FP VS TP - perspective matters

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What perspective do YOU want in CP game ?

  • FP- First person

    Votes: 300 22.9%
  • TP- Third person

    Votes: 457 34.9%
  • I must play TP- I have motion sickness GIVE as choice !

    Votes: 99 7.6%
  • I do not care

    Votes: 131 10.0%
  • I want both!

    Votes: 323 24.7%

  • Total voters
    1,310
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The poll is obviously more likely to draw fans of TP in an effort to ask for changes. With that said, if any CDPR forum sees over 60% of its participants asking for the opposite perspective or some inclusion of both, that's not something to be ignored. The most irritated group thus far seems to be those defending FP as if they've been personally insulted by fair and honest suggestions.

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Well that was not the point now was it?

He said CDPR alienated half of their fans, is that the case?

Is 60% of this forum, 60% of the whole fanbase?

And those defending FP, have the right to do so, you see, it's not really about the perspective, it's about what other aspects of the game could suffer because of a a hybrid perspective, and trying to fit one in maybe late in development, a good one.

Maybe they will, and some people still would not be happy
 
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Well that was not the point now was it?

He said CDPR alienated half of their fans, is that the case?

Is 60% of this forum, 60% of the whole fanbase?

And those defending FP, have the right to do so, you see, it's not really about the perspective, it's about what other aspects of the game could suffer because of a a hybrid perspective, and trying to fit one in maybe late in development, a good one.

Maybe they will, and some people still would not be happy

I'd argue there's really no way to know for sure the exact number of the fanbase that prefers FPP vs. TPP. We have the poll, which leans HEAVILY in the third person direction. But internet polls are self-select, "opt in" and so therefore the results could be skewed by a biased sample size.

I also agree that people defending FP have the right to do so. Everyone has their personal preferences.

But I do think that, anecdotally, the CDPR fanbase likely leans towards the third person crowd based on the fact that every single one of their games to date are third person games. It would be a little counter-intuitive that the fanbase of a company that has never released a FPP game before leans that direction.
 
Just dropping by to say that all of my hype is dead like so many others, after years of waiting to find out now that I can't play it unless I want to feel sick constantly. Paying to make myself sick seems silly, I'd go to the pub for that if I wanted it.
 
what has gone missing is that their fan base was mostly made by lovers of traditional TP rpg with well written characters and plot; of course cyberpunk will be a quality game, i'm sure, but the sudden turn of perspective with atatched fps gameplay left this fan base disappointed; it's more probable that a usual COD player will buy this game than someone who played the witcher games.
 
Just dropping by to say that all of my hype is dead like so many others, after years of waiting to find out now that I can't play it unless I want to feel sick constantly. Paying to make myself sick seems silly, I'd go to the pub for that if I wanted it.
Then the pub it is for you lot:) Meanwhile back at the ranch... I will be happily waiting for a pre-order button to appear:)
PS: I am an occasional FPS player, but will still enjoy the game, since is RPG!
 
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Can they also make a poll about the fact that we no longer get to play as our own character? Because that was the biggest reveal that soured me. I can deal with FPS, in fact I'm fine with it, but being forced to play as a named character with predetermined personality traits killed this game for me. Registered specifically to express this.
 
Let me begin this post by saying I am a huge fan of CD Projekt Red, I own all Witcher games and expansions, I have played the standalone trading card game Gwent, where I purchased kegs for God knows how much real-world currency. I will admit that, personally, first person(FP) is a perspective that does not appeal to me in video games, but regardless, I will buy Cyberpunk 2077 for CD Projekt Red despite my dislike of the perspective. I will make the purchase because of their exemplary consumer friendly practices in regards to DRM and microtransactions as I believe the gaming industry is incredibly lucky to have CD Projekt Red be part of it.

I know that a lot of people have posted in regards to the first person perspective of the game(FP), and that a lot of people, including me, have expected the game to be in third person (TP).
As fans with technical expertise in software engineering or hardware engineering have posted a variety of technical reasons for why the decision of the game only being FP has been taken, I would like to apologise in advance for my lack of knowledge and naivete that I might show when discussing this matter. I am by no means knowledgeable in those fields of study.

I understand that the studio has a vison, for their game, and that their vison of the world, story, characters, level design and combat is theirs and theirs alone. I respect their decisions and from reading responses posted here on the forums I might come to understand them even better, however, I do have some issues.

My main issue is that many fans of Cd Projekt Red have known them particularly for their outstanding work in the award-winning Witcher series, that are played from a third person perspective, and perhaps, be it their fault or not, have come to expect that the game will be a RPG in TP and not FP.
Although I understand the studio’s reasons for choosing FP are due to their vison of the world, or due to technical reasons, as part of games development, I do not understand their lack of communication with fans on the front of making such a fundamentally important decision such as a locked FP perspective before entering the development of the game.
Surely, the backlash of this decision could have been prevented if there would have been better communication between the studio and its fan base. Before starting the development of the game and making technical and level design decisions tied to the FP perspective, a poll for question about combat ideas and preferred perspective for players could have been forwarded to fans in a post on various social media. Making the decision of locked first-person perspective could have a drastic impact on the sales of the game. I have known many friends who were in full-hype mode after the trailer that have went from complete joy to a solid no-buy attitude simply because of the FP perspective.

Surely, there could have been a prediction that this fundamental decision would divide the player base, resulting in less purchases or dissent among fans as to why this decision was taken.
As I have read on the forums about the verticality of the game, and how implementing a TP(third person) perspective so late in the development of the game can cause issues with both camera and immersion, I understand if the studio decides not to make such a decision as not implementing a TP(third person) perspective no matter how fervently a portion of the player base would want it.

I would love it, if, in the future, CD project Red would consult on what player experience fans would want before making such key decisions, as it would help them get a better understanding on what type of experience their target audience would prefer and base decisions on those statistics and percentages before beginning the actual development.
As said at the beginning, I love CD Projekt Red, and I will purchase Cyberpunk 2077 for their outstanding consumer friendly practices as I believe they are a shining light in the gaming industry, I will gift my copy to a friend who enjoys FP, I, however, no matter how much I love CDPR, and no matter how much I love the world of Cyberpunk, I cannot play first person(FP) because of personal taste, and how much I dislike the perspective. I am sorry to end this so melancholic. I will, in the future, always keep an eye out for future CDPR projects, if they are third person, turn based, or strategy, as those are my main interests. I wish them the best of luck with Cyberpunk 2077 and I hope they take as much time in development as needed.

With great respect,
A loving fan
All of this. Amazingly well written
 
Just dropping by to say that all of my hype is dead like so many others, after years of waiting to find out now that I can't play it unless I want to feel sick constantly. Paying to make myself sick seems silly, I'd go to the pub for that if I wanted it.
If you have true motion sickness (I mean no offense to any of you with the condition, but I'm starting to doubt it given just how many people are suddenly popping up with it), you wouldn't just say "your hype is dead" (probably).

There are so, SO many ways to address the problem. So many. Surely, your time would be better spent advocating for your group by asking CDPR to implement accessibility options to improve the situation?

If you do have simulation sickness and absolutely nothing helps, I feel for you. Seriously. But that group is such an insanely small minority that I don't think it would make up even 1% of the game's sales. CDPR should not add an entirely new mode to the game for that one group.

Specifically, the group of individuals who A. have motion sickness B. haven't been able to get over it by adapting and C. cannot reduce or eliminate the problem in any other way except by playing in TPP.

I say this as an individual with motion sickness myself, by the way. Things like the removal of head bobbing, wider FOVs (around 110), and more all help quite a bit. Nothing is perfect, but it can come damn close. If we can play even a couple hours at a time, that's a victory.

What if they have? Nobody finds it weird how they allow gameplay for insiders to write amazing articles on but wont show this same amazing gameplay?

Because they understand how the public works. The game is not finished. The press know this. They only invite people that they know aren't going to rail against them for having unfinished, probably buggy, gameplay.

The public does not forgive, and it does not (the vocal ones, that is) take the time to think things through. It has kneejerk reactions. This is not an individual attack on anyone (not you or anyone else here), just an acknowledgement of the reality that we so often see in this industry.

You might believe yourself to be someone who would forgive, and maybe that's true, but the insane, vocal majority is going to flip their sh*t if the game doesn't look how they want it to.
 
Can they also make a poll about the fact that we no longer get to play as our own character? Because that was the biggest reveal that soured me. I can deal with FPS, in fact I'm fine with it, but being forced to play as a named character with predetermined personality traits killed this game for me. Registered specifically to express this.
Character customization is already confirmed, dunno if the character from the trailer is gonna be in the story or not though.
 
what has gone missing is that their fan base was mostly made by lovers of traditional TP rpg with well written characters and plot; of course cyberpunk will be a quality game, i'm sure, but the sudden turn of perspective with atatched fps gameplay left this fan base disappointed; it's more probable that a usual COD player will buy this game than someone who played the witcher games.

To be fair, the camera doesn't have anything to do with the writing. I'm going to give the benefit of the doubt that the game's writing will be awesome since I see no reason why CDPR will drop the ball in that area.

But I 100% agree that they waited waaay to long to announce FPP. I know some have argued in this thread that the company doesn't owe anyone anything with regards to expectations, that expectations are fan created.

But I don't agree with that argument. Certain expectations are reasonable, and others are not. The idea that the game would be TPP when every other game by CDPR to date has been TPP is a reasonable expectation and CDPR dropped the ball a bit in managing that expectation. They should have engaged earlier with the community if they were planning on deviating on that.
 
I'd argue there's really no way to know for sure the exact number of the fanbase that prefers FPP vs. TPP. We have the poll, which leans HEAVILY in the third person direction. But internet polls are self-select, "opt in" and so therefore the results could be skewed by a biased sample size.

I also agree that people defending FP have the right to do so. Everyone has their personal preferences.

But I do think that, anecdotally, the CDPR fanbase likely leans towards the third person crowd based on the fact that every single one of their games to date are third person games. It would be a little counter-intuitive that the fanbase of a company that has never released a FPP game before leans that direction.
Yea the poll is just to get a general sense of whether or not this issue is important enough to really discuss. I like FP just fine, and would probably even prefer it in certain situations. I don't think the majority wants FP out of the game entirely. They just want the ability to play both given the game's abilities and, like you said, the crowd built by Witcher success leans TP if we can only have one or the other.

I understand the "what would the game have to sacrifice in order to incorporate this" argument. But at the same time, if something as basic as your game's perspective is questionable, every other aspect you've sunk time into is going to be affected in some way.
 
Maybe because I'm used to playing RPGs in first person but I'm surprised at people's reactions. I actually don't care either way but FP is a lot more immersive for me. I'm sure they'll let us zoom out the camera and see the character if that's what you want?
 
If you do have simulation sickness and absolutely nothing helps, I feel for you. Seriously. But that group is such an insanely small minority that I don't think it would make up even 1% of the game's sales. CDPR should not add an entirely new mode to the game for that one group.

I'd actually like to see some statistics on this. I have to admit, not being a sufferer of this, it isn't something I've ever spent a lot of time thinking about prior to this thread.

There were a couple of videos presented earlier by a lady claiming that this impacts 17% of gamers, which seems high to me. But then again there seem to be an awfully lot of people in this very thread claiming that they have the condition. And that's made me feel pretty sympathetic.

Does anyone actually have some sources that quantifies the number of people who have this issue?
 
Character customization is already confirmed, dunno if the character from the trailer is gonna be in the story or not though.
According to the game's associate design director "Much like Geralt from The Witcher, V will still very much be their own person". I don't want that. I HATED Fallout 4 for that type of garbage. I didn't care about it in The Witcher because The Witcher doesn't sell Geralt as a custom created player character like Cyberpunk does.
 
This article has a pretty good part on why the FPP perspective works design-wise but it's of course just the author's opinion - https://www.pcworld.com/article/3281374/e3/cyberpunk-2077-preview-e3.html

Listen, I’ve played a lot of video games in my life. Almost 30 years of them at this point. I know what a “city” looks like in video games, and I’ve watched that definition evolve over the years. I remember when Morrowind’s towns seemed bustling, and Oblivion after that. I remember watching a trailer for the original Assassin’s Creed and being stunned how large and crowded it was. I remember driving around Grand Theft Auto V and being in awe of the traffic and the number of unique pedestrians.

So I’m deadly serious when I say: I didn’t think Night City was possible. Not yet, at least. I literally didn’t think the technology existed. What I saw during CD Projekt’s demo was astounding.

At this point, I should probably mention that Cyberpunk 2077 is played in first-person. That means it’s even harder to convey a sense of scale to the player. As we walked out of that apartment, I was stunned as we looked up at towering skyscrapers, dozens of them stretching off into the distance and dotted with billboards and storefronts and all sorts of other signs of life. It felt like an actual city street, something from Manhattan or downtown Los Angeles or Tokyo or some other urban megacomplex.

And the people. The people! Dozens if not hundreds of NPCs casually milling about. Not just walking, but doing things—stopping to look at stores, or talk to each other, in ways that seemed entirely natural. One boxed with an android in a back-alley ring, while onlookers crowded around. These aren’t the robotic schedules I’m used to from Skyrim or Fallout 4, or even The Witcher 3. I’d say Assassin’s Creed: Origins got closest, but even it pales in comparison to what I saw during this Cyberpunk demo.

Night City felt like a living, breathing place.
 

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Let me begin this post by saying I am a huge fan of CD Projekt Red...
Yes it would have been nice for CDPR to sad they are working on fps/rpg game set in cyberpunk universe. Now we have this lame discussion with title FPP vs TPP. I understand people being disappointed for waiting game from favourite developer know for 3rd person rpg games. But saying it can be done ore which is better for rpg which is better for melee or gunplay ore which is more immersive is subjective. So argument goes this was not i as a person prefer or expected. But to think CDRP will always make same type of game just in different settings is kinda naive. Just look how Witcher and Witcher 2 are different. You cant even say original Witcher was really 3rd person. I played it as almost isometric. So we have 4 games Witcher series and Gwent. So TCG/CCG original game is kinda isometric/3rdperson/top-down and two 3rd person games. Sorry but for me this doesn't say they now have to stick to Witcher 3 formula and i sure wouldn't want that.
 
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