dragonbird said:
That's what I meant about the danger of letting this issue become an overwhelming aspect of the game. As soon as you go for this kind of reaction, you're going to spend half the game worrying about it, or you just end up avoiding it completely by not looting, and therefore not exploring.
You are right here. That's why I think that the player should have an incentive in doing things that are morally wrong. For some gamers loot will be enough. Myself, I would consider ruining my reputation for one playthrough if it allowed me to have more quests.
Mind you, I just threw the idea about reputation out of random. I never expected it would become such an important issue.
It depends which features and complexity you mean. I thought that, after the fiasco of DA:A's implementation of runecrafting, the removal of a lot of the crafting requirements in DA2 was an improvement. I'm also not disappointed that a lot of the "real world" requirements from earlier RPG games have gradually disappeared from modern games, stuff like "you need to rest/eat/crap every X world-hours otherwise your health will deteriorate". If the main gameplay lasts 40 hours, extending it to 50 hours by making you spend time resting, hunting for food or farming for ingredients for health potions is NOT improving the value of the game.
I look at that differently. To me it amounts to, let me put it bluntly, dumbing-down games. I somehow find it astonishing that games from 90s were more complex than today's AAA titles. Now, I understand that some real life requirements can be a chore, but I find that solution of scrapping a potentially interesting feature altogether, because you can make it enjoyable is almost always wrong. The real answer is - make it more interesting. Make it inherent in gameplay, make it inseparable from it, make it meaningful for the player to use it.
Let's think about such a simple thing as death. In Infinity Engine (BG series, Icewind Dale series) games death is meaningful. You just can't allow you characters to day. First, rezing them can be expensive. Second, there are whole chunks in the game where you don't have access to a cleric capable of resurection. Third, there are attacks that can kill your chars permanently. Effect? You will do your best to keep your entire party alive and well. You will try to use abilities that can't damage your party but can cause chaos in your opponent's ranks. A basic, but complex tactical layer is added to gameplay. Because you cannot afford losses you will do your utmost to avoid them.
In comparison, death in Dragon Age is a joke. Unless it's a scripted cutscene no one will die. You can go all trigger happy just because you don't have to think about casualties, they will autmatically wake up after the battle as if that fireball in the face didn't hurt at all (if you play on the hardest setting, that is). If you don't have to think about your party's condition, you will not even try to use your skills as creatively as you should. And so, tactics in DA is one great farce.
I'm using this comparison to illustrate how something that is not fun (death) can contribute to gameplay and overall feeling of accomplishment, and how the lack of this common sense mechanic can ruin one's expereince.
It's the with with stealing in TW2, although here we are talking about progression (making feature more meaningful in the future TW installments), not regression (removing death from gameplay in DA). Adding the stealing and reputation layer makes sense in the context of the world the action takes place in. Moreover, ignoring both of them would hurt the consistency of the setting. From the logical standpoint there are no reasons not to implement them... except for the question how to do it in meaningful fashion.
There are many ways... like I said - make the community react to your crimes. Instead of a girl running behind you saying "can I be a witcher too?" make it so urchins will throw rocks at you and run away. From gameplay perspective, let Geralt receive bonuses to intimidation and penalties to diplomacy (separating those skills from each other, so that you won't get the same result when you use them, as it is now would also be a good idea).
Even the whole scene of being caught red-handed while stealing possessions could be solved in an interesting, meaningful manner. Say, a woman sees you nicking stuff - being powerless calls the guards. You try to rush out, but are accosted by militia. Fortunately, you have good connections in the court (reputation) so you easily intimidate guards to let you go. All is fine and dandy, but the rumour spreads. Next day you notice that the dwarven blacksmith is unwilling to talk to you, and when asked to show wares, he demands 30% more money than yesterday.
Simple, neat, meaningful. Slap a few sidequest on the top of that for sufficiently 'renegade' characters.
The same applies to the issue of theft. Yes, for immersion, it would be good if they come up with a way of dealing with it that still makes you explore, but they shouldn't blindly follow traditional techniques such as reputation, nor should it change the overall feel of the game.
First of all, I don't find reputation to be very traditional. It's very rare system in reality. Secondly, no one says that if they decided to go for it they have to take the same way everyone else had gone. Think outside the box. Make it meaningful.
Also, you are right. CDPRed shouldn't blindly go for such concepts. They shouldn't do it because some random dude on their forums thought this would be a good idea. But they also should not cut away their content, like many others before them did. I find it simply abysmall idea to remove something that could have worked but just never got fixed. It's a sure sign of
dumbing-down streamlining, which brings about decline.
I say more, they should come up with their own ideas that could add layers upon layers of options. They should surprise us with how many things you could do, and how the world they so lovingly crafted could react to them. More options, more complexity, more interaction, more possibilities - that's what all cRPGs are about.
Sorry for derailing the thread.
TL;DR. Carry on
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