The Bittersweet Ending is actually a Bad Ending ... and it's All Geralt's Fault. [SPOILERS]

[Avaricious]

To me the Witcheress ending makes no sense because how the hell would no one realize that she is actually alive? Nilfgaard located her after she arrived back on the continent from another world. So faking her death and then just continuing to roam the lands without ever being recognized is very unrealistic - plus Geralt would be a wanted man for betraying the emperor and they would try to take Ciri by force. Not to mention she can only become a Witcher if you don't take her to the emperor. If you try to avoid the fact she's an incredible person and selfishly shield her from influences YOU don't like.

Whatever the reasons for he choice, maybe she was manipulated nefariously we'll never know, the fact is she decides to become empress and you have to respect her choice as an adult and let her fly the nest. Perhaps she'd fail in her attempts to reform the empire, but isn't that a better fate than having your head torn off by some monster in a swampy village that no one will remember? Ciri had a gift, and she chose not to run away from it but instead tried it make the world a better place. Avoiding problems never works. She might have enjoyed being a witcher more but that doesn't mean her elder blood suddenly vanish and no one will ever try to exploit her again. Just like me playing Witcher 3 didn't change the fact it was bloody exam week!

Of course they'd realise she's alive, Emhyr comes to terms with her decision to become a Witcher and lets her go.

Ciri: "Did he believe you?"
Geralt: "I have no idea."

The fact that the ending slide says she goes on to become a famous witcheress is testament to the fact that Emhyr let her go. It's possible that he contacted her in the future and she declined him.

Ciri said she's sick of people planning and plotting behind her back, and when the decision to visit Emhyr came up, she said her opinion is Geralt's opinion, if Geralt says visiting Emhyr is a bad idea then Ciri's decision to disregard Emhyr makes sense. After all, Emhyr can't force someone who can jump worlds to do what he wants.

 

[ZoltansBeard]

Of course they'd realise she's alive, Emhyr comes to terms with her decision to become a Witcher and lets her go.

Ciri: "Did he believe you?"
Geralt: "I have no idea."

The fact that the ending slide says she goes on to become a famous witcheress is testament to the fact that Emhyr let her go. It's possible that he contacted her in the future and she declined him.

Ciri said she's sick of people planning and plotting behind her back, and when the decision to visit Emhyr came up, she said her opinion is Geralt's opinion, if Geralt says visiting Emhyr is a bad idea then Ciri's decision to disregard Emhyr makes sense. After all, Emhyr can't force someone who can jump worlds to do what he wants.

Ah, I forgot about that line because I got that ending in my first playthrough which was a while ago now. Completely disregard that point I made then...

It does make sense but it's Geralt deciding for her in that case. And while she may have wanted him to decide, that doesn't necessarily make it a good thing. After all, she pleads with you to attend the meeting with the Lodge and rejecting her turns out to be a positive choice. I think that even though Geralt thinks it's a bad idea, he has to let her meet her father because only then will she have a CHOICE regarding her destiny. The other option is to shield her from her father so that she can't make her own decision - and Geralt's not a manipulator.

Although I should say, I don't think there really is a 'true' ending. Just find it interesting to discuss which one I think is the most fitting conclusion.

 

[Avaricious]

Ah, I forgot about that line because I got that ending in my first playthrough which was a while ago now. Completely disregard that point I made then...

It does make sense but it's Geralt deciding for her in that case. And while she may have wanted him to decide, that doesn't necessarily make it a good thing. After all, she pleads with you to attend the meeting with the Lodge and rejecting her turns out to be a positive choice. I think that even though Geralt thinks it's a bad idea, he has to let her meet her father because only then will she have a CHOICE regarding her destiny. The other option is to shield her from her father so that she can't make her own decision - and Geralt's not a manipulator.

Although I should say, I don't think there really is a 'true' ending. Just find it interesting to discuss which one I think is the most fitting conclusion.

I agree about discussing to find out which is the most fitting conclusion, I'll explain my reasoning below:

When you talk to Ciri at Valdo's (the place where you steal horses) she tells you about how a whole bunch of people have plans for adding "Even Yennefer" to that.

This connects to when you bring up visiting Emhyr during the Bald Mountain quest, Ciri replies "Yennefer mentioned something".

What I think is that Yennefer wanted Ciri to go hear out Emhyr

Ciri however, disagreed indirectly by not bringing up visiting Emhyr (Geralt has to or you miss the chance).

If Geralt supports visiting Emhyr than Ciri is "outvoted" 2-1 and decides that Emhyr can be trusted and is worth visiting, but if Geralt decides against then Yen is "outvoted" and Ciri will instead form the opinion that Emhyr cannot be trusted and she does not visit him.

For me personally, I base Geralt's choices on what I think Geralt from the books would do (I roleplay as book Geralt rather than self-inserting). Emhyr's past actions were despicable (and he hasn't done much to help himself in that case), and as a result I didn't think he was worth visiting or trusting.

That's my explanation to why I think the Witcher ending works best.

 

[Dracolich55]

I don't understand why people seem to think the only way Ciri can help people is by being Empress. Monsters are not going to all go extinct overnight, and even killing monsters around "forgotten villages" is doing some good, besides I think Ciri would would put the needs of the common people/peasants above the needs of the snot-nosed nobles she would be helping as Empress.

Besides, I think Emhyr will be a fine ruler for the continent (as I sided with Roche in my game). People have to keep in mind book and game Emhyr are completely different people. Book Emhyr is horrible I agree, but the Emperor as we see him in game is basically Tywin Lannister, who despite his horrible actions is quite a competent leader.

 

[iNeSiNhA]

The whole point is what Ciri wants. And to me is very clear that she doesn't want to visit Emhyr. despite Yen and Geralt toughts (it seems to me that Geralt would choose to visit him first).

 

[RepHope]

The whole point is what Ciri wants. And to me is very clear that she doesn't want to visit Emhyr. despite Yen and Geralt toughts (it seems to me that Geralt would choose to visit him first).

Nah, Emhyr is politics and Geralt hates politics. Plus he's got personal reasons to hate Emhyr based on the books. He wouldn't go see him at all if he had a choice, that is Book Geralt wouldn't.

 

[Antiks07]

Ehh the whole last part of this game felt botched. Ciri really didn't want to become the empress. But does to make the player feel sad. They do this by trying to have you figure she's just a normal girl. But she isn't. She can teleport and do all kinds of crazy stuff. Then all of a sudden she loses her edge, almost gets killed by that Griffin and stuff. I don't get it.

And what the hell is the white frost?? She walks into a snowstorm and depending on her memories she lives or dies?? What they couldn't think of any way to portray what happens in the portal? It's what turns out to be the whole GOAL OF THE GAME! what happened to avallac?

I got the empress ending and watched the others on YouTube. I barely had enough time for even one playthrough of this game so I looked at a guide from time to time to make sure u didn't get a shit ending for my 100+ hours of playing. The empress ending is considered the best in this guide. But I knew things were messed up when letting ciri talk to the lodge by herself was a "good" choice. She came to you asking for help with obvious concern on her face and in her voice and you basically have to tell her eh can't be bothered.

You are expected to act a certain way towards her that isn't always consistent and then this empress ending turns out to be wildly inconsistent with what happened.

She can warp to other worlds but all of a sudden it's wahhh I have to leave geralt I'll never see you again. As if she is destined to become the miserable little girl in that painting again.

I'm done for now. I'm not even gonna get started on the whole Yennefer working for nilfgaard angle not being addressed in this ending.

Game was ambitious and def probably ruined many future games I'll play cuz this one really raised the bar. But jeez the last third of the main game felt rushed or lazy. It makes you wonder if the guys who make the game were all sitting back thinking "we nailed it guys" when playing the final story out.

To me the " coolest" ending is geralt going after the last crone.

 

[shnabeltasse]

I think you were supposed to get the point from where you support Ciri to make her own decisions, but at least I did not get that. You only had the options on being overly suspicious to what was happening with Avallac'h and the lodge or you were too naive.

More than once you are put into the silly-corner, because you were NOT educated (meeting of Yen, you and that bloody elven sorceress by a megascope), not understanding that plotting and scheming and manipulating was a true sorceresses' nature but suddenly you are supposed to trust those, who speak down on you, padding your head most of the time like adults do with kids, who try to grasp some things with their own, naive minds....

This is an actual insult to a player's intelligence. On the other hand you are forced into the role of an asshole and end up alone just because you did not adhere and utterly surrender to the power-of-boner...

One example:
The Last Wish quest, you ask Yen more than once, what she is up to and at one point on the teleported ship you have the option: ''Tell me or I leave at once...'' What? The context of this dialogue does not warrant that rude behavior in this particular situation but instead you should have had this dialogue option on many occasions before to show that you may be sick of being just someone for doing the dirty jobs.

The last act rewards good or reasonable dialogue options as reactions of Geralt's treatment into punishments (best example of having the choice to visit Ciri's father, but if you do, you will make her empress, if not, you will have her becoming a witch/-er).

You may choose it for the good of the world and saving Ciri, just to leave her with Eilhart and her non caring, power obsessed father. Maybe even married to general Voorhis, who is oblivious to anything besides his court life. Wow.

I read many guides to achieve specific outcomes as well and surprisingly they consider empress ending as the best avilable conclusion. For why, it eludes me. Maybe because you got more screentime than on the wicther ending or ...the other one, which shall not be named...?

 

[endymionendymion]

Personally, I got the best ending (for me) with just doing what I thought was right if I was Geralt. So, I don't give a f*** what "books Geralt" would do, this is RPG, it's my character and my choices.
I didn't read all posts cause I'm lazy and I'm not sure what are spoiler rules so, i'll just put everything from now on in spoiler alert.

Spoiler

Anyway, I got witcheress ending with Ciri, Nilfgaard winning the war and Geralt moving to Kovir with Triss (even if she was a traitor in the books, i liked her in the first two games and considered that she changed and grew as a person in the games)
So, my actions were:
- played snowball fight with Ciri cause the girl needed it (only a idiot would go drinking with his/her daughter when she is feeling like that)
- didn't feel the need to take her to Emhyr cause he's an ass and I don't owe sh*t to him (but even if I did, I read that refusing payment would get you a wither ending, so CDPR did that part very good)
- went with Ciri to Lodge meeting but stayed at the side and let her make her own mind (went there as a support, at the same time letting Ciri deal with them alone - and I don't care what CDPR says, for me THAT is the good thing to do there. I am being supportive of my daughter by going in there with her, but I keep quiet, letting her know that i am confident she can handle those old hags by herself)
- broke the lab with Ciri, cause Avallac'h is also an ass and it just felt really good
-went with Ciri to visit Skjall's grave cause I wanted to spend some time with my daughter and it meant a lot to her, so it did to me too

Now, while I liked how my story ended, I, too, would like to have a more complete epilogue. My idea for perfect ending here is having to talk to Dandelion and Zoltan (in the inn, or on the road to that smith). Just a small talk, how's things, what are you planning now kind of stuff. Then picking up the sword and going to the inn, where Ciri awaits. Give her sword, everything is peachy and in that moment comes Triss (or Yen if you choose her) in the inn. Ciri smiles and tells you she will wait outside. You have a talk with Triss/Yen where you get the "see you in Kovir / that shack where you end up in with Yen" kind of talk or "let's all go together hunt some monsters for a while" option and all three ride into the sunset.
But that's just me.

 

[Antiks07]

Maybe Ciri is really just pissed with Geralt. She says what do you know about saving the world your only a witcher at the end. Then she is bitchy during the empress ending. Taking this at face value it would seem she really doesn't mean it. But at the end she reveals her she hid her true intentions to stop the white frost. So she must be a really good actor. So you are supposed to show her support cuz she needs it ...but then she reveals that she better than u anyway..so what does any of that matter. Ending really got under my skin. 3 days now I'm still mad about it lol

 

[col_caboom]

I disagree wholly with the OP's point of view and I will explain why.
First of all although the ending you chose to explain as the future may sound like a goodish, but very sad story it clashes violently with something you overlooked, which is the fact that Ciri is built as a very strong character, her, with her powers and her will being dominated by the general or her father sounds highly unlikely.
Second of all, she acts like a child, there's a whole slew of evidence for this and as most of us,hopefully, may know reaching adulthood changes a person almost completely. The way she is built I see Ciri as a very strong compassionate empress, who not only has all the possible cheatcodes to set the Nilfguardian empire straight, she also has the strength of character to do it. Last but not least she is very wise for her age, since living as a witcher and going trough what she's gone trough has matured her a lot.
Thirdly, if Geralt can in any shape resemble an father, at least an iota, better than Emhyr, she would ask her to be empress, it's a privilege in my opinion, not a curse.
Last but not least Geralt retiring is not the end of the House of the Wolf, after all there are at least 2 more older witcher(okay just one that is highly likely to stay on the path) that can take his place and train new witchers. That of course not even mentioning the strong hints that someone ending in a relationship with Yen could mean that there would be a lot of lonely days for Geralt - at least on the long run that is.

 

[Randomdrowner2015]

Ciri becoming empress is just a result of Geralt keeping his word to Emhyr and giving Ciri the information that her biological father wants to see her- as well as by being supportive giving her the strength to do what she thinks is right. It is a sacrifice for sure, but one that she is willing to make given she have the information and confidence.

 

[StormKorp]

Well I beg to differ that is in my opinion the hardest and most complete ending you can get. Ciri power and heritage is wasted as a Witcher because as Empress of Nilfgaard she can truly make the difference and have the possibility to improve the world in which they are living. Running away from your father and your responsabilities isn't a positive ending. Besides she can always count on Geralt and Yennefer helping her out should she need it. I think in this ending the world is in a much more stable situation and we have less wars overall.

 

[tonturp]

This is the best possible ending, OP clearly doesn't care about the state of the world. Ciri stops the war, massacres, everything, brings peace to north and stops white frost.

 

[Euripides66]

I agree that the empress ending is the worst, mainly because there is no reason to think that the tie of fate between Ciri and Geralt has been severed. For all the books, fate which tied Ciri and Geralt together was much more powerful than the blood she and Emhyr shared. So in my mind the empress ending is the worst, because it breaks with the continuity set down in the books. It wants us to accept at face value that Ciri is gone away from Geralt and Yennefer for Emhyr and Nilfgaard, with no explanation concerning the breaking down of the law of surprise... In terms of continuity, the witcher ending and the death ending fit the story best. Furthermore, I dislike the empress ending because it breaks from the theme of the Witcher series, that there is no 'greater good', the empress ending is practically a high fantasy ending, or a Bioware ending.

 

[Lytha]

Oooh, thanks for digging out this thread. I always felt that I was abnormal for thinking just like the OP. So, it's great to see that other people think the same about this ending.

 

[szspagna]

I totally see the appeal to Ciri as empress. It's the big picture kind of thinking, and it's true that she stands to do the most good from that position, especially for the Northern kingdoms Nilfgaard just conquered.



My problem, though, is that my Ciri prefers women. And I can't see her happy in an arranged marriage to some male noble (even though I don't consider Vegelbud all that bad, he is not a remotely good personality match for Ciri).

So, my lesbian Ciri would be deeply unhappy as she's pressured into a loveless marriage and is expected to have children with a man.


So, with that canon in mind, and that I wouldn't see happiness for Ciri in court, I chose to make her a witcher. She retains her agency since she doesn't have to worry about making decisions for the state versus her own good. She's all she has to worry about. It's a life of freedom even at the cost to the world.

And I'm a big believer in individualism so I support individuals who put their happiness over that of a collective so long as they aren't directly harming anyone.

I'm actually disappointed with this dichotomy, however, because it deprives Ciri of having a relationship and a chance to mend/bond with her father. If I keep Ciri witcher, I do the horrible act of lying to Emyr about his daughter -- his only possibility for an honest human relationship not tainted by politics -- and in the process keep Ciri estranged from her biological family.

It would have been a lot nicer to have Ciri meet with Emyr and reconcile somewhat, but still influence ultimately what she wants to do with her life. And at least Emyr would be aware that his daughter cannot be empress because she cannot produce an heir (and I doubt Nilfgaard is so progressive as to allow an empress to rule alongside another woman and adopt a ward to be an heir).

 

[Coltaine123]

First: Thanks @col_caboom for digging out this threat. I always thought that it is strange not to see a discussion of the Empress Ending in the forum. I never would have thought that the last post there would already be half a year old

In my opinion the empress ending is not the worst one. There is always the bad one where Ciri and Geralt are dead. From an emotional point of view.

But I would go with @Euripides66 that it is the worst one for the continuity of the story

From my point of view, with the knowledge from the books, Geralt would never trust Emhyr enough to bring Ciri to him. This would be completely out of character. He may have abandoned his incest-plans for her in the last moment, showing that he at least has a bit humanity left and not killed everything within himself for the reason of state, but he is responsible for the death of several persons important to Ciri and has been shown as a calculating and manipulative person.

For Ciri this choice seems also unlikely. At one point in the books, I think it was in Tower of the Swallow, she wanted to become Empress, as she heared that that a pretender is going to marry Emhyr and get all the luxus while she was sleeping in barns and living with a band of thieves. Aside from this one part of the books, in which she was a lot of time on fisstech and killed people for fun, she never showed interest in becoming a queen, marry a prince, or being someone important. She wanted to be free, she wanted to a witcher, she wanted to be with her true family, Geralt and Yennefer.
As for her relation with Emhyr, I don't think that she would give him a chance as father. I have read somewhere before that he told here that he is her father in the books when he called her daughter at the end of Lady of the Lake. I have read the german version and there it is translated with Töchterchen, which could also be a form of adress for a young girl by an older man. I'm not sure what the polish version says but by my interpretation she does not know at the end of the book that Emhyr is her father. If she would know that her reaction would be much more shocked. And once she would know the whole story about the death of Pavetta, Emhyrs plans and everything, I think she would be disgusted of him.


As the game ignores the incest-plans and fake ciri it may be better to regard it as a standalone. Without ignoring this two things, it would also be impossible to make an Empress ending at all.

"Okay, the woman you married is not Cirilla of Cintra, but this is the real one and she is your daughter. WTF??"

In the game the Empress ending is explained as Ciri embracing her heritage and accepting the responsibility. She ignores what Emhyr has done (in the journal is only stated that he was responsible for the death of some people Ciri cared for if I'm remembering right) for the greater good and becomes a great empress. So it is shown as a selfless ending.
In the witcher ending she is with Geralt for some time and afterwards hunting monsters alone. She has fun and is free to do what she want. But she only helps people through killing monsters. So it is shown as more selfish in comparison to the Empress ending.

But also in game Ciri stated several times that she wanted to be free. No longer controlled and manipulated by other peoples who have plans for her. Doing the things she want.
But if you have the Empress Ending she decides to give her newly won freedom, no white frost, the wild hunt is gone, up and go to Nilfgaard, leaving her true family behind, go to the snakepit the nilfgaardian court is, possibly full with people like Phillipa and Siggi, marrying Voorhis, and trying to reform the Nilfgaardian Empire.
It sounds good. You could say that she is now grown up, accepts the reality, gives up her dreams and tries to improve the world. But it does not feel like this is Ciri. It does not feel like something that will make her happy. And I'm also not sure if she will succeed.

Forgiving Emhyr: unlikely
Marrying someone she don't love and know: Impossible
After being chased for nearly half her life by people trying to use her and risking her live to save the world just giving up her hard won freedom: Very unlikely to me.


Ciri is also no politician. I think she would hardly make compromisses at things she detests and would earn enemies through this and she has also no experience with politic and intrigues. Eddard Stark was also a good person who tried to do the right things. I think most of us know what happend to him.

Also the problem with the North still remains. What if Kaedwen rebells against Nilfgaard? What would Empress Ciri crush it with all force? Make concessions? What if the other conquered kingdoms want the same? What if they want to fight until Nilfgaard leaves? What will the nilfgaardian military and nobility say?

In the end it is up to everyone which ending he or she choose, but in my opinion the Witcher Ending fits better to the overall story. And considering the books it is no choice at all for me.

 

[StormKorp]

Each ending has some pros and cons...there is not an objectively good ending. People trying to rationalize their decisions and make them appear good are a quite laughable attempt of dismissing things they don't like and emphasizing others they prefer more. Also using the book to justify in-game choices is a moot point as the game provides with you the ability to make decisions that contradict the books so it's quite pointless to bring the books up. The books say Ciri prefer women? Well wrong I made her say she prefers men so really using the books to justify your decisions is quite pointless for the purpose of this game. The game provides you with the possibility of making your own canon.

Also dismissing this ending based on Ciri desires it's quite ironic considering Ciri takes this decision on her own should you convince her to see Emyr who is still her father after all. Furthermore dismissing this ending based on Ciri lack of political skills is even more ridiculous considering it's all based on assumptions on how the court will react or the military....no in game events provide any evidence that support this idea of more wars in the North or lack of Ciri authority as Empress.

Each one of us has it's own favorite ending, I do still believe that the Empress one is the best ending but I don't say it's the objectively best outcome of the game.....despite CDPR making this ending the most difficult to achieve and feeling overall the most complete in relation with the others.

 

[Coltaine123]

Each ending has some pros and cons...there is not an objectively good ending. People trying to rationalize their decisions and make them appear good are a quite laughable attempt of dismissing things they don't like and emphasizing others they prefer more.

Oh,I thought that would be the idea behind a discussion. I'm trying to explain rationally why I think something is right/the better choice/more important and the other one is doing the same for his opinion. According to you many posts in many threads here would be quite laughable attemps

Also using the book to justify in-game choices is a moot point as the game provides with you the ability to make decisions that contradict the books so it's quite pointless to bring the books up. The books say Ciri prefer women? Well wrong I made her say she prefers men so really using the books to justify your decisions is quite pointless for the purpose of this game. The game provides you with the possibility of making your own canon.

The game is based on the books. And I don't think that there is a choice Geralt can make in the game that contradicts the books completely. For the dialogue choices in the sauna,... All are valid. Ciri is bisexual in the books, according to her interest in Mistel and Galahad.

And why should I limit myself in choices to the knowledge from the game. I have read the books. I know the characters and there history. I have an opinion about them. Sure this influences my choices. That is why I mentioned the books in my previous post. To explain why I made this decission.

Also dismissing this ending based on Ciri desires it's quite ironic considering Ciri takes this decision on her own should you convince her to see Emyr who is still her father after all. Furthermore dismissing this ending based on Ciri lack of political skills is even more ridiculous considering it's all based on assumptions on how the court will react or the military....no in game events provide any evidence that support this idea of more wars in the North or lack of Ciri authority as Empress.

At the beginning of this thread there was a discussion why Ciri would agree to that, how Emhyr convinced her. I'm not sure who started it, but I think it was willowhugger who had a nice explaination that would also explain why five decisions decide Ciris fate. If you are interested the discussion started on Page 3. It is pretty much so I won't quote everything.

Yes, I have made some assumptions. That is what I think may happen. I don't know for sure because CDPR did not give us much information.
But you were doing the same in this post.

Well I beg to differ that is in my opinion the hardest and most complete ending you can get. Ciri power and heritage is wasted as a Witcher because as Empress of Nilfgaard she can truly make the difference and have the possibility to improve the world in which they are living. Running away from your father and your responsabilities isn't a positive ending. Besides she can always count on Geralt and Yennefer helping her out should she need it. I think in this ending the world is in a much more stable situation and we have less wars overall.

We both are making assumptions of the impact of Ciri becoming Empress. I have explained my assumptions a bit more. What is the difference?

In the Empress Ending Screen nothing is said that would support one of us.

"After years in exile, Ciri returned to Nilfgaard, her parental home, where Emhyr prepared to name her successor
The woman had the necessary qualities. From her father she inherited an empress' political instincts. From Geralt she gained a sense of simple human decency,
Few monarch boast both traits, which is quite ashame..."

The other ones also don't support one of us.

Each one of us has it's own favorite ending, I do still believe that the Empress one is the best ending but I don't say it's the objectively best outcome of the game.....despite CDPR making this ending the most difficult to achieve and feeling overall the most complete in relation with the others.

I agree with you that it feels the most complete. You can talk to Zoltan and Dandelion. You do a hunt with Ciri. And it is also the most diffult to achieve. But I don' think that CDPR wants to say therby that this one is the best. I think for them are all endings equal valid.