from the original Alts old Employers made. Later within the net, She tries to create spaces for engram AI who were soulkilled. She may have changed somewhat by 2077 though.

But anyway, point is Alt didn't exactly create soulkiller as we know it, and has worked hard to limit its existence/use, and take care of those its been used on in the net. She's not exactly the mad scientist, more the type whose advances become weaponized. Though, she was no anti corpo-revolutionary, she thought Johnny was a bit mentally ill.

 

[GVArcian]

Though, she was no anti corpo-revolutionary, she thought Johnny was a bit mentally ill.

As much as I like Johnny, it's hard to argue she's wrong on that point.