The unofficial watchlist of cards needing balance or rework

[Rulegard]

Thank for your reply.
Sukrus: Just have seen after my post that there is a separate thread. Generally I always see the in this forum answer "hey, it's no problem, you just have to purify / remove it." The answer is yes, if you are playing NG. I'm a MO & ST player and for me it's next to impossible to remove a defender completely within one round since there are almost no removal cards causing more than 6 damage. SK could get Sukrus even twice and revive it in the final round to protect your defender in the same round. (Hmm, maybe I shoud try SK now - like the raven swarms...)
Besides poison I can't think of anything to remove a defender after Sukrus is in place.
But I agree: I almost never see it (but if I meet him, I lose), so there must be a way for most player to handle it.

Rot Tosser:
Hey it's a five provision five power card, that, if no handled immediately, causes the destruction of one unit in the following round (the second will normally be purified / moved out of the way). Yes of course, you can handle the rot tosser often somehow. But is this really necessary that this "small" bronze card has the potential to disrupt the opponent's play and I have to take care of it to avoid being f....d? Give it 1 or 2 power or raise its provision and everything is fine.
But, you're right. The other cards you mentioned at the beginning are more important.... (Yennefer: Instant Forfeit for example... For me the biggest problem is not that it can attack nearly everything but steal my cards thus making it unavailable for Revival, Ozrel, Caretaker etc.)

 

[InkognitoXI]

Archespore.
I would honestly quite like it if its nerf would get reverted and it would regain Thrive, if necessary it could go to 5 provisions, however right now it is completely unplayable.
If anything Monsters are currently the worst faction in the game and this buff would be similar to the Savage Bear buff (as in a bottom end of the provision spectrum buff to the faction).

 

[dragoonzen]

I am sick of ST. Playing monster which is currently underpowered (IMO) but no way should I get three precision strike ST in a ROW. Plus each time, RNG made me go first??? Is the odds really that bad... Nerf the WoB card.

 

[Payus]

You can always move the defender away from Sukrus. Every faction has a movement card or two + neutrals.

so the solutions are:
A)Deal enough aoe damage or use Yrden at the end puinishing the row stacking.
B)Move defender
C)Purify defender
D) Banish defender(korathy, yenn)
E)Destroy defender : scorch, coc, etc
F)Poison Defender
G) Doom and destroy with Gaunter O'dim

Choose whatever fits your deck.

Also Enslave can yoink it at 6

 

[mazeebra]

You can always move the defender away from Sukrus. Every faction has a movement card or two + neutrals.

so the solutions are:
A)Deal enough aoe damage or use Yrden at the end puinishing the row stacking.
B)Move defender
C)Purify defender
D) Banish defender(korathy, yenn)
E)Destroy defender : scorch, coc, etc
F)Poison Defender
G) Doom and destroy with Gaunter O'dim

Choose whatever fits your deck.

Also Enslave can yoink it at 6

All require special cards just to deal with the defender, except the damage/destroy.

It's a pretty bad mechanic. Perhaps it would help to make it more expensive than 9 give 7 power plus 4 armor plus "defender", meaning they estimate the worth of defender alone at only 1 provision, while it's probably more like 3-5.

 

[Payus]

All require special cards just to deal with the defender, except the damage/destroy.

It's a pretty bad mechanic. Perhaps it would help to make it more expensive than 9 give 7 power plus 4 armor plus "defender", meaning they estimate the worth of defender alone at only 1 provision, while it's probably more like 3-5.

Of course you need "special cards" for a special ocasion, goes without saying. Defender wouldn't defend much otherwise.
I'm only talking about the Sukrus/covenant combo, not about defenders in general, which not all of them have 4 armor and 7 strenght , there's Azar Javed with 5 streght that summons 2 defenders each with 1 str 1 armor. Figgis merluzzo has 5 strengh even if he provides a 2 body dwarf, at 5 str you can yoink it with enslave, vigo's muzzle or kill it outright with a stunning blow (4p Sk card).

My point is that there's about 5 to 6 widespread ways to counter sukrus/covenant and that the combo is not only far from broken, it is a non problem.

 

[mazeebra]

Of course you need "special cards" for a special ocasion, goes without saying. Defender wouldn't defend much otherwise.
I'm only talking about the Sukrus/covenant combo, not about defenders in general, which not all of them have 4 armor and 7 strenght , there's Azar Javed with 5 streght that summons 2 defenders each with 1 str 1 armor. Figgis merluzzo has 5 strengh even if he provides a 2 body dwarf, at 5 str you can yoink it with enslave, vigo's muzzle or kill it outright with a stunning blow (4p Sk card).

My point is that there's about 5 to 6 widespread ways to counter sukrus/covenant and that the combo is not only far from broken, it is a non problem.

Defenders is not a special occasion, lots of decks include defenders.

Some defenders are weaker than others and/or provides less/more value, sure..

 

[Payus]

Defenders is not a special occasion, lots of decks include defenders.

Some defenders are weaker than others and/or provides less/more value, sure..

So if they are common so should be those "special cards" that counter them, right?

 

[Evangium]

Thank for your reply.

Sukrus: Just have seen after my post that there is a separate thread. Generally I always see the in this forum answer "hey, it's no problem, you just have to purify / remove it." The answer is yes, if you are playing NG. I'm a MO & ST player and for me it's next to impossible to remove a defender completely within one round since there are almost no removal cards causing more than 6 damage. SK could get Sukrus even twice and revive it in the final round to protect your defender in the same round. (Hmm, maybe I shoud try SK now - like the raven swarms...)

Besides poison I can't think of anything to remove a defender after Sukrus is in place.

But I agree: I almost never see it (but if I meet him, I lose), so there must be a way for most player to handle it.

I do think it's one of those cards to watch, but only in the context of a future meta where it becomes part of SK decks core strategy. Even then, it probably is something that can be self-corrected just by providing more options in units and tech. NG, probably has the widest range of options from immediate answer (removal or enslave mechanics) to using spies to break apart a Sukrus+defender/key unit combo, making it much easier to do two-step removal. Except for NR, other factions just don't have that kind of tech and that's probably something that CDPR could look into again. After all, I don't think they've ever given a reason why they removed many disloyal/spy units from SK,ST and MO.

Rot Tosser:

Hey it's a five provision five power card, that, if no handled immediately, causes the destruction of one unit in the following round (the second will normally be purified / moved out of the way). Yes of course, you can handle the rot tosser often somehow. But is this really necessary that this "small" bronze card has the potential to disrupt the opponent's play and I have to take care of it to avoid being f....d? Give it 1 or 2 power or raise its provision and everything is fine.

But, you're right. The other cards you mentioned at the beginning are more important.... (Yennefer: Instant Forfeit for example... For me the biggest problem is not that it can attack nearly everything but steal my cards thus making it unavailable for Revival, Ozrel, Caretaker etc.)

Historically, Rot Tosser (RT) has gone through a few changes, both to its body and its token, Cow Carcass (CC). Originally it used to wipe the lowest units from a row. So it was a popular choice for weather decks. Then CC was changed to poison, but triggering on controlling player's turn. As you can imagine, even though there weren't that many poison cards in the game (RT may have been the only one that NG could use), it made it pretty easy to remove two units. That was then changed to trigger on turn end, allowing locks to be used against it. Body-wise, it has had it's strength changed a few times, going as low as 4 and as high as 8. Overall, it has been a fairly stable card. Unfortunately, like many changes that have come to Gwent, the ability to answer it has slowly been leeched away from many archetypes, mainly through the loss of effects, like lock, that can be played on your side of the board. Again, it's one of those situations that we need better tech units, than the card being a problem.

With the advent of NG's poison archetype, RT has become a little more versatile. However, from a NG perspective, it's still not an optimal choice. If I'm playing poison, then RT usually only accomplishes two things for me. First is the carcass's doomed status boosts Thirsty Dame. Second is that I disrupt your game plan for a turn or two, while you deal with it. Occassionally the second part works in my favor. If you've got two prime targets side by side to each other, then you are going to have to choose which one to sacrifice. That is faction specific though. Playing RT against Svalblod Priest and the unit he's pinging just results in the priest pinging the carcass for an extra boost and neither unit gets poisoned. MO just eat the carcass in those situations. NR Kikimore/Kadweni Revenants decks just use it to spawn another unit if I haven't guessed what type of deck they are and played RT earlier. Sometimes, there are those rare moments where playing RT, like other spies, wins the game by preventing you from playing your finisher if you've played a greedy swarm or not managed your rows and the carcass fills the slot instead. But for the most part, it's a case of having to play it early to disrupt you (e.g. bluff another NG player to protect a Magne Division's early, split an Anna Stregbor+Tridam Infantry pair) when I need to save my better removal for bigger threats (or just don't have it and am trying to bluff). It's not an efficient two-step removal when compared to other poison cards, given you do have some control over what gets poisoned.

 

[Murderlin7]

celano harpy is a worse bargazi

 

[jmoyano92]

-Dryad Fledgling with 3 base power instead of 4 and 9 provision cost instead of 11 for that card.
-Nerf also Percival S. with 3 base power instead of 4 but keep his 3 armor. (Glynnis aep Loernach is balanced because 'Create' has a lot of RNG, Harmony doesn't have any RNG, Percival is much better because of that)
-Increase provision cost for The Great Oak to 14 and add more finishers for all factions. The Great Oak, Ozzrel... always the same... boring and predictable, we need more finishers plus creative and different ways to play the game (more combos and synergies between cards)
-Nerf also Ewald Borsodi's base power to 3 and increase his provision cost to 9 because this guy can remove all your board in the same turn he has been played (9 coins plus 1 or 2 bounties and he will shoot over and over again with no counter... disgusting)
-Nerf Wild Boar of the Sea (to its previous state) because in its current state is clearly broken with Dagur or An Craite Greatswords. 42-0 pts in my last turn in one match against Skellige and my opponent won with only 2 cards in his last turn with literally 0 units on his board before using his leader and Dagur. That's broken af*. If devs don't nerf this at least bring back non-units decks to counter this thing... tss.
-Nerf Crowmother with 3 base power instead of 4. This unit is broken compared to Roach or The Flying Redanian.
-Nerf Savolla-Madame Luiza combo: Increase Savolla's provision cost to 11 instead of 9. (17pts for Savolla for only 9 provision without counter for Madame Luiza is clearly broken)

etc, etc, etc.

 

[dragoonzen]

-Dryad Fledgling with 3 base power instead of 4 and 9 provision cost instead of 11 for that card.
-Nerf also Percival S. with 3 base power instead of 4 but keep his 3 armor. (Glynnis aep Loernach is balanced because 'Create' has a lot of RNG, Harmony doesn't have any RNG, Percival is much better because of that)
-Increase provision cost for The Great Oak to 14 and add more finishers for all factions. The Great Oak, Ozzrel... always the same... boring and predictable, we need more finishers plus creative and different ways to play the game (more combos and synergies between cards)
-Nerf also Ewald Borsodi's base power to 3 and increase his provision cost to 9 because this guy can remove all your board in the same turn he has been played (9 coins plus 1 or 2 bounties and he will shoot over and over again with no counter... disgusting)
-Nerf Wild Boar of the Sea (to its previous state) because in its current state is clearly broken with Dagur or An Craite Greatswords. 42-0 pts in my last turn in one match against Skellige and my opponent won with only 2 cards in his last turn with literally 0 units on his board before using his leader and Dagur. That's broken af*. If devs don't nerf this at least bring back non-units decks to counter this thing... tss.
-Nerf Crowmother with 3 base power instead of 4. This unit is broken compared to Roach or The Flying Redanian.
-Nerf Savolla-Madame Luiza combo: Increase Savolla's provision cost to 11 instead of 9. (17pts for Savolla for only 9 provision without counter for Madame Luiza is clearly broken)

etc, etc, etc.

All these broken cards and yet they have been around for a long time now. Broken when first introduce, still broken after patches and still be broken with the coming of a new expansion. Lol.

 

[mazeebra]

Dryad Ranger is quite ridiculous. Not only does it damage a unit by 2 (3 body = 5 total), but it ALSO poison the enemy unit AND has Harmony in addition.

Clearly a unit with too many abilities and very OP at 5 provisions.

I have this unit in my own thread about "problematic cards", but I thought I would add it here. One of the most OP bronze cards in the game.

Post automatically merged: Feb 27, 2020

Madame Luiza and Savolla (+Savolla's Frightener) auto 23 points (+6 armour) for 18 provisions, no counter.

It didn't occur to me before how silly this is. Madame Luiza is "on deploy" aka deploy ability, not row ability or "on the board" ability. This means if you don't sequence things wrong, you will get a 2x6 point unit + one of the biggest units in the game on the board in 2 moves, guaranteed.

I thought Madame Luiza was a lockable or counter-possible unit, but it's not. Not knowing that, I thought, fair enough, this move is ok. But realizing there is no counter makes it quite ridiculous. What's worse is that the frightener also has 6 armor!

Fair enough, they pay 9 coins to do this, no worries, nothing wrong there, but no, they automatically get it for free! The highest tribute in the game. Haha!

Pretty dumb combo.

 

[Evangium]

Archespore.
I would honestly quite like it if its nerf would get reverted and it would regain Thrive, if necessary it could go to 5 provisions, however right now it is completely unplayable.
If anything Monsters are currently the worst faction in the game and this buff would be similar to the Savage Bear buff (as in a bottom end of the provision spectrum buff to the faction).

celano harpy is a worse bargazi

Monsters isn't in a good place right now. Ironically, even though they are traditionally the swarm and big tall unit faction, powercreep and an over abundance of removal tech has reduced them to a balanced faction. Along with that, CDPR's design philosphy of homogenising archetypes by printing or changing cards so they are functionally the same as others (my pet theory is they do this so they don't have to revert back to the three copy rule) has pushed cards like Archespore and Celaeno Harpy to fringe factional decks. Why play Archespore for 4 points of damage (deploy:2, Deathwish: 2) and two recovered, when you can play Rotfiend for 4 points in both damage and recovery? Simply, Larry (the Archespore) is not as many points for the same outcome. Even a simple change like giving Larry targetted damage would provide something more to consider when choosing between it and similar deathwish damage units.

Calaeno Harpy (CH), I'm not too sure what can be done. If I remember correctly, back in beta she used to spawn a couple of harpy eggs, so at least there was some reason for her to be just another consume unit (not that there were that many back then). In the Witcher 2, there was a quest that involved hunting down some CH that were stealing the townsfolks dreams. They accomplished this by locking them in crystals. So for MO, CH could be repurposed as a tech card to fill a gap that exists when it comes to being able to counter a spell. I could see it working like this -

1. CH becomes a 2-4 strength gold card and gets a passive ability similar to the old Serpent Trap, "Destroy the next special card an opponent plays before it triggers its ability."
2. Since CH is a unit and susceptible to removal, a second part to its ability could be added. This could be "Then spawn a Dream Crystal artifact in a random row."
3. Dream Crystal, being an artifact, could have either 1-2 point boost or damage, without requiring too much increase in CH's provision cost.

 

[Murderlin7]

like CH synergies with morvudd for one extra point, that is the only advantage it has over bargazi. But with that logic bargazi is immune to sabrina's inferno so it needs something to differentiate it more. As a MO main, I can agree that the faction is hurting. Rotfiend is better than archspore but it costs 1 provision more. Even still, when you compare this to ST which has units that poison, damage, and have harmony all for 5 provisions (dryad ranger). It is pretty easy to see there is a problem here.

 

[mazeebra]

As a MO main, I can agree that the faction is hurting. Rotfiend is better than archspore but it costs 1 provision more. Even still, when you compare this to ST which has units that poison, damage, and have harmony all for 5 provisions (dryad ranger). It is pretty easy to see there is a problem here.

Monsters aren't that bad, common! MO have some of the widest and best tempo cards in the game. It's not just a tall faction!

Problem is rather that some other factions have some really over-powered cards.

 

[Ulubey0]

In the Witcher 2, there was a quest that involved hunting down some CH that were stealing the townsfolks dreams. They accomplished this by locking them in crystals. So for MO, CH could be repurposed as a tech card to fill a gap that exists when it comes to being able to counter a spell. I could see it working like this -

I remember in Beta the regular harpies had a really lore accurate ability. They would summon from deck whenever you killed an allied beast. It made sense since harpies are scavengers, so you'd kill animals to attract them. You would have these harpy decks where you would sacrifice a ton of cows/wolves and create a feast for them and they would come scratch everything up. It was really thematic and I would love if they went towards that direction again.

I like your crystal idea alot too!

 

[BartonFink]

A oneshot, nonrepeatable effect that reactivates the leader ability. When he was introduced, there wasn't really many ways to clone him and power levels were a lot lower, so it was kind of justified. Particularly in matchups with Usurper/Lockdown, who shut down a lot of NG decks tempo and R3 strategies at the start of the game.

Lockdown leader's ability is something that DLT can get around, which I was surprised to discover. Another thing that bugs me is decks where the leader can seize units of 5 power and above. There goes my urge to play DLT! It just totally nerfs my Seize a 4 power unit Nil deck.

You mention scenario stealing...well, just that add to my list of BS game elements, along with bringing back scenarios from the dead etc. Who thinks that that sounds like a good idea and should be implemented? CDPR, obviously.

KR puts out a lot of ping damage and doesn't even care if the row is full and can't spawn new copies. Given both cards still need a turn to pull that kind of swing, I think the problem is more that CDPR has been killing of wide/swarm removal from Gwent, than the card combos being inherently overpowered....KR especially, given that for a long time it was seen as a potentially interesting, but garbage performance card. I was one of those who wasted so much time trying to make my NR Cursed deck work back in the day

Can't say that I've noticed that KR is beating the limit on cards allowed in a row. Is that what you mean? I've mentioned in another post here that I think Poison decks like mine could do with units which have a secondary Order ability in order to counter decks which can just wipe out all your units with you not having much ability to really hurt your opponent.

Nor Cursed deck? How did that one work? You mean you played KR but couldn't get it to work as sweetly as it does now? I once played a Nil deck which didn't have any poison units, I don't think. Pretty sure that I beat it, but I was wondering what it's 'thing' was...how did they expect to beat other players? What was their strategy?

I don't know if you played during open beta, but if you did, you might remember the temporary fix they did to silver spies

No, I haven't played the open beta. I only started playing GWENT a few months ago. It was unplanned really. I saw that it was free on GOG, so I got it. I had no intention of playing but I got sucked in. Actually, I haven't even played any of The Witcher games yet! Since you mention Silver, with the current system, does the Gold, Silver, Bronze card tier structure still exist? I can't say that it's obvious, just going on the look of the cards, whether one is Gold or Bronze. if they do have these colours. If these tiers are a thing, it would help if they chose colours which are easily distinguishable from one another. E.g. Red, Blue, Green.

 

[KamranR]

NG is Overrated as F for some reason. I basically have 90% winrate against NG with my SY and ST decks. Demian is usually 13 for 11p card and Invocation is usually a 9p heathwave that can make your draws better or worst if played in round 1 or 2.

NG can sometimes win with great RNG but outside of that it just can't compete with tier1 decks.

Meanwhile ST and SY dominate and no one bats an eye.

 

[StradYerV]

NG is Overrated as F for some reason. I basically have 90% winrate against NG with my SY and ST decks. Demian is usually 13 for 11p card and Invocation is usually a 9p heathwave that can make your draws better or worst if played in round 1 or 2.

NG can sometimes win with great RNG but outside of that it just can't compete with tier1 decks.

Meanwhile ST and SY dominate and no one bats an eye.

I agree, NG is not #Tier1, it depends a lot on luck. Heatwave is the best card right now to counter NG and NR. Harmony (the mechanic) is the subject to discuss without leaving aside ST trump cards Barnabas and Great Oak.