The Triss content and the inconsistency of our romance's choice

[Trireme]

Will be a long trip to complete Velen and Skellige first. But if you managed it before getting killed cuz of the desire to see Triss.. tell us if it feels better/worst

Lucky for me I have a Death March save with White Orchard and Velen 100% completed, so I can hop straight in to Novigrad/Skellige whenever I want!

Yeah I'll probably do that first Triss quest first (if anything, just so I can level up more to Skellige level) and then head off to Skellige. Save the rest of the Novigrad content for after Skellige.

I did my 2nd playthrough this way, and it makes a much better narrative. After the Vegelbud party and the kiss, Geralt is confused and not sure what he's feeling as he sails to Skellige. Then after the "Last Wish" Geralt has made up his mind and returns to Novigrad, where he finds Triss about to leave forever. If I were making a movie version of the game that's how I would order it.

 

[hawkeyesforever]

I think they underestimated how much work would go in the game. The same thing that happened in The Witcher 2... Biting more than they can chew... Of course, the game IS amazing. But some edges were left obviously very rough in the later game.

I agree with you. I mean everything before Kaer Morhen is amazing. What happens after is kind of lackluster in comparison except for a few great moments with Ciri.

I'm hoping in the next 2 years they'll be able to patch things up and make Act 3 at least comparable to everything that occurred Kaer Morhen. I somewhat wonder if maybe more side quests for the Koer Morhen map would benefit in terms of helping the pacing and making it not feel like a rush to the end.

It does make me wonder what level those Toussaint quests will be with the Blood and Wine expansion will be.

"Blood and Wine, a 20-hour tale that will introduce the all-new in-game region of Toussaint, will take Geralt to a land untainted by war, where an atmosphere of carefree indulgence and knightly ritual masks an ancient, bloody secret."

I just hope I can take Triss to Toussaint for some "carefree indulgence"

 

[snakey_77]

I agree! Lend me your tinfoil hat please? Nice...comfy!

CDPR MIGHT have wanted to give us the worst case endings SO we would try and run it again to get a better ending...

Here's your hat! OUCH!!! for a moment...we were BOTH exposed! Or, wait...that was just me exposing myself! :whip:

of course they wanted us to screw the pooch on the endings sheer replay value in itself there .. hell not sure if many of you played mass effect 2 ? i googled the crap out of mass effect 2 ending to see how to do the cannon everyone lived ending not to mention the flings with nearly all crew members.. what i don't think they realised till later for what ever reason is that they messed up the triss romance by trying to cannon yen and maybe started throwing things in that only just kinda made sense to tie a red bow on it and call it a alternative romance ..

 

[Pescador7]

But i never played a game with so many dense branch stories. In my first playtrough when i choose both i was expecting to see a catfight, but this never happened, would be nice a catfight, both in a pool with swimsuits.

I fully agree that the game is great and I certainly haven't played something like it since... Forever? When morrowind was released I felt something similar, but still different...

As a stand alone game, Witcher 3 is the shit. Truly great... BUT, having played the previous games, I expected some continuity... And this continuity left much to be desired.

 

[Dibre]

I fully agree that the game is great and I certainly haven't played something like it since... Forever? When morrowind was released I felt something similar, but still different...

As a stand alone game, Witcher 3 is the shit. Truly great... BUT, having played the previous games, I expected some continuity... And this continuity left much to be desired.

I already wrote about this in few topics, this is the rp need: We really don't need 10h of content to fulfill this feeling. What we need is a dense dialogue options with repetitive mini quests, like give a gift to triss to be rewarded, play gwent against yennefer, if you lose she gets a reaction if you wins she gets another, play drink contest against Zoltan... We need a post-game like this.

 

[Riddlin]

Could you imagine the uproar there would have been if it was left like that, with no romance choice at all? I'm guessing there would have been quite a bit of outrage.

That said, from 2013 on it seems like they wanted to make sure Yennifer got done first, Triss was added on later but in the rush to get the ending done the Triss content didn't get completely finished. In fact in Act 3, Yen could use more content too.

I have faith that something more will get put in though.

The problem I am now facing is, I have prefaced ALL my design ideas that they ran out of time but what they wanted to put in the story was already there, just waiting for some time so they can implement it, BUT...if they brought in Jaimi Barbakoff (your english version Triss) early to do her VO work...and then later changed their minds...it could seriously explain the DETAIL of Novigrad Triss and the absent (or at best destant) Triss we get the rest of the way through.

That would mean for Triss to be filled out, they would HAVE to bring the VO talent back for an extended stretch...and thats not usually done.

---------- Updated at 07:23 PM ----------

I think they underestimated how much work would go in the game. The same thing that happened in The Witcher 2... Biting more than they can chew... Of course, the game IS amazing. But some edges were left obviously very rough in the later game.

I can totally agree with that and I hope they have the desire to fix it ALL!

 

[Costa417]

There is no way for anyone new to the witcher games to make an informed final decision on who to romance, you are forced to make that decision at the docks in Novigrad before ever really seeing much of Yennefer while having spent a lot of time with Triss already.

They should have made it so you had the possibility to chose between the two of them ONLY after you actually knew them both.

Let's say a new player likes Triss. Then he goes to skellige and gets to know Yen better and he decides that he likes Yen more. Well he's f*cked and he's gonna end up alone

 

[ltdk92]

I think they underestimated how much work would go in the game. The same thing that happened in The Witcher 2... Biting more than they can chew... Of course, the game IS amazing. But some edges were left obviously very rough in the later game.

Exactly this. There are so many plot threads that they were trying to include with two major conflicts: The Wild Hunt and the White Frost. They wanted to make a grand game with an intense and complicated story, and they succeeded in delivering an epic experience, but it suffered from the same ambition that made them succeed.

They couldn't maintain the solid character and story development that they started off with, and they couldn't push back release to make the game perfect in every way from start to finish. The game is still a masterpiece and an accomplishment for a developer their size, but it left many disappointed in an area that most of us found important to the series: the personal relationships. The ending should have had the epic sense of closure that the entire story oozed in other areas.

 

[Pescador7]

I agree with you. I mean everything before Kaer Morhen is amazing. What happens after is kind of lackluster in comparison except for a few great moments with Ciri.

I'm hoping in the next 2 years they'll be able to patch things up and make Act 3 at least comparable to everything that occurred Kaer Morhen. I somewhat wonder if maybe more side quests for the Koer Morhen map would benefit in terms of helping the pacing and making it not feel like a rush to the end.

It does make me wonder what level those Toussaint quests will be with the Blood and Wine expansion will be.

"Blood and Wine, a 20-hour tale that will introduce the all-new in-game region of Toussaint, will take Geralt to a land untainted by war, where an atmosphere of carefree indulgence and knightly ritual masks an ancient, bloody secret."

I just hope I can take Triss to Toussaint for some "carefree indulgence"

I also hope they find whatever reason to have Triss in Touissant

Maybe she developed a taste for wine..? From her questline in Novigrad it became obvious she enjoys drinking

 

[Riddlin]

There is no way for anyone new to the witcher games to make an informed final decision on who to romance, you are forced to make that decision at the docks in Novigrad before ever really seeing much of Yennefer while having spent a lot of time with Triss already.

I think that points more to the fact you brought up earlier...Triss was suppose to get on the boat and never come back! Then that changed when someone said, "You know they have pitchforks right?"

---------- Updated at 07:34 PM ----------

I also hope they find whatever reason to have Triss in Touissant

Maybe she developed a taste for wine..? From her questline in Novigrad it became obvious she enjoys drinking

And Geralt ENJOYS her drinking!

---------- Updated at 07:38 PM ----------

It does make me wonder what level those Toussaint quests will be with the Blood and Wine expansion will be.

"Blood and Wine, a 20-hour tale that will introduce the all-new in-game region of Toussaint, will take Geralt to a land untainted by war, where an atmosphere of carefree indulgence and knightly ritual masks an ancient, bloody secret."

I just hope I can take Triss to Toussaint for some "carefree indulgence"

That seems like a REALLY good place to bring whomever you be romancing...hell I might take my wife to a place like that...ply enough wine to her I might try some new nightly rituals! :O

 

[Costa417]

The game is still a masterpiece and an accomplishment for a developer their size, but it left many disappointed in an area that most of us found important to the series: the personal relationships. The ending should have had the epic sense of closure that the entire story oozed in other areas.

Perfectly spotted on

 

[Hashmalum]

I have been thinking about the relationship acknowledgement. But even though it may be good to those who picked one of the sorceresses, it would kinda punish earlier those who decided to go with them both, as there would be no way of keeping secret of the separate relationships from Triss and Yen up to the point it is now, if both kept hearing everyone acknowledging the two as Geralt's lover. So, in that specific Geralt's mind, it is actually wise to keep it in a low profile.

 

[EtherealSand]

Question for those who had a playthrough where you didn't romance Triss:
Is the "Good luck" you get from her exclusive to those who romanced her?
I noticed that some moments that seemed exclusive to those who romanced Trss were seen by those who didn't romance her as well.
Just what did we get for romancing Triss aside from her lighthouse scene, the kiss in her room in Dandelion's place, the fountain scene, and the epilogue slide?

 

[Redemyr]

Yeah that's why imo, perhaps contrary to what many here might wish, the first step into fixing romance angle in a permanent and consistent way, and not just a couple of dialogues here and there, is to make the Vizima meeting with Yen much much longer...

Have Yen propose a trade when he refuses to be teleported, she would stay with him and talk if he agreed to be teleported afterwards (Geralt gets his time, Yen cuts the 5 days later part to just a few hours, very Yen-like efficient solution, optional though, the player can still choose to ride if they want to skip this)

It would be a sort of closure for the "search" for her so hyped in the W2 game... and it would give players more insight into her character, both the good parts and the bad... I picture a walk in the battlements, or just them sitting in the courtyard... Yen would ask him about his previous adventures, choices, etc and she could react differently... that way people can get a sense whether she would be appealing to them or not... whether their views on the world were aligned, etc...

Of course the Triss issue would be touched as well, with players either passing it as just a "fling", I lost my memory etc or to really make her understand how much Triss means for Geralt currently (options here could even be tied to choices imported.)

They could even make it so that Triss was active in the search and leaves with Vesemir when Geralt is summoned (incidentally that would be a nice way to cover up for why Ciri and Dandelion never found her). And Geralt could even mention that and stand up for Triss, or not if they so desire. So many possibilities wasted here.

There would be no "hard" locks with her at this point, but players would get a feel for her character. And, depending on how the meeting went, if Geralt was very "pro" Yen in his responses, they would part with a sweet kiss and "see you in Skelligue, can't wait", neutral would be neutral and if the player was pro Triss, she would teleport him in the middle of some some ghouls with a "hope they beat some sense into that thick head of yours" and then she would be off.

 

[xE1NSTE1Nx2049]

It would be cool if the rose would return normal after the lighthouse scene. Like for yen's sex scene when you see the wolves, for triss's sex scene the rose

Hell, I'd be happy if they did something with the Rose. I would call what we got to be effectively nothing Rose-wise and so if they did really anything with it, I'd be happy. I still think making it it's own dedicated quest would be better. First of all, can you ever really have too much Elven Tomb raiding? I think not. Second of all, if he did do it, it would not be at her behest. He would do it simply as a romantic gesture, a way to make her happy. Geralt isn't incredibly romantic but he did give it to her in the first place & he I think it not terribly out of character for him to do something simply to make her happy. Hell, if they can add a village full of pigs side quest (did anybody go back in and do that quest btw? It was kind of dumb to be honest. :X ) then they could add a Rose side quest. I don't know if they will though. Seeing as the side quests they have been releasing are rather pointless and sort of for everyone, this one would be impactful and would only affect us Triss peeps. Maybe sometime in the future? Here's hoping.

That's the impression i got in my second playthrough. There's a line of dialogue when you first meet Triss whilst moving from one location to another where she implies something along the lines of she had to make a fresh start and it wasn't her choice. So yeah i think the game implies Geralt ends things with Triss because his memories lead him to believe he has to find Yen and see if he still loves her as his memories tell him her should.

I am still under the impression that it was partly mutual. Like maybe he started pulling away a little bit? Dropping hints that he needed to go find Yennefer and Triss conceded and let him go. It was like old times again. She was to fade into the background of his life, having to now compete with Yennefer. So she had made plans to move on. Which I give her a lot of credit for. She wasn't sitting around waiting for him. They had something real though, as the journal states,"the two shared feelings that ran far deeper than a superficial and fleeting fancy". That kind of stuff doesn't just disappear and I think him walking back into her life was unexpected. In a good way.

I might be on to something here or just speculation lol ..
maybe RED knew they f.cked up the triss romance but due to time constraints and release they thought look we will put the rose in there as a junk thing and have no purpose FOR NOW!! but we will keep player guessing but we will revisit it and make it useful ..

I LIVE IN HOPE lol

I too am hopeful. Maybe they just ran out of time. The Rose could make a reappearance yet. :wub: I wouldn't hold out for it though. :X There's a bunch of random items that are quest items and/or junk that you never seem to do anything with.

 

[ltdk92]

With the profits that are rolling in for CDPR at the moment, I am hoping they will seriously consider creating new content with Triss that is supplementary to what is found in-game. If sales reports are any indication, this game will be a massive monetary success for them with returns of over 100% from the previous installments a year after release. The game has already sold 4 million copies in a two week span of time--double the copies sold for the Witcher 2 some three months after release. Regardless of how many of these sales are from digital copies or discs, the returns are enough to make up for any losses gained when they pushed back the release.

Sales will taper off over the following months, but if they continue to be strong, CDPR could afford to produce more content starring the main cast, especially Triss. I am hoping that their silence is because they, at least, have this option on the table. They have already said they are supporting Wild Hunt for the next 2 years, so this also leaves them the time and resources to make this a reality. The only downside to this would be that the extra content may not be free, because it would require a whole new budget and financial investment. In turn, we may also have to pay for the extra content.

The way I see this playing out is CDPR re-releasing the game as a Enhanced Edition, where all the issues we have addressed on the thread could be answered more thoroughly. There must be developers who spot the narrative issues we are talking about in regards to Triss and co. If their ambition and professionalism in the games they have created is any clue, I would even say they are discussing every possible way they could make the game closer to the vision they had but were constrained in fulfilling.

Of course, like I have said before, we should try to remain skeptical until further notice.

 

[zaskar70]

I would even say they are discussing every possible way they could make the game closer to the vision they had but were constrained in fulfilling.

I think the game without a romance choice at all with Triss sailing away to kovir was their vision for the game, they put the Triss choice in afterwords as more fan service than anything else.

If the game had been designed with a romance choice between Triss and Yen from day one there would have been a lot of back and forth between them both quest wise and storyline wise to allow the player to make an informed decision on who he/she wanted Geralt to end up with.

instead we got CDPR's vision of the game with no choice involved, the whole Novigrad questline with Triss was designed with the intention of her leaving. After that the next half of the game was focused on Yen.

This is why there is a block of Triss content then a block of Yen content, they were not worried about giving players a chance to get to know both women before making a choice because in their vision of the game there was no choice.

Only after feedback and probably some internal discussion towards the end of development did they decide to allow players to choose, unfourtunately they already had most of the game done with no choice so they did what they could for fan service I think.

If we do get a response i'm thinking it will be along the lines of " sorry guy's we had the option late in development to either keep the game the way it was with no choice at all or do what we could with what we had and allow the players to make a choice but fit it into the existing narrative as best as we could without rewriting anything done previously as that would not have been possible".

I think we may have to live with the fact that they just plain made a mistake on day one when they started writing the story. To be honest the whole flow of the game would need to be redone in order to do a choice properly and I cant see them ever doing that as it would almost mean a completley new game. I think they just made a bad decision on day one regarding Triss

 

[ltdk92]

I think the game without a romance choice at all with Triss sailing away to kovir was their vision for the game, they put the Triss choice in afterwords as more fan service than anything else.

If the game had been designed with a romance choice between Triss and Yen from day one there would have been a lot of back and forth between them both quest wise and storyline wise to allow the player to make an informed decision on who he/she wanted Geralt to end up with.

instead we got CDPR's vision of the game with no choice involved, the whole Novigrad questline with Triss was designed with the intention of her leaving. After that the next half of the game was focused on Yen.

This is why there is a block of Triss content then a block of Yen content, they were not worried about giving players a chance to get to know both women before making a choice because in their vision of the game there was no choice.

Only after feedback and probably some internal discussion towards the end of development did they decide to allow players to choose, unfourtunately they already had most of the game done with no choice so they did what they could for fan service I think.

If we do get a response i'm thinking it will be along the lines of " sorry guy's we had the option late in development to either keep the game the way it was with no choice at all or do what we could with what we had and allow the players to make a choice but fit it into the existing narrative as best as we could without rewriting anything done previously as that would not have been possible".

I think we may have to live with the fact that they just plain made a mistake on day one when they started writing the story. To be honest the whole flow of the game would need to be redone in order to do a choice properly and I cant see them ever doing that as it would almost mean a completley new game. I think they just made a bad decision on day one regarding Triss

Agree with the Triss content being added later. I have mentioned that the Triss content was initially meant as a farewell between Triss and Geralt, not a rekindling to their romance. I have played the game twice and have come to that conclusion doing both the Yen and Triss romances.

What I meant above was that they can make the game more polished to their final vision, which now included the Triss romance choice. They clearly tried to give it justice, because the Triss and Geralt moments in Novigrad are well done. However, they simply didn't have the time and resources to flesh it out to make it feel like a genuine rekindled romance and not heartfelt goodbye. Now, of course, this is my observation and perspective on the general interaction between Triss and Geralt.

I also think that it was an error on their part to fumble on the creative course and storytelling of the game. However, I can see what's already present salvaged with better narrative sequencing and pacing. The only way that these changes can be made, from how I see it, is if they re-released the game to give proper development to EVERY relationship and theme they present, especially in regards to Triss.

Whatever CDPR does--if they even decide to do anything--is contingent on many factors. I'm not too enthusiastic that any grand changes will be made, and we shouldn't be getting our hopes too high either. I am waiting for some comment from CDPr before I put any faith on anything yet.

 

[hawkeyesforever]

I think the game without a romance choice at all with Triss sailing away to kovir was their vision for the game, they put the Triss choice in afterwords as more fan service than anything else.

If the game had been designed with a romance choice between Triss and Yen from day one there would have been a lot of back and forth between them both quest wise and storyline wise to allow the player to make an informed decision on who he/she wanted Geralt to end up with.

instead we got CDPR's vision of the game with no choice involved, the whole Novigrad questline with Triss was designed with the intention of her leaving. After that the next half of the game was focused on Yen.

This is why there is a block of Triss content then a block of Yen content, they were not worried about giving players a chance to get to know both women before making a choice because in their vision of the game there was no choice.

Only after feedback and probably some internal discussion towards the end of development did they decide to allow players to choose, unfourtunately they already had most of the game done with no choice so they did what they could for fan service I think.

If we do get a response i'm thinking it will be along the lines of " sorry guy's we had the option late in development to either keep the game the way it was with no choice at all or do what we could with what we had and allow the players to make a choice but fit it into the existing narrative as best as we could without rewriting anything done previously as that would not have been possible".

I think we may have to live with the fact that they just plain made a mistake on day one when they started writing the story. To be honest the whole flow of the game would need to be redone in order to do a choice properly and I cant see them ever doing that as it would almost mean a completley new game. I think they just made a bad decision on day one regarding Triss

I agree, although I don't really think the story needs to be redone from day one. The game does have some excellent Triss scenes right now, and I think it can be improved upon. A few dialogues here and there, maybe a quest in Act 3 with Triss, something in Kaer Morhen with Triss. Adding some dialogues on the boat with Triss so she's not saying "Well?"

In all honestly, as much as we want Triss content, I don't think CDPR is extremely far off in making the Triss romance better.

 

[Riddlin]

Question for those who had a playthrough where you didn't romance Triss:
Is the "Good luck" you get from her exclusive to those who romanced her?
I noticed that some moments that seemed exclusive to those who romanced Trss were seen by those who didn't romance her as well.
Just what did we get for romancing Triss aside from her lighthouse scene, the kiss in her room in Dandelion's place, the fountain scene, and the epilogue slide?

I chose Yen on my first play-through and she said that to Geralt. Triss is exactly the same, romance or not after KM the first time! I have watched some vids and there is NO difference. Only difference is one or two scenes but I honestly don't know what spawns them or where they take place...trying to keep SOME things secret for my current Triss run-through.