Imlerith: Sabbath

[Thunderscape]

Funny what the devs consider an instant update. They won't change cards that have been complained about like sabbath but instantly change oligerg (sorry about spelling) since people complained about him returnung to the same row. Both him and sabbath can get it off control but are counterable.

Then people will complain about GS, or consume or reveal or something that beat their decks.
Cards need to be balanced for high elo. If a deck has a high winrate in high elo sure. Let the devs balance the game.

Stuff like this is pitifull:


"Oh no, i had 2 23 power units and a scorched burned them! A silver took 46 points its so broken, and then they use scorched again! It negated my win condition!"

"Oh no, my perfectly aligned token deck got obliterated by a bronze card "epidemic" my feelings are hurt! A bronze card!"

"Oh no, my point vomit Monster deck, couldnt beat another point vomit NG deck, and i dont want to run tech against that! Its broken!"

"Oh no, my deck with no removal but a mandrake got obliterated by a sabbath card oh noes! I dindt draw the card, so i lost, see its binary."

"On no, my specific deck X cant beat Y, the horror! Pro players can only circumvent this because they have superpowers, its not MY fault!"




tl:dr; -> Try that op card or deck, and you will see that something will beat you. Or that you really cant play that deck because its not has easy as you think it is.

"Git Gud" (I dont really like the expression, but it does have a point, with effort and training you will get better. )

 

[bojerbela]

Then people will complain about GS, or consume or reveal or something that beat their decks.
Cards need to be balanced for high elo. If a deck has a high winrate in high elo sure. Let the devs balance the game.

Stuff like this is pitifull:


"Oh no, i had 2 23 power units and a scorched burned them! A silver took 46 points its so broken, and then they use scorched again! It negated my win condition!"

"Oh no, my perfectly aligned token deck got obliterated by a bronze card "epidemic" my feelings are hurt! A bronze card!"

"Oh no, my point vomit Monster deck, couldnt beat another point vomit NG deck, and i dont want to run tech against that! Its broken!"

"Oh no, my deck with no removal but a mandrake got obliterated by a sabbath card oh noes! I dindt draw the card, so i lost, see its binary."

"On no, my specific deck X cant beat Y, the horror! Pro players can only circumvent this because they have superpowers, its not MY fault!"




tl:dr; -> Try that op card or deck, and you will see that something will beat you. Or that you really cant play that deck because its not has easy as you think it is.

"Git Gud" (I dont really like the expression, but it does have a point, with effort and training you will get better. )

Great! :cheers:

 

[Mancoon1980]

I'm against the changes. I was sayings it's easily counterable. Why change it at this point in the game when more broken cards like war dancer took months to change?

 

[Communist33]

The card doesn't fit in a deck, so we make the deck fit the card. That's when you know it's OP.

 

[partci]

Is everyone playing Sabbath in Casual? I played some last night and now this morning and out of around 10 games, at least 6 were against Sabbath decks.

This is STUPID.

No GG was given once.

 

[devivre]

Is everyone playing Sabbath in Casual? I played some last night and now this morning and out of around 10 games, at least 6 were against Sabbath decks.

This is STUPID.

No GG was given once.

Most monster decks are and it can happen that you run into the same faction way more often than usual in casual (two days ago I almost exclusively saw dwarf decks - but I doubt that's what everyone was playing)

 

[flyhy]

I usually don't agree with changing cards just because someone doesn't like it or it counters his/her favorite deck, but this can't agree more. CDPR should never make a card that annihilates half or even an entire deck if this one specific card isn't drawn to neutralize it once and for all.

Some people have suggested about locks, but locks can be countered by playing a lock to unlock.
Some people have commented that with Loyal Decree, Sabbath is only 9 with armor that can be killed by a thunder, but the armor grows. If the highest unit on your side of the board is 8 or below then Sabbath will be 10 or 11 with armor and safe from a thunder.
Some people have suggested Witcher Vipers .... but if everyone plays Witcher Vipers, how fun will be Gwent?
Some people just randomly posted a list of removal cards that supposedly "kill" Sabbath ... that's just simply idiotic since when Gwent is a game of incoherence and a subject to a random deck construction.

Once Sabbath is not removed by one shot, then there comes Mandrake and Resilience. If you don't have two Nova or two Scorch or two locks, it's game over for you. There is a way to work around Scorch. And there is a way to work around Nova, but MANDRAKE is the only card that works against Sabbath. All these people who suggested removals doing the job, obviously never had to deal with Sabbath or they are the Sabbath abusers who exploit this broken part of the game.

Removal used to be the identity of ST and still is with the exception of Alchemy. SK, MO, and NR are factions that either gain points over time or remove points over time. Sabbath is great against the later which is more than half of the existing archetypes. I remember the community once cried about faction identities but with Sabbath, it is the player's fault not to tech with an ample amount of removals ... I am baffled.

 

[Iuliandrei]

It will probably be redesigned in homecoming, though this isn't a new problem tbh. I think CDPR should learn from these type of cards, we had this situation before with the likes of Villentretenmerth or Letho, cards that turn the game into a coinflip, if you draw your counter you win, else you lose.

Sure the card looks interesting, one of the first decks i made after Midwinder was a Sabbath deck, it was fun to see opponents resign at turn 3 however the novelty wore off pretty fast and made me realize this isn't a healthy card for the game.

 

[goofything]

Every time I run into Sabbath, it makes me want to quit the game, whether I win or lose. I think it's the worst card in the game. It's such a binary card. If I kill it, the player forfeits. If I don't, I lose. The concept is so contrary to a game that is supposed to have a strong strategic element. It has the ability to win a match on it's own even in rounds 1 or 2. Half the time, you can play Sabbath and literally throw the rest of your cards away and still win the game.

That's how I feel, what do you think?

 

[jgolden234]

Whenever I see the card I get seriously triggered. Doesn't matter if I win or lose, I am just not enjoying the game when it is there.

 

[flyhy]

Although I voted "yes," I think the card is interesting and should be restricted to Arena. I also want to add those Sabbath players RARELY, if not NEVER, gg. Just goes to show what type of people enjoy exploiting this broken part of the game.

 

[Draconifors]

@goofything Thread merged.

(And sorry for the pointless ping to the person who got it.)

 

[el_Bosco]

I also want to add those Sabbath players RARELY, if not NEVER, gg.

Well... i never GG shupe or sabbath decks so its payback b€&$#!s.

 

[qbim]

GO TEAM SABBATH, SABBATH - WOOOHOOO

IN SABBATH WE TRUST

(Please play this card so I could score easy wins in ranked)

 

[Soltblod]

I really don't think this situation should be left to fester until Homecoming.
Everything has been said, and I could only repeat it.
That everthing has been said makes it more shameful, that this card is still up.
This card kills half of the options of the game because if you don't adapt your deck specifically to be able to counter this single card, you lose.
If your deck is adapted but you've bad luck of the draw, you lose.
If your deck is adapted and you draw everything you need but you have to keep back a ton of useful cards just for the chance of encountering a single card....I don't know if you'll lose, but I'm sure as hell that's not a fun way to play the game.

Fun is the point of the game, this card turns stacking your deck against it into a chore, which is the opposite of fun, or makes losing regularly a given, which is not fun, and thus breaks the game.

A card being counterable doesn't mean it's not overpowered, it just means there's some counter.

Gwint has 875 cards and only one of them can decide a game on its own. Obviously that means this one card is disproportionately more powerful than the others. Obviously that reduces the value of the other cards. Obviously one card devaluing all other 874 cards on its own is bad balancing and needs to be fixed - by complete removal in my opinion.

And just for the sake of the argument: A card not being OP doesn't mean it's a card that should stay in the game.
Anything which consistently can remove the fun from the game must go.

 

[jgolden234]

I really don't think this situation should be left to fester until Homecoming.
Everything has been said, and I could only repeat it.
That everthing has been said makes it more shameful, that this card is still up.
This card kills half of the options of the game because if you don't adapt your deck specifically to be able to counter this single card, you lose.
If your deck is adapted but you've bad luck of the draw, you lose.
If your deck is adapted and you draw everything you need but you have to keep back a ton of useful cards just for the chance of encountering a single card....I don't know if you'll lose, but I'm sure as hell that's not a fun way to play the game.

Fun is the point of the game, this card turns stacking your deck against it into a chore, which is the opposite of fun, or makes losing regularly a given, which is not fun, and thus breaks the game.

A card being counterable doesn't mean it's not overpowered, it just means there's some counter.

Gwint has 875 cards and only one of them can decide a game on its own. Obviously that means this one card is disproportionately more powerful than the others. Obviously that reduces the value of the other cards. Obviously one card devaluing all other 874 cards on its own is bad balancing and needs to be fixed - by complete removal in my opinion.

And just for the sake of the argument: A card not being OP doesn't mean it's a card that should stay in the game.
Anything which consistently can remove the fun from the game must go.

Yes yes and yes. Great point about only 1 out of 874 cards can win the game by itself. None of the other aggravating cards or archetypes can do that, they require combos and proper deck building. Sabbath just requires slapping the card down.

And yes, an all in Sabbath deck can lose, but the fun was leeched from the match regardless of the outcome.

 

[Khreygond]

In fact you'll notice by now that most people play Swim's variant of Sabbath decks which prays on baiting your Mandrake out in order to then win via large Ghouls that eat Cyclopes and Fiends from the graveyard. It basically sends out Sabbath early in order for you to use your Mandrake, and then they just spam STR 11 and STR 15 - 16 units, with Cyclops for added removal.

This would not be a problem if there was anything as reliable as Mandrake in killing a boosted Str 7 3 - 4 armor card that can be Renewed. Opponents can also force you to keep your mandrake on the mere suspicion that they run Sabbath despite playing STR 15 Ghouls the entire game.

And as said before, the problem is not that the card is OP in my opinion, just that it is the opposite of fun. I never GG Sabbath decks at all. And I win against it about 80% of the time.

 

[flyhy]

I really don't think this situation should be left to fester until Homecoming.

You are right. Lately I've been seeing Sabbath on the ladder more than ever. It's just stupid. Regardless of winning or losing, I feel stupid whenever my opponent flops Sabbath on the board and disregards all of his other cards. There's nothing more once Sabbath sticks. I've decided to take a break until Sabbath is removed or resolved. There is no reason for me to play a game that makes me feel stupid half of the time.

I just saw a match on Gwent open moments ago. The guy played Sabbath and the game abruptly ended half way. LOL, Good show, CDPR. Good show.

 

[jgolden234]

You are right. Lately I've been seeing Sabbath on the ladder more than ever. It's just stupid. Regardless of winning or losing, I feel stupid whenever my opponent flops Sabbath on the board and disregards all of his other cards. There's nothing more once Sabbath sticks. I've decided to take a break until Sabbath is removed or resolved. There is no reason for me to play a game that makes me feel stupid half of the time.

I just saw a match on Gwent open moments ago. The guy played Sabbath and the game abruptly ended half way. LOL, Good show, CDPR. Good show.

I couldn't believe it was seeing Sabbath in open. That alone is a reason not to watch for me.

 

[Khreygond]

It's even funnier that Molegion said he doesn't like Sabbath, turned to the camera, said "Don't play Sabbath kids" and then showed up in the Gwent Open using it

As for Damorquis, it almost feels like he resorted to Sabbath after committing major mistakes in every other tournament appearance he's made to date. Kinda cheap, isn't it?