The Yennefer/Triss choice in TW3

[GHOSTMD]

sidedishes ... true ... but soooooo delicious ones don' t you think?

specially (for now) with Yen plot hehehe lets get the same delicious sidedish
with Triss too

Hm... kinda weird Fringilla doesn' t give Geralt a bitchslap when both meet again eh?
Cuz we were talking about strong women n shit

 

[saricc]

Yeah exactly. It almost feels like CDPR is whitewashing Triss's vices and past actions while every single one of Yennefer's flaws is clearly highlighted. It gives people who don't pay much attention a very skewed view on both ladies. Yennefer is better than TW3 makes her seem to be while Triss is worse than TW3 makes her seem to be.

In the end I think both Yen and Triss did some equally fucked up shit in the past. Geralt himself isn't exactly holy either. All 3 of them have major flaws and that's what makes these characters so fun and believable. But I do wish the game would show Yennefer's sweeter side more often while showing Triss's bad side more often as well.

Still, I am content with how Yennefer's arc was handled in TW3.

Spoiler

I really loved that scene on the boat at the end of the Last Wish quest when Geralt and Yenenfer truly declared their love for each other for the first time.

Honestly I think it was fine the way it all turned out. Yennefer is not a "sweet" person. She's guarded, blunt, sometimes mean, and sarcastic. With that being said there are times when she's vulnerable, but to see that it requires commitment from Geralt. That's what I like about her character. Maybe it could have used a bit more sweetness, but anything more than that would've been overdoing it.

As for Triss... Well I think her more treacherous side should have been shown off more. Oh well. Looks like us book readers will only know, rofl.

 

[Captmorgan72]

Tris took advantage of Geralt's amnesia and seduced him. Geralt's subconscious knew he was in love with a sorcerous and Tris knew that. She even admitted to Geralt that she took advantage of his amnesia. I don't think she was counting on falling in love with him though. After Geralt regains his memory, his feelings for Yen and all his memories of her return. How could he not want to go back with her?

 

[Kallelinski]

Hm... kinda weird Fringilla doesn' t give Geralt a bitchslap when both meet again eh?
Cuz we were talking about strong women n shit

Yeah, that was really underwhelming. I was quite excited to meet her and then you talk like 15 seconds with her and you are done.

In the books she starts to make out with him to get information and hold him on short leash, but the longer Geralt stayed in Toussaint, the more she got interested in him, she even started to be protective about him against the lodge, that was rather unexpected. I really thought that she starts to get involved in my affairs again, but nada.

 

[wright1978]

Tris took advantage of Geralt's amnesia and seduced him. Geralt's subconscious knew he was in love with a sorcerous and Tris knew that. She even admitted to Geralt that she took advantage of his amnesia. I don't think she was counting on falling in love with him though. After Geralt regains his memory, his feelings for Yen and all his memories of her return. How could he not want to go back with her?

I think she was already in love with him which is why she takes advantage of his amnesia and the belief Yen is gone to try and make her dreams a reality. An understandably human reaction imo if certainly not saintly. Geralt regains his memories but he's also got a whole set of new memories & possible love established free of Yen which can conflict with the memories he has of their relationship & help him see it in a new light. So i view it as being very much a new ball game and not set in stone that he should want to waltz back into Yen's arms.

 

[luc0s]

I think she was already in love with him which is why she takes advantage of his amnesia and the belief Yen is gone to try and make her dreams a reality. An understandably human reaction imo if certainly not saintly. Geralt regains his memories but he's also got a whole set of new memories & possible love established free of Yen which can conflict with the memories he has of their relationship & help him see it in a new light. So i view it as being very much a new ball game and not set in stone that he should want to waltz back into Yen's arms.

Already in love with him? You mean completely obsessed with him! Triss has always been obsessed with Geralt. Since the books.

But being obsessed =/= being in love. Obsession and love are two different things. If Triss truly loved Geralt she would have been honest with him. Instead she tricked and manipulated him in the hope he would fall in love with her and forget about Yennefer. If I was Geralt and I found out about this I would have been pissed. It's weird that Geralt never confronted Triss about this. even if we would assume Geralt started to love Triss during the Witcher game trilogy, I still think he should have confronted her, I know I would.

---------- Updated at 12:25 AM ----------

@luc0s

Yeah that scene on the wreck was just awesome.

Hm... if you play the game with open eyes you clearly see the flaws of both ladys.
Recognized how Triss shows of her "dark side" at a certain point during her quests?

You even can choose to comment it then, as Geralt

The point is... when Yen x Geralt get so much romance plot and attention ppl who decide to got
with Triss x Geralt should get the same amount if romacne plot and attention.

Otherwise its just uneven and doesn' t feel right (for me) since TW3 is the story conclusion for
Geralt you know ...

Well... i still hope this will get "fixed" and balanced ... mabye with even more Yen / Triss joke around?
This would be so awesome just getting along a bit ... fooling around with Yen / Triss and get a good
smirk on the comments they give each other

PS:

Give us a "slap ayss" timed decision RED' s ^^ i missed that option for Tomira
HEHEHEHHEHE every time i enter her house in the prolouge i miss that decision dialog

I don't get all this complaining about Yen having more exposition in TW3 than Triss. Triss has been there since the start and you've got 3 games full with Triss exposition and romance stuff. Yen is only in one game. So what that Yen gets a little more attention than Triss in TW3? It's to be expected, since she's a new character in the games and she is one of the main character in the books (more so than Triss who's really more of a side character in the books).

I hate to break it to you, but Yen is just more important to the plot of TW3 than Triss. Triss had her moment of glory in TW1 and TW2. Now it's time for Yen to get her moment of glory.

 

[devinireland]

Already in love with him? You mean completely obsessed with him! Triss has always been obsessed with Geralt. Since the books.

But being obsessed =/= being in love. Obsession and love are two different things. If Triss truly loved Geralt she would have been honest with him. Instead she tricked and manipulated him in the hope he would fall in love with her and forget about Yennefer. If I was Geralt and I found out about this I would have been pissed. It's weird that Geralt never confronted Triss about this. even if we would assume Geralt started to love Triss during the Witcher game trilogy, I still think he should have confronted her, I know I would.

But her obsession is so cute (in the games.)

 

[GHOSTMD]

@luc0s

My complaining is caused, by the promise of @theta77 (for example) and the REDs that we ll have
a difficult decision to make. Go with Yen or Triss... waving Yen in front of us (it is not bad i love her)
is just imbalanced. Players they didn t played the previous games have definatly difficulties to understand
all the fuss / or even to hook up with Triss a bit... there is just to little romantic "content", nearby no flirt mode
and so on. The player doesn' t feel any of the sexual tension ... the affection of both torwards each other.
Sure .... you have references ... but FUCK i was together with Triss the last 2 games ... which is a time span
and nearby nothing of that is felt in TW3.

On the other hand, you imidiatly (can) hook up with Yennefer from the start, in that tutorial dream.
Which is good since RED had to "build" a plot where you definatly care for her. Since she is
(as you said) very important to the story.

Its kinda the same situation with the shani dumb down... weaker ... but you definatly can
see that Triss got a huge cut back, compared to raw romance plot / interaction.

So ... where is the difficult, demanding decision i have to make? Didn t find this one ...
And Yen is more important to the plot yes... but after TW1 and TW2 Triss should be equally
important ... THATS the reason for all that fuss. And you didn t break anything for me

As i said i love Yen, but i miss out complete the difficulties for the final decision with whom
i settle down for a while (yes a while ... pff as if Geralt would stay at 1 place with Yen / Triss forever)

See.... i just wan' t to struggle with myself when i have to decide which one i go for...
at this time (second playthrough) i want to go with Triss, but the only difficulties i have
/ will have... is saying NO to Yen on the other hand.... no hard feelings when saying NO
to Triss... after all we went through with her? Really?....

But ok... its all up to the player and how he interprets the actions of Triss x Geralt, right?
I think after TW1 and TW2 Triss x Geralt is part of the canon to, equally to Yen x Geralt.
It should be treated like that.... damned CDPR give us some real struggle here!!!

 

[Harthwain]

It's also refreshing how, when they meet, Yennifer's pragmatic about Geralt's relationship with Triss. She's like "You don't need to tell me 'this time apart made me love you more' or any other bullshit. I know you had amnesia, so there's no need for excuses."

Are you certain of this?

Spoiler

- One thing before we go... Why didn't you contact me? Didn't need me, didn't even want to see me?
- I didn't want to spoil things. I'd heard you and Triss made a great couple.
- Yen... I'd lost my memory.
- Really - that's your excuse? Let's drop it, all right? "It's not what you think" or "it helped me to understand how much I love you" - I don't wish to hear it, any of it.

Seriously? After hearing something like that - and after what happened in W2 - at that point I couldn't really care for her anymore. I don't care if Geralt loved her in the books. I don't care if she is important for the plot. The way Yennefer is being presented to me in W3 makes me simply not care. At least with Triss I had my own personal history. Can't say that about Yennefer, so I doubt this will even be "the choice" for me in W3 when I'll have to decide betweem my own pick from W2 and someone else's pick based on "just because".

 

[devinireland]

Are you certain of this?



Seriously? After hearing something like that - and after what happened in W2 - at that point I couldn't really care for her anymore. I don't care if Geralt loved her in the books. I don't care if she is important for the plot. The way Yennefer is being presented to me in W3 makes me simply not care. At least with Triss I had my own personal history. Can't say that about Yennefer, so I doubt this will even be "the choice" for me in W3 when I'll have to decide betweem my own pick from W2 and someone else's pick based on "just because".

Oh ya, she's a bitch there. I remembered that scene differently for some reason.

 

[luc0s]

Are you certain of this?


Seriously? After hearing something like that - and after what happened in W2 - at that point I couldn't really care for her anymore. I don't care if Geralt loved her in the books. I don't care if she is important for the plot. The way Yennefer is being presented to me in W3 makes me simply not care. At least with Triss I had my own personal history. Can't say that about Yennefer, so I doubt this will even be "the choice" for me in W3 when I'll have to decide betweem my own pick from W2 and someone else's pick based on "just because".

I don't think Yen meant it the way you interpreted it. The way I took Yen's comment to Geralt is basically her saying "don't bother trying to justify your choices, I understand, let's just drop it, it's water under the bridge as far as I'm concerned".

I don't think Yen is a bitch. She's just a very strong and pragmatic woman who who is straight to the point and says what she wants/thinks. She doesn't lead Geralt on or make him jump through hoops unlike Triss. That's what I like about Yennefer.

Picking Yen most certainly isn't "just because". She is a very important character in the books and she means a lot to Geralt. I understand that you haven't read the books so you don't know much about Yen. Still, I think the TW3 does a good job at showing how important Yennefer was to Geralt and what kind of relationship they used to have.

 

[Tangsta]

Yen doesn't make Geralt jump through hoops?! Lol, are we talking about the same Yennefer here? In the game, that's exactly what she does, just very cleverly. She very much is a bitch, just one Geralt happens to be madly in love with, and no one knows why but him.

It's not just Geralt either, she manipulates and orders everyone around. She doesn't have that many friends and for good reason. From what I hear, in the books Geralt himself admits that his relationship with her is poisonous. Triss and Ciri are miles better in terms of personality and likeableness, Yennefer really only has her looks, which we all know is fake and created using magic.

 

[devinireland]

I don't think Yen meant it the way you interpreted it. The way I took Yen's comment to Geralt is basically her saying "don't bother trying to justify your choices, I understand, let's just drop it, it's water under the bridge as far as I'm concerned".

Yes and no. She moves past his tryst with Triss, but she knew about Geralt's amnesia and didn't even check up on him for the first two games. She implies that Geralt should be sorry for his amnesia - he obviously shouldn't - then magnanimously forgives him... That's a fool's bargain.

---------- Updated at 12:09 PM ----------

Yen doesn't make Geralt jump through hoops?! Lol, are we talking about the same Yennefer here? In the game, that's exactly what she does, just very cleverly. She very much is a bitch, just one Geralt happens to be madly in love with, and no one knows why but him.

Don't call my Yennifer a bitch!

---------- Updated at 12:14 PM ----------

It's not just Geralt either, she manipulates and orders everyone around. She doesn't have that many friends and for good reason. From what I hear, in the books Geralt himself admits that his relationship with her is poisonous. Triss and Ciri are miles better in terms of personality and likeableness, Yennefer really only has her looks, which we all know is fake and created using magic.

I think it's the narrator, maybe Dandelion, that describes their relationship as poisonous in "The Last Wish". Also, all sorceresses start as mediocre or ugly women. The hot ones marry rich lords and play politics or retire (that's considered the "classier" option.) The hard studying is for the unattractive upper-class women, then they make themselves hot once they can use magic.

 

[Harthwain]

I don't think Yen meant it the way you interpreted it

There is little room left for doubt when you listen to what she says. I played it again, just to be sure. She does not answer Geralt why she didn't call him, or at least why she didn't contact him. Instead she brings out Triss. Meaning she has a problem with Geralt having strong relationship with Triss. As for the memory loss she directly calls it an "excuse" and says she doesn't want to hear it. There is nothing pragmatic in it. At least not from where I am standing.

Picking Yen most certainly isn't "just because". She is a very important character in the books and she means a lot to Geralt.

Exactly why I said it's based mostly "just because". Just because she's in the books and books said she meant a lot to Geralt. The problem is: players played W1 and W2 and they are bound to have stronger relationship with Triss, because they went through both games (or at least one). It's a personal experience. And personal experience beats the books.

 

[devinireland]

There is little room left for doubt when you listen to what she says. I played it again, just to be sure. She does not answer Geralt why she didn't call him, or at least why she didn't contact him. Instead she brings out Triss. Meaning she has a problem with Geralt having strong relationship with Triss. As for the memory loss she directly calls it an "excuse" and says she doesn't want to hear it. There is nothing pragmatic in it. At least not from where I am standing.

She deflects his question by blaming him for his amnesia, then claims the moral advantage by forgiving him. Deflection and reframing... The vaginal mind-tricks are strong with this one. Just look at dat ass.

 

[luc0s]

There is little room left for doubt when you listen to what she says. I played it again, just to be sure. She does not answer Geralt why she didn't call him, or at least why she didn't contact him. Instead she brings out Triss. Meaning she has a problem with Geralt having strong relationship with Triss. As for the memory loss she directly calls it an "excuse" and says she doesn't want to hear it. There is nothing pragmatic in it. At least not from where I am standing.

Again that's just your interpretation. I did not interpret it that way at all. If anything, Yen probably didn't want to disrupt Geralt and let him figure things out himself. She cares deeply about Geralt and she really wants him to make his own decisions. I mean what else could she have done? Suddenly show up and say "hey Geralt, you might have forgotten about me due to your amnesia, but I'm actually your eternal lover, so better dump that Triss and go with me"? That's not her style and it would be incredibly dumb.

Instead she let Geralt figure things out himself. When she brings up his relationship with Triss I do sense a bit of jealousy in her tone, but in no way does she blame Geralt for having amnesia and being with Triss. She's disappointed maybe, jealous even, but not spiteful or angry. I don't even get how you could interpret it that way because it would be incredibly dumb of Yen to hold his amnesia against Geralt and Yen isn't dumb.

Exactly why I said it's based mostly "just because". Just because she's in the books and books said she meant a lot to Geralt. The problem is: players played W1 and W2 and they are bound to have stronger relationship with Triss, because they went through both games (or at least one). It's a personal experience. And personal experience beats the books.

I could use the same arguments for Triss. Just because she's in TW1 and TW2 and the games force a relationship between them down our throats (even if you don't romance Triss in TW1 she still ends up being his lover at the start of TW2) doesn't mean I as the player should care about her.

And how are games more of a personal experience than the books? Triss and Geralt being together most certainly wasn't my personal experience. It was an experience forced on me by the devs. The devs decided that Geralt had a relationship with Triss, not me.

If anything, I'd say the books beat the games in terms of emotional experience and having a connection with the characters. Books are a way better medium for fleshing out characters and telling an emotional and deeply personal story. Because the books are written from a first-person perspective you gain a much better understanding of the characters, what they go through and how they feel and because of that I get a stronger connection with those characters. A game can't create that same kind of experience.

Because I read the books I care much more about Yennefer and her relationship with Geralt than I ever cared about Triss, despite Triss being in all 3 games and Yen only being in the 3rd game.

 

[devinireland]

Instead she let Geralt figure things out himself. When she brings up his relationship with Triss I do sense a bit of jealousy in her tone, but in no way does she blame Geralt for having amnesia and being with Triss. She's disappointed maybe, jealous even, but not spiteful or angry. I don't even get how you could interpret it that way because it would be incredibly dumb of Yen to hold his amnesia against Geralt and Yen isn't dumb.

But don't you think she should've made contact and helped him once he turned up? He traded himself to the Hunt for her, and she doesn't even call when she learns he's escaped. I like Yen, but that's rude! Also, you didn't answer my question yesterday... Are succubi rapists for using magical seduction?

 

[Tangsta]

Lucos, have you finished Witcher 3 yet? If not, then I think you may need to before judging. The ordeal with Triss + Geralt as a couple is nothing, Yennefer does far worse things in this game. Her only redeeming feature seems to be her strong maternal feelings for Ciri. Everyone else is nothing but a means to an end for her.

Her romance with Geralt also feels a bit disingenuous, and I can't help but feel he's nothing but a f*@# buddy and errand boy to her.

 

[luc0s]

But don't you think she should've made contact and helped him once he turned up? He traded himself to the Hunt for her, and she doesn't even call when she learns he's escaped. I like Yen, but that's rude! Also, you didn't answer my question yesterday... Are succubi rapists for using magical seduction?

Why would she? Geralt's is not a baby. He can take care of himself. He already had the other witchers at Kaer Morhen, Triss, Dandelion, Zoltan and Shani to help him get back on his feet and figure things out. Not to mention that Triss IMMEDIATELY jumps on the opportunity to start a romantic relationship with Geralt as soon as he returned.

Not to mention that Yen always realized that her relationship with Geralt can sometimes be quite toxic and she always felt Geralt might be better off without her. In the books she often tries to leave Geralt but Geralt doesn't let her. He wants to be with her despite what other people think and despite the fact their relationship isn't exactly healthy. Yen might have figured that it would probably be better for Geralt if she would stay out of his life, at least for the time being until he recovered his memories. If I'm not mistaken Yen tells this to Geralt if you romance her in TW3.

---------- Updated at 02:12 PM ----------

Lucos, have you finished Witcher 3 yet? If not, then I think you may need to before judging. The ordeal with Triss + Geralt as a couple is nothing, Yennefer does far worse things in this game. Her only redeeming feature seems to be her strong maternal feelings for Ciri. Everyone else is nothing but a means to an end for her.

Her romance with Geralt also feels a bit disingenuous, and I can't help but feel he's nothing but a f*@# buddy and errand boy to her.

No I haven't finished TW3 yet. But have you read the books? If not then you may need to before judging. Because your view on Yennefer is completely inaccurate.

The downside of videogames is that you can't get into the mind of other characters. You solely have to rely on what they tell you and what they do to form an opinion. The strong point about the books is that we get a better insight on Yennefer. If you read the books you know she cares deeply for Geralt. She loves him, a lot.

If you actually romance Yennefer in TW3 instead of Triss you can clearly see this in TW3 as well. Geralt and Ciri are the two people she cares most about in the entire world and I think TW3 did a good job at showing this fact. So I really don't get how you came to the conclusion that Geralt is just a fuck buddy and errand boy to her. You probably romanced Triss and never even bothered to look at Yen's romance arc in TW3 but still, your view on Yen and what is actually presented in the game doesn't add up.

 

[Harthwain]

Again that's just your interpretation. I did not interpret it that way at all. If anything, Yen probably didn't want to disrupt Geralt and let him figure things out himself.

She sent a letter to him when she needed something from him. Not a moment before. Either the CDPR couldn't think of good reasons to justify Yennefer's silence (and that's why she stabs Geralt with Triss, instead of explaining herself - make no mistake, that's an actual deflection) or they failed to present that properly. In any case I call that a failure on their part, because it doesn't help bound player with Yennefer.

I don't even get how you could interpret it that way because it would be incredibly dumb of Yen to hold his amnesia against Geralt and Yen isn't dumb.

I am not the one who made the cutscene and put dialogues and voices in such a fashion. The way her sentences are shaped, the way her voice is toned, everything points to why I came up with the interpretation I gave you.

I could use the same arguments for Triss. Just because she's in TW1 and TW2 and the games force a relationship between them down our throats (even if you don't romance Triss in TW1 she still ends up being his lover at the start of TW2) doesn't mean I as the player should care about her.

And how are games more of a personal experience than the books? Triss and Geralt being together most certainly wasn't my personal experience. It was an experience forced on me by the devs. The devs decided that Geralt had a relationship with Triss, not me.

I didn't say you should care about her. I said you're more likely to do so. It's a choice - you could enter a relationship with Triss or not. Games are more of a personal experience than the books precisely because it's up to players to decide that, while books follow a script.

If anything, I'd say the books beat the games in terms of emotional experience and having a connection with the characters. Books are a way better medium for fleshing out characters and telling an emotional and deeply personal story. Because the books are written from a first-person perspective you gain a much better understanding of the characters, what they go through and how they feel and because of that I get a stronger connection with those characters. A game can't create that same kind of experience.

I would agree, but the books weren't written from first-person perspective. It was always he, him, etc. This creates a divide between the character and readers.