Thank you CD Project Red for not using DRM in you games!

[Scholdarr.452]

I'm afraid you clearly don't understand this issue you are attempting to speak authoritatively about.

Do steam games check to see whether the steam client is installed before they are run?

Yes they do.

Actually that's the problem: you already seem to believe CDPR's (and other people's) "propaganda" or better misinformation.

The truth is that games don't NECESSARILY check whether the Steam client is installed or running. There are a ton of games that function completely without Steam after they are downloaded and activated. You can for example play Crusader Kings II (or almost any other Paradox Entertainment game) completely without the Steam client running. You can copy your game files, transfer them to another PC and play the game there without any Steam client involved and without any internet connection required. The truth is that it is indeed totally up to the puslisher how they want to use Steam and how much DRM they want to include in their Steam version. Valve doesn't force you to use Steamworks CIG or other DRM methods. You can use Steam basically just as a download client, much like how the browser-based solution is working. CDPR's games on Steam COULD work like that as well - if CDPR wanted it - even with all the typcial Steam features still in place an running for those who enjoy them. You can still see the initial Steam client requirement for installing the game for the first time as kind of DRM. That's ok. But why does CDPR goes beyond that, implementing Steamworks CIG for e.g. Witcher 2 if they are so much against any form of DRM? That's the whole point of my posts here...

So maybe I'm not the one who should do his homeworks. I recommend reading for example this site: http://steam.wikia.com/wiki/List_of_DRM-free_games

Agressive? No

Limited English, yes. What does mean to fool someone? I' m one of those who has posted a thank, do you know me to tell me if I'm let myself be fooled? Why don't you respect my feelings toward CDPR when I express them here? Why do you say I am someone whose let itself be fooled? and Why are you acusing CDPR to fool me?

Agressive? I'm a latin woman, sorry if I seem to lash about anyone

I'm sorry if you took that too personal, really. I do respect your feelings but I don't necessarily have to agree with your motivations (at least the ones you or others openly state here), do I? I just elaborated why your reasons to thank them here made little sense to me and I don't that this is a personal attack. At least it wasn't meant as one. Instead I wanted to talk about the topic and not so much about the people posting here.

I accuse CDPR of fooling people because I'm convinced that it is that way. I've explained my reasons for that conviction in the posts above. You are of course free to disagree with me but that won't change my own opinion, at least not if you don't come up with any strong arguments on your own. And I think I have every right to raise my opinion as well, the same right and respect you demand for your own posts.

 

[Aes Sídhe]

Hypothetical: Valve collapses as a business, Afterwards I want to play Crusader Kings on a new build computer. I install the game but can't activate because Steam no longer exists.

If only I'd got that game from GOG I wouldn't have this problem.

On the spurious issue you are pushing regarding Devs forcing degrees of steam on people, you have stated yourself that you are one of those who wants steam integrated in the game by the devs, can't you see that is why different devs do it differently, to give what they believe their fans using that service want?

Damned if they do damned if they don't eh.

 

[wichat]

I accuse because I think that...

Too much to me. In my world one needs to proof when one accuses. If One doesn't proceed this way one's committing aggression. But that's in my world. Calm, cats, we are not contagious in this meaning

 

[Scholdarr.452]

Hypothetical: Valve collapses as a business, Afterwards I want to play Crusader Kings on a new build computer. I install the game but can't activate because Steam no longer exists.

Hypothetical: if Valve really collapses as a business AND they don't stick to their promise to make all games available in that case I would just pirate any game I've bought and want to play and from which I don't have any files left.

But I think you haven't understood me fully before: you don't need to activate those games on a new system. You can just copy them to a different computer and play them there. No activiation needed. So if Steam collapses and you still have the game files (once activated, no matter on which PC) you're good to go without Steam servers running. It's actutally not really different from GOG with the one exception of the one-time activation (which you could do at the time of purchase to go sure). You still need Steam for updates (as you need the GOG servers for updates) but you could also live without them in the extreme case...

I accuse because I think that...

Too much to me. In my world one needs to proof when one accuses. If One doesn't proceed this way one's committing aggression. But that's in my world. Calm, cats, we are not contagious in this meaning

The proof is in my posts. It's not a theory but reality.

You can also try it yourself if you don't believe me. Install games like Divinity Original Sin, Xenonauts or Kebal Space Prgoram on Steam. Then deinstall your Steam client. You can bet those games will still run fine just without Steam (MP probably won't work if it uses Steam though but since Witcher 3 doesn't have any MP that's a no-issue here). So there you have your proof.

If you already knew that you're obviously not fooled here. Doesn't change the circumstance though that CDPR kind of wants to sell the idea to people and therefore kind of fools them.

 

[wichat]

Hypothetical: if Valve really collapses as a business AND they don't stick to their promise to make all games available in that case I would just pirate any game I've bought and want to play and from which I don't have any files left.

But I think you haven't understood me fully before: you don't need to activate those games on a new system. You can just copy them to a different computer and play them there. No activiation needed. So if Steam collapses and you still have the game files (once activated, no matter on which PC) you're good to go without Steam servers running. It's actutally not really different from GOG with the one exception of the one-time activation (which you could do at the time of purchase to go sure). You still need Steam for updates (as you need the GOG servers for updates) but you could also live without them in the extreme case...


The proof is in my posts. It's not a theory but reality.

You can also try it yourself if you don't believe me. Install games like Divinity Original Sin, Xenonauts or Kebal Space Prgoram on Steam. Then deinstall your Steam client. You can bet those games will still run fine just without Steam (MP probably won't work if it uses Steam though but since Witcher 3 doesn't have any MP that's a no-issue here). So there you have your proof.

If you already knew that you're obviously not fooled here. Doesn't change the circumstance though that CDPR kind of wants to sell the idea to people and therefore kind of fools them.

???

Why do you thing I didn't try it?

I know there are a bunch of game you don't need the Steam connection. As I know that the games I really want to play need this DRM connection.
But you're very confused. I've not answerd you the first time because your convictions about DRM yes/no but your sentlences. Your criticizes our expressions of thanks to CDPR. Needless to insinuate that people whom you don't know is fooled by a company or by an idea just to prove you can play a downloaded game on Steam, which is not necessarily required to be connected.

Say whatever you want about DRM but let on my own desicion if it is needed by me to thank or not to CDPR .

Thank you again

 

[Scholdarr.452]

I know there are a bunch of game you don't need the Steam connection. As I know that the games I really want to play need this DRM connection.

You accuse me of a lot of things I've never said or intended. I don't want to argue with you just for the sake for arguing. Please at least try to understand what I'm trying to point out. I just said that their DRM-free approach is not really honest but just a marketing ploy and that therefore I don't think it's good to thank them for it. I'll personally thank them once they confirm a DRM-free version on Steam. Until then their DRM-free campaign is just a marketing strategy to sell more games on GOG. You may thank them for that, that's up to you. But as I've said before, I don't share that opinion. If that hurts your feelings in any way I'm sorry (again) but that doesn't change my opinion on the topic.

Everything I've wanted to say is included in your little quote above. Point is that Witcher 2 needs that DRM connection and the only reason it does is that CDPR or whoever is responsible for the digital distribution of the game on Steam wants it that way. It's pretty clear that CDPR will publish Witcher 3 themselves on Steam. So there is no objective need to include any DRM connection on Steam. If CDPR say that GOG is the only location they could decide on that they are fooling you. That's just a fact because it's provable not true. The same applies to Steam. People asked more than once if the Steam version will include any form of DRM and CDPR refused to answer those concerns so far. That's suspicious to me to say the least.

 

[wichat]

So don't let them fool you. ....

There is no need to thank them for much...

.

Well , I read then I reply

 

[Scholdarr.452]

Well , I read then I reply

Well, I would say you cherry-pick (and I don't even know what you're problem is with my statements above) but that leads nowhere at this point. I've said all I wanted to say and I've also said more than once that it wasn't my intention to hurt your feelings. So there is no need to go in circles. Either you accept my apology and try to understand my whole point or not, that doesn't change much.

 

[wichat]

Never mind... Sometimes I'm a little stubborn

 

[Ryanza]

delete

 

[Scholdarr.452]

You know what. Fuck Steam. Fuck Steam for being forced onto nearly every PC game at retail. There is no reason to have Steam, Origin, Uplay at retail.
These Witcher 3 Steam DRM arguments are so arbitrary. If you want to buy digital PC games through Steam on the internet then fine, buy it. If there's DRM or no DRM, no1 cares because it's digital shit.
The main reason for the DRM fight is to get DRM out of retail. The Witcher 3 has no DRM at retail. And we thank you CD Projekt RED. We want all PC games to be released at retail without DRM. It leads to better PC games at launch and it will stimulate the growth of PC gaming.

Don't Support DRM.

You know that retail is pretty much DEAD on PC? Really, nobody cares anyone about retail on PC with the exception of a few rare collectors. That's just the simple reality. So no, the DRM thing isn't really about the retail market if more than 90% of the PC gamers choose digital versions...

 

[Ryanza]

delete

 

[Scholdarr.452]

If that is the case then PC games shouldn't be sold in retail. But PC games are sold in retail and those retail PC games shouldn't have DRM.

Retail games on PC are sold as long as they generate at least some income. But that doesn't mean they are significant or really important on a general level I fear. I even predict that retail PC games will in many cases vanish sooner or later.

I actually don't have any problems with retail games being DRM-free. I just want every possible version to be as DRM-free as possible and that's possibly not what CDPR has in mind...

 

[Ryanza]

delete

 

[gregski]

Anyway, we have a thread here dedicated to DRM specifically: http://forums.cdprojektred.com/threads/16563-What-does-DRM-achieve-and-does-piracy-equal-lost-sales

Indeed, and I suggest we use it from now on. 2 threads on the same issue is 1 thread too many.

 

[dragonbird]

A moved post said:

So why do you write about it here??? It wasn't me who started this sub-part of the thread...

No, but it's you who is continuing the discussion after being asked to stop. Your post (and the one you were replying to) have been moved to the other thread - please continue with it there. Any further sidetracking in THIS thread is subject to deletion.

Discussion is at http://forums.cdprojektred.com/threads/16563-What-does-DRM-achieve-and-does-piracy-equal-lost-sales

 

[Guest 3765545]

It's really awesome the games without DRM really thank you CD Project Red thanks a lot.